Confused and need assistance

[Zdster]

Hi all:wave: ,

I know that the topic of suspension has been covered in many many threads (I have searched and I think that I have read almost all of them) and after speaking to a few 'professionals' I am more confused about suspension than before I began.

1. What is the difference between springs, coilovers, shocks, dampners and all of the rest of those things that I am told that I do or do not need???

I am driving an ek and want to lower my ride about 1.5-2 inches. I would like to retain some sort of ride quality, perhaps something like the stock ride feeling. Other than that I am not particularly sure of what else I want out of my suspension/springs etc.

2. Regarding the above would suggest only putting in springs? or springs and shocks? What are the benefits of one over the other? I was told by a 'professional' at Pedders that all I would need was springs while a guy that I spoke to at Honda said upgrade springs and shocks?

In terms of budget I am simply better of spending $400 and getting springs or spending four times as much and get the works??? What are the long term differences between the two???

Very confused as you can probably see. Thanks for bearing with my all of questions and hopefully you guys can put me straight.

Thanks.

[Kawasaki]

if you want to just lower your car get some springs, the ride should stay smooth. I'm using pedders springs and they are great! nice and stiff but not over the top. Don't know if you would need shocks as well.. OEMs should do

[mytoycivic]

regarding only using springs, its not the best idea. if you are lowering your car 40-50mm then your stock shocks (OEM) will only bottom out on every bump on the road. for $1100 you can get a full top-of-the-line eibach sport spring and koni yellow setup. on the other hand, you can get a king spring and koni red setup for about $800..

if you are only using your car on the street, you dont want coilovers.

go for springs and shocks. you will thank yourself later for doing it right the first time.

[Zdster]

Thanks for the responses guys.

From what I understand I am much better going with a set of springs and shocks? What is the difference between springs/shocks and coilovers?

Also what is the difference between eibach sport spring and koni yellow vs king spring and koni red besides $300??? Are cheaper springs all that much worse than more expensive springs???

[Zdster]

Bump . . . can anyone help???

[Z]

Koni Yellow is height and damper adjustable, where the Koni Red is JUST damper adjustable? (I think :o)

I've got Koni Yellows and Kings on my EK and I love em.

**Im not 100% if this is accurate - someone pls verify :D**

[Zdster]

Thanks for your help Z, mytoycivic and Kawasaki.
Why do you need height adjustable shocks? Isn't the height determined by the springs (hence the reason for buying lowering springs but keeping stock shocks)?

So from what I understand I am better going stocks and springs???
Quality wise, what do you get for your extra cash if you spend more on each of these items?

Anyone else got any input and able to give me a hand?????

[Limbo]

Coil overs allow you to adjust the height of your shocks and dampering (the good ones do). Main reason is cos they allow you to setup for a track. But you are looking for at least $2-3k for these.

Standard shocks only allow max (the adjustable type) to adjust the hardness of the shock or dampering. There is no height adjustment.

From what i remember the koni reds are just standard shocks with better than normal handling and dampering. Koni yellows are the sports type which have slightly better handling. There are adjustable konis also which are adjustable in stiffness, i use to have these in my old car.

[barefootbonzai]

So if i can score myself a set of Tein SS coil overs for around $1200 i should just get that over the eibach sport spring and koni yellow for $1100. What do you guys think????

[CTR Coupe]

Teins are very harsh I’ve heard. Great for Jap roads but our roads suck. The great thing about the Eibach and Koni yellows is you can pick your spring rates. This means you can get softer springs that won’t be as hash and more suited for Australian roads. Only downside is there isn’t as much hight adjustment in them.

[joneblaze]

*sigh*... There are many goals and aims for each individual and their ride, even more variables, and yet again more people on line that will be willing to spend half a minute typing up a post that will serve to confuse you even further.

Perhaps Zdster, if you would like to outline in more depth your goals and requirements for your new suspension?
You have already described the height drop you're aiming for. You have also stated you wish to retain close to stock ride comfort. Are you aiming for your car to handle well on the road/circuit, or merely cruise and look good/low?

Outlining and evaluating these goals will enable you to pick the right application for your EK, without spending in excess and wasting your money, nor picking the wrong suspension items and being unhappy.

I believe Koni Reds are not damper nor height adjustable.

In regards to the question about Koni Yellow vs Koni Red (+ springs) package, the difference is basically the pricing, and the ability to height and damper adjust.

Speak to someone with suspension knowledge, like McChook (Matt), on these forums.

And btw, from personal experience, don't even waste your time talking to most Pedders staff... :)

[alphabeatsco]

if i was to do track work, is KING LOW springs, with KONI yellow a good setup!?
cos when i do cornering, i can feel my car totally tilting...
not a good sign on a track.

[type one]

koni yellows and springs at best offer a "sport" set up... a bit of hard road cornering coupled with a smooth but "firmish" ride...

you can take this combination to the track, but do not expect to get good track times.

My best advice to you zdster which has been covered off before - is get in someone's car with a koni type set-up and with a coilover set-up... make the decision yourself, as it is your car and u will have to live with your decision.

honestly, if you are like me and wouldn't have the foggiest idea of "optimum" suspension settings do not waste your money on a set of expensive coilovers which allow you to adjust 16 -32 damper rates and lower your car to differing heights... you will NEVER use these functions.

there are members on this board who will swear by 2k-3k suspension but never utilise them to their full potential.

please research this topic more thoroughly by speaking to some of the folks mentioned above and having a drive on different set ups.

[alphabeatsco]

is the KYB or TOKICO good SHOCKS?
i found some on ebay..at a pretty good price.

just remember i've currently got KIng sprins.. dunno if it'll be good for track...

[alphabeatsco]

is the KYB or TOKICO good SHOCKS?
i found some on ebay..at a pretty good price.

just remember i've currently got KIng sprins.. dunno if it'll be good for track...

[type one]

are you yanking my chain?

[wynode]

if i was to do track work, is KING LOW springs, with KONI yellow a good setup!?
cos when i do cornering, i can feel my car totally tilting...
not a good sign on a track.
A larger rear sway bar is your best bang for buck to reduce body roll.

[alphabeatsco]

yeah but i thought i should always get the suspension setup first, then get the sway, strut barz...
isnt that true?

is KYB or TOKICO any good with the king's?

[type one]

ok so you weren't yanking my chain... the yanks like tokico shocks... so if you want to be a yank then take the tokico...from what i have "heard" the kyb is a better product - but all in all i'd be happy with either... product should be broadly comparable as they are pretty much the same thing.

and dump your king springs in the bin and get something more firm - this should negate the need for you to get a swaybar for a "predominant" street application.

[Non Vtec]

I had the Tokico Illumna's in my CRX I had they where pretty good shocks, I also have them in my other CRX with Adjustable platform suspension on nthem, They car handles better than anything I've ever driven, including cars withKonis etc..
There is alot to be found in Spring rates and sway bars when it comes to tuning suspension, the shock is only the beginning. Try to buy a shock that has adjustable hardness on it, that way you can tone it down for daily driving aswell...

[alphabeatsco]

so in that case, TOKICO is da way to go ????

[Non Vtec]

most shocks in the Adjustable Koni-tokico-Kyb brackets are all pretty much the same, Buy some that are in car adjustable, some shocks have to be removed to be adjusted. We use alot of Blistein's in car now aswell, mainly cause they can be cut and built to any length. I beleive the Koni's can be rebuilt when they start to get worn.
Just buy what you think is right for you.
Koni Yellows or Tokico's and Nuespeed Springs are a very good handling combination for street use.

[liberx]

yeah but i thought i should always get the suspension setup first, then get the sway, strut barz...
isnt that true?

is KYB or TOKICO any good with the king's?

A sway bar is an integral part of your cars suspension, the Springs, Shocks and Swaybars all work together and should complement each other. Upgraded sway bar(s) will help reduce body roll and affect balance (hopefully getting it right!) without having to go to rock hard springs that you otherwise may need.

There are other elements to the equation (strut bar, bushes, bump stops, plethora of geometry measurements), but provided those are basically OK (IE not stuffed up) Springs, Shocks and Swaybars will have the greatest effect.

[Zdster]

Thankyou all for your replies. I completely forgot about this thread after I initially got very few responses.

Limbo: Thanks. I had a look at konis website and figured that out.

joneblaze: My proirities were to have a car that was a comfortable daily driver. I don't need extremley aggressive suspension (such as the Tein RA's). Really I am just after a cruiser that feels alright on the roads.

I have been reading very widely about suspension, its components and what it will do to my ride. Furthermore, I have also been looking for the 'best bang for buck solution" as my funds are limited at the moment. From all of this reading (which I hope anyone that is looking at suspension does do widely) and am almost in a position where I have made up my mind.

type one: Thanks for the advice. I am finally starting to find my way through this maze of information :) .

Non Vtec and Liberx: I think that purchasing quality suspension components is key and it is just a matter of finding what is right for you and your ride.

So I have almost sorted out springs and shocks. The next question that I had is what else would I require? I no some sort of sway bar but there are so many. What do you guys suggest? Front, back, top, bottom??? Also if I buy shocks/struts are camber kits needed/suggested? Do I need different control arms?

Thanks again all :wave:

[type one]

on top of your strut tops = strut bar
underneath your shocks (under your car) = tie bar

you are confusing yourself. You would need control arms if you were thinking of changing your suspension to that of another car OR to upgrade to an aftermarket set which is completely silly to someone who drives a street car...

camber kits are used to adjust your wheels camber + and - now you might need one of these kits if you were intending on correcting your cars camber if you ended up lowering it into the ground or wished to add some negative camber for handling purposes.

Here is my advice to you:

1.) get your springs and shocks sorted.
2.) drive on these shocks and "bed them in" as you woulkd an engine for a few hundred k's and then give your car some... if you are happy then forget about the rest of what you have mentioned.

my feeling on this is that you will be very happy...

[Zdster]

Thanks type one, I think that is good advice :thumbsup: .

I think that is what I will do :) .

[Mystic_Integra]

hey, i have an LS 91 teg, and i'm planing on gettin new springs, so far i've looked at KING Springs or Pedders Springs, but mite get the Pedders Sport Ryder Kit, which includes Springs and Shocks.

i'm still unsure wat 2 get tho...:confused:

now i'm lookin into Koni Yellow or Red, but i wanna know how much it set-me back.....
plus will those type of koni springs go well with KING Springs or Pedders Sport Ryder Springs?????? or will need a diff. type of springs?????

does any 1 here have or want a similar set-up? and was it worth the price?

:wave: plus does any 1 have Koni's in Western Australia, and where did u get'em from and how much did it cost ya?:wave:

thanks:D

[LO_N_SXC]

[QUOTE=Mystic_Integra]hey, i have an LS 91 teg, and i'm planing on gettin new springs, so far i've looked at KING Springs or Pedders Springs, but mite get the Pedders Sport Ryder Kit, which includes Springs and Shocks.

i'm still unsure wat 2 get tho...:confused:

now i'm lookin into Koni Yellow or Red, but i wanna know how much it set-me back.....
plus will those type of koni springs go well with KING Springs or Pedders Sport Ryder Springs?????? or will need a diff. type of springs?????

does any 1 here have or want a similar set-up? and was it worth the price?

:wave: plus does any 1 have Koni's in Western Australia, and where did u get'em from and how much did it cost ya?:wave: [QUOTE]

I have Tokiko Illumina shock's and Jackson Racing - Full race spec Springs on my 89 LS, Heaps of guys in the States have setups like this, the shocks give five points of tension adjustment for soft to stiff! you could go on E-Bay Motors (US Version) and get your hand on a set of this Shocks for a good price and some times if you're lucky the have Coil over inserts on them with Springs, Plus I suggest to stay away from King Springs (IMO) I have seen many people get them and they ain't happy with the height of the car so they end up geting them Compressed and after a while they Sagg Badly Or you're better of Buying full Coil overs! but depends on what budjet you have????

[Zdster]

Mystic Integra you might want to try DNA Autoworks . They are from Melbourne but I know that they sell Koni's (see here: http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10054). I am sure that they will be able to give you a quote.

[Mystic_Integra]

hey i rang up some place around perth, and this place said the can get me a set of KING Springs for about $550 fitted.(no shockies) and they said i can use my stock shock's, and my car will be lowered by an inch and a half. wat do u reckon?

i also called up Pedders in WA, they Sport Ryder Kit Suspension cost round $1515 for springs and shocks, and for shocks only it costs $1090.

but i thinkin of get KING Springs all round, with Koni Sport Yellows, how does that sound??? but i dont know off a place in Perth that can get Koni's in??

so this set-up will cost around $1400 for Springs and Shocks do reckon its worth it?

but first i'm gettin my springs then i'll buy the shocks, and i'll buy them a pair at a time. is that good, or is that danerous.....should i really buy them all at once? can my stocky shocks handle KING springs??

[edw-R]

Within your budget, i think spoon spring is your first choice. Around $350. But if you want high performance, coilover is a choice for you. The spring rate setting is very important for coilover. For street: F9K R6K. For track: F14K R9K ( i can accept track setting on the street ). Too many people did'nt try and said " Too hard, No good, this is a daily day, not suit for me....etc ". My car is a daily car. I am using track setting with no problem. No complaint. Hope this info can help you!!

[type one]

hey i rang up some place around perth, and this place said the can get me a set of KING Springs for about $550 fitted.(no shockies) and they said i can use my stock shock's, and my car will be lowered by an inch and a half. wat do u reckon?

i also called up Pedders in WA, they Sport Ryder Kit Suspension cost round $1515 for springs and shocks, and for shocks only it costs $1090.

but i thinkin of get KING Springs all round, with Koni Sport Yellows, how does that sound??? but i dont know off a place in Perth that can get Koni's in??

so this set-up will cost around $1400 for Springs and Shocks do reckon its worth it?

but first i'm gettin my springs then i'll buy the shocks, and i'll buy them a pair at a time. is that good, or is that danerous.....should i really buy them all at once? can my stocky shocks handle KING springs??


YES, if you want to lower your car, please do it properly and springs with matched shocks is the cheapest and BEST way to do this... by using your stock shocks with shorter springs you will be killing your shocks and putting undue stress on your chassis...

You can do this and its not an issue, your stock shocks will support the Kings Springs, but for long term support i would avoid this at all costs... if you don't have the cash then wait and do it...

IMO $550 is quite expensive...shop around...

[Mystic_Integra]

na type one, the springs cost $300, but the place is charging $240 for labor.

[type one]

so $240 is cheap to you?