GruppeM intake for FD2 review/info

[liquid23]

hey guys,

This is the most expensive intake on the market (i think). It does not fit the FD1/2 civic that we have, only for the FD2R (maybe Mugen RR?). The piping on the FD2 is 2" and the FD2R is 3". As i wanted this intake because of the carbon fiber also some performance, i bought it (from Xposed trader) being the 1st buyer i got some discount and became the guinea pig. Due to the problem of the smaller piping on the FD2 as i found out when i tried to fit it myself i got a custom pipe made up from Embleton Engineering (Myaree). I was advised to go there because Wayne was a very good TIG welder.

When installing the GruppeM intake i found that the sensor wouldn't fit anywhere so i had to get it put back on. Thanks for the confirmation on the MAF sensor by the posts in the other thread. I did put the sensor back on the piping when it was made. You can see from the pictures below its next to the battery on the underside of the piping.

The CEL light came up the next day i started driving, to try solve this i reset the ECU by taking the positive clamp on the battery off for about 5-10mins. It has been 2 days and still no CEL light so going good :D

Performance wise, i feel that it is more responsive from 2000/2500rpm - 4000rpm. The sound starts from 2500rpm and exponentially increases till 7000rpm. Sounds like i have a 3" exhaust in my engine haha. I don't know how much power it had given me but not alot. From the SG forums they said about 5-6hp lol so power to money ratio is very bad.
Injen CAI is apparently the best intake for how much it costs.

There is a problem with the intake. It is a bit loose and wobbles. This is due to the adapter being smaller than the big carbon thing that holds the filter. I've tried tightening it up as much as possible but still loose. So i put double sided tape on the underside of the scoop (the one with GruppeM label) stuck it to the cowl. It is still a bit loose but alot less instead of before moving around very easily. I want to put foam under the clamp so it will even out the size difference.

The instruction says that on a rainy day your suppose to cover up the inlet scoop and also while you wash your car. I can see this being a problem in winter.... the dreadful hydrolock.

thanks for reading. if i have made any mistakes please tell me and i will fix it up, or if you have more information on this intake i will add it on.

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/5868/p1020587n.jpg
http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/4839/p1020583q.jpg
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/8739/p1020589l.jpg
http://img104.imageshack.us/img104/7913/p1020588.jpg
http://img104.imageshack.us/img104/18/p1020593.jpg

[Fung]

HOLY COW!!!!!!!!

how much did that take you!!!

timmy, consider this

[black8thgen]

only for FD2 i think, and it costs a SHIT LOAD

[lukits01]

I gotta hand it to you buddy, at least you are persistent
here's my retrofit to my FN2
I used a MAF adapter and made it fit the standard intake tubing
moved stuff around the engine bay to get it to fit
and it is gloriously loud!

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/4002/dscn1280ed1.jpg

[black8thgen]

shit damn, u have a pretty engine bay, how much kw are u pulling?

[aero]

nice write up liquid. should move this to the review section :thumbsup::thumbsup:

[lukits01]

The CEL light came up the next day i started driving, to try solve this i reset the ECU by taking the positive clamp on the battery off for about 5-10mins.

The MAF sensor needs to be placed in straight airflow to perform properly.
The problem with these kind of aftermarket intake is they don't bother putting proper baffles in the MAF mount to direct airflow. So the air swirls around and enters the sensor with turbulence. This will occasionally throw a CEL light, I'm not sure what affect it has to power though, but my guess is, it can't be good.

[liquid23]

are you suppose to cover up the hole in the intake? where you have your insulation tubing going down. what is that hole for anyway? lol

i wanted to just chop off the original pipe where the sensor is and then stick it to the new pipe but the guy said it would look ugly and so did i. so we just made a new placement for it.

bad news.. CEL light came on again. tried to fiddle around with sensor and disconnect battery for another 30mins. after a few starts came on again..
ARGHHHHH!!!!!

what do i do now? :confused: need to fix this thing

[lukits01]

bad news.. CEL light came on again. tried to fiddle around with sensor and disconnect battery for another 30mins. after a few starts came on again..
ARGHHHHH!!!!!

what do i do now? :confused: need to fix this thing

I thought that might happen :(
at the very least the MAF has to be mounted dead straight on same diameter piping.
If you can, you need to reuse the original mount, even then its no guarantee
the MAF is very very sensitive

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n90/tu5j4/fnhatch/HPIM0554.jpg
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n90/tu5j4/fnhatch/HPIM0561.jpg

[liquid23]

hmm... possible to just add the two internal fins inside the tubing? so the air will go straight? as you can see my sensor is on the bend. i don't really want to spend another few hundred $$ to fix this. the stupid intake is already so expensive.

will the air go straight after the fins are put in so maybe i can put it on the adapter?
also is it bad to drive around at the moment with the CEL on? any damage to engine?

[lukits01]

I don't think making a proper MAF mount is something that can be done by eye.
Honda didn't put vanes in the intake for no good reason.
I have no idea what you would need to do to make your own,
so I reused the one that came with the car.

The CEL wont damage your engine, most likely the car is running limp mode map
so it'll affect your power and fuel economy.

[liquid23]

ah oks....

maybe i can ask the guy to chop off a bit and stick it in..
but it would kinda look funny with a black thing in the middle haha

where can i take my car to have the CEL code read? will this help to fine tune on what is wrong?
also are MAF sensors suppose to be from the top? or it can be from anywhere? maybe having it upside down is a problem?

[liquid23]

hey guys took it to the mechanic beside the place i got it done. he reset the ECU and fiddled around with things. he said should be fine and then when i started my car the CEL light came on haha, didn't even get to move anywhere.

he pulled out the piping and cleaned everything for me. he gave the sensor a clean as well. he said that it should be ok now. started the car a few times and it was fine. he said if the light comes on again, i need a fuel catch tank cause he said the pipe for the fuel vapour thing (the black tube on the left of the other black pipe) might be too close to the sensor so might be blocking it up.

so in 2 days if it doesn't come up it should be ok :D
all free of charge ^^

[aero]

thats some pretty good service

[black8thgen]

damn, yeah for sure. hope it goes well for u man, would be a huge bummer if it all went wrong after all this effort!. good luck

[aaronng]

ah oks....

maybe i can ask the guy to chop off a bit and stick it in..
but it would kinda look funny with a black thing in the middle haha

where can i take my car to have the CEL code read? will this help to fine tune on what is wrong?
also are MAF sensors suppose to be from the top? or it can be from anywhere? maybe having it upside down is a problem?

Your guy can easily weld those two baffles in. Just need to provide the dimensions.

[liquid23]

yeah he said he would if the reset of ecu and everything didn't work.

yes it was really good service for someone that didn't do any work to my car lol i wanted to give him something but he said don't worry bout it. even had to store my car at the guy's place cause Embleton didn't have room lol.
he called me "the carbon man" -_-"

[black8thgen]

hahahahaha, i wouldn't blame him.. LOL

[liquid23]

bad news... the light came on again...
sooo... the mechanic said a oil catch can should solve the problem.
getting it made up now and polished.
whoever wants a gruppeM intake to fit FD2 make sure u do it right and keep the sensor away from the fuel vapour hose haha

[black8thgen]

hahah, man hope this goes well now!

[liquid23]

i hope so too or else i'll just buy the FD2R engine to make life easier

[black8thgen]

LOL, yeah and cost urself half ur future life plans at the same time =/

[aaronng]

bad news... the light came on again...
sooo... the mechanic said a oil catch can should solve the problem.
getting it made up now and polished.
whoever wants a gruppeM intake to fit FD2 make sure u do it right and keep the sensor away from the fuel vapour hose haha

Instead of wasting all this time and money on an oil catch can, just read the CEL code. If the code pulled is one of the following, then get the baffles done up straight away. An oil catch can won't fix your CEL, since your engine is not tuned aggressively enough to ping when oil vapour goes back into the combustion chamber.

P0101 Mass Airflow (MAF) Sensor Range/Performance Problem
P0102 Mass Airflow (MAF) Sensor Circuit Low Voltage
P0103 Mass Airflow (MAF) Sensor Circuit High Voltage

[liquid23]

i think i saw the reading on the computer said
P0102 Mass Airflow (MAF) Sensor Circuit Low Voltage
P0103 Mass Airflow (MAF) Sensor Circuit High Voltage

i asked him what was the code, he just said oh your car is running lean.
are baffles the 2 fins things that sit right before the sensor?>

[liquid23]

okk. finallyy hope this works. The oil catch tank was put in. the piping had 3 fins put it as well, but it ran vertical with the sensor instead like the OEM running horizontal with the sensor. But when everything was fitted the CEL light turned off. Nothing was reset on the ECU, so it just turned off by itself.
Hopefully this will be the last of it.

Anyone done GruppeM in their FD2, you best have a mate that can do all this for free :p cause it'll cost you.

now just gotta drive it for a few days and see what happens. fingers cross the light won't ever come up again

[black8thgen]

GOODLUCK! such huge effort for just an intake =[

[liquid23]

... ah crap

[black8thgen]

seriously?!!?! - shit =/

[aaronng]

okk. finallyy hope this works. The oil catch tank was put in. the piping had 3 fins put it as well, but it ran vertical with the sensor instead like the OEM running horizontal with the sensor. But when everything was fitted the CEL light turned off. Nothing was reset on the ECU, so it just turned off by itself.
Hopefully this will be the last of it.

Anyone done GruppeM in their FD2, you best have a mate that can do all this for free :p cause it'll cost you.

now just gotta drive it for a few days and see what happens. fingers cross the light won't ever come up again

The fins should be put in the exact same orientation as the stock pipe.

[liquid23]

seriously?!!?! - shit =/

yeah man... SHIT. seriously nearly spending close to 2k now.

yeah i thought about that but he's only someone that produces things. I'll tell him to take it out and do it again even though he did it for free lol.
its something that i can try. until i run out of options i'll cut the OEM filter sensor in and fit it. but then it'll look like a DIY job.

[liquid23]

UPDATE ...
everything got taken out and the pipe was cut. i called up my usual friend from beyond custom to help me out and he told me that the MAF sensor has to be on a straight pipe at least 60mm - 70mm long. told the guy and this is what it looks like (also the oil catch tank was put in).

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/9878/img0931re.jpg
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/6224/img0934o.jpg

the fins weren't put in inside the pipe because he wants to know if it was the problem that the fins weren't there or it could just run like that. so after nearly 2 days driving. was fixing the rattle on the intake about 30 mins ago, started engine again... light came on. took out the MAF sensor and gave it a blow, put back again. unplug battery... light gone. :confused::confused::confused:
gonna ring up and tell him to put fins on to see if that works. Now i'm wondering about the hole in the intake. maybe i should run a pipe from there to the outside like lukits01 did on this FN2 or spend(waste) $800 to get it tune so i can tune the engine light out?

[liquid23]

oh yay more bad news. one of the guys that does alot of preformance cars from Xspeed just told me not to use the intake because its meant for MAP sensors (ie FD2Rs) not MAF sensors. because i have a MAF sensor everything would have to be exactly the same as stock piping, even the slighest things would make it not work and throw the engine light. i asked if i could chop off the original sensor par, he said even then it might not work because of the big hole in the intake box. but if it doesn't work then i have a half cut up stock box.

either i spend 5k+ to get a MAP sensor or do trial and error to get it working.

*UCK sake should've just went for Injen.

any suggestions before i throw this intake the bin?

[rk 86 wa]

Ill take it off your hands for 50$ lol.

[aero]

sell it to brian, here in qld. get him to test it on his fd2r when it arrives

[liquid23]

yeah i was thinking of that and just buy Injen CAI instead direct bolt on no hassels.
i'll pm him hehe

[black8thgen]

u need RBC intake manifold too though

[liquid23]

for the injen? isn't there already one made for FD2?

[black8thgen]

nah u need intake manifold still im pretty sure - i remember asking jdmyard i think, and they said i still need rbc intake manifold =/

just get simota carbon charger intake - thats what im getting =D

[liquid23]

hm just waiting for reply because a guy has done it to his FD using the gruppem. i just gotta do everything the same as him then hopefully it will work

[liquid23]

ok the guy said the systems is nearly the same as mine. i just need to get the pipe where the MAF sits to be same as stock which is 70mm. where as mine is 80mm as i found out today when i took it apart. i told the guy if it was all like the original but i guess it wasn't.

[liquid23]

ok another update

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/303/img0944ub.jpg
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/3775/img0941e.jpg
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/8488/img0940d.jpg
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9810/img0939e.jpg

To make up a new pipe that is the same as the original was around $450 :thumbdwn: so instead took a chance and told him to cut off the OEM MAF sensor part and stuck it on the intake pipe. The MAF pipe was threaded and glued on to the adapter and fiberglass was added for more secure fixing (Works out to be cheaper if it didn't work, to buy a new top half of the air box is $175 from honda). Everything works now, well for the last 2 days. Should be working fine as using the original part and it only matters where the MAF sensor sits. Can't go wrong if using OEM part.

So to anyone buying the GruppeM intake for FD2R and wants it to fit the FD2/1. It is easy now as i have gone through all the hassels haha. All you need to do it cut off the original part and move it back (if using OEM piping) or make a new pipe with the original part on it (should cost about $250 fitted)

[blasdf]

this looks really good man. do u notice a difference in power, sound etc? i wouldnt mind doing some stuff to mine but i don't know anything about engines etc so id have to get a shop to do everything for me. just seems not heaps of stuff that gets done.

[liquid23]

thanks,
power erm... only a small difference. an intake wouldn't give much power unless you get an exhaust, extractors etc
the sound is really loud, feels a bit faster in acceleration.
just do lots of research and you'll find that a lot of people have done what you would like and gone through the difficult process and all you need to do is follow how they did it. Or you can change it up a bit to your liking.
I couldn't find anyone that did the gruppem so i gave it ago and only one person in singapore has put it in a FD2 not FD2R. a difficult process to put this in but once you know what is needed then anyone can do it.
only downfall of modding engines is when you start you will never end, you will want to do more and more. you can't have something without the other to give more performance. but for me its only intake, extractors and exhaust.

[G3NX]

thats what i did to mine i cut off the OEM MAF sensor part and attached a k&n filter and made a custom heat shield work just as good.