Has trouble kicking over when hot

[RandyRhydah]

hey i got a d16y4 eg and it starts perfect every time when its cold but when its hot it will try for a little then just stop then try again and just stop it eventually comes around takes a while though its not the battery i tried replacing that. its not the starter motor i had that inspected re lubed and cleaned up. i need help my auto electrician has no clue and my mechanic has no clue. please help :D

[trism]

fuel pump?

plugs?

[wkd_crx]

check your main relay. cause mine did that.

[RandyRhydah]

auto electrician checked the relay and it was fine. :( it doesnt sound like its the fuel pump because after it cranks a little it just stops i wonder if it is the plugs or leads.. there is no missfiring or anything during normal running though :S realy beats me

[OMG.JAI xD]

auto electrician checked the relay and it was fine. :( it doesnt sound like its the fuel pump because after it cranks a little it just stops i wonder if it is the plugs or leads.. there is no missfiring or anything during normal running though :S realy beats me

try changing the main relay with a donor car.
not saying not to take an auto elecs word for it, but its better safe than sorry.

[RandyRhydah]

yeah tru no harm in trying ey. i might just give up gives me more reason to get a b18cr lol

thanks anyway guys

[ECU-MAN]

does the motor crank and not fire, or does it stop cranking ??

[RandyRhydah]

it will crank then stop cranking then crank then stop cranking it can stop for like up to 5 seconds then ill turn the key off and try again

[jem]

it will crank then stop cranking then crank then stop cranking it can stop for like up to 5 seconds then ill turn the key off and try again

Hey Mate, don't want to go against your auto-elec either, however this sounds like the exact same problem i had with my crx very recently, which did turn out to be my master relay.

It got to the point where if i drove for half an hour, turned engine off, it would not restart as engine warm and could not hear my fuel pump squiritng. If your ride has the above symptoms it may very well be your master relay.

Apparently master relays seem to malfunction in most earlier model Honda's. Also if u plan on B18CR and it is your relay, then it will not fix the problem.

You're in luck though, it's a quick fix ! At least give it a go, u have nothing to lose.

Locate your master relay, remove, clean up existing solder (may find that solder is no longer shiny), then just re-solder the exact same points. Let me know if you need further info. Should be good for another 15 years hehe.

Hoping above is of assistance.

[RandyRhydah]

yeah ill get a different mechanic to have a look at it tomorow for sure.. thanks for the help guys :thumbsup:

[ECU-MAN]

sounds like the brushes in the stater motor, or the solenoid on the starter

[ITR]

Im having this problem atm aswell with my Si, hope you find out what it is. :)

[RandyRhydah]

new starter motor solenoid been checked. mechanic didnt check out the relay ill get on his case tomorow :thumbsup:

[Han17]

hey yeh let me know how it all goes and what the matter was. I am having the same problems with my EK4 atm and its really getting on my nerves now.
I can drive 5 mins up the road to the service station.. run in for a drink and when i get back it doesn't do anything. I mean it doesn't even crank! Mechanics can't find anything wrong but you cant always trust one person's opinion hey!

[Benson]

If the car doesnt crank, here are some of the problems;

Main relay is dead
Starter Motor is dieing
Battery is dieing

Replace each one and see how you go

[omgzilla]

Han17: When you're unable to crank the engine is the little green key icon flashing on your dash? I sometimes have the same issue, but it's due to my busted key not holding my immobiliser chip in correctly.

RandyRhydah: So as your switching/holding the key to cranking position the starter motor actually cuts out, even though you're still switching key position to crank?

[RandyRhydah]

thats correct the engine will fully stop cranking no sartermotor no revolutions :( mechanic is purposly avoiding looking at it need might take it apart myself:thumbdwn:

[omgzilla]

Probably because he's out of ideas.

Check your earths, especially the one(s) for your starting circuit, also might be worth checking out your ignition switch.

When it cuts out and you go to try again can you hear the starter clicking (get a helper to crank the engine while you listen under the bonnet). Even though it may not crank, if there is a definate click sound it usually indicates that the pull-in winding is working, but may have issues with the hold-in winding (if it doesn't crank that is).

Does your water temp gauge work properly? Coolant temp sensor faults can cause starting issues, but usually it will not crank at all if the reading is too far out of range.

[RandyRhydah]

ill check the temp sensor today and no not even a click when starting. ill take out the main relay today and check it out myself i found a diy on this forum so it may come in handy :D

[omgzilla]

If you've had the starter motor replaced (it's obviously not going to be that). You'll have to think about the circuit before the starter motor: Ignition Switch -> Main Relay -> Starter Motor.

Make sure to check your earth too dude. Many people just assume they're ok by having a quick look at them. Take the big ones off and clean/scuff up the contact surface and put back together.

[Han17]

My car is just being plain dodgy!! Heres an example..

Drove for roughly 15 mins, stopped at the video store. I was in the shops prob about 20 mins and when i tried sarting my car nothing happened. EXCEPT.. when I touch the break my radio lights flicker, also when i turn the air con fan up it adjusts the brightness of my radio. then eventually once ive left the bonnet up for a while and just left it, it starts.

But yeah, i suppose it is going to be trial and error as to finding out what is wrong.

[jem]

Hi Han17,

Just a suggestion.

http://autorepair.about.com/od/enginetroubleshootin1/a/honda_hot_start.htm

Still tipping main relay as the problem.

[ECU-MAN]

a new starter motor doesnt mean its a good starter motor.

a very simple test

put a globe in paralelle with the stater motor solenoid, and when it wont crank look for power on the globe. if you get power, then the starter is faulty, if you dont get power then its the ignition switch or any aftermarket alarm.

there is no relay from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid.

[omgzilla]

My car is just being plain dodgy!! Heres an example..

Drove for roughly 15 mins, stopped at the video store. I was in the shops prob about 20 mins and when i tried sarting my car nothing happened. EXCEPT.. when I touch the break my radio lights flicker, also when i turn the air con fan up it adjusts the brightness of my radio. then eventually once ive left the bonnet up for a while and just left it, it starts.

But yeah, i suppose it is going to be trial and error as to finding out what is wrong.

Sounds like it could also be a battery or an earth issue. My old R32 had bad earthing and had very similar issues - i cleaned up all the big earth contacts and made my own earthing kit - sorted it!

A dodgey battery could give similar symptoms if it has dropped a cell or on its way out.

Main relay is the root of alot of problems however!

[jaz3]

Ive got the same problem with my EM1. If i try start it on a cold morning, its fine but if i try start it when its been sitting in the hot sun all day - sometimes it will hesitate and not start first go. Interested to hear the outcome here.

[RandyRhydah]

i feel better now im not the only one.. havent had time to look at the main relay yet. had mechanic do starter motor test and the startermotor is in good working order

[RandyRhydah]

took out the main relay today had a look at it. none of the solders were worn but we re soldered them all anyway and still no differance... when the problem happens the battery drops to 8 volts.. its not the battereys fault becasue this is the second new battery that is doing it.

[Han17]

Yeh i think i'll try a new battery first off coz all my other stuff seems to be fine. Honda resoldered some stuff in my main relay. It could be a wiring problem due to the fact that it impacts the workings of my radio.

[RandyRhydah]

doesnt fix my problem.. getting realy frustrated now

[alaric]

ok i have had this problem before and worked out that it was the ignition module as it is very comon on the d16 motor. so i suguest to replace this and it should fix it

[RandyRhydah]

more information on ignition module? where to buy what it is bla bla. im not the most mechanicaly minded when it comes to car electronics :)

[omgzilla]

Randy - Your problem seems to be your starter motor cutting in and out. Alaric's previous experience with this issue seems to be a 'crank but no fire' issue, where as yours is a 'cranking cut-out' issue = different symptoms, hence meaning the ignition module is most probably not the cause of your fault. The ignition module could create issues on hot starting, but those issues would be 'crank but no fire' or just plain misfire issues.

Checked out that Ignition switch yet? Check condition of switch contacts and wiring.

Checked your Earths points (at battery terminal, engine earths, and body/chassis earths)?

Tried checking if power is still getting to the starter motor whilst its cutting out? If power is still at the starter while it is cutting out then your starter is at fault! If there is no power at the starter whilst its cutting out then you need to check back further down the circuit (as previously stated). Don't forget to check all wiring and plug connections - There may be a short/open circuit somewhere or a dodgey connection along the wiring between components such as the Ignition Switch, Main Relay or Starter.

[alaric]

just leating you that i have tried all these things before i found that it was the module. If u go to spare parts shop u will be able to get one, and it is located on the dizzy.
the reason why i said this is because it starts and then runs and then once the motor is hot it cuts out which tells me that its an electrical problem.

[omgzilla]

So as your switching/holding the key to cranking position the starter motor actually cuts out, even though you're still switching key position to crank?


thats correct the engine will fully stop cranking no sartermotor no revolutions.

alaric: From what RandyRhydah has explained (as i've quoted above) his is a completely different issue than the one you were experiencing. Your help is still appreciated, however. :thumbsup:

[RandyRhydah]

thanks, ill check these things out tomorow. checked all earths and they are good but i will see if it is the starter motor. it has been looked at by mechanic and stuff but there may have been something un noticed by him.

hopefully i have better luck tomorow cheers guys

[omgzilla]

Meanwhile... some light reading for you dude:
http://www.aa1car.com/library/1999/cm119948.htm

Just some basics of the starter circuit to help you gain some understanding of the system.

Let us know how you go tomorrow ;)

[RandyRhydah]

sorry for the late reply guys, my cars off the road now, destroyed some rod bearings and rings are absolutly shot. still has hot start problem though! im doing a b16a or 18c conversion soon hopefully the problem doesnt stick around. ive tried everything in this forum to fix it but wasnt able to fix it.. feel free to share any experiances and reflections in this thread but it realy beats me :P