Shifting problems

[innozent]

I got a B16B engine and a S80 Gearbox with some unknown aftermarket gears in it, at least it got an aftermarket LSD.
The problem is: It is always hard to shift when it drives a while or everythings are hot, It is smoother to shift when it is raining. I changed Transmission fluid from Honda MTF to KAAZ LSD oil to reduce the clicking sound when turning corners. Until a day, I cant put the gears stick into second while down shift, it feels like there is a wall blocking it. so i try to move back to neut when i am still clutch in, then rev, then put into second, same thing, sth blocked. still clutch in until the car fully stopped, still unable to put into second. I have to put back into neut and step the clutch few times to let me get into second. This made me think it is something do with my clutch.
Another day i tried to reverse and i hold the clutch at balance point, the car moves slowly in a constant speed, but it suddenly stopped although i didn't move my left foot. It is like the balance point is some time high, some time low. then i try to put back in to neutural, The gear stick stuck in reverse, the only method is to force it back to neutural or fully release the clutch, let the car moves a bit and press it again then i can put back to neut.
In normal days, i heel toe every corner and it helps me to put in second but it is hard, even harder in every gears no matter upshift or downshift when it is hot. Tried double declutch as well, but it is still hard to put into second, feels like it didn't select into the perfect position.
Sometimes It is into second put it is not actually in any gear and the gearbox is spinning or something. sometimes it poped out from second.
I changed Excedy oem Type R clutch and release bearing when i took my gearbox out. I changed Clutch master cylinder, I change the gearbox oil to KAAZ to make it smoother, but it is still hard when hot. I changed Shifter bushings, then the second gear problem occur. I went to a GB specialist and they said it is not my gearbox although i prepared to rebuild it. They said it is something with the clutch and the shift linkage.
Then I changed the shift linkage, but same it is hard when hot and second gear problem.

Notes: I do not have front transmission bracket, i am running the trans top, rear L, the one near the cam cover and the A/C bracket.
No crunching sound, but there is a quick spinning sound when i release the throttle when the rev drops from high to low
So here are the questions
1: How to check Clutch slave, Master and clutch line properly.
2: How to check engine mount properly.
3: Please advise how to solve the problemsss

[squish85]

I got exactly the same problems after changing to honda MTF from my "unknown" tranny oil... OR it could be due to my short shifter which I have been advised by a good workshop to change into JDM ITR shift linkage and shifter..

It happens randomly.. and sometimes even while entering the freeway... (very scary..) The irritating part was that nothing of that sort happened when it was being inspected by the workshop...

Oh yea.. just to add on.. The difficulty in changing gears like you have described.. happened to me while just started the engine from cold.. the weather is warm about 25-28 celcius..

Would be good if someone with better experience can offer some insight into this problem..

[TODA AU]

Adjust pedal height & bleed clutch hydro system correctly.
Replace any leaking components (slave / master)
Check all engine mounts & replace U/S mounts.
If difficult shift issue remains, it is likley shift forks in box.

[taman]

bump, i got the same problem here too,

[innozent]

shift fork as in the "release fork connect to the slave or the one inside the box?

[AE092]

The clicking noise could be due to a stuffed drive shaft.

The spinning sound could be due to stuffed wheel bearing(s).

[innozent]

Thanks for advice, But i did changed three different drive shafts on RHS and two on the LHD. According to wheel bearing, i didn't hear any special noise when i jack on the car and spin the wheel.


The clicking noise could be due to a stuffed drive shaft.

The spinning sound could be due to stuffed wheel bearing(s).

[aaronng]

Do what TODA AU suggested first.

[TODA AU]

shift fork as in the "release fork connect to the slave or the one inside the box?
No, shift or slector fork inside the gearbox.

[innozent]

I researched for a while, and another person got a similar problem with me and he found out is the "clutch area problem", and it stated sth wrong with pressure plate.
Just wonder how would a dmged pressure plate lead to and hard down shift to second when the car is moving

[TODA AU]

I researched for a while, and another person got a similar problem with me and he found out is the "clutch area problem", and it stated sth wrong with pressure plate.
Just wonder how would a dmged pressure plate lead to and hard down shift to second when the car is moving

Very unlikley... Pressure plate problems are pretty rare these days.
Either way though, as I said before,

Adjust pedal height & bleed clutch hydro system correctly.
Replace any leaking components (slave / master)
Check all engine mounts & replace U/S mounts.
If difficult shift issue remains, it is likley shift forks in box.

In this case, the box is comming out anyway so you can check clutch at the same time.

[Limbo]

i had a pressure plate problem before. What happens is that the clutch is unable to engage/disengage properly, so you get intermitted shifting problems. You'll only know if you pull the box out.

Mine a few pieces of the pressure plate fell out when the box was pulled out.
Either way your gonna have to pay for the box to come out and upon inspection then you will know what you are up for.

Still do what toda said first. It will be cheaper, if that is the problem.

[innozent]

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g270/innoz/13S020027_p07.gif

Shift fork? Looks like so much easier than changing the synchro

[jspec civic]

The clicking noise could be due to a stuffed drive shaft.

The spinning sound could be due to stuffed wheel bearing(s).

i got the clicking nosie when turning as well, drive shaft changed and its still there..

[innozent]

I really dont understand why would it become harder , very hard to shift after i drove it for an hour. I changed transmission fluid already, whatelse can it be

[tekung89]

dont drive till u find out wat the problem is, forcing gears will lead u to a new gb. bleed ur clutch yet?

[innozent]

Took the gearbox out. Check inside gearbox, input shaft seal is gone, the leaking oil
went into friction disc, make it not disengaging properly. Gearbox specialist inspected the gearbox, no worn synchro or bent shift fork. After putting everything back, the car will not become harder to shift after driving a while.

But 1 thing still happen, second gear pops out when up shifting. It feels like the second gear stick position did not make the gearbox put into second properly.
For example, when people shift into reverse in Honda gearbox, sometimes it didn't go in although the gear stick is in R position. with clutch engaged, clutch out. there will be some spinning sound near the gearbox. It feels similar to how i cant put into second.

Notes:Gearbox oil level Checked, up til that bolt.
Master and slave checked, no leaks.
Original Clutch disc with oil has been cleaned with oil cleaner, I didn't feel that it slips and disengaging not properly. Gearstick form reverse can be pull back to N easily
Will it be the shifter problem or the stabalizing bar of the shift linkage lead to this problem?
Any idea would be appreciated

[90LAN]

did u find out what lsd it is when u opened it up ?
try another lsd oil like endless or cusco

[TODA AU]

Normally for 2nd gear to pop out, the dogs on the 2nd counter gear are worn.
The problem with reverse is due to straight cut rev gear & wear.
Generally as the 1st / 2nd sleeve carries the rev main gear, slotting the gear box into 1st gear before reverse will almost guarantee reverse selection every time. Unless something is seriuosly wrong.
This problem in 2nd is usually only present with syncro or seltector problems / wear.
It can be an assembly issue, but is generally only found in 3rd & up as there is no torqued nut on the input shaft. Incorrect shimming can do this too. But as you had a gearbox specalist lok at it, it's unlikley he got that wrong.
If the box comes out again,, look at the following parts.
(in ref to the pic you posted previously)
Slector fork # 3, the part that coreseponds with part # 5 & the mechanism that drives it.
If the main pivot pin is fouled or off angle slightly, the same can occur.
If there is an assembly problem, IE: 1st & 2nd gear outer syncro rings swapped acitently, the same can also occur.
NB: It's rare to be able to foul or catch the pin off angle without cracking the case.
NNB: When the syncros are fitted arse about, the shim clearance becomes incorrect causing the syncro to feel tight & not follow through.

The shift stabilising bar generally only causes issues when there is a problem with the bushes. round one at gearbox end & odd shaped 2 bolt one at the rear.
Both need to be in good condition & secure.
Engine mounts can cause similar problems but I expect your gearbox guy would have checked these for you.

Last though, it could also be an over torqued detent ball carrier.
When these are over torqued, the carrier rather than the ball makes contach with the shaft of the selector fork & this can cause similar / same issue.
These can be accesed without removal of box.
Hope that helps.
Cheers

Adrian

[innozent]

very detailed information, thanks

[denrie]

Try getting new gear box oil.... bring it to HANNY"S 50 bucks.. oil is think but when it gets hotter obviously it gets thinner so maybe its low on oil and not enouhg lubrication!

[innozent]

Questions again,
1. will worn synchro lead to hard to shift in other gears after a while of driving.
2. Besides of oil, what else can lead to hard to shift after a while of driving, like 1 hour.
It was smooth at the beginning in first gear, third, and forth, fifth. It becomes harder after driving it for a while

[omgzilla]

As heat increases (after driving) the viscosity/thickness of the gearbox oil changes.

[innozent]

yeh i knnow, just wonder besides of oil.
it must be incorrect clearance to lead to hard shifting when hot ?

[ZCroofrack]

I have an 89 cable clutch tegra 230,000km, and it shifts fine when cold, but as soon as it's warmed up it crunches in nearly every gear!!

Changed oil and used 75w90 oil and still did it.

Next will be a 90w110 oil!!!

If that's a fail, I'll replace the box!

[aaronng]

I have an 89 cable clutch tegra 230,000km, and it shifts fine when cold, but as soon as it's warmed up it crunches in nearly every gear!!

Changed oil and used 75w90 oil and still did it.

Next will be a 90w110 oil!!!

If that's a fail, I'll replace the box!

Sounds like your clutch cable is worn out. Works fine when cold, but when it warms up, the cable stretches and your clutch does not disengage even then you press the clutch pedal all the way in.

[ZCroofrack]

I'll check it out and adjust.

Cheers for that. :)

[ZCroofrack]

Adjusted cable, no good.
Dropped the 75W90 and put in some nulon 85W140 and she's better now! doesn't crunch no more.

No gbox change yet :)

[innozent]

good to hear that