VTEC not engaging correctly

[oongie]

Hi Euro owners,
I seem to have lost my VTEC.

Currently on the car is headers, cat, exhaust, intake and Greddy Emanage ultimate.
Now, got the car tuned as ISMR and the VTEC point was set at 5500 by previous owner.

Before the Emanage was installed I had the standard VTEC point and could hear when VTEC kicked in yo! but after the tune, no such thing.

Looking at the dynographs dont see a kick in KW's at where Vtec should kick in... (will upload tonight) but it is very linear...

Already checked oil pressure and levels, all is good.
before you ask made 127KW @ wheels

What is going on?!
Help a brother.

[onlykillzz]

ummm call the place you got the car tuned at..... if the car wasn't hitting vtec when it was dynoed then its probably not set......

[felixd]

thats sounds about rite 127kw at wheels u wont get more than 130kw with those mods.

[integral90]

If they tuned the VTEC engagement to the right RPM then the power should be linear... you don't want a sudden jump in power when VTEC engages.

Also 127kW sounds like what it should be for those mods with a light tune

[oongie]

Ok ok, so my VTEC didnt fall off and shouldnt be worried LOL...
I'm thinking next mod will be Intake manifold and 64mm throttle body...
what sort of gains do you think...
I've been told the RSP will net gains across the board...
your thoughts?

[jyh888]

Ok ok, so my VTEC didnt fall off and shouldnt be worried LOL...
I'm thinking next mod will be Intake manifold and 64mm throttle body...
what sort of gains do you think...
I've been told the RSP will net gains across the board...
your thoughts?

The RRC/RSP intake manifolds are very similar to the RBC and will probably result in a slightly higher net gain but i dont think it will be that much of a difference. In my opinion, i still believe it is cheaper and more effective to go for the RBC since it is cheaper and more readily available. It will result in a loss of mid end torque due to its short fat runners so you must get your piggyback re-tuned with this mod, and make sure it is port matched with your increased throttle body size, the RBC will also work well with more aggressive cam shafts.

Answering your question, changing the RBC/tb itself will probably net approximately 5kw gain, it must be tuned to gain full potential.

Ask or PM integral90, he has the RBC and he provided me extremely useful information for my thoughts for build. :) btw specifically what are your mods on your car? AT or MT? can you post your dyno please! thx

[oongie]

I/H/E + tuned ECU,
I have read one EUROact's thread that the RSP is like a combination of the RBC and RBB.
So you wouldnt lose the torque like the RBC.

Mines a manual and was thinking about cams but the emanage ultimate will not be able to handle this, so further breathing mods it is!

Throttle response should improve considering the RSP is running 4 individual runners to a plenum?

[jyh888]

I/H/E + tuned ECU,
I have read one EUROact's thread that the RSP is like a combination of the RBC and RBB.
So you wouldnt lose the torque like the RBC.

Mines a manual and was thinking about cams but the emanage ultimate will not be able to handle this, so further breathing mods it is!

Throttle response should improve considering the RSP is running 4 individual runners to a plenum?

Im not too sure about the RSP, we will wait till others post on this. It is mainly due to the fact that k24 engines do not have a higher rev limit, therefore it cannot make full potential of a higher free flowing intake manifold. The RBB is designed for more torque to compensate the extra weight of the cl9. You really have to make the k24 rev higher to gain from the IM.

What are the main goals of your setup? track/race use or just a daily car? if it is just a daily you probably want to stick with the RBB and get a larger tb and port the opening of the IM - you will still gain power/response after a good tune.

which intake/header/exhaust do you have?

[jyh888]

btw just curious how much difference in kw would a manual be compared to an automatic?

and oongie which dyno did you use and where did u tune it? able to post ur dyno sheet up at all?

[oongie]

injen/maxim/fujitsubo/metalcat cat.
Road tune done by ben@touge tune and dyno tune touched up by Indy @ IS Motor Racing
Dyno was on a dyno dynamics.
Need to take a photo and post it.
No idea but I've heard the manual nets better gains on a dyno than a manual.

[jyh888]

injen/maxim/fujitsubo/metalcat cat.
Road tune done by ben@touge tune and dyno tune touched up by Indy @ IS Motor Racing
Dyno was on a dyno dynamics.
Need to take a photo and post it.
No idea but I've heard the manual nets better gains on a dyno than a manual.

ahh nice setup, are u the guy who bought fuji exhaust off me recently??

[oongie]

Did you sell it on ebay?

[jyh888]

Did you sell it on ebay?

yep, did you also have a buddyclub exhaust u want to get rid of?

[aaronng]

The RRC/RSP intake manifolds are very similar to the RBC and will probably result in a slightly higher net gain but i dont think it will be that much of a difference. In my opinion, i still believe it is cheaper and more effective to go for the RBC since it is cheaper and more readily available. It will result in a loss of mid end torque due to its short fat runners so you must get your piggyback re-tuned with this mod, and make sure it is port matched with your increased throttle body size, the RBC will also work well with more aggressive cam shafts.

Answering your question, changing the RBC/tb itself will probably net approximately 5kw gain, it must be tuned to gain full potential.

Ask or PM integral90, he has the RBC and he provided me extremely useful information for my thoughts for build. :) btw specifically what are your mods on your car? AT or MT? can you post your dyno please! thx
Eur000act did a comparison between RBC and RSP. RBC has a loss of torque at low to mid RPM, while RSP maintained a similar low to mid range torque as RBB and then had extra like the RBC at high RPM.

[oongie]

yep, did you also have a buddyclub exhaust u want to get rid of?

Yah, tis me.
Have sold the buddyclub already to a mate of mine.

Realistically, do you think adding the RSP + 64mm TB will be noticeable in the seat of the pants?

Never been in a car with RBC, so experiences will help!

[aaronng]

Yah, tis me.
Have sold the buddyclub already to a mate of mine.

Realistically, do you think adding the RSP + 64mm TB will be noticeable in the seat of the pants?

Never been in a car with RBC, so experiences will help!

RBC basically makes the VTEC crossover point more obvious. The sound is a lot louder and the change in torque is more apparent because you lose some torque at low to mid RPM

[jyh888]

Yah, tis me.
Have sold the buddyclub already to a mate of mine.

Realistically, do you think adding the RSP + 64mm TB will be noticeable in the seat of the pants?

Never been in a car with RBC, so experiences will help!

the RSP is extremely expensive tho...theres one on sale for $1k+ IMO jus stick with RBC and get it retuned, should flatten that torque/power dip.

Btw, if you dont mind how much did it cost you to tune your car, and how long did it take? How does street tuning work? do you have to floor like each gear? and how is fuel consumption after tuning?

[aaronng]

the RSP is extremely expensive tho...theres one on sale for $1k+ IMO jus stick with RBC and get it retuned, should flatten that torque/power dip.

Btw, if you dont mind how much did it cost you to tune your car, and how long did it take? How does street tuning work? do you have to floor like each gear? and how is fuel consumption after tuning?

And how are you going to retune it without spending an additional $500-1500 for a piggyback ECU? ;)

[jyh888]

And how are you going to retune it without spending an additional $500-1500 for a piggyback ECU? ;)

he already has a greddy emanage ultimate at the moment

[aaronng]

he already has a greddy emanage ultimate at the moment

Check Crapdaz's thread on whether he managed to fix the lack of low end torque of RBC using the emanage ultimate.

[oongie]

I think the RSP will be worth it!
I dont think anyone has been able to tune out the torque dip in the lower end.
hence the RSP
1K with TB worth it...

[aaronng]

I think the RSP will be worth it!
I dont think anyone has been able to tune out the torque dip in the lower end.
hence the RSP
1K with TB worth it...

You get more gains from Toda header than the RSP + TB. Of course, the Toda header is more expensive, but you should calculate $ per kW.

[oongie]

You get more gains from Toda header than the RSP + TB. Of course, the Toda header is more expensive, but you should calculate $ per kW.

Tis true, considering I/H/E + ECU have been done and coilovers will be going on soon, the next logical step would be to free up the breathing as much as possible...
If I were looking to start from scratch.
Headers+cat would be the first thing I would do again.

In your opinion how much gain would you expect on current set up + RSP & TB?

[aaronng]

Tis true, considering I/H/E + ECU have been done and coilovers will be going on soon, the next logical step would be to free up the breathing as much as possible...
If I were looking to start from scratch.
Headers+cat would be the first thing I would do again.

In your opinion how much gain would you expect on current set up + RSP & TB?

Have you dyno'd your car with the current setup? If you did, where did you do it?

I'm guessing not much at all throughout the rev range, but you get maybe 1-4 kW gain at 6500rpm onwards. Just guessing here. I can't tell you exactly. You might even get 0kW gain because your TB is not sealing properly against the manifold. :p

[oongie]

Dyno was done on IS motor racing's Dyno.
But the TB will be a stock TB off a CTR, as is the RSP, so fingers crossed sealing wont be an issue...

[jyh888]

Dyno was done on IS motor racing's Dyno.
But the TB will be a stock TB off a CTR, as is the RSP, so fingers crossed sealing wont be an issue...

what size is the tb off the ctr? is it drive by wire?? i think it would give a good 5-10kw, chris F did a similar set up with the tsx tb (64mm) and port matched RBB and i think he got pretty good gains already wit that

[aaronng]

Dyno was done on IS motor racing's Dyno.
But the TB will be a stock TB off a CTR, as is the RSP, so fingers crossed sealing wont be an issue...
So what was your dyno reading? If you are taking the TB and RSP straight off the FN2R, then you shouldn't have sealing issues. Just make sure that the coolant bypass ports match up to the Euro, otherwise you'll have coolant everywhere. :p

[jyh888]

So what was your dyno reading? If you are taking the TB and RSP straight off the FN2R, then you shouldn't have sealing issues. Just make sure that the coolant bypass ports match up to the Euro, otherwise you'll have coolant everywhere. :p

his dyno reading was 127 kw

[aaronng]

his dyno reading was 127 kw

We need a Toda dyno day. :p

[jyh888]

Hey oongie how was ur fuel consumption after the tune? Did u get a before dyno aswell? Just wondering if the gain is throughout the whole rev range? Do u tell ben how u like it to be tuned or he decides?

[vaikis]

oongie you have PM.

[oongie]

Hey oongie how was ur fuel consumption after the tune? Did u get a before dyno aswell? Just wondering if the gain is throughout the whole rev range? Do u tell ben how u like it to be tuned or he decides?

Fuel consumption gotten a little bit thirstier.
Whether thats from the tune or me driving a bit harder cant tell.:o

You can let them know whether your looking at better power across the board or just peak power and they can cater for that, but they're the ones in the know so I just leave it to them.

I've gotten a really aggressive tune on mine for better mid-range.
I dont think peak power has improved that much but on an overall scale the car has more power across the range.

[jyh888]

Fuel consumption gotten a little bit thirstier.
Whether thats from the tune or me driving a bit harder cant tell.:o

You can let them know whether your looking at better power across the board or just peak power and they can cater for that, but they're the ones in the know so I just leave it to them.

I've gotten a really aggressive tune on mine for better mid-range.
I dont think peak power has improved that much but on an overall scale the car has more power across the range.

sounds good! do u know how much u gained in the midrange? did u get a before dyno? it would be nice to see the graphs

[oongie]

Nup, forget to get a dyno before the ECU was installed...
let me take a photo of my dyno sheet and post it up...

[integral90]

IMO jus stick with RBC and get it retuned, should flatten that torque/power dip.

RBC is useless if you're going to piggy-back tune it. You need to run a stand alone ECU to control the VTC and then tune accordingly with that.

With stand alone tuning the RBC and RBB should be very similar in the midrange I think, but the RBC would obviously have it at low end and top end.

Remember that stand alone tuning is huge. An RBC with piggy-back tuning won't make as much midrange as an untuned RBB.

[oongie]

How about RSP then V manage down the track?

[integral90]

That would be better... but how about stand alone now and not messing around with the intake manifold until you've surpassed its limits?

Piggy-back tuning will never reach the limit of the RBB, or even make the RBC/RSP viable. You should only modify or change a part on a car when the stock part has reached its potential, so there's no point changing to a high performance intake manifold if your ECU isn't going to be able to unlock any of its ability.

Not putting you down, just trying to save you money. Look at Chris F.'s dyno chart from stand alone tuning with the RBB. O M G.

[oongie]

Would V manage do the job?