Adjusting Accelerator Pedal

[BURST]

I was just wondering if it's possible to adjust the accelerator pedal, cos my one sits in quite a bit further than my brake pedal. And makes it a bit annoying to drive at times, especially when you're trying to revmatch and brake at the same time.

If it's do-able, would I have to take it to a mechanic or something ,or would i be able to do this myself?

Thanks.

[lil_foy]

Its normal, get used to heel toeing correctly.

[BURST]

But right now I can't get my heel to touch the accelerator pedal unless I have the brakes fully in. Is that how its meant to be ?

[trism]

you dont actually use your heel.

its more the side of your foot

[javer81]

you can either get a bigger pedals for the current set up or change the whole thing. if you are having a civic, civic type r pedals are flushed.. so it depends how you want to do it. 2 cent.

[JohnL]

If the accelerator pedal doesn't rely upon hitting the floor in a certain spot (to act as the positive stop, limiting pedal travel to avoid overstessing the linkage), then it may be possible to bend the accelerator pedal to the left toward the brake pedal. I've done this with a few cars, including my CB7.

This can make 'heel/toe' a lot easier. With the throttle pedal closer to the brake pedal you can brake with the ball of the foot and rock the foot to 'blip' the throttle with either the side of the foot or with the little toe (or pad of the foot below the the little toe). More or less the same thing can be achieved by fittting an oversize accelerator pedal pad as already suggested.

By carefully bending the accelerator pedal it's also possible to optimise the accerator pedal pad height from the floor (relative to brake pedal pad height) to optimise the pad relationship for 'heel/toe'. If you do this (or bend the pedal in any way) you do need to check that you can still get WOT.

[BURST]

you dont actually use your heel.

its more the side of your foot

I've tried using the side of the foot, but i still cant seem to push the accelerator pedal in enough, maybe cos I have small feet.


If the accelerator pedal doesn't rely upon hitting the floor in a certain spot (to act as the positive stop, limiting pedal travel to avoid overstessing the linkage), then it may be possible to bend the accelerator pedal to the left toward the brake pedal. I've done this with a few cars, including my CB7.

This can make 'heel/toe' a lot easier. With the throttle pedal closer to the brake pedal you can brake with the ball of the foot and rock the foot to 'blip' the throttle with either the side of the foot or with the little toe (or pad of the foot below the the little toe). More or less the same thing can be achieved by fittting an oversize accelerator pedal pad as already suggested.

By carefully bending the accelerator pedal it's also possible to optimise the accerator pedal pad height from the floor (relative to brake pedal pad height) to optimise the pad relationship for 'heel/toe'. If you do this (or bend the pedal in any way) you do need to check that you can still get WOT.

How can I find out if the accelerator relies on hitting a certain point on the floor ?

[TONTON]

What size are your feet?

[JohnL]

I've tried using the side of the foot, but i still cant seem to push the accelerator pedal in enough, maybe cos I have small feet.

More likely that the throttle pedal pad might be too low relative to the brake pedal, or that the distance between the pedals just makes it more difficult. Pedal spacing should be such that you can heel / toe without having to twist your foot around too much.

The car makers typically don't set pedal spacing and height with heel / toe in mind, the opposite is probably true. They most probably deliberately space them farther apart to minimise the chance of the right foot from ever coming into simultaneous contact with the brake and accelerator pedals (I wonder why...).

With my car (after pedal modification) the spacing between the brake and accelerator pedals is 4cm, which I find very nice for heel / toe. The original spacing would have been twice what it is now at about 8cm, which made heel / toe awkward.

My accelerator pedal pad is about 3cm lower than the brake pedal pad which is a relative height found through experimentation. The ideal relative pedal heights depends a lot on just how much brake pedal motion there is.


How can I find out if the accelerator relies on hitting a certain point on the floor ?

Get down in the footwell and have a look. There would be a hard 'stop' pad protruding from the carpet that prevents the pedal moving too far. If not then there is probably a 'stop' at the top of the pedal, i.e. up near where the cable attaches (sharply push the pedal all the way to the floor and you might hear it make contact with the stop).

In this case pedal travel is controlled at the top of the pedal and it should be OK to adjust pedal spacing and height by bending the pedal bar below the spindle.

If you decide to bend the pedal then you need to be careful. Make sure you don't place too much stress on the pedal spindle, and bend the bar (that forms the pedal lever) below the spindle. It can be fairly difficult to bend, strong hands will certainly help.

[SiReal]

or you could simple get a thickass pedal set, and simply use the accel one, whilse leaving the other ones stock. or stick a really thick piece of rubber onto the pedal.

[Petronas]

What size are your feet?

You know what they say about big/small feet lol :thumbsup:

[rayb3na_]

You know what they say about big/small feet lol :thumbsup:

boy/small shoes? lol

[Petronas]

boy/small shoes? lol

wat lol?

Mugen pedal set
http://i1.iofferphoto.com/img/item/503/550/81/mugen_pedal_set.jpg

[FDBenni]

Revmatching is a bitch on the new gen Hondas where the throttle pivots off the ground especially on light braking, but u get used to it.

[Chernoby1]

Are you actually brakeing hard while doing your toe and heel? If its just light brakeing there is little reason to even heel and toe*

*well for most of the cars i have driven.... just brake, shift out, move foot to acel, bring up revs then put in next gear.... still keeps it smooth.

[night_wolf]

heel toe method is only soposed to be used under heavy braking and in turn the need to downshift. the rev matching enables the engine to transfer power smothly during downshifting without losing power. this is not only controled by the heel toe method but also how well the cluth is realsed. release too late and your revs have droped again, release to early and you lose power

light braking conditions do not require heel toe mate... my teggy has the same issue as you do. all i did was got used to heel toe bare feet this was i had a more sensitive feel to amounth of braking inturn too amount of throttle. afterwards i just becomes a breeze. if you have small feet just get aftermarket pedals as they expent the height and with of the pedals. keeping in mind you would need to get racing pedals as well not the ones they sell at supercheap or autobarn.

[FDBenni]

Even in light braking conditions I still prefer to heel and toe because I like to be in gear and downshift smoothly without the jerk, but most of the time if say I'm approaching a traffic light I downshift before I start braking so I don't need to heal toe.

For those who are learning to heal toe one thing I learnt while doing it is that the harder you brake the softer you blip the throttle, also the higher the gear you're in the softer you blip the throttle.

[JohnL]

heel toe method is only soposed to be used under heavy braking and in turn the need to downshift.

It's a technique that enables smooth downshifts in any conditions and whether or not you are braking heavily or lightly. I use it most of the time as I approach corners, using the engine to assist in smoothly slowing the car. You are then in the correct gear already for corner exit, no fumbling mid corner to select a lower gear (when you really should have both hands on the wheel).

The main difference between heel / toe used when driving in a more sedate manner and in a more 'enthusiastic manner would be that in the former situation the gear shift will tend to be done lower in the rpm range and later as you approach the corner, but when driving more enthusiastically (or racing) you would tend to down shift earlier and at significantly higher rpm.


the rev matching enables the engine to transfer power smothly during downshifting without losing power. this is not only controled by the heel toe method but also how well the cluth is realsed. release too late and your revs have droped again, release to early and you lose power

It's not about "transfer" of power, the engine isn't producing any power (more than is momentarily required to 'blip' the rpm) when coming down through the gears as you approach a corner. It's about being able to smoothly select lower gears in order that the engine compression can assist with slowing the car, and that you are in the correct gear to instantly accelerate away from the corner.

It enables down shifts while braking (with the brakes) without abrupt and excessive engine 'braking' forces being applied to the driving wheels as the clutch pedal is released after the lower gear has been selected. Such excessive and harsh engine braking forces (caused by engine rpm being too low for the selected lower gear and road speed) can cause loss of traction (especially in more slippery conditions) and drive train wear / damage.


light braking conditions do not require heel toe mate...

It's not 'required' in any 'normal' driving conditions with synchromesh gearboxes, but it is smoother, less stressful on drive train components, lessens brake wear and is safer when done correctly. It does use a bit more fuel. The more you do it the more you can do it correctly without needing to think about it.

PS I would avoid doing it when being followed by a Police car, they tend to not understand...

[night_wolf]

u do realise i was refearing too mountain runs sort of driving conditions and not daily driving conditions yeah? johnL

but there is truth to what you say too no disagrements there mate. like the part about not trying when followed by a cop car. lol thats how you get OWNED!!! lol

[Chernoby1]

if your moving slowly you should be able to shift fast enough for there to be no need to blip the throttle at all..... let the clutch do its job. and no, im not talking about grinding your clutch.... release it as fast as you want, and aslong as your smooth, you shouldnt feel a jolt.

And as to when police are bhind you... how exactly do they know you are using t&h? Are you blipping all the way to redline or smth? I do not own a honda, but my car has even less power down low than you guys get and there is no need to really blip the throttle that much in a situation that a cop is behind you. (Wouldn't you be done for reckless driving for braking that hard on a constant basis anyway?)

[JohnL]

if your moving slowly you should be able to shift fast enough for there to be no need to blip the throttle at all..... let the clutch do its job. and no, im not talking about grinding your clutch.... release it as fast as you want, and aslong as your smooth, you shouldnt feel a jolt.

Whatever works for you. Heel and toe is not compulsory with synchro boxes, though in the old old days before synchro you really did need to know how to do it or the gears would just grind.

With correctly functioning synchro all that heel / toe does is avoid a lurch (and the accompanying drive train loadings and wear), and speeds up the shift itself because while synchromesh does allow a grindless shift it is still a slower shift, to varying degrees depending on the disparity between gear rpms. Matching gear rpm allows the gears to engage more quickly (and the synchro rings don't even come into play).


And as to when police are bhind you... how exactly do they know you are using t&h?

Depends how loud your exhaust might be... It wasn't an entirely serious comment.


Are you blipping all the way to redline or smth? I do not own a honda, but my car has even less power down low than you guys get and there is no need to really blip the throttle that much in a situation that a cop is behind you. (Wouldn't you be done for reckless driving for braking that hard on a constant basis anyway?)

It's not necessarily only used when braking hard (i.e. hooning), you might just be braking normally from X speed approaching a corner and using heel / toe so that you'll already be in the correct gear for when you are accelerating out of the corner. I'll often be in say 4th or 5th gear and brake normally up to the corner, then just prior to turning in I'll heel / toe into 2nd (skipping a gear or two) so I'll already be in the correct gear for the corner.

You can just let the clutch slip a fair bit to get a smooth down shift, but heel / toe is smoother without wearing the clutch (my clutches last a long long time, but then I don't abuse them with hard acceleration from rest either).

I heel / toe a lot (more than strictly necessary) because it's a habit I developed while learning to do it properly (it does take practice to perfect the technique), and have done for years. I prefer the way the down shift feels without the synchromesh causing resistance at the shift lever (while it synchronises gear rpm) and it's now second nature, for me the shift just doesn't really feel right unless I do it...

[FDBenni]

IMO even if heel toe isn't necessary I do it anyway because you want your shifts to be as smooth as possible. When you're moving slowly you may not feel it but the second you push your clutch in your revs drop causing engine speed and transmission speed to be unmatched which will cause it to jerk. Remember when you downshift the lower gear will always be at a higher rpm than the higher gear no matter how slow you're going, pushing the clutch in causes rpm to drop which is the opposite of what you want.

[Chernoby1]

I understand that you need to bring the rpm's up when gearing down and you want it smooth, not much dispute about that. But why must the OP hit the accelerator pedal WHILE braking if he's not driving enthusiasticly?
Brake -> Gear out - > coast / bring up rpm's -> Gear in... your doing the same thing, except one step at a time. And if you cant do that smoothly.... there is something wrong with you/ your car.

Still see no need to change the pedal.

(Yes i am very stubborn).

[FDBenni]

In the end its just personal preference and everyone has a different style of driving. When I'm feeling lazy I just revmtach before or after I brake, but IMO if you're able to heel/toe in any condition it's the better option. Reasons are because you're ALWAYS going to be in the right gear, and it's also quicker.

To the OP - what car do you drive? how long have you been heel/toe-ing?

This might be an interesting read:
http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/interior-style-mods/74762-diy-extended-heel-toe-gas-pedal-installation-picture-heavy.html

[BURST]

I drive a dc2r.

When I'm driving normally I don't have to heel-toe, but when I'm driving 'enthusiastically' I can't heel-toe. Even when I have the brake pedal in as far as it can go, I can only blip the throttle to about 2k revs, and even that is a struggle.

And I'm a noob to heel-toeing, so I might just be doing it wrong...