idle hunting - over it!

[ceeazian]

hey guys, i have researched this issue a couple times with no luck nor resolution for that fact.

a little bit of background to the story. I've got a 96 Civic GLi and i havent driven it for a while due to a work car and when i went to start it up after quite a while it seemed fine, although i noticed the idle was quite high at 1500rpms. I didn't think there was too much to worry about until the car got warm and it then started jumping rapidly between 2000rpm down to 700, and continued up and down until i turned off the car! the problem continues...

i've pulled apart my throttle body and the RACV (GLi d16) cleaned it thoroughly, new gaskets from honda, put back together and still hunting idle. I've actually done this a couple times thinking i havent cleaned it enough to no avail.

I will mention i have a J racing Rep Intake on it if that helps?

whats next? throttle position sensor? vaccuum leak? list goes on of possibilites? anyone had a similar situation???

any help would be greatly appreciated! :)

[beeza]

So U have cleaned the IACV on the TB?

Is your IAT sensor hooked back up after U changed the Intake?

Have you callebrated the Voltage on the TPS?

U can put your hand over the TB,if it dies then no leak,if it idles then U have a leak.

[ceeazian]

So U have cleaned the IACV on the TB? <---Yes

Is your IAT sensor hooked back up after U changed the Intake? <---Yes

Have you callebrated the Voltage on the TPS? <---Next thing maybe to look at doing??

U can put your hand over the TB,if it dies then no leak,if it idles then U have a leak. <---forgot about this. will try that out aswell.

i should have pointed out that i was driving the car with the intake for quite a while with no issues at all, it was only after i hadnt driven it for that extended period of time that suddenly the idle hunting started?

[beeza]

I reckon to swap the TB over with another and see if that fixes it.I've had this exact same thing,damn near drove me nuts.Finially swapped the TB over and the problem went.U can go to a wrecker and ask nicely if they have one you can swap in and if it's the problem you'll buy it.Or do U have a friend with the same car? (probably not)

You should also -

- Hook your IAT back up (If it isn't already)
- Collerbrate the TPS on the TB
- Check for leaks (Hand over TB,spray carby cleaner all around the intake/exhaust seals and monitor if the revs increase i.e. because the carby cleaner is making the seal air tight.

It could be an electrical issue between the TB and ECU but worry about that next.Do the easy and obvious checks first.

[[ricer]]

i have a gli d16 as well and i didnt drive the car for about 2 to 3 months and when i started it i had the exact same problem... finally after almost giving up trying to fix it my friend had a spare one and i went on to use that...

[ceeazian]

;2183277']i have a gli d16 as well and i didnt drive the car for about 2 to 3 months and when i started it i had the exact same problem... finally after almost giving up trying to fix it my friend had a spare one and i went on to use that...

so what do you think? its almost sounding like i should go out there, get another throttle body and hope that is solves the issue? i am just about giving up fixing it right now aswell!

[[ricer]]

i had my local mechanic look at it... had adrian at toda look at it... the throttle body just shit itself basically... cant remember the price brand new but remember it being something ridiculous.... kinda same price as a whole 2nd hand d16 motor and gear box lol...
are u in sydney? if so probably head down to honbits in smithfield... heaps of EKs there last time i went... or ask charlie at GPC if he has any around

[ceeazian]

hahah i remember asking honda parts how much a genuine one is and i do believe it is something ridicolous.so maybe my TB has sh*t itself. unfortunately not in sydney, im in perth so its going to make it that little bit harder, i never found hobits here helpful!

[beeza]

If I just swap the whole bloody TB in the first place,it would have saved a lot of stress.Ya live and learn.

[bennjamin]

wait wait wait.

Replace the FITV (located under the throttle body) with a known working one OR adjust it -follow this guide CLICK HERE (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64161&highlight=fitv)

[Lukezen27]

;2183291']i had my local mechanic look at it... had adrian at toda look at it... the throttle body just shit itself basically... cant remember the price brand new but remember it being something ridiculous.... kinda same price as a whole 2nd hand d16 motor and gear box lol...
are u in sydney? if so probably head down to honbits in smithfield... heaps of EKs there last time i went... or ask charlie at GPC if he has any around

No TB or IM at honbits anymore :thumbdwn:

suckers are keeping everything for complete conversions :o

[beeza]

wait wait wait.

Replace the FITV (located under the throttle body) with a known working one OR adjust it -follow this guide CLICK HERE (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64161&highlight=fitv)

Yes yes yes!!

THIS is the sucker!!!

I didn't know what it was called,but this must have been what was shot in my TB!

I did try to fix the old one but I didn't know what I was doing so I didn't succeed.Replacing it did.

Well Done Benny!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[beeza]

The FITV is part of the IACV,so if you are replacing it,you need the IACV,which has the FITV on it :)

[bennjamin]

The FITV is part of the IACV,so if you are replacing it,you need the IACV,which has the FITV on it :)

What ? The FITV and IACV are seperate parts , linked by one coolant hose. They are to be adjusted / replaced / cleaned individually or together.

[beeza]

OK,I see where my confusion lies.I was thinking the whole part is the IACV and the FITV is part of the IACV.But the whole part has both of them on it.

[ceeazian]

can i confirm that on the GLi d16 engine that there is a FITV? I remember how long it it took to discover on the d16 there isnt what everyone refers to as the IACV but the RACV. i assume serving the same purpose but located differently to the b series.

[beeza]

Yes,just like in the DIY :)

[[ricer]]

can i confirm that on the GLi d16 engine that there is a FITV? I remember how long it it took to discover on the d16 there isnt what everyone refers to as the IACV but the RACV. i assume serving the same purpose but located differently to the b series.


the d16y4 one is completely different to all other ones i've seen...

the d16y8 and y1 can be fixed most of the time... the y4 is just a pos set up lol

[bennjamin]

can i confirm that on the GLi d16 engine that there is a FITV? I remember how long it it took to discover on the d16 there isnt what everyone refers to as the IACV but the RACV. i assume serving the same purpose but located differently to the b series.


as previously stated - the gli has the FITV located directly under the throttle body.....like most D and B series engines

[beeza]

;2183444']the d16y4 one is completely different to all other ones i've seen...

the d16y8 and y1 can be fixed most of the time... the y4 is just a pos set up lol

Yeah,totally Ricer :thumbdwn:

[[ricer]]

as previously stated - the gli has the FITV located directly under the throttle body.....like most D and B series engines

are you 100% sure?

the y4 has like the iacv at the bottom where as the others have the iacv at the back... no sign of the fitv... thats the one where you can disassemble and wind back in and should fix the problem right?

[beeza]

The FITV is on the the IACV part facing the front of the car.

[bennjamin]

;2183484']are you 100% sure?

the y4 has like the iacv at the bottom where as the others have the iacv at the back... no sign of the fitv... thats the one where you can disassemble and wind back in and should fix the problem right?

The EG4 gli has a FITV located on the bottom of the throttle body, with a IACV located on the back of the inlet manifold.

[[ricer]]

The EG4 gli has a FITV located on the bottom of the throttle body, with a IACV located on the back of the inlet manifold.

yup same as the d16y1 and y8 motors...

the EK gli's d16y4 is completely different. :(

[bennjamin]

sorry i thought you guys were hinting about the Eg series ! You are very right it differs.
OBD2 engines seem to have a FITV of sorts - more like a small gallery with a coolant bypass to heat up the throttle body.

[beeza]

That's where our confusion lies Benny.

[ceeazian]

dead end :(

[beeza]

dead end :(

Why.?

[ceeazian]

Well I believe the d16y4 which is the gli in the 96 ek that there is no fitv??

[kyle]

There is no FITV in OBD2 Honda's.

[beeza]

Well I believe the d16y4 which is the gli in the 96 ek that there is no fitv??

Yes there is,it's 'on the the IACV part facing the front of the car',which is at the bottom of the TB.

This is for a d16y4,same engine as mine.

You can try and tighten the spring back up like I did,it may work,it's a bad design...better just to replace the whole IACV part (which has the FITV on it) on the bottom of the TB OR replace the whole TB.

[ceeazian]

i've managed to find a guy here who had spare parts for a civic, and i got the throttle body complete off a d series engine. perfect. wouldnt believe he gave it to me for $20 lol just needed to get rid of it. so weekend job will compromise of throttle body change over and i'll be sure to let you know if it solves the problem? any advice before going ahead with this? seems standard procedure? Reset ECU after?

[beeza]

- Clean up the TB with Carby cleaner.Make sure you take the IACV off the bottom and spray the shit out of it :) The 4 bolts on the bottom,don't tighten too hard just over hand tight or you can snap them.
- Do it when the engine is cold.
- You will need to dissconnect the 2 coolant hoses on the bottom of the TB.Use pliers to squeeze the clips then pull the hoses off.Don't worry about plugging them up,only a little coolant will come out.
- The swap over is strait forward.
- U can replace the TB gasket for $6 from Honda.Not a must but for $6...
- When you put the TB cable back on,you will need to hold the TB open at WOT (wide open throttle) to get the cable back in.I'm sure you will figure this out but I know it's easy to fall into the trap of not knowing and stressing out cause ya can't get the sucker back in!
- You can now adjust the throttle cable.You will see 2 nuts,that you use to tighten/loosen this.Make sure the cable is firm but not tight.
- Re-check you have tighten all nuts/bolts/everything
- You don't need to reset the ECU for this.
- But I would expel the air in the cooling system though.
- Start the car,take off the radiator cap,let it idle until the bubbles stop coming out the radiator.Squeeze the coolant hoses to help and/or park the car on a slope (front of the car up) to help the air rise/escape.

YOUR DONE!

[Lukezen27]

Whoop

Finally things are looking up..

Was the throttle position sensor mixed with more than likely a dodgy IACV

The car finally started today without revving straight to red line!!

[ceeazian]

good stuff mate. thanks for the instructions. when i cleaned out my original TB i remember that feeling of not being able to get that throttle cable back in right haha and stressin abit but it was all good. anyway will be changing over the TB tomorrow so cross fingers. also, just a quick one, is it safe to use carby cleaner quite thouroughly through the TB and IACV without damaging any of the sensors and electrics attached to either of these parts? i think im being paranoid about everything now. :confused: abit of reassurance please

[beeza]

No worries!

Yes,they will be fine.Spray heaps for the IACV,the TPS and MAP sensor,you will only need a small amount anyways.Best to take those 2 sensors off and give them a quick spray under there.


That what my problem was too in the end Luke.I reckon the MAP sensor was even playing up on mine,cause when I swapped it,it was running better.Far easier just to swap the whole TB from the start with these type of problems.

[Paul1985]

No worries!

Yes,they will be fine.Spray heaps for the IACV,the TPS and MAP sensor,you will only need a small amount anyways.Best to take those 2 sensors off and give them a quick spray under there.


That what my problem was too in the end Luke.I reckon the MAP sensor was even playing up on mine,cause when I swapped it,it was running better.Far easier just to swap the whole TB from the start with these type of problems.

It's ok for older TB's. Newer TB's have a coating on the butterfly which carby cleaner will damage. Some sensors can be sensitive aswell.

You should be fine to use it on the EK1 TB though.

[beeza]

Yes yes :)

[ceeazian]

well, for $25 it was a successful route to go. as beeza suggests, its a much easier route to find a replacement TB and just replace it!

Idle is smooth. sitting at roughly 800-900RPM, let it run for 15mins and NO IDLE HUNTING!!!!!! im stoked. love that feeling of accomplishing something!

[beeza]

I stoked for ya!!

It's not hard eh :)

[ceeazian]

time to go for a drive! appreciate all the help man!

:)

[beeza]

WOOT WOOT!!

U can reset the ECU too if ya wish.Not needed but dosen't hurt :)

[Riviera]

congrats :thumbsup::thumbsup:

now to find out what it was inside the TB causing the trouble....

[Gio]

FFS has anyone found the iACV on a d16y4 lol.

I want to repair mine not replace the TB :(

[ceeazian]

What's the problem? Same as mine? To be honest I don't think it's worth replacing that particular part as I believe to get it new or used wouldn't be too much difference than buying the whole throttle body.

Your better off going to the wreckers and getting replacement tb because it could be one of the sensors on the tb? The iacv I believe on our d16y motors are located under the tb. They have two coolant lines going into them. I think on the d16y they are more commonly known as the racv.

I think the easiest bit of advice I could give is to just change your tb. I learnt the hard way having taken off my tb several times replacing gasket. Cleaning etc etc with no joy. Having listened to beeza and replace it. All my problems were gone like that!! It will just start to become a pain in the azz man !!!

[beeza]

Yes! So true.Sorry I didn't say via PM Gio but it's true! :)

Thanks ceeazian!!

[Gio]

I'm in the process of taking the TB off now. All off, but those fkn hoses wont budge!! How tight are they on there, even sprayed some silicon spray on the clips which got the clip moving but the hose wont lol. Im off to try some more.

[Alexx]

The clips holding on the hoses should be easy to take off, just pinch them with pliers and slide them down the hose away from the fitting.

Then use the pliers to clamp around the hose where its joined to the fitting and 'crack' the seal by jiggling the pliers back and forth.

Once the seal is cracked, you should be able to take the hose off much easier, just grab the hose and yank it away from the fitting. Simple :)

[Gio]

Thanks bro, didnt need plyers, fingers copped it haha. All done DIY ON ITS WAY

[beeza]

Spray carby cleaner into the throttle body/engine Too while revving the engine and clean all that crap outta there.

[Gio]

While the car is on?

Anyone have a d16y4 TB they want to sell?

[beeza]

Yes,while its running and rev it to help it through.

[Gio]

Cleaned the iacv and just submitted a DIY.

Now i guess the o2 sensor needs to be changed?

[Gio]

DIY here

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2214782#post2214782

[ceeazian]

Hahah pulling off those hoses are something hey. Your hands just cop a beating! I felt mine were swollen for couple days haha

O2 sensor doesn't necessarily need to be replaced as going by some posts earlier most carby cleaners are o2 sensor friendly? Someone correct me if I'm
Wrong. How's the idle now??

[ceeazian]

DIY here

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2214782#post2214782

Nice write up man!! Well over due for those d series drivers out there!

[Gio]

I think they mean that the o2 sensor has just gievn up and needs replacing, the cleaner didnt kill it...

Still goes from 1500 - 2000 every 3 seconds when warmed up. Sits on 1500 still when comd :( used to sit on 900 :(

[ceeazian]

I think they mean that the o2 sensor has just gievn up and needs replacing, the cleaner didnt kill it...

Still goes from 1500 - 2000 every 3 seconds when warmed up. Sits on 1500 still when comd :( used to sit on 900 :(

Exactly same issue as I had man :( wreckers time. Dude just negotiate a price. Trust me it's more satisfying replacing the thing putting it on and then problem
Gone!! Feel for ya man !! It's the most irritating thing !

[Gio]

How much was your TB from the wreckers?

[Lukezen27]

How much was your TB from the wreckers?

I just picked one up for about $20 bucks :thumbsup:

[Gio]

Nice man! Where at? Just now?

[Gio]

Just called honda wreck and they dont sell them seperately WTF!!

[Lukezen27]

Nice man! Where at? Just now?

Two weekends ago..

Was the last one hahah

Well it was for The B's and we used a CRV one on my B16A2 :p

I'll find the number when I get home but its not a wreckers

[Gio]

Lol fkn b seriers....

I'll need the d16y4 one

You are in brisbane luke?

[Lukezen27]

Lol fkn b seriers....

I'll need the d16y4 one

You are in brisbane luke?

Manly

Sydney bro

its only been fkn b seriers.... for one week ahfasdjfnsd

[Gio]

Damn, for some reason i thought you were in Brisbane...

Hahaha, how is it feeling? Pimp??

[ceeazian]

I just picked one up for about $20 bucks :thumbsup:

Likewise man. $25. Worth the money haha

[Gio]

I called honda wreckers and he said that they do not sell them seperate!! :confused:

[Lukezen27]

Damn, for some reason i thought you were in Brisbane...

Hahaha, how is it feeling? Pimp??

Its OK but once the turbos back on then whoop woo

[Gio]

How long are u looking at till all up and going?

What are u aiming for?

Japspec b16 sounds so banga lol

[Lukezen27]

How long are u looking at till all up and going?

What are u aiming for?

Japspec b16 sounds so banga lol

Might install the turbo kit tomorrow of I wake up early enough :p

[Gio]

Link to pics at the moment please :p

[Lukezen27]

Link to pics at the moment please :p

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=108143

Enjoy :p

[Gio]

Thanks bro