which gearbox oil should i use?

[ig3o]

my gears r starting to get rough and doesnt go into gears sometimes.. and people been telling me to change my gearbox oil.. lol

any advice on which gearbox oil to use.. and how many mL or L do i need to buy

thanks

[JDM-EGG]

haha geo u cac , use motul bro .. just buy like 4 litres should be enough , and save for next time :)

go to shift and buy it

or if u want use water :)

[aaronng]

Use Honda MTF 06. You need about 2 litres for the manual gearbox.

[racerwannabe]

Use Honda MTF 06. You need about 2 litres for the manual gearbox.

Agreed! after i changed mine gear shifts are much smoother and no more crunching.

[aaronng]

And change every 2 years if possible too.

[mrwillz]

2 years or how many km's, 40000?

i just changed mine not long ago, ended up using 2.1L or so.

[aaronng]

2 years or how many km's, 40000?

i just changed mine not long ago, ended up using 2.1L or so.

40000km is right according to the average driving distance. If you find you end up doing a bit more of 40000km in 2 years, I wouldn't worry too much with going past that. It's still better than Honda's service schedule which is over 100000km before you do anything with the transmission fluid.

[power_of_dreams]

40000km is right according to the average driving distance. If you find you end up doing a bit more of 40000km in 2 years, I wouldn't worry too much with going past that. It's still better than Honda's service schedule which is over 100000km before you do anything with the transmission fluid.

I can't beleive that is their recommendation, so rediculous..

[aaronng]

I can't beleive that is their recommendation, so rediculous..

Just found it. Honda recommends that it is changed at 120000km / 6 years.
http://carservice.com.au/car-service-servicing-guide-2.aspx?sid=40349:thumbsup:

[Phased]

At the 100,000km mark I'll probebly be changing mine to Royal Purple Gear oil. That's only because I used it in my old WRX and find it hard not to use it again (even though Honda's MTF is quite good). Shifting improves 3 fold, and gear transitions/noise is cut by half. Also I would rather know that during the 50,000km service interval it still performance as close as possible to the day I put it in there. I used to change the Mineral Oil (MTF 06) in my integra every 15,000kms and everytime I noticed a quite noticable differance in shift smoothness. If a differance in transmission oil is noticable then the fluid deteroriated over a fairly short period of time too much for my liking.

MTF is probebly more than sufficient. My only advice, stay far away from Penrite Products including the synthetic. I used both their Mineral and Synthetic in about 4 differant Honda's and all ended up shifting hard and grinding/notching into third at anything above 4000rpm. Would not go near their products again. Expessially considering Honda MTF at almost a third of the price, performed better...

Edit, awful spelling

[xxb4xx]

Guys there is an oil out there I used with my straight cut gearbox.. Called NEO,

fuc@ing excellent stuff.. 120 for 4 litres.. So much better than motul and royal purple, ps redline shockproof is ok too

[Phased]

Guys there is an oil out there I used with my straight cut gearbox.. Called NEO,

fuc@ing excellent stuff.. 120 for 4 litres..

I have heard mixed opinions on the "Neo Synthetics" product line. Some mechanics are very much against Neo (Engine oil in particular) as they have "narrowed it down" to causing some serious engine problems, in some of their skylines/wrx's. Having said that... I know a couple of people that use it with no problems...


So much better than motul and royal purple, ps redline shockproof is ok too

Firstly, How exactly is it "so much better" than motul/royal purple? Are you an e-mechanic that reads posts of people saying "OMG xxx oil is the best, because the company targets the high end market and they say its the best"?

Do you have any proof of this? Have you actually compared all the oils? If you have you must have fairly deep pockets and change much more often than recommended drain intervals...

I'm not saying that it necessarily isn't better, or you havn't tried it. However, a post like the one above isn't very helpful to the original poster when all you write is an inane opinion.

To be honest, If I was willing to spend the extra/go to the extra effort to purchase it. I would be using Amsoil. No questions. However, I enjoy my discount/5 minute drive to get Royal Purple ;)

[defibros]

I go royal purple!!!!!I had it on my skylne and Wrx before and it's awesome!!! Even the engine oil is great !!!just a bit pricey :(

[xxb4xx]

To phased..

Yes it was so much better.

First of all u never said to use NEO as engine oil, but as gearbox .
When you have paid thousands for a gearbox that will actually handle power you need the best you can get.

To be honest you all, including myself can use water as gearbox oil, these cars don't make power to need good gearboxes or oil.

For me, motul starting overheating in my box and turned to shit.
It became harder to change gears and the box was getting louder and louder.
This is the same for royal purple, another brand people buy cause everyone else is, i'd rather use cooking oil.

So to sum this up,

One day you are going to be a big boy, and own a car that makes more than 35kw at the wheels, when you do, all of what I'm saying to you will make sense.

P.s if you don't know what straight cut gears are google it..

[tony1234]

I have heard mixed opinions on the "Neo Synthetics" product line. Some mechanics are very much against Neo (Engine oil in particular) as they have "narrowed it down" to causing some serious engine problems, in some of their skylines/wrx's. Having said that... I know a couple of people that use it with no problems...



Firstly, How exactly is it "so much better" than motul/royal purple? Are you an e-mechanic that reads posts of people saying "OMG xxx oil is the best, because the company targets the high end market and they say its the best"?

Do you have any proof of this? Have you actually compared all the oils? If you have you must have fairly deep pockets and change much more often than recommended drain intervals...

I'm not saying that it necessarily isn't better, or you havn't tried it. However, a post like the one above isn't very helpful to the original poster when all you write is an inane opinion.

To be honest, If I was willing to spend the extra/go to the extra effort to purchase it. I would be using Amsoil. No questions. However, I enjoy my discount/5 minute drive to get Royal Purple ;)
So what other MTF would you suggest apart from the Honda one?It seems to be pretty good.By the way what is your background?Are you mechanic or something else as your avatar says suspension/chassis guru.:)

[aaronng]

I go royal purple!!!!!I had it on my skylne and Wrx before and it's awesome!!! Even the engine oil is great !!!just a bit pricey :(

Royal Purple may be great for other gearboxes, but those are spec'd to use 75w90. Honda uses 75w80, which is a grade thinner when warm. Interestingly, I have compared both Royal Purple and Honda MTF from the bottle and the Royal Purple was like warm honey, while Honda MTF was like slightly thicker cooking oil. That is a big difference in viscosity eventhough this was at 20 C and the 80/90 viscosity is measured at 100 C.

[aaronng]

So what other MTF would you suggest apart from the Honda one?It seems to be pretty good.By the way what is your background?Are you mechanic or something else as your avatar says suspension/chassis guru.:)
I have tried Elf MTF 75w80 and have no problems on the street or on the track. I still have Elf in my gearbox now.

[aaronng]

fuc@ing excellent stuff.. 120 for 4 litres.. So much better than motul and royal purple, ps redline shockproof is ok too
Redline Shockproofis NOT ok. Looking for the shockproof thread with many Honda owners having smoother shifts at first and then gear wear after long term!

[tony1234]

I have tried Elf MTF 75w80 and have no problems on the street or on the track. I still have Elf in my gearbox now.
Would you rate it better than the Honda MTF and why?:D

[xxb4xx]

I have tried Elf MTF 75w80 and have no problems on the street or on the track. I still have Elf in my gearbox now.

Where did you find Elf???

it's like trying to find a leprachaun.

Would love to try out Elf.. I need to do my GB oil, i just hit 80k,

I was gonna settle for standard run of the mill Castrol MTF, but wouldn't mind hitting elf, as I bang the car around a bit

[aaronng]

Where did you find Elf???

it's like trying to find a leprachaun.

Would love to try out Elf.. I need to do my GB oil, i just hit 80k,

I was gonna settle for standard run of the mill Castrol MTF, but wouldn't mind hitting elf, as I bang the car around a bit

You'll have to order it in I believe. I got mine from Toda Australia when I had a part installed in my gearbox. They had a drum of the stuff.

[aaronng]

Would you rate it better than the Honda MTF and why?:D

I can't tell the difference, which is good. Shifts are all as smooth as Honda MTF 06. The deciding factor will be how long it lasts. I've had it in for almost 1 year now, and gone through 1 trackday.

[ig3o]

haha geo u cac , use motul bro .. just buy like 4 litres should be enough , and save for next time :)

go to shift and buy it

or if u want use water :)

lol its 40 bux a litre for motul at shift =O

[Phased]

So to sum this up,

One day you are going to be a big boy, and own a car that makes more than 35kw at the wheels, when you do, all of what I'm saying to you will make sense.

P.s if you don't know what straight cut gears are google it..

Ah, the typical emotional response. Although you haven't offered any real information to the OP, as the gear box's your talking about are completely differant to those of the Euro. You have made me laugh, which is good for something.

First of all. Big boy? Original.

You can see the the cars ive owned in my avatar, The wrx after I sold it got swapped with a prebuilt PPG straight cut box which I drove. Very whiny, and uneccesary for the street in my opinion. Although AWD's are well known for transmission failure, when driven hard. Gets the attention of pedestrians/cops.

You would also well know that all of them have at least triple that figure to the wheels... So again, well done... another supurb insult.

The worst part about your whole post, is that you didn't realise... I NEVER once said it wasn't better than royal purple/motul nor was a personally attacking you (excluding the mild e-mechanic comment, I love to joke :angel:). I was criticizing your post. It wasn't helpful the OP, that was my only real point.




This is the same for royal purple, another brand people buy cause everyone else is, i'd rather use cooking oil.

A comment that isn't even worth addressing.

/end discussion


Royal Purple may be great for other gearboxes, but those are spec'd to use 75w90. Honda uses 75w80, which is a grade thinner when warm. Interestingly, I have compared both Royal Purple and Honda MTF from the bottle and the Royal Purple was like warm honey, while Honda MTF was like slightly thicker cooking oil. That is a big difference in viscosity eventhough this was at 20 C and the 80/90 viscosity is measured at 100 C.

aaronng, you better be joking, lol. I have been told by two differant honda service centers that the 6MT Euro should use 75w90 (apparently the viscosity of Honda MTF 06) I thought it was odd as the integra was spec'd to use MTF 06 however it was 75w80. Interesting. How did you come accross the viscosity required? It doesn't mention in my service book or on the bottle. Which is why I double checked with the service centre.


Redline Shockproofis NOT ok. Looking for the shockproof thread with many Honda owners having smoother shifts at first and then gear wear after long term!

I can second that. In my WRX it did NOT respond well to shockproof (original owner was using it). Nothing that would cause collateral damage of course. However, it caused notchy shifting.


So what other MTF would you suggest apart from the Honda one?It seems to be pretty good.By the way what is your background?Are you mechanic or something else as your avatar says suspension/chassis guru.:)

I have spent a large chunk of my life since I was about 10, at my uncles workshop (BM Specialist) either working or annoying him, until he sold it a few years ago. Ever since then, my spare time is either modifying/engineering chassis/suspension modifications or servicing cars, most of them friends lol. I had the ambition of becoming a Specialist Mechanic, however I got into a couple of University Courses and decided to take the more "secure/mature" option in the long run. :zip:

I was suggesting MTF, lol. Unless you have money to spend, I wouldn't recommend anything else. I would however, recommend much shorter change intervals. Honda MTF is more than sufficient even if you drive hard as long as its changed every 15-20,000kms. Dr. Spoon (Tsuchiya) recommended changing the transmission fluid every engine oil change :eek:

In the higher end of the scale, for a euro. I would recommend sourcing some Amsoil if you really want to go all out. The major benefit of synthetic fluids (excluding marginally enhanced lubrication qualities) is extended life. Synthetic fluids are more resistant to Oxidization and breakdown. If you compare Honda MTF to Amsoil when they are both new, the differance will but MUCH less than when they were both 10,000kms old.

I would also take into consideration any oils that aaronng recommends. He is known to be somewhat of an oil/fuel guru :p

[aaronng]

aaronng, you better be joking, lol. I have been told by two differant honda service centers that the 6MT Euro should use 75w90 (apparently the viscosity of Honda MTF 06) I thought it was odd as the integra was spec'd to use MTF 06 however it was 75w80. Interesting. How did you come accross the viscosity required? It doesn't mention in my service book or on the bottle. Which is why I double checked with the service centre.

The Euro definitely requires 75w80. Not sure why those Honda service centers (are they dealers?) said to use 75w90, especially if Honda doesn't sell a 75w90 MTF. I suspect that those service centers use whatever gearbox oil they have in the drum, which is usually 75w90 because that is cheap and common (used by many other car brands). That was the case for my dealer where they used magnatec instead of FEO, just because they could use magnatec in the other cars that they serviced there.

Honda MTF Plus (which is the original Honda MTF) and HondaMTF 06 (which is the equivalent to Honda/Acura MTF II) are 75w80. I have the service manual for the Euro and it says specifically to use MTF II. It even says not to use engine oil in the gearbox, which was actually recommended for older Hondas.

I also have an Acura bulletin announcing MTF II 75w80 (MTF 06) and saying it is for all Acuras/Hondas and that all new vehicles would come with it from the factory beginning 2007.

[STTICH]

will MTF 06 be good for older cars as well?

[aaronng]

will MTF 06 be good for older cars as well?

For older Hondas, yes. It replaced MTF Plus and original MTF.

[xxb4xx]

Reply back to "Phased"

Nice.. I like when someone tries to disprove me, and can actually back themselves up,

Nice reply, and fair enough, I wasn't aware of your sarcasm, so I took it as a flame.

But, all well addressed.

In regards to viscocity of the GB oil,

75-80 and 75-90, both will do fine in the box.. especially for the earlier model Euro's like mine, i'd be pushing for the 75-90 in mine.

[Phased]

Reply back to "Phased"

Nice.. I like when someone tries to disprove me, and can actually back themselves up,

Nice reply, and fair enough, I wasn't aware of your sarcasm, so I took it as a flame.

But, all well addressed.

In regards to viscocity of the GB oil,

75-80 and 75-90, both will do fine in the box.. especially for the earlier model Euro's like mine, i'd be pushing for the 75-90 in mine.

Haha, no problems.

Yeah, I was thinking that. However, I never really drive hard so using an oil of a heavier viscosity wouldn't be necessary/the best idea. I would probebly want to use something like Royal Purple/Amsoil/Neo in my trans if I was doing drags/track work. However for the street, I think OEM will suffice. Unless someone can find me a DAMN DEALER for Amsoil in Melbourne.

Have you ever used Neo Engine oil? I've spoken to two mechanics (one in particular) which say that they/customers have used they narrowed it down to the oil most likely causing head damage/seal damage. I don't see how an API approved oil would do this....

[aaronng]

In regards to viscocity of the GB oil,

75-80 and 75-90, both will do fine in the box.. especially for the earlier model Euro's like mine, i'd be pushing for the 75-90 in mine.
Why would an older gearbox require 75w90 over 75w80? Have you opened the gearbox to confirm that the tolerance has increased to require a thicker oil?

[xxb4xx]

Ok,

Phased- never used neo engine oil to be honest, only gearbox.. Out of all the oils for engines, I'm a fan of FUCHS 10-40, it's made for jap performance engines, and high revving engines, and it's cheaper than most oils too, eg castrol edge..(which I like too)

Aaronng, if your box has copped a beating, or you have a lot of km's there is nothing wrong with jumping up a notch in oil, obviously if your car is relatively new, not driven hard, and has low k's, stick to oem specs..

Mine has 75 on the clock, but I drive cars relatively hard.. So as a precaution I'm planning on jumping up a notch.. But no one has to, the oem spec is fine, it's just my personal choice.

[Phased]

Ok,

Phased- never used neo engine oil to be honest, only gearbox.. Out of all the oils for engines, I'm a fan of FUCHS 10-40, it's made for jap performance engines, and high revving engines, and it's cheaper than most oils too, eg castrol edge..(which I like too)

When I had my integra rebuilt after 1500kms I was using Fuchs GTO 10w30 Semi-Synthetic. I liked it. Then after 10,000kms switched to full synthetics. Had Motul 300V Full-Synthetic in there and dispised it. Changed it after 1200kms. Made the engine very chattery/lacked response down low. It was the same viscosity too. It's been Royal Purple ever since.

I wouldn't mind trying out neo, expessially for the summer as you can actually obtain the 10w30 in Australia unlike Royal Purple. However, I can't get past what mechanics have told me. So I really want to get Amsoil but I can't for the life of me find a retail outlet in melbourne.

[xxb4xx]

Why don't you checkout www.rocketindustries.com.au

They usually have everything and anything, ask them to post it?

Ps. 10-30 would be awesome for winter time in a high boosted suby, I could only ever find 5-30

[aaronng]

Ok,

Phased- never used neo engine oil to be honest, only gearbox.. Out of all the oils for engines, I'm a fan of FUCHS 10-40, it's made for jap performance engines, and high revving engines, and it's cheaper than most oils too, eg castrol edge..(which I like too)

Aaronng, if your box has copped a beating, or you have a lot of km's there is nothing wrong with jumping up a notch in oil, obviously if your car is relatively new, not driven hard, and has low k's, stick to oem specs..

Mine has 75 on the clock, but I drive cars relatively hard.. So as a precaution I'm planning on jumping up a notch.. But no one has to, the oem spec is fine, it's just my personal choice.
Yeah, I'm just picking on this because I have 82,000km and 5 trackdays on mine and 75w80 is still fine.

[xxb4xx]

Having a track day or 2, won't really hurt the box that much, if you are shifting correctly, and not over-doing it..

But when start banging the gears with the clutch being flung up and aggressive, gears and gearboxes don't like that too much (trust me, I know the hard way LOL), and to keep the oil in the box working just that bit longer while you are smashing it, I'd go the thicker..

but if the car is still relatively new, and all is in good shape and looked after, the OEM is more than fine.

I'm just a little podantic, and prefer going that little bit thicker.. especially for the 1st - 2nd gear shift.. it's always the hardest one anyone will do..

[ig3o]

sorry im still abit noob at this.. which one would be a thicker oil.. higher the number or lower? 75w80 or 75w90 etc..

and my cars done 58,xxx kms.. and my friend recommended the castrol one.. any experiences with the castrol transmission oil?

[aaronng]

sorry im still abit noob at this.. which one would be a thicker oil.. higher the number or lower? 75w80 or 75w90 etc..

and my cars done 58,xxx kms.. and my friend recommended the castrol one.. any experiences with the castrol transmission oil?

The first number is viscosity at cold temperature, the second number is viscosity when the gearbox is warmish.

If it is 75w80 and can be used with manual synchromesh gearbox, then you can use it.

[xxb4xx]

sorry im still abit noob at this.. which one would be a thicker oil.. higher the number or lower? 75w80 or 75w90 etc..

and my cars done 58,xxx kms.. and my friend recommended the castrol one.. any experiences with the castrol transmission oil?

castrol oil is fine, no issues.. Some people eg me, are picky with what the car gets.. Stick to oem (Honda) specifications and you'll be fine

[Phased]

sorry im still abit noob at this.. which one would be a thicker oil.. higher the number or lower? 75w80 or 75w90 etc..

and my cars done 58,xxx kms.. and my friend recommended the castrol one.. any experiences with the castrol transmission oil?

If I were you, unless you're going to purchase something that's a large jump from OEM (eg. Fully Synthetic) not to mention the correct viscosity (75w80, as aaronng mentioned). I would stick with OEM Honda MTF 06. It's cheaper or similar price to off the shelf minerals/semi synthetics and it's proven to be good. No point in getting an average after market brand for a price that's similar or more expensive that what you can get OEM for...

[aaronng]

It is also better to use change MTF often (every 2 years), than to use a super expensive synthetic and not change for (6-8 years)

[Hanice]

Hi,

Does anyone know where the drain plug for the transmisson is on a accord euro 2004?

[aaronng]

Hi,

Does anyone know where the drain plug for the transmisson is on a accord euro 2004?

Should be the lowest bolt with a 3/8" square drive on the transmission case. Not sure if it is facing the left or right side of the transmission case. Usually faces the passenger side but it could be the opposite side as in the case of the TSX.

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/3595/sda3aebe10400013001kbad.png

[Hanice]

Thanks Aaronng.

I have that pick from tuning dvd I boought ebay.
I can't seem to replicate that under the car. I will try again

[10KRPM]

Abit off topic but what about the auto trans? any decent aftermarket alternatives? comparable on a cost /quality perspective?

[aaronng]

Abit off topic but what about the auto trans? any decent aftermarket alternatives? comparable on a cost /quality perspective?

Use ONLY Honda ATF. If you use the lube finder tools on Castrol's website, it actually says to use the manufacturer's ATF.

[Phased]

Use ONLY Honda ATF. If you use the lube finder tools on Castrol's website, it actually says to use the manufacturer's ATF.

To be honest, if you have a standard transmission I don't see the point/need to use anything other than Honda MTF/ATF. Honda transmissions are built very well. The fact they are FWD helps (Less stress, less power loss etc.)

Aftermarket oils in AWD's and cars with higher torque is understandable due to the stress they are under (and also the fact if the car has torque and is RWD it most likely isn't a honda... so the OEM oil may not be as good).

[10KRPM]

To be honest, if you have a standard transmission I don't see the point/need to use anything other than Honda MTF/ATF. Honda transmissions are built very well. The fact they are FWD helps (Less stress, less power loss etc.)

Aftermarket oils in AWD's and cars with higher torque is understandable due to the stress they are under (and also the fact if the car has torque and is RWD it most likely isn't a honda... so the OEM oil may not be as good).


Your logic is flawed there. You do not need higher outputs to warrant changing over to a non factory oil. There are countless examples of where 3rd party companies produce a similar or exact same version of oil(s) for a similar price or even lower?

Why else would you have people with stock standard cars , buy semi syn oils when mineral based will do? Even performance cars, why buy full syn when semi will do? the examples are endless.

And being rwd does not mean it can use aftermarket oils better...........where did that statement come from?

[Phased]

Your logic is flawed there. You do not need higher outputs to warrant changing over to a non factory oil. There are countless examples of where 3rd party companies produce a similar or exact same version of oil(s) for a similar price or even lower?

Why else would you have people with stock standard cars , buy semi syn oils when mineral based will do? Even performance cars, why buy full syn when semi will do? the examples are endless.

It's not a debate just over the base stock of the oils used. It's a debate over viscosity, API/GL service ratings, additives, Esters etc. They design an OEM oil for use in the Standard transmission.

My Point was Honda's design and build good transmissions and good transmission oil... Wheras most of the other manufacturers deliver fairly average OEM oils. There is no real need to change it if your doing street/occasional track driving. Honda AT transmissions are very sensitive to which oils are used thus why as aaronng said even the aftermarket brands specify OEM oil. Noticed how most manual Honda Transmissions specify 75w80 and most other cars specify a 75w90?

The reason I mentioned built AWD's/RWD's as they usually have higher torque and more stress put on the transmission (WRX is a great example) when I owned my WRX even the differance between a good Synthetic and a better synthetic was noticable. (Redline vs Royal Purple vs Castrol). In my old DC2... no matter which oil I used... OEM always felt just as good or better... The reason people use aftermarket oils in these cars is there is belief that you need to, if driving it harder than usual.


And being rwd does not mean it can use aftermarket oils better...........where did that statement come from?

That isn't what I said. Rear Wheel drive vehicles usually come from manufacturers that produce OEM oils that are of inferior quality to honda's and also most of them are put under a larger amount of stress.

Main Point: Honda's have less Torque, Are Built better, and produce very good quality OEM Oils so it is not as necessary nor would i recommend using anything other than an OEM oil for a standard transmission. If your box has been rebuilt with aftermarket equipment (have a few mates which have PPG's in their WRX's, then you use the oil that the builder specifies.)