Ozhonda Wiki - Feedback Required

[wynode]

I would just like to get some feedback on what you would want from a Wiki based on the following perspectives

1. As a reader learning / looking for information
2. As a contributor who would like to help maintain the Wiki

Please post any thoughts you have on the following:


How the sections / categories should be setup
Who should have access to editing the Wiki
What should be in the Wiki
Etc

I am tossing up a couple of options with regards to how it should be implemented so all feedback is welcome.

EDIT: Based on feedback we will look at having the following sections:
Accord,
Civic
etc (the other Honda models)
Road Rules and Regulations
Suspension / Handling

Under each section will most likely be an entry for each generation of that model.

Ie say under 5th generation Civic we might have:
History
Changes from the 4th generation
Specs
Economy
Variants
Performance recommendations

ETC

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

As a reader I'd like to see a nice and simple base for example have on the main page it sectioned off by model i.e AH ED EG EK etc (even having an image of the car to help reference nubs further) then from there go into the basics i.e suspension, engine/engine swaps, compatability, standard specs/info etc

As you know Win I'm more then happy to contribute if and where possible, though lately I've been busy with the move to Brisbane and not having internet access, though my hand is raised I may not be the best help of all.

[redefine]

i agree with lloyd on the model section, but also with technical categories...like a general suspension/engine etc. maybe having a tagging system, to link an artical to the "suspension" category as well as the "eg" category...if its not too hard. i have no idea on the technical side of wikis so im not sure how viable this is.

i'd be interested to see what people think about a database of general mechanical knowlege rather then honda specific, like an article on mcpherson struts and double wishbone as opposed to just in the civic article "the ek has double wishbone"

i am more then willing to contribute my knowlege...

[tseesinngwailo]

is this going to be available to the world or just OzHonda registered members?

It's a great idea as going from a DA9 to DC2R means I have to keep searching everywhere for info.

Definately sectioned into models, the chassis designations etc

Cross linking shouldnt be too hard, or just have a link at the bottom of each page to the model maybe

Would be great to ba able to find info on models, specs, suspension and drivetrains, conversions

Thanks in advance to the people who have to do the hard yards!

[wynode]

Thanks all for the offers.

Yes it will be open to everyone to view but only Ozhonda members to edit. Please keep the comments coming all.

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

Why has there not been much more input in this?

Come on people, this will make researching parts and interchangability a shitload easier, not forgetting all the nubs who cry 'how do I search?' or 'search for me' shall be no more, it'll be a simple point to the wiki which will be alot more straight forward!!!

[wynode]

Thanks Lloyd. I've put up a notice to get a bit more people looking at this.

[1990B18A]

As a reader I'd like to see a nice and simple base for example have on the main page it sectioned off by model i.e AH ED EG EK etc (even having an image of the car to help reference nubs further) then from there go into the basics i.e suspension, engine/engine swaps, compatability, standard specs/info etc

As you know Win I'm more then happy to contribute if and where possible, though lately I've been busy with the move to Brisbane and not having internet access, though my hand is raised I may not be the best help of all.

2nd that

[pat88c]

i think time to get a honda-tech style model lay out for each model with date of production as well

example

Honda civic

-ah and older
-ed/ef civic/crx
-eg/eh
-ek/ej8/em1
and few more in later models

Integra
-da
-dc2
-dc5

Accord
-cd
-old euro
-new euro

jazz
new and old model

Maybe move city , CRV and Odyssey out on the main section and out of Other Hondas

and other words a bigger Model Specific with more option for the user to find out more on each model without getting confuse

[burak213]

What should be in the Wiki
Etc
[/LIST]

i see alot of

"is this a defect" or "what can cops defect me for"

I think we should have a section stating the basics on what is legal and a defect.

-----------------------------------

Another idea would be to have basic modifications section for each car/engine/chassis with a DIY linked to it

----------------------------------

track and drag time section for everyone to see.


more ideas when i think bout it

[jdm_b16a]

For it to be effective we would have to be diligent with cross-referencing. For example, some performance mods relate to a variety of vehicle models eg. DA rear brake conversion on ED. Cross-referencing makes sure that all users, both experienced and noobs, can follow a thread or idea across models. Also, we would have to have plenty of scope to edit entries where we know the poster has made an error or at best, perpetuated a myth. I can't think of an example, but there's plenty of this currently on OzHonda.

I would like to see an alphabetical listing, but as I said, heavily cross-referenced.

Also allow for posting of photos as examples but restrict the photos to non-copyright and no stuff pinched from other sites. In other words, original photos only.

If I think of more, I'll post up.

Peter

[kcokla]

whilst you said wyn, itll be for ozhonda memebers to all edit, i think there should be strict regulation and format. in addition, proof reading perhaps by a handful of people. and ozhonda memebers who are allowed to add info should have a particular amount of rep points or something of similar nature.

[02gzm]

Sounds like a good idea. Centralise the common knowledge a bit more.

[SlobberGoat]

So the intention is to move all the tech to wiki....and leave the forum for spamming?

[thegame-01]

the intenstion is to minmize the amount of duplicate questions being asked over and over again. I think its a great idea. here at work we have a wiki so theres no need to ask questions unless it out of the ordenary :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup: for a great and effective idea

[Timmy_B]

Wyn, I really dont have a problem with how it is now..
I think if we have every make/model of car it will just create clutte. also i enjoy going into say the 'Integra' section and reading bout everything from DA's to DC5's. I think if everything was sectioned into make/year/model etc, i would probably not read as much from other users.
In saying that if there was sections/sub forums for makes/models it would be easy to find what your after..
PLUS each group could do like a photo comp, so each month or so when you click on that sub forum it will load with a pic of 'the car of the month' that would change things up a bit and keep members interested in submitting photos and voting for photos they like.

So pros and cons either way

[02gzm]

It shouldn't change the way things are asked/discussed now. It'll just be a place to put the information once it is agreed upon. Which saves having to search through heaps of threads to find the one thing you're looking for.

[GEG]

Honestly, all the info anyone could ever want - or need, is available at the touch of the search button.

Since there is no one answer to everything, the wiki would not be a definite answer. The best solutions to your own needs are often found in the back comments where someone stumbled across something that is related to your own situation.

I imagine it would be a waste of time to put together the wiki, as that would not change the jillion posts about the same subject in the forum.

Telling people to check the wiki is the same as telling people to check the search!

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

Telling people to check the wiki is the same as telling people to check the search!

It indeed would, only thing is that its easier to:

Ozhonda Wiki>Make and Model>EG>Suspension&Brakes>How to do a 5 lug conversion

then to:

Search > How to* 5 stud conversion on an EG

The info is directly there, has images diy's etc rather then have to go through 2+ threads to find the information or piece the correct information from 2+ threads.

[redefine]

It indeed would, only thing is that its easier to:

Ozhonda Wiki>Make and Model>EG>Suspension&Brakes>How to do a 5 lug conversion

then to:

Search > How to* 5 stud conversion on an EG

The info is directly there, has images diy's etc rather then have to go through 2+ threads to find the information or piece the correct information from 2+ threads.

+1. easier to link too

plus, alot of threads are based around the situation of the op, so when someone asks about an eg 5stud conversion, he might be looking for a specific piece of info not found in the latest 5 stud conversion thread, they might have to go 3+ threads back to find it, compared to once with the wiki. i know at the start the wiki may be very incomplete and the search will have more info, but as more people add more info to the 1 wiki page, compared to 15 different threads it becomes much easier to see for someone who was just starting out/hasnt done it before.

[02gzm]

You can compare it to google vs wikipedia:
Yea sure googling something will give you heaps of web pages with relevant info. But it takes a bit so search through them all and find the exact bit of info you want. Normally you'll have to get it from multiple sites anyway like Lloyd's example. And you're more than likely to get a wikipedia page come up in the search too.
But if you go straight to wikipedia for your info (providing it's actually correct), then it's going to have everything you want in the one spot, and more.

If it's a simple question like "what engine came in this model" or "what is the curb weight of an EG5" that a few people would know, then of course the answer could be found quite quickly on a wikipedia page and heaps of google results (probably the whole first page of results).

But if it's something not normally asked like "what is the stock stroke length of a K20A" or "what's the genuine part no. for a B-series sump gasket", then a wiki page can be a good place to store this info as searching through heaps of random crap in google is time consuming and you're probably going to get multiple results.

I for one would like somewhere that lists commonly used genuine part numbers and their applications as trying to get them from Honda when you have an engine swapped car is as painful as pulling teeth with pliers.

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

You can compare it to google vs wikipedia:

Then again you can do the Google vs Honda-tech also,

Honda-tech is filled with tonnes of information but I find its horribly hard to find diy's on there (might just be me)



I for one would like somewhere that lists commonly used genuine part numbers and their applications as trying to get them from Honda when you have an engine swapped car is as painful as pulling teeth with pliers.

Agreed

[wynode]

i see alot of

"is this a defect" or "what can cops defect me for"

I think we should have a section stating the basics on what is legal and a defect.

-----------------------------------

Another idea would be to have basic modifications section for each car/engine/chassis with a DIY linked to it

----------------------------------

track and drag time section for everyone to see.


more ideas when i think bout it

Sounds like a valid section to have. The way I see it we will have various section for each model type (ie Accord, Civic etc) and then sections under that for each generation. Each generation of that model will then have an article style layout with sub-headings for the various points relating to that generation or model.

See first post which I have updated.

Will look at a "Road rules and regulations" section also then.

As for track/drag times, it will require some 'evidence' in the form of a timeslip but we'll have to deal with that later.


For it to be effective we would have to be diligent with cross-referencing. For example, some performance mods relate to a variety of vehicle models eg. DA rear brake conversion on ED. Cross-referencing makes sure that all users, both experienced and noobs, can follow a thread or idea across models. Also, we would have to have plenty of scope to edit entries where we know the poster has made an error or at best, perpetuated a myth. I can't think of an example, but there's plenty of this currently on OzHonda.

Peter

Agreed on referencing and quoting sources. I know media wiki does this without too many dramas but it doesn't integrate well with vBulletin. The vBulletin option that I'm looking at however, (as far as I know) doesn't do this too well (if at all). I've noted this as a factor though thanks.


whilst you said wyn, itll be for ozhonda memebers to all edit, i think there should be strict regulation and format. in addition, proof reading perhaps by a handful of people. and ozhonda memebers who are allowed to add info should have a particular amount of rep points or something of similar nature.

Depending on how we implement it it might be restricted to certain member groups first. But the idea of a wiki is that everyone can contribute (as well as check each others work)


So the intention is to move all the tech to wiki....and leave the forum for spamming?

Not really. The forum will remain as is. There is a LOT of information on the forum, we're just trying to make this information easier to find and better structured.


Wyn, I really dont have a problem with how it is now..
I think if we have every make/model of car it will just create clutte. also i enjoy going into say the 'Integra' section and reading bout everything from DA's to DC5's. I think if everything was sectioned into make/year/model etc, i would probably not read as much from other users.
In saying that if there was sections/sub forums for makes/models it would be easy to find what your after..
PLUS each group could do like a photo comp, so each month or so when you click on that sub forum it will load with a pic of 'the car of the month' that would change things up a bit and keep members interested in submitting photos and voting for photos they like.

So pros and cons either way

As above. Forum will remain, it's just about how we might organise / structure the wikki and what we want from it.



<snip>
Telling people to check the wiki is the same as telling people to check the search!

Not really, because even when you search, you still have to go through a lot of posts/threads to find what you after. For someone just learning this isn't the best way to learn / read up on things.

Forums are great and have a lot of information. However I see a fundamental change required in that we need a way to collate that information in a central place. The internet started out with mainly static pages maintained by a webmaster. Web 2 saw the creation of reader contribution and 2 - way communication through social networking and (yes you guessed it) forums! I see a new change that is required and that is having a central place for information which is submitted and maintained by the community for the community. A wikki style structure would be ideal for this.

[mocchi]

ozhonda search function most of the time gives me junk.
will have to go through several pages to find some things that are actually relevant.

wiki should be a good idea. you gonna move the diy to wiki?

[wynode]

ozhonda search function most of the time gives me junk.
will have to go through several pages to find some things that are actually relevant.

wiki should be a good idea. you gonna move the diy to wiki?

Problem with the search function (well not really a problem, but more the nature of it) is that it gives you every single instance of the term you searched for. That's why it is important to have 'effective searching' skills.

Wiki will possibly reference DIYs but that's about it. How the Wiki gets implemented is still up in the air!

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

Wiki will possibly reference DIYs but that's about it. How the Wiki gets implemented is still up in the air!

Just having a thought/suggestion here Win.

With things like having technical about 'how to do a 5 stud conversion on an eg' or even 'how to make a k24 fit into an ek' (you get my drift?) if there are references/diy write ups/build threads available (in the DIY section or even elsewhere) perhaps it'd be good to have a link in with it for reference, that way nubs can have a read rather then reed the technical spread sheet of parts they need then get have a thread in the nub section of 'how much will it cost to' 'how much work is it to' 'etc etc etc to' (you know, they can read the thread and get perspective on what the OP went through)

When I brought the wiki up last year that was my intention tbh.

[wynode]

For those interested I've made a blog entry about possible wiki options here (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/entry.php?5-The-Wiki-Debate).

If you're interested in site related blogs you can subscribe (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/blog_subscription.php?do=subscribe&u=3) to my Ozhonda blog.

[wynode]

Just bumping this up again.

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

Wynode, haven't been on much.

Keep me updated via pm or email (I'm sure you still have it?)

[wynode]

Lloyd, will be doing some testing soon. So trying to get any feedback on board now while we plan things.

[wynode]

Guys just bumping this thread up as we're pretty close to getting some testing done by the moderators. I've read through the previous comments and believe we can cover most of them.

The layout will be roughly as follows:

Model Specific
|-> Accord
|-> Civic
|-> Integra
|-> CRX
|-> S2000
|-> NSX
|-> Jazz
|-> Prelude
etc

Technical
|-> VTEC
|-> Swaybar
etc

Acronyms
|-> DOHC
etc

Site Related
|-> FAQ
etc

For the Model Specific section we will of course have multiple pages for say Civic. Such as Civic EG, Civic EK etc.

Each of those pages will have a basic framework as follows:



Background
Specifications (Can have various sub sections under this for engine, drivetrain, suspension etc)
Fuel Economy
Variants
Features
Known Issues
Modifications (Can have various sub sections as per item 2 above)



Anything else to be added ?

[SHOGUNOVDDRK]

Lovin' it

[panda[cRx]]

http://blog.arkayne.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/LikeButton.gif

[wynode]

LOL @ pixelation

Thanks guys.....need contributors now!

[pat88c]

so if i know information about Gen 2 crx and want post it up just reply to crx subsection in wiki and will be modified into section ?

[wynode]

You should be able to actually edit the page.

If a page doesn't exist, then reply back here and I can create it.

[02gzm]

I added a few common electrical issues (and solutions) in the EG Si section which could probably be copied to most of the other car/model pages once they're created, since they affect most 90's Honda's ;)

Oh and just a suggestion. I think there's too many levels within the Wiki. Maybe instead of the variants having their own pages, have sub sections under a model? i.e. EG Civic has its own page, under that you have the specific variant info (a specifications table for each variant), then further down you can have generics (background, features, known issues, modifications, etc). This will save having a heap of duplicate info on each page since 90% of it will be the same for each variant anyway. Then there's also more chance of the Wiki being filled out correctly/completely.

[wynode]

Thanks for that.

Point noted about the multiple levels. Perhaps having many pages like you mention is a bit hard to maintain and results in duplicate content. I'll have a think about it and might cut the levels down. The CRX page is looking like going that way so will keep an eye on it.

[wynode]

I've just re-enabled the Wiki having disabled it due to some errors with advanced search (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?151442-fatal-error-when-attempting-to-use-advanced-search).

Happy to have people contribute/provide feedback.