Mugen 5 way adjustable

[MM89]

I'm looking for some info regarding the
Mugen 5 way adjustable suspension kit
for DC2R (50000-XG9R-K1S0).

As I own an EG4, I'm aware that DC2R/EG6
Rear LCA is required for fitment. In stock form,
a rear sway currently remains not yet fitted.

What I'm interested in is the performance
of these shocks, particularly on the track.
Most track time will be spent at Winton.

I am currently running 6 way adjustable coilovers
by the name of AOE. Having done a little bit of
research, I have gathered that it is a Taiwanese
brand. I am pursuing a replacement for this suspension.

Accompanying these coilovers at the moment are only
front Summit and rear Carbing strut tower bars.

Upcoming suspension modifications are planned along the lines of:

1. Front + Rear DC2R sway bars (something else otherwise?)
2. Front + Rear camber kit
3. Front castor kit
4. Complete replacement - all suspension bushes (Most people go for ES?)
5. Any other "bars" that are deemed necessary along the way.


According to another online source, the Mugen setup looks
a little something like this. Would be good if anybody could
verify the accuracy of these details.

Approximately 12,000 miles on them, great condition. Bought brand new from King Motorsports. 5-way dampening adjustable. Lowers the car approximately 3/4" from stock ITR ride height. The height is non adjustable. Great street suspension, daily driving/occaisonal track use.

Spring Rates - Mugen 5-way
Front – 385 lb 6.8 kg/mm
Rear – 245 lb 4.5 kg/mm

Spring Rates – Stock ITR
Front – 246 lb /in
Rear – 140 ~246 lbs/in

So with all the anti roll, - camber, + castor, reinforcement bars etc.
Can this "Great Street Suspension" deal with heavier load track duties?

It would be good to hear from those with personal experience with
these shocks.




Another issue I would like to address is that of wheel hop.
Whilst driving hard at times, changing from 1st to 2nd, I experience
plenty of wheel hop. Sometimes wheelspin, sometimes a combination
of both.

From the top of my head, a LSD, or a traction bar or even solid
engine mounts could assist in solving this problem. Is there anything
else I have missed that could possibly even dampen the effects
or better eliminate wheel hop.

Kindest regards
Michael

[shadou]

wheel hop engine torque damper coupled with aftermarket mounts? Just a possible thought.

[MM89]

why what a pleasant surprise!
solid mounts are definitely up there

still would like to know about those mugen shocks though...

[chargeR]

Those Mugen springs and dampers will certainly do the job. OEM DC2R suspension is perfectly adequate for any type of track work in a DC2, it is just not ideal. By the same token the upgraded Mugen springs and dampers will be sufficient for track work in an EG, just not ideal. Stock EG suspension will also work okay on the track, don't get sucked into the trap of thinking you need a lot of upgrades to track.

What tyres will you be using? If you are using very sticky tyres then the car will probably feel a bit undersprung and underdamped on the Mugens, and it will probably not be as responsive in transitions as you would like. If however you are using a 150+ treadwear street tyre then you will probably like the Mugen springs and dampers.

EDIT: Don't waste your money on camber kits until you have taken the car to the track and have some idea of the alignment settings you would like to use. The camber settings resulting from the slight lowering on the Mugen springs and dampers might be fine for your use.

[MM89]

First couple of times would be RE001?
Then progress onto semi slicks?

Not being ideal as in not as good of a performer coilovers potentially are?
Otherwise, in what aspects are they considered 'not ideal' ? Spring rates?
Damper rates?

Although I'm still leaning towards the Mugen 5 ways, what for example
would you consider 'sufficient' ? The coilovers I'm currently using
doesn't seem to cut it for me. Stiff in the wrong places and soft at the
wrong times if that gives you an idea of what I'm trying to get to.
Also it is very difficult to setup the coilovers to a setting that I'm happy
with ever since playing around with the spring length and the shock
body height etc. The non height adjustable seems to be alot easier
for the time being before I can learn more about setting it up.

Your last comment regarding camber adjustment seems like
a fair call. Thanks for the reply.

[chargeR]

I mean not ideal in the literal sense, as in they will not be the fastest/best setup, and they also are not significantly adjustable to get you closer to your ideal configuration, but without a lot of testing and some prodigious driving skill none of us will ever get close to a 'perfect' setup so it isn't really a concern.

However I think that less adjustability is sometimes a good thing as it is less things to bugger up. With this in mind and if you don't have heaps of track experience I am sure the Mugens will be a great suspension to work with, because they have some adjustability but some of the hard work and potential for stuff ups has been taken out of the setup by the fixed ride height. I think there is a lot of potential for faster times simply from tuning the damping, tyre pressures and your driving without needing to be mad tyte low on super stiff dampers.

Take these opinions with a grain of salt because I have never driven on the suspension we are discussing, and I have some track experience but I wouldn't profess to being particularly good at it :).

[MM89]

Fair enough
Something else I should mention is that after changing to
DC2 front and rear brake setup. The car seems to handle
a little bit better in some respects. Steering response
is a little bit more direct and overall it is more stable.

Any suggestions why this may be the case?

[moo moo nel]

becos the rotor is a bit bigger and heavier? :p

[string]

Fair enough
Something else I should mention is that after changing to
DC2 front and rear brake setup. The car seems to handle
a little bit better in some respects. Steering response
is a little bit more direct and overall it is more stable.

Any suggestions why this may be the case?

Placebo and confirmation bias :D

[MM89]

Sorry, I do not understand your comment.
Could you please explain?

[string]

What I mean is that if you aren't braking, you're imagining it. When braking however you'll have much more control over the forces which has many handling benefits and makes driving much more pleasurable.

The driver makes the biggest difference to a car's road holding ability; a little bit of hardware induced confidence goes a long way.

[OT] I find your signature deliciously ironic: you have upgraded your handling by increasing the horsepower of your braking system :D

[MM89]

yes i'm aware of the confidence issue.
in fact i think it is a very common thing for me
to believe that significant changes have occured
through modifications which are not necessarily
that significant.

the signature has been there for a long time,
before i did an engine conversion.
i thought i had better handling than some other
bigger cars with more horsepower. i slowly learnt
that this was not necessarily the case.
now that more power has come into the equation,
i FEEL at times that it might be a detriment to the
handling.

[air23box]

Like ChargeR mention.......top of range damper may not be ideal especially its not a full race car set up. Can you clarify what springs is the mugen damper using atm.....coz as far as I know all mugen coilovers didn't come with springs. (I know the DC5R one dun at least) and with such a stiff damper with those soft spring rate the ride will be quiet funny.....dun flame me coz I never ride in it b4......

I will suggest you bring your car to track and learn your car as it is then I am sure you will know what you want from your car. Dun just put some parts and expect it will do the job for you. It take a long time to play around with those damper settings and spring rate seletcion to get ur ideal setup. Also camber, caster and toe is a bitch to play with too. I did some trackday with ChargeR together and its something not easy to deal with. hope that help...