s2k tuning?

[dc5ive]

hi guys, just wondering with ur experences....
where inn melbourne can i get my s2000 tuned ??
and what i ecu options are recommended??
piggy back .. like a hondata?
or a standalone ecu would be better

ive got basic engine mods
air intake, exhaust and headers

is it worth getting a tune or should i save my pennys?

[mikoZ]

if money no a problem , go for MOTEC, can tuned by PUAL @ CHASERS

or a AEM, also good one and much cheaper

[WhiteAP1]

Motec is awesome and so is Chasers (they built my engine), but considering your mods, Motec is massive overkill and I doubt you'd be making the most of the unit. Most likely it will no longer be daily driver friendly, but if its a dedicated track car, why not! Ive got quite a long list of mods including engine internals and all i run/need is an apexi neo. I spoke to Paul about a stand alone ECU and he re-affirmed what I thought and explained that the 2-3 thousand spent on a stand alone ecu will not be worth the 3 odd kw that may be squeezed out and it will affect the cars drivability.


End of the day it depends what you want from your car and what ratio of cost vs. benefit you can justify.

[stndrd]

speak to Trent and Sebastian @ STATUS TUNING (ph: 03 9792 3333)
they are the authorised distributors and tuners for the GReddy eManage but will tune just about anything.

[alvin_R]

why not try a Js,spoon or mugen lug and play ecu?? cause i spoke a distributor in HK they said it will be fine to run in our car with the com ratio!!

[mikoZ]

does the j's; spoon and mugen is re flashable? if not, i just wondering how these ecu will 100% suitable for a car runing under different environment.

[alvin_R]

according the wedsite explaination, those ecu has been re fine the map via the manufactor, and some of them u can change the on cam rev, so just for my own opinion , it will get the better balance in between the power and lifetime of the engine. plz correct me if im wrong ^^ because im decide to get js one so....

[7ypeR]

Motec is awesome and so is Chasers (they built my engine), but considering your mods, Motec is massive overkill and I doubt you'd be making the most of the unit. Most likely it will no longer be daily driver friendly, but if its a dedicated track car, why not! Ive got quite a long list of mods including engine internals and all i run/need is an apexi neo. I spoke to Paul about a stand alone ECU and he re-affirmed what I thought and explained that the 2-3 thousand spent on a stand alone ecu will not be worth the 3 odd kw that may be squeezed out and it will affect the cars drivability.


End of the day it depends what you want from your car and what ratio of cost vs. benefit you can justify.

When running an ecu in the s2k, you can't piggyback them so you will have to run a stand-alone. This includes the hondata, which requires you to buy a the full kpro ecu rather than plug into your factory unit. In saying that though, the price is quite exxy so you might also want to consider the Autronic or Motec units. Only thing obviously being that Hondata is a factory honda unit so it will probably RUN your car the best. Whether or not it tunes better, you have to contact your tuner.

On another note, I can understand what your saying about weighing up cost v benefit. You may get only give/take 3-5kw on top of the Apex Neo but that does not include the gains from low-mid range tuning. With the complete ecu, you have a tuning window for low cam (non-vtec), and a separate tuning window for high cam (vtec). This means you could probably adjust the tuning points for every 100-250rpm compared to the Neo which MAY be every 500-1000rpm (guessing). The Hondata i believe has a 20x20 matrix for tuning, whilst the Motec is 25x25 (please don't quote me, this is from memory years ago).

It is at the end of the day, cost v benefit. :thumbsup:

[AusS2000]

Firstly, the S2000 is pretty well tuned from the factory so gains with only NA mods (short of ITBs) will be modest.

The most popular piggybacks are the V-AFC and the E-manage Blue and Ultimate. The VAFC allows you to add and subtract fuel across the range and adjust VTEC engagement. The E-manage Blue does the same but also allows some rough adjustment to ignition timing but I don't believe it is very useful. The E-manage Ultimate however is a much more capable unit and allows full adjustment of ignition timing.

In plug and play options there is the venerable (and highly capable) AEM EMS and the Hondata.

The AEM is what I use. It is truly plug and tune and very comprehensive. It has maps for fuel, ignition, boost control, traction control, nitrous control, launch control and closed loop feedback from an O2 sensor just to name a few. I'm am just scratching the surface of it capabilities. The complexity however is also a downside as few know how to get the best from it. Oh and you lose you temp gauge but it can be restored with Modifry's ECT.

The Hondata is not strictly plug and tune as you have to replace various sensors and your valve cover to get it working. It is highly capable I am assure but I know there is a lot to do to get it to the same capabilities as the AEM.

As for Motec etc, they are custom installs, will have problems driving the OEM dash and cost an absolute fortune to have even half the facilities of the AEM.

[AusS2000]

Oh, and the JDM brand name (J's, Spoon, Mugen etc) ecus are a waste of money. They are tuned to the absolute limit on JDM fuel which is 100 octane and remove such safety features as ignition retard on knock. That is a combination that will cost you an engine.

[eliack]

"The E-manage Ultimate however is a much more capable unit and allows full adjustment of ignition timing."

can anyone confirm that?

[WhiteAP1]

When running an ecu in the s2k, you can't piggyback them so you will have to run a stand-alone. This includes the hondata, which requires you to buy a the full kpro ecu rather than plug into your factory unit. In saying that though, the price is quite exxy so you might also want to consider the Autronic or Motec units. Only thing obviously being that Hondata is a factory honda unit so it will probably RUN your car the best. Whether or not it tunes better, you have to contact your tuner.

On another note, I can understand what your saying about weighing up cost v benefit. You may get only give/take 3-5kw on top of the Apex Neo but that does not include the gains from low-mid range tuning. With the complete ecu, you have a tuning window for low cam (non-vtec), and a separate tuning window for high cam (vtec). This means you could probably adjust the tuning points for every 100-250rpm compared to the Neo which MAY be every 500-1000rpm (guessing).


What do you mean you CANT piggyback the oem ecu??? Thousands have done it before, hell im doing it now. I agree with Aus, the hondata is too much of a dickaround considering the other options out there and with the plug and play pre tunned J's, Spoon etc ecu's your begging for detonation or knocking.

What I was trying to illustrate, that even with a piggyback ecu, like the apexi neo (a very simple unit) even on a internally modified NA engine (sleeves,pistons,valves, valve springs....) its pretty much all thats required. A more complicated ECU may get you 2-5 extra kilowatts but it will effect the cars daily drivability and you will lose some functionality however minor. For example Chasers tunned a S2k fitted with a motec M800 and typical bolt on mods and got 150 atw. My car made made 3 more kw, can still average 400-450 km per tank (compared to about 250 with the M800) and my midrange is better (100kw at 6K rpm and 138kw at 7K rpm)

All im saying is that for a NA set up (even with a bit of work) a "rip you balls off" ECU isnt gonna make a huge difference (like FI does) no matter how well the unit can be tunned or how small the rpm gaps.

[FLICK]

Motec is awesome and so is Chasers (they built my engine), but considering your mods, Motec is massive overkill and I doubt you'd be making the most of the unit. Most likely it will no longer be daily driver friendly, but if its a dedicated track car, why not! Ive got quite a long list of mods including engine internals and all i run/need is an apexi neo. I spoke to Paul about a stand alone ECU and he re-affirmed what I thought and explained that the 2-3 thousand spent on a stand alone ecu will not be worth the 3 odd kw that may be squeezed out and it will affect the cars drivability.


End of the day it depends what you want from your car and what ratio of cost vs. benefit you can justify.

TRUE! Motec is overkill and very expensive.

[7ypeR]

sorry WhiteAp1 but what I meant to say was that you cannot chip/over-ride the factory ecu with like hondata, chrome or neptune. With hondata you need to replace the whole unit.

In regards to cars not running properly, i don't know much about tuners in melb, but in bris, car's that run Motec/Autronic, most run like they came from factory. When you buy the unit, the base map for your car is pre-loaded into the ecu to it'll drive normal immediately. My mate's evo runs the m800 and it starts and drives the same as when he bought it only faster due to tuning and bigger turbo.

In regards to your comparison of the stock s2k running only 250klms per-tank, i'd recommend he go get an A/F gauge as it seems his motor is running rich.

Back on topic, I'd recommend James @Revzone in Melb to tune as I had him come to bris to tune my turbo dc5. It's runs great on stock internals and does over 400klms per tank (including spirited driving here/there).

[iwantvtec]

call up andy from akmotorworks. He,ll be able to help u out.

[F20C]

honda-Tech or another Honda specialst behind honda tech cant remember the name of the top of my head.. or check up chasers..

[WhiteAP1]

sorry WhiteAp1 but what I meant to say was that you cannot chip/over-ride the factory ecu with like hondata, chrome or neptune. With hondata you need to replace the whole unit.

I know what you mean. Only ecu's from 06 and up can be flashed


In regards to cars not running properly, i don't know much about tuners in melb, but in bris, car's that run Motec/Autronic, most run like they came from factory. When you buy the unit, the base map for your car is pre-loaded into the ecu to it'll drive normal immediately. My mate's evo runs the m800 and it starts and drives the same as when he bought it only faster due to tuning and bigger turbo.

I agree, but I dont exactly mean the car wont run properly im saying depending on the ecu you may loose things like the imobiliser, guages and even sensors or have to replace them, not to mention poor fuel consumption. Considering the small gains and the high price, IMO I dont think this is worth it.


In regards to your comparison of the stock s2k running only 250klms per-tank, i'd recommend he go get an A/F gauge as it seems his motor is running rich.

Sorry I musn't have expressed myself clearly. The s2000 with the M800 only gets 250 per tank with 150 atw. I have a very cheap and simple piggy back ecu getting 153 atw and get 450 per tank on average. Again my point is an expensive and highly functional ecu may not be the best option. If the OP is after power, go FI or be humble with the limits of NA tunning. Which ever your choice be wise with you spending. Expensive doesnt automatically mean big gains.

[lzybum]

digging up an old thread~

anyways does anyone here run the basic mods (intake/headers/catback) on stock ecu?(no piggybacks!)
if so, would u mind telling me how much km/tank of fuel ur getting?

i used to run just the injen intake and that got me about 440km/tank.
changed that for j's intake and a catback, and getting 390km/tank.
thinking about going aftermarket headers and by the looks of things, i will be getting less than 390km!

if i wanted to get a tune on a/fr to improve my milage with the basic mods, would a vafcII do the job?
any suggestions of other piggybacks? or should i just leave it as it is with stock ecu?

[vyets]

I ran a J's intake with TP and Exhaust and got pretty much the same fuel about 420ish - 440 a tank with average driving and afew WOT's.

[JAP-S2K]

To answer your question in short! Yes a vafc, piggyback could/will improve your mileage, but at what cost? and is it worth it? That depends who tunes it. A deadshit will more than likely lean it out too much, and you'll see an increase in power with decent mileage, but this will more than likely result in some type of mech failure such as a burnt valve. Tuning it properly is very important. With someone that understands Honda's, there fuel maps and there high revving nature, only a very slight improvement is possible. IMHO it's probably best not to toy with ecu settings while your still with basic bolt on mods. It is possible to trim some fuel out to get better consumption as i mentioned as the factory fuel map/a/f ratio are quite rich. By why change it? Honda did this for a specific reason. As a rich fuel map is generally regarded as a safe tune. So many are eager to attempt or find something Honda didn't, regarding ECU/Fuel maps, unfortunately in this circumstance little or no fessible gains are to be had. If there was gains to be had, you'd find plenty of info on what to do.

[STAiN MASTER]

Using e-manage ultimate I got 11kw over stock with I/H/HFC/E and i got 40km more out of my tank. but this tuner leaned it out and was great on WOT but not so good daily, so got it re-tuned for more daily friendly driving which was much better and the car felt much smoother.

with the mods you have i'd recommend emanage ultimate or blue.

[lzybum]

i should of added that this is my daily.
i drive at least 350-400km, so a fresh tank of petrol every week.
so im not looking for more peak power gains, more reliability on fuel consumption although any gains is a bonus =D

[lzybum]

I ran a J's intake with TP and Exhaust and got pretty much the same fuel about 420ish - 440 a tank with average driving and afew WOT's.

u running intake/TP/exhaust atm on stock ecu? and ur getting 420!? i want 400+! lol

[JAP-S2K]

u running intake/TP/exhaust atm on stock ecu? and ur getting 420!? i want 400+! lol

Maybe look into getting your injectors serviced/changed. Something is causing your poor mileage, either poor maintenance or dirty injectors. Generally basic bolt on mods only effect fuel consumption due to more of a heavier right foot.

[stndrd]

agree with jap-s2k. get your injectors cleaned (new pintle caps, o-rings, etc as well) and flow tested and change your fuel filter. depending on how many km's your s2k has done and what sort of a service history it has may be what has caused it. also have a look at your spark plugs and see if they need replacing. if this doesnt do you any good, you might have to look into voltage readings from your O2 sensor and coolant temp sensor (yes the coolant temp sensor does play a role in a/f ratio's)

[dc5ive]

ill have to get my injectors cleaned as well
i daily my car the most kms ive ever got out of a tank was 390 km =(