Installing oil pressure & water temp gauges?

[EK1.6LCIV]

Installing oil pressure & water temp gauges?

Im just after some ideas on the best possible setup for the installation of an oil pressure & water temp gauges hard lines. With the oil gauge I was ether going to buy a sandwich plate & oil cooler combo, but I’m a bit nervous of oil loosing pressure, I’m chasing any other ideas on where to mount the sensors.

[Limbo]

sandwich plate is usually the best option. Other option is a small T piece off the regular pressure sensor position.

if its N/A don't get a very large oil cooler and you will not loose much oil pressure (5psi or less). Also recommend you get braided cos i stuffed up the first time with normal rubber & they broke, leaving me on the fwy waiting for a tow truck (NOT FUN!). Another thing is make sure the lines are big enough otherwise you will starve the engine of the oil flow and vtec will not engage (happened to me also)

If you still worried you can always up the pressure later with a few washers. There's a DIY on upping pressure.

[EK1.6LCIV]

T piece? Please explain more as to where it would be located

By large you mean a small 10 row cooler (refers Edvance kit on offer atm)? It does have braided lines but I cant find any credible info on recommended inside dia.

I'd rather not have to run washers in the sump if at all possible, I'm looking for a way to loose as little of pressure as possible

[Limbo]

take out your oil pressure sender. I think its a 3/8" diameter. Goto some place like Pirtek and tell them you need a T piece, its a brass piece in the shape of a T(under $10). It will allow you to take the pressure from there, which will give you the most accurate oil pressure. Earls will also have something, or rocket or motosport connections, but they will be more expensive.

I ran -8 braided lines, lines are pretty standard, & something like earls will be fine.

To reduce the loss of pressure, smaller cooler & short lines.

[EK1.6LCIV]

thanks guys for the advice :)

[aaronng]

Why do you want to get an oil cooler btw? Do you need it? Do you bring your car to the circuit?

[DLO01]

Easiest way for Oil pressure is get a sandwhich plate. You'll only need a cooler if your gonna track it Ryan. Seriously, don't bother with a cooler if its just gonna be street driven or at the Drags. You have a point with Oil Temp to with the sandwhich plate.

Water temp, easiest is just to get a adaptor for the top hose. Just cut the hose, clamp in the adaptor and you have your tap in point. I have got mine tapped it to the top hose housing on the engine. Bit neater and stealth.

[aaronng]

The only downside of using a sandwich plate and running the oil pressure sensor from there is that it measures the oil pressure before the oil filter, not after the oil filter, which is what the T-piece does and is actually the correct way.

I have my pressure sensor on the sandwich plate, and most of the them when driving, it shows the pressure at 80psi, which is the pressure at which the oil filter's bypass valve is opened. LOL.

[EK1.6LCIV]

thank you all very much for the help :) oil gauge is ordered and will be on in a few weeks

[string]

Here's a photo of a "T" fitting. Just go to your local hardware store and ask for 1/8" pipe fittings. You need one 1/2' pipe nipple, one 3 way fitting and adapters to the gauge size. If you can check your installation kit as there should be one adapter inside. The other side you reinstall your stock sender so your idiot light still functions.


If you got NPT fittings then you have cross-threaded the block. The stock oil pressure switch is a 1/8" BSPT thread. Silicone thread sealer works, but in the end it's a dodgey job.

[aaronng]

Define 1/8" pipe thread? Both BSP and NPT are pipe threads. :)

[DLO01]

1/8 BSPT is the correct thread to use. 1/8 NPT is different, sure it may fit and you can't notice anything, but it is ever so slightly different.

[aaronng]

1/8" NPT and 1/8" BSP are different by 1 thread/inch. So you should not mix them. You can mix 1/2" with thread tape though because the pitch is the same, although one has rounded edges and the other has sharp edges on the thread and I wouldn't do it on a pressure critical system.

[vinnY]

question about sandwich plates, anyone have a problem with the center bolt that holds the plate to the block coming loose while changing the oil filter?
haven't installed mine yet, just a concern that i have with the sandwich plate

[aaronng]

question about sandwich plates, anyone have a problem with the center bolt that holds the plate to the block coming loose while changing the oil filter?
haven't installed mine yet, just a concern that i have with the sandwich plate

I have not come across that yet. Just don't overtighten your oil filter.

Make sure that the o-ring on the sandwich plate doesn't fall off when you are mounting it on. Put a drop or two of oil in the groove and press the o-rings on.

[DLO01]

I always screw the bolt on the the filter first with a spanner or shifter so it will never move. Then put the plate in place and turn on the filter.

[aaronng]

I always screw the bolt on the the filter first with a spanner or shifter so it will never move. Then put the plate in place and turn on the filter.
I tested and the torque that you get with tightening the fitting that secures the sandwich plate to the block with a socket is much higher than the torque that you will achieve when you tighten the oil filter by hand.

[DLO01]

What are you getting at Aaronng? It will depend on how tight you do it up either way?

Eitherway, you don't want to overtighten the setup.

[string]

BS the block is pipe thread. It works just fine I know because I have done mine and it's been fine for 3 years now. It starts and goes in with finger pressure AS IT SHOULD with correct threads. I guess you haven't installed any because they have a tendency to weep oil without teflon pipe thread tape THAT IS NOT SILICONE. Guess you have done a few???? So show us the photos of the ones you have done.

If you look at the photos of BOTH parts the oil and water gauges you will see the fittings supplied by the gauge manufacturer Autometer they are all 1/8 pipe threads as are ALL the fittings included in the kit and on several STOCK Honda sensors and every other gauge kit so I guess you are saying the ALL the gauge manufacturers are wrong and so is Honda I guess their engineers aren't quite as experienced as you they are so dumb that they include the wrong sized parts in their kits ... one would think that they would know better than that:D
Look, I don't know what your point is but I've been backed up twice now. It's common knowledge that the rear block port is NOT 1/8" NPT but BSPT. The two are functionally identical but not mechanically interchangable regardless of how many times you show your ignorance with the term "pipe thread".

I've been running a T-piece on the back of my block(s) for the past couple of years and I only used red loctite. Zero leaking because I've got the right threads.

[aaronng]

What are you getting at Aaronng? It will depend on how tight you do it up either way?

Eitherway, you don't want to overtighten the setup.

I just mount it on without overtightening the bolt. Then when I put on the oil filter handtight, the bolt doesn't come loose.

[string]

WTF are you talking about?

They don't make the gauges to plug into the standard block port, they make gauges with insustry standard fittings. How the end user gets oil pressure behind said industry standard fitting is competely independant of the gauge manufacturer.

[DLO01]

I just mount it on without overtightening the bolt. Then when I put on the oil filter handtight, the bolt doesn't come loose.


Ok I see what you mean now. And if that works then all good.

My method of putting the bolt to the filter first is just to lock the bolt in place. Then you put it all together like you would normally do with a filter hand tight. That way then you then have equal force on block to plate, plate to filter.

[string]

What are you smoking of course they make the kits for INSTALLATION that's why they call them installation kits the brass 1/8" NPT fittings that come in an INSTALLATION KIT WILL SCREW RIGHT INTO THE SPOT OF THE STOCK OIL SENDER WITHOUT MODIFICATION OR OTHER ADAPTERS and the same thing goes for the water temp sender bosses 1/8" NPT AND sandwich plates threaded for 1/8" NPT.

Yes they screw right into the female BSPT block port, and with enough sealer of course will seal - not enough pressure for it to be a problem. I'm not arguing that it won't work - and it's pathetic of you for attempting to bring my character into this argument. The fact of the matter is that you're screwing an NPT fitting into a BSPT thread.

I've tried both. Turning the NPT felt rough, the BSPT fitting went in smoothly.

Search "BSPT" on www.honda-tech.com for a myriad of 'further opinions' on the matter.

[string]

What are you smoking of course they make the kits for INSTALLATION that's why they call them installation kits the brass 1/8" NPT fittings that come in an INSTALLATION KIT WILL SCREW RIGHT INTO THE SPOT OF THE STOCK OIL SENDER WITHOUT MODIFICATION OR OTHER ADAPTERS and the same thing goes for the water temp sender bosses 1/8" NPT AND sandwich plates threaded for 1/8" NPT.

check out this installation adapter fittings page they ONLY made an oil pressure adapter FROM 1/8" NPT TO 1/8" BSPT product #2269 if what you are trying to say IT WOULD BE THE OTHER WAY AROUND so the BSPT would screw into the block then the NPT would screw into that.

http://www.autometer.com/cat_accessorieslist.aspx?pid=11

So now what??? Autometer is wrong....... check the whole list there is NO adapter to go into a BSPT BLOCK only INTO A NPT BLOCK

2269: 1/8" NPT Female to 1/8" BSPT Male. Read it again and you'll see that it is exactly the way I am saying it should be. The male end plugs into the block.

Do you have any more poorly formed arguments for me to shoot down?

[aaronng]

http://www.autometer.com/cat_gaugedetail.aspx?gid=3457&sid=2

You haven't proved crap look at the specifications 1/8 National PIPE thread Npt any and all of them. Guess all the gauge manufacturers are wrong.

I can confirm that the sensors that comes with gauges are 1/8" NPT. I can confirm that the ports on oil sandwich plates are 1/8" NPT as well. But, the oil pressure switch on the block is 1/8" BSP.

[DLO01]

^^^ Totally agree. Thats why sandwhich plates are so handy. NPT threads.

This is a sorta T peice you can get for our engines. Read it. Self explanitry.
http://www.stealthmodeperformance.com/oil-blockfit.shtml

[aaronng]

Yeah, sandwich plates are great if they don't leak, but they are useless for oil pressure sensors because all you read is the oil pressure before the filter. What is needed is the post-filter pressure.

[string]

So you used a "T" piece with BSP threads into your block and i'm assuming the stock sender into one side of the "T" how did you fit 1/8 NPT from the kit into the other end of the BSP "T"?
I use a T-piece that has a male BSPT thread on one side, a female BSPT on the other side (for the stock sender to plug into), and a female NPT on top for you to plug in your gauge, or in my case, a line which leads to a 3way NPT T-piece for 2x NPT accessories.

What do fords and suzzuki's have to do with this? We're talking about the back of the Honda B-series block here, nothing else.

[Limbo]

on my sandwich plate there is one side pre-filter & one post.

Just make sure you get the post like aarong said.
The T piece is easier & less likely to leak.

i've had problems with my sandwich plate also, its leaked before as well.
Its always a slight leak that its almost not noticable until you've driven it for a while. Real pain

[aaronng]

on my sandwich plate there is one side pre-filter & one post.

Just make sure you get the post like aarong said.
The T piece is easier & less likely to leak.

i've had problems with my sandwich plate also, its leaked before as well.
Its always a slight leak that its almost not noticable until you've driven it for a while. Real pain
Do you have a link to the sandwich plate that you have? Mine is 4 port, but I can see that all 4 are on the void side, and not in the center fitting side (no idea how would you have it in the center fitting though). At least mine doesn't leak. The only thing that leaks is one of the block off plugs, which I think I did not use enough PTFE tape on. I did the sensors using anaerobic thread sealant, so I will do the same with the block off plug the next time I change oil.

[Limbo]

not on me cos i'm at work.
Its got a hole for sensor on each side of the sensor, so you can choose which oil you want, pre or post filter.

Leaking seems to be coming from the main seal for the sandwich plate. The other holes and stuff i used some gasket glue in the fittings to block it off.

I ended up using a Speedflow T piece for all my sensors, its a nice bling thing, but it cost quite abit more. If i was gonna do it again i'd just get a brass T piece.

[DLO01]

Yeh, Limbo. Most, or all of the Plates that I have seen are pre-filter. Can't see it work the way you describe. Outdside goes to the filter, inside goes down the middle. Your ports can only been on the outside ie pre-filter.

You sure your not running a sandwhich plate and cooler combination? These do have gauge ports one before and one after, as the plate is split to send to and from.

[Limbo]

i'm only running the sandwich plate for the cooler. It has extra holes on the side, left & right to allow you to place your sensors. if you look at the plate, one is a feed side and the other is a return side. The holes for the sensors are on each of those sides so you can pick. Not sure how else to explain. I originally had the sensors on the sandwich plate.
The only issue i had was that it was really tight and as it was leaking i spearated them so it would make it easier to identify which was leaking.

Hopefully its now fixed as i did an oil change on Weds & resealed it
The sensors are off a T piece from the OEM position of the oil pressure sender.

[b18boy]

Rather than make a new thread i have 1 question,
I have two gauges oil temp and pressure.
They are all wired up i just need to fit the sensors,
Wondering if you can go the t-piece route with three outputs?

So 1 for the stock sensor and two for my sensors, if not then i suppose i will go a sandwich plate.

[DLO01]

I don't think there is such a thing. If there was it would not exactly be called a T peice then would it?

If anything just ditch the stock pressure sender. You don't need it if you have a pressure gauge.

[e240]

Rather than make a new thread i have 1 question,
I have two gauges oil temp and pressure.
They are all wired up i just need to fit the sensors,
Wondering if you can go the t-piece route with three outputs?

So 1 for the stock sensor and two for my sensors, if not then i suppose i will go a sandwich plate.

Well, you can T piece the Oil temp gauge and pressure, and you can easily buy the T-piece attachment from say Earls or something. However, I strongly recommend against it.

You see the T piece is a basically a tube extension from the block and the you have the various sensors hanging off the end of the tube extensions (adding weight) - under vibrations, there's a good chance the T-piece adaptor can break off (Afterall, most are either made of aluminium or brass).

I actually have seen one example of the T-piece breaking off which led me to immediately change to a Oil block adaptor (or in my case, I have a oil cooler attached, so the sensors run off the oil cooler adaptor)

(Edit : Actually no)

[vinnY]

bumping up an old thread
looking at the stealthmodperformance (http://www.stealthmodeperformance.com/oil-blockfit.shtml) block fitting it says:


Our single fitting has the correct male end to mate with the factory oil sensor port on you Honda/Nissan/Toyota/VW (and many others) engine block (Male 1/8 BSP). On the opposite end is the correct female end to accept the factory sensor (Female 1/8 BSP). On two sides of the fitting are the oil take-off ports, where you can install any two 1/8 NPT fittings for feeding your turbo, VTEC, or oil gauge! That's right NPT and BSP threads in one fitting! No more adapters and mismatched thread pitches!
does that mean i can hook up both my oil pressure and oil temperature sensors to the block to eliminate the need for a sandwich plate?

also to elaborate on limbo's sandwich plate adapter i suspect he's using this one (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PRM-186/) from perma-cool
anyone have any idea how it works? as it does somewhat look like it can do either pre/post filter pressure measurements

i'd somewhat be more trusting of a larger sandwich adapter to hold all my sensors than a brass piece

[aaronng]

does that mean i can hook up both my oil pressure and oil temperature sensors to the block to eliminate the need for a sandwich plate?
That's right. Although it looks like you will need to get a new-style oil pressure sender which is the more compact version of the old chunky pressure sender because of the lack of space between the engine block and the 1/8" NPT ports.



i'd somewhat be more trusting of a larger sandwich adapter to hold all my sensors than a brass piece
This brass piece looks more reliable than a T-fitting that others usually use.

[vinnY]

yeah my oil pressure sender units a bit bulky but it looks like it would fit on that brass piece

[aaronng]

yeah my oil pressure sender units a bit bulky but it looks like it would fit on that brass piece

The new style senders look like this:
http://www.sensorsportal.com/HTML/DIGEST/april_09/Pressure_sensors_th.jpg

Brands like Saber have a Version 1 and Version 2. Version 1 is the traditional chunky sender and matching gauge. Version 2 is the new compact sender that uses an updated gauge to match it.

[vinnY]

wow tiny
too bad i've had gauges for the last year and a half and haven't really been bothered :p