please help? b16b with cams.

[Redlinemotorsport]

hi guys, questions for the tuners/mechanics out there.
i have buddyclub spec IV cams, valve springs, retainers, and gears.
in a b16b that has been midly ported and polished, new valves, and a SLIGHT mill.
i also have a full exhaust and cold air intake.

i was hoping that someone else with a similar setup could tell me how there car runs.
because i recently got my car tuned with a hondata s300 and it runs like absolute crap.
backfiring,
NO torque under 3000k,
and sounds like a tractor on idle....

now, here is a wierd problem.
the low lobe on the cam is making 140 atw kw at 8.5k rpm.
and if u engauge vtec at the normal range, 5-6; it drops the power and torque curve dramatically.
but the tuner told me if u engauge at 8k that it keeps the power curve going.
but 1000 of vtec? sounds pretty shitty to me.

i was hoping that someone could tell me if its a dialling of the cams issue,
if the cams are too big for the car,
if the tuning is wrong,
alittle help is needed honda enthusiasts.

thankyou.

[Limbo]

sounds more like a tune problem.
the cams are prob large but you should be able to tune it out.

reason being is that the b16b already comes with the most aggressive cam that honda had. I don't see why it would not react properly to other good cams.

[Redlinemotorsport]

i know that the cams have just over 300 degrees of duration?

[lil_foy]

When will people realise being in vtec isnt the greatest thing since sliced bread.

You use vtec to have the ability to have a smaller cam for lowend power and when that smaller lobe becomes innificent you switch to the larger lobe that will keep the power consistant.

[Redlinemotorsport]

When will people realise being in vtec isnt the greatest thing since sliced bread.

You use vtec to have the ability to have a smaller cam for lowend power and when that smaller lobe becomes innificent you switch to the larger lobe that will keep the power consistant.

no shit.
but when my lower cam doesnt make ANY power below 3000 there is something wrong. thats what the smaller lobe is for isnt it?? LOW END power? e.g below 3000? not for 8000?
esp considering that buddyclub cams begin at stage 3 and go to 6, stage four sounds pretty mild.

thanks for your extremely helpful and informative comment.

[delsol9000rpms]

cam timing might be retarted thats why it might be making power so high... is it an engine dyno? cause thats some big numbers out of a b16.

[fatboyz39]

Throw your stock cams back in. BC spec 4 are a HUGE cam for a B16B.... They work better with bigger displacement/stroke (b18B/B20B). Unless you have some ridiculous comp it wont work.

[lil_foy]

You're using a big cam.

Your small lobe is actually ****ing huge hence the lack of power down low.

If oem cams cross over at 5000ish at their tiny size, why would your cams be that low?


no shit.
but when my lower cam doesnt make ANY power below 3000 there is something wrong. thats what the smaller lobe is for isnt it?? LOW END power? e.g below 3000? not for 8000?
esp considering that buddyclub cams begin at stage 3 and go to 6, stage four sounds pretty mild.

thanks for your extremely helpful and informative comment.

[delsol9000rpms]

Throw your stock cams back in. BC spec 4 are a HUGE cam for a B16B.... They work better with bigger displacement/stroke (b18B/B20B). Unless you have some ridiculous comp it wont work.

even with stock b16b comp those cams will still work. there is a cam timing issue hence the high end power.

[fatboyz39]

even with stock b16b comp those cams will still work. there is a cam timing issue hence the high end power.

Yes can be cam timing. Its a HUGE cam for a b16b. Go throw your stock ones back on and see the difference. In our 2.0L motor B series our cam isnt as big as BC spec 4. So go figure.

[Slaz]

Sounds like a timing/install issue, and given the smaller stroke/revs, if the comp is there, they should work fine........................ but i wanna see this 1.6ltr 140kw atw dyno sheet! :thumbsup:

[delsol9000rpms]

Sounds like a timing/install issue, and given the smaller stroke/revs, if the comp is there, they should work fine........................ but i wanna see this 1.6ltr 140kw atw dyno sheet! :thumbsup:

Quoted for truth.. Small capacity doesnt mean big cams dont work... As long as the compression is there they will work very well. Im running Toda Spec C's on less than 10.9:1 compression and I certainly dont have any issues below 3000rpms LOL I thought i would mention that since the Toda Spec C cams have big Primary cam lobes too..

[dsp26]

this mite sound retarded but vtec control wired up backwards (or tuned wrong)? high cam starts first and when crossover happens it actually switches to low cam?

do you have an oil pressure gauge by any chance to check my theory?

[imratedpg]

my cuz had the same setup on his b18c2 and it had similar problem like you it doesnt idle properly, backfires and vtec engages at like 7k it ran like sht so he reverted back to stock

[Benson]

Who told you to put spec 4's in your motor?

[Redlinemotorsport]

not an engine dyno.

and its sounding like there are two opinions here.

that the cams are too big.

or that they have been installed/tuned incorrectly.

will someone give me a 100 % sure thing,

who has worked with, and who knows BC cams?

[CRXer]

ive only seen a set of IV's once & the biggest impression they left on me was,gee thats a big set of primary lobes.

& any evidence ive ever seen of their application was to larger capacity motors with comps of at least 11.8+,so i think if your gonna persist with them in such a mild build,its hardly gonna be a comfortable daily driver.

btw ronny,its near impossible to wire up wrong with honda vtec ecu,u would have to be using a non vtec specific ecu to get something like that wrong.

[fatboyz39]

not an engine dyno.

and its sounding like there are two opinions here.

that the cams are too big.

or that they have been installed/tuned incorrectly.

will someone give me a 100 % sure thing,

who has worked with, and who knows BC cams?

Dont think tuning can be that Wrong. Did the installer dial the cams as to the instruction sheets?

We have used BC spec 4, dont have much to say but there a HUGE cam and works with the bigger capcity motors. I know of a set floating in a LS/VTEC motor with decent head work done, 12 + comp and it worked well.

[SPEEDCORE]

Interestingly enough.....

http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/15_buddyclub.shtml (http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/15_buddyclub.shtml)

[Redlinemotorsport]

Interestingly enough.....

http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/15_buddyclub.shtml (http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/15_buddyclub.shtml)




well that seems to prove that its the tuning/dialling in the cams issue.
that car has good torque, great power.
thankyou very much.

[Redlinemotorsport]

Dont think tuning can be that Wrong. Did the installer dial the cams as to the instruction sheets?

We have used BC spec 4, dont have much to say but there a HUGE cam and works with the bigger capcity motors. I know of a set floating in a LS/VTEC motor with decent head work done, 12 + comp and it worked well.

and how much headwork can i do?
valves syncroseated,
ported,
polished,
and milled....

[CRXer]

Interestingly enough.....

http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/15_buddyclub.shtml (http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/15_buddyclub.shtml)

that article is very vague regarding the actual extent of the build on the motor & mentions nothing on the streetability of the final result.

[delsol9000rpms]

http://www.tprmag.com/issue/15/peak.html

Check out that graph... Doesn't it look like it would be driveable on those cams ??

[Redlinemotorsport]

yup it does.

[BlitZ]

cam timing might be retarted thats why it might be making power so high... is it an engine dyno? cause thats some big numbers out of a b16.


This would also be my explanation..

Drop you tuner.. and go elsewhere.. ahha maybe

[fatboyz39]

You need some vtec killer cams for your b16b.

[delsol9000rpms]

nah you need to change your b16b CTR cams over to ITR cams because ITR cams are the best even though they are the same. My mate has 600kwatw all motor just using ITR cams.

[ZeForce]

nah you need to change your b16b CTR cams over to ITR cams because ITR cams are the best even though they are the same. My mate has 600kwatw all motor just using ITR cams.

Apparently if you use toda C cams in a stock B16a it will give you more power and torque than a fully built B20VTEC, true story

[delsol9000rpms]

Apparently if you use toda C cams in a stock B16a it will give you more power and torque than a fully built B20VTEC, true story

Whoever said that is an absoulte nut.. I know i never did.

I know i would rather have b16a turbo push 167kw than a b20vtec n/a though... LOL

[ZeForce]

Whoever said that is an absoulte nut.. I know i never did.

I know i would rather have b16a turbo push 167kw though... LOL

Your ignorance is frustrating, you cant seem to understand that even if you had a turbo b16a making 167kw, it would simply lack the same midrange torque as my B20VTEC which is 1/2 the fun...

Sorry to the OP, I will stop spamming your thread :o

[delsol9000rpms]

i no that a b20 vs b16a is much better... i was simply pointing out that your car didnt make good power? well at least thats my opinion.

lets get something straight.. b20 > b16a anyday of the week and twice on sunday...

[fatboyz39]

nah you need to change your b16b CTR cams over to ITR cams because ITR cams are the best even though they are the same. My mate has 600kwatw all motor just using ITR cams.

Great advice for those noobs out there:thumbsup:

[jdm18c]

Great advice for those noobs out there:thumbsup:

lol didnt it mention that when you searched it on google!