Individual Throttle Bodies

[Louis - Type S]

Hi everyone,


Is there much point to having Individual Throttle Bodies on a B18CR if you havnt had any head work done. Obviously throttle response is increased and the induction sound is awsome, but what are the other bennefits from this mod. Any info would be greatly appreciated.


Check out this EK B18CR with Individual Throttle Bodies. I know its old but the new guys will appreciate it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShPqWQIYB4w



cheers



Louis

[nick_sixx]

ITBs ftw :) it would be better if you had TODA vtec killer cams also

[EG5]

ITBs ftw :) it would be better if you had TODA vtec killer cams also

You dont have to run vtec killer cams to run ITB
Our B18CR EF ran A sport ITB and it made good power gain over stock.

[94dc2tegz]

is anyone else here running ITBs? and care to share their experiences with them?

[fatboyz39]

We are running ITB's. We are running very mild cams, tad bigger then ITR cams. Works well on a b16a.

[nick_sixx]

You dont have to run vtec killer cams to run ITB
Our B18CR EF ran A sport ITB and it made good power gain over stock.

i know you dont need them to run ITBs, i'm saying it would be better to have them in addition.

like a supra would be cool to have, but a supra with a t88 would be better to have

[94dc2tegz]

well ok, since it's hard to ascertain how good or bad a certain item is purely from a collection of people saying "how much better is this on this" lets try and do a pro's and con's of ITB's. Anyone?

[aaronng]

One almost guaranteed benefit of ITBs is the improved throttle response.

[nick_sixx]

One almost guaranteed benefit of ITBs is the improved throttle response.

it IS gauranteed if it is replacing an oem IM

[aaronng]

it IS gauranteed if it is replacing an oem IM

Yes, I should have added that. :thumbsup:

[Limbo]

i know you dont need them to run ITBs, i'm saying it would be better to have them in addition.

like a supra would be cool to have, but a supra with a t88 would be better to have

you cannot run ITB on boosted applications. Otherwise you could not boost the car. ITB are an NA novelity

[fatboyz39]

you cannot run ITB on boosted applications. Otherwise you could not boost the car. ITB are an NA novelity

Well the R33/R32 Skyline GTR runs 6 individual throttle body? Also to add to that the Pulsar GTi-R runs ITB's. Both system are box.

So you info is incorrect.

[Benson]

One almost guaranteed benefit of ITBs is the improved throttle response.

Not only will it provide good throttle response, the mid range gains is unbeliveable. We gain close to 15-20kw midrange with just itb's over single throttle. Torque wins races not peak power

[AE092]

Well the R33/R32 Skyline GTR runs 6 individual throttle body? Also to add to that the Pulsar GTi-R runs ITB's. Both system are box.

So you info is incorrect.

Yeh thats correct

One of the advantages of the GTI-R SR20 over it's Sivia cousin was it's quad throttle set up. The GTR's had a similar set up as well, it had one big intake plenum but each intake had it's own port if that makes any sense.

Need to find a pic... hrm

[nick_sixx]

you cannot run ITB on boosted applications. Otherwise you could not boost the car. ITB are an NA novelity

omg nobody can understand what im saying. ill simplify:

jessica alba with make up on>jessica alba without make up
300kw>250kw
full strength beer>light beer
sex without condom>sex with condom
turbo skyline>NA skyline

ergo,

ITB's+Vtec Killer Cams>ITB's + no head work

[trism]

vtec killers are ghey

defeats the entire purpose of having a b series. for the VTAK Y0000

but in all seriousness, ITBs with ITR or CTR cams would be very naice

[fatboyz39]

but in all seriousness, ITBs with ITR or CTR cams would be very naice

Sure is...tried on it a stock b18c7 and midrange is just awesome:thumbsup:

[Benson]

ITB's+Vtec Killer Cams>ITB's + no head work

Well of course a built head is better than a stock head :p + you need a hetic engine combo to support those vtec killer cams

[Louis - Type S]

Not only will it provide good throttle response, the mid range gains is unbeliveable. We gain close to 15-20kw midrange with just itb's over single throttle. Torque wins races not peak power


what motor were these gains achieved on, B18C or B16A.
were there any other mods done to the motor to get these kind of results. 15-20kw midrange is a huge gain for just having ITB's only, how many Nm of torque did you gain.

[Benson]

You'll net more gains on a B18c7 than a B16a due to displacement

The motor has CTR piston, set of BC spec 3 cams, Spoolin Performance 4-2-1 headers and ECu +tune. We did 2 tunes, one on single and one on ITB's.

In comparison to both graphs, that was the difference midrange. With top end, the itb's lost 5kw to the single throttle, but the car drive so much better with the Itb's. The torque difference is awesome

[Frankie]

would it be worth puitting a bigger throttle body on a D-series

[4age8u]

4age 4throtle bodies are mad on a vtec

[nick_sixx]

when a turbo car runs itb's, it requires a plenum, which differs from an intake manifold because of its ability to support the itb's.

[trism]

thats true, but it still has better throttle response etc

[nick_sixx]

your mum has good throttle response

[Limbo]

well i guess what i said was wrong, but my idea of running ITBs is when they run independently. When they are stuck to a plenum they aren't really ITBs.
Cos i rang ITBs with seperate pods on my 20v without the plenum and that was alot different from when it ran on the stock plenum setup.

[trism]

pendulum? or plenum?

its individual throttle bodies. just means that there is one TB for each cylinder

however when most people talk about ITB they are reffering to running them open, rather than with a plenum

[Louis - Type S]

Does anyone have a dyno chart of before and after ITB's on a b16a2 or b18cr engines.


cheers


Louis

[Benson]

Does anyone have a dyno chart of before and after ITB's on a b16a2 or b18cr engines.


cheers


Louis

All you need to know ITb's make more midrange. IT will also shift the power band back 500rpm.

There was a thread awhile back with itbs on an b18c7 motor

[grumpy rooster]

The key to making ITB's work on any car is airflow. If you do not have sufficient airflow and airspeed they will not produce the gains expected. Having a ported head with decent sized headers is a good match for a set of ITB's. You don't necessarily need cams but they will of course net you even larger gains.

Any gains that are achieved are all relative to the combination they are replacing.

[vte18c]

my biggest concern would be getting cold air to them..

[grumpy rooster]

That's where an air box and cold air feed comes into play. Its not difficult at all. Its just that people don't do it because they are lazy. :p

[vte18c]

yeah i know but surely that would make the majority of the gain? id do it for sure, otherwise why bother.

[AE092]

why bother? response

if you want gains, bang for buck - go turbo

[trism]

not everyone likes FI

[CB7_OWNER]

Could someone, explain quickly how ITB works??

[F.O.B Squad]

Instead of having one throttle body taking in air for four of the inlets, with the ITBs, each inlet has it own throttle intake/body, hence Individual Throttle Body/s taking in air individually for each inlet port.

[Limbo]

a single intake for each combustion chamber.

[grumpy rooster]

Here's an article written by one of the legends of Honda drag racing Bisi Ezerioha. It is part of his build for the Super Street engine builders competition.

http://www.superstreetonline.com/features/130_0809_individual_throttle_bodies_castrol_syntec/index.html

[CB7_OWNER]

Here's an article written by one of the legends of Honda drag racing Bisi Ezerioha. It is part of his build for the Super Street engine builders competition.

http://www.superstreetonline.com/features/130_0809_individual_throttle_bodies_castrol_syntec/index.html

Thanks for link!


I read about that engine before because its the engine from my car -.-.. its unbelievable how much potential it has..like WOW...

[SeverAMV]

on top of getting a more balanced amount of air per cylinder, you just get resonance/reinforcement physics as well.

your engine produces vacuum on the intake stroke, which pulls air into the cylinder for as long as the valve is open, however, when the valve suddenly closes, air rebounds off the valve and goes out the trumpet. and then when the valve opens again, the air is drawn in again. according to a certain formula, if you manage to set it up so that the end of your trumpet is exactly a certain distance away from your intake valve, you can hit certain harmonics (at which points the air wave that was deflected away from the valve is drawn in at the same time as new air wave, thus reinforcing the strength of the wave).
im not sure about the specifics of the formula, but it also applies to individual carburetor setups using trumpets. according to a basic calculation using a d series motor as the base, with 13 inches between the end of the trumpet and the valve, you hit the fourth harmonic between 5294 to 5920rpm, the third harmonic between 6790 to 7760rpm and the second harmonic between 9037 to 10966, each with increasing pulse strength.
however, you will have to toss up between what your car is being used for. with trumpets, they only really produce more power when you hit the harmonics. with itbs, the disadvantages of trumpets are minimised due to fuel only being injected into the cylinder when the valve is open. with carburetors in a d series, lets just say that the direction of the carburetors is less than ideal for trumpets, so if you accelerate, fuel will just fall out of the trumpets and you'll run lean.