Toda C

[todaek9]

I just saw this web saying this CTR using Toda C has 280hp....

anybody know how the hell it get 280hp?....
please give the facts, but not assuming...

i think lots of Vtec fan here wants to know why....including myself...

[panda[cRx]]

lol, alot more than just toda c's did that.

there is a white and blue gen2 NA crx thats running 240ps, its only 720kgs i think and is velli velli quick!
its on bmi - battle at 10krpm and kills s2k's, type r's and nsx's :D

CRX y0!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v472/panda_crx/10krpmcrx.jpg

[TODA AU]

B16B 1600cc @ 280hp... Nup...

[karbonphyber]

can i have a 10krpm tacho too panda??

[panda[cRx]]

lol sure, oh and i just remembered the crx had a b20 in it....(hence the NA2000)
still havent seen that dvd :(
my mate took screen shots on his pc for me lol
and i cut and paste the tacho from one shot to that one

[Civic Type R]

my 1.8 pumps out atleast 215HP and its got some work to be done but 240 would be nice :P

[todaek9]

B16B 1600cc @ 280hp... Nup...

using ITR engine....

[todaek9]

TODA AU
Is it possible that Toda C can do 280 hp on an ITR engine??

[[G]]

']lol sure, oh and i just remembered the crx had a b20 in it....(hence the NA2000)
still havent seen that dvd :(
my mate took screen shots on his pc for me lol
and i cut and paste the tacho from one shot to that one
its not a b20 its a b16b stroked out to two litres.

[Civic Type R]

the highest ive seen from a JDM B18c Spec R is 260ps. This was stroked to 2000cc.
it was in those feature cars in the Hyper Rev books.

[OLM-02R]

my 1.8 pumps out atleast 215HP and its got some work to be done but 240 would be nice :P
nice # dud...u got ur dyno paper ?? just wanted to see the graph... :thumbsup:

[jords]

The "Battle of Vtec" DVD that the pictured CRX is from rocks, some pretty nice cars, I loved it when this CRX easily beats a ITR and NSX around a track.
That DVD is a good buy if you can get your hands on it.:thumbsup:

[panda[cRx]]

yeah i'm waiting to pick up a 'backup copy' off a friend...

[Civic Type R]

nice # dud...u got ur dyno paper ?? just wanted to see the graph... :thumbsup:its getting dynoed this saturday.
this figure was given to me by the engine builder.

[sivic]

']yeah i'm waiting to pick up a 'backup copy' off a friend...
which volume of BMI is that?

[edw-R]

its getting dynoed this saturday.
this figure was given to me by the engine builder.
I want to have a look the dyno graph too, can you show the air/fuel ratio too??
Thx!!:)

[TODA AU]

TODA AU
Is it possible that Toda C can do 280 hp on an ITR engine??
Yes, It is faintly possible... However, It is not in any way probable...
The power level you're talking about is at the extreeme end of b-series engine development and way beyond the abilities of the "backyard bandit" surfing the net for advice...
Engines making that much power are back-engineered to do so...
They are certainly not made up from a wish list of components...

In reality, 220 real hp is plenty from a B-series...
240hp is just massive...

Adrian

[Civic Type R]

Adrian, i want 240 :D

[tinkerbell]

Adrian, i want 240 :D
*might* be possible at Flywheel,

very difficult at the wheels...

will be interesting to see your dyno results...

from your 1/4 mile time i'd say you are putting out abt 150hp ATW on a Dyno Dynamics dyno...

[edw-R]

Adrian, i want 240 :D
Yeah, i want toooooooooooooooooooooooooo:honda:

[todaek9]

Thanx Hips for the advice Toda AU...

i got a Friend who has 180hp ATW's...round up should be 240hp at the engine...so it means pretty high....and it's just a 1.8 ITR engine...i guess he should be happy about it huh...haha..!..

Anyway, i don't trust Dyno Machine anymore, Figure don't show you how optimum the car can perform...i prefer Street Tuning... :)

Anyway...i know there are few ways to get 280Hp....but i think people will laugh at me if i tell them my way...so i rather listen to what other has to say...(W/O N20)

But i guess Toda Spec C cams are one of the Problematic Cams to Gain power, as well as Showing straight line performance at the same time, Tuning needs to refine, Always...then only the best result will show...

i notice there are lots of Secret while tuning a Vtec but i guess all Tuners won't tell us huh...haha...sad....i just wanna know that...sob sob..

[edw-R]

Thanx Hips for the advice Toda AU...

i got a Friend who has 180hp ATW's...round up should be 240hp at the engine...so it means pretty high....and it's just a 1.8 ITR engine...i guess he should be happy about it huh...haha..!..

Anyway, i don't trust Dyno Machine anymore, Figure don't show you how optimum the car can perform...i prefer Street Tuning... :)

Anyway...i know there are few ways to get 280Hp....but i think people will laugh at me if i tell them my way...so i rather listen to what other has to say...(W/O N20)

But i guess Toda Spec C cams are one of the Problematic Cams to Gain power, as well as Showing straight line performance at the same time, Tuning needs to refine, Always...then only the best result will show...

i notice there are lots of Secret while tuning a Vtec but i guess all Tuners won't tell us huh...haha...sad....i just wanna know that...sob sob..
Good tuning with your friend. Can you show the dyno grahp and list his mod??
Thanks :)

[todaek9]

ehh...how to scan when i don't have a scanner...hmmm...can show you the graph if you wan.... hehe...

[edw-R]

ehh...how to scan when i don't have a scanner...hmmm...can show you the graph if you wan.... hehe...
Take a pic with digital camera and post here. Thx:)

[todaek9]

dude....i don't have a Digital cam man...but if you wanna see it wor, why don't you pay the Dyno and i show you?..hehe...
but i still think that Toda C is Damn hard to tune...

[TODA AU]

I still think that Toda C is Damn hard to tune...
That's not entirely true...
If the cams are installed correctly, it's easy...
B16A - LCA 105deg...
Tighten the LCA to 102.5deg on a B18 as the piston speed is too high...
If that's not perfect, they'll be a bastard to tune...
If your tuning ability is upto scratch & the cams are spot-on...
There's probably an issue with your ecu & injectors...
(Battery compensation number or something like that)
Issues like that can cause absolute havok...
Just remember to give the engine what it want's rather than a number you think it might...
Hope that helps...

Adrian

[spoondc2]

That's not entirely true...
If the cams are installed correctly, it's easy...
B16A - LCA 105deg...
Tighten the LCA to 102.5deg on a B18 as the piston speed is too high...
If that's not perfect, they'll be a bastard to tune...
If your tuning ability is upto scratch & the cams are spot-on...
There's probably an issue with your ecu & injectors...
(Battery compensation number or something like that)
Issues like that can cause absolute havok...
Just remember to give the engine what it want's rather than a number you think it might...
Hope that helps...

Adrian
Great info :thumbsup: thanks......
just wondering is that true that you need high compression ratio for Toda C? What else do you need? Just heard about fuel pumps, milled head...etc. And also what's the idle for C cam?

[TODA AU]

Great info :thumbsup: thanks......
just wondering is that true that you need high compression ratio for Toda C? What else do you need? Just heard about fuel pumps, milled head...etc. And also what's the idle for C cam?
High compression sure helps, it allows your engine to not only make higher peak power but hang on in the upper limits of the rev range.
That said, Spec C's work fine in a std compression B16A, certainly a lot better that JUN Step 3's. B18's perform better with Spec B's at std compression.
Milled heads are a problem due to 12.5mm valve lift as do thinner head gaskets... Valve to valve & piston to valve clearance must be confirmed.
Especially if the engine has been machined in any way.

In most cases, fuel pumps & fuel pressure regulators are all that is required on the fuel side of things... Extreem rpm & higher comp can nessesitate injectors & even high energy ignition systems... But certainly not always.

An aftermarket programable ECU is an absoulte must.
A VAFC or some other "play with your willy" vtec controller isn't good enough to get the most out of these cams... That is both Spec B & C
3 ECU's that will do the job & offer good bang for bucks are the Apexi Power FC, Vtec Link & Hondata...
Top shelf ECU's like MOTEC, Autronic & AEM EMS offer much, much more than the above mentioned ECU's at a premium price.

Regarding idle...
When installed & tuned corectly, depending on a few other things...
The idle is around 900rpm.
Ive had the idling as low as 800rpm.
Never higher than 1000rpm, unless there is an ECU issue that can't be solved.
Idle is very smooth, not lumpy in any way, though tougher sounding than stock. Further, the idle charateristics of Spec B's & C's are identical.

[todaek9]

Thanks hips adrian...valuable info...

[spoondc2]

:thumbsup: Totally Agree......
Anyone knows what is Toda D? similar to Toda Cs?

[todaek9]

Toda D is being customised by a company in USA where is meant for Drags only...you need to over size your cilinder head by 2mm...everything need to be oversize...the lobes is around 325, where as the Toda B is only 295....soo...i think is hell lot diff...and is good for 2 Lit...thats what i know...

[TODA AU]

The "Erick's Racing" TODA Spec D cams still share the same low cam as the B & the C.
High cam duration & lift is 305deg @ 12.5mm (Intake) & 315deg @ 11.9mm (Exhaust)
Spec C's by comparison are 295deg @ 12.5mm (Intake & Exhaust)
LCA is different.
The cams are produced by TODA Racing in Japan for Erick's Racing.
Because they are produced under licence, they come at a premium price.
Best suited to engines of increased capacity & rpm ability.
Valve springs, retainers & pistons need to be changed to suit.