Sticky Gearbox and clutch shudder

[blabla]

Hi,

I was driving to work this morn and the car was fine and all of a sudden the gearbox became sticky and now i have clutch shudder it never did that before.

The motor is a b16a with type r clutch and fly.

I have s4c gearbox w/o lsd.

Kris

[bennjamin]

Recently installed ? Sounds like your master or slave cylinder has failed

[blabla]

Recently installed ? Sounds like your master or slave cylinder has failed

came with the motor about 4-5yrs ago. its a non lsd box. there is a bit of squeak when i put the clutch in.

[bennjamin]

It's safe to say the clutch pressure plate and or disc should be replaced. Just do it. Exedy organic clutch kit very nice for b series.

[blabla]

It's safe to say the clutch pressure plate and or disc should be replaced. Just do it. Exedy organic clutch kit very nice for b series.

so my clutch needs replacing? what about the slave cylindet isn't that what causes the squeak?

[mugen_ctr]

didnt you replace the clutch an remachine fly wheel before u dropped in the new motor + gearbox?

[markismaximus]

isn't that what causes the squeak?

no, a clutch squeaks because its a moving mechanical part, when you depress the clutch the diaphragm springs are what squeak.

[blabla]

didnt you replace the clutch an remachine fly wheel before u dropped in the new motor + gearbox?

i didnt do the conversion byp did it.

[blabla]

didnt you replace the clutch an remachine fly wheel before u dropped in the new motor + gearbox?

flywheel was machined the clutch was one they had. both parts where from an type r.

[blabla]

drove car again when engaging clutch it makes a hissing sound. and starting to crunch.

[blabla]

hello? has anybody delt with this before?

[mugen_ctr]

if its not the clutch, could be thrust bearing, if not, input shaft bearing.... if all fails, prbs the gearbox itself

[dougie_504]

Sounds to me like the clutch is about to shit itself as this sounds like how mine felt before it died half way through the black spur. But I'm no expert. Replace it IMO.

[blabla]

clutch is engaging randomly at a complet stop. car is in gear, clutch in all the way and it engages wtf!

[blabla]

ffs can someone give a straight answere

[markismaximus]

the only way the clutch will engage if your foots to the ground is by a leaking slave or master cylinder. Ben mentioned it in his post above. have you checked them both???

ps. settle down, no-one here is forced to help you at all. if you are that worried take it to a honda mech

[blabla]

the only way the clutch will engage if your foots to the ground is by a leaking slave or master cylinder. Ben mentioned it in his post above. have you checked them both???

ps. settle down, no-one here is forced to help you at all. if you are that worried take it to a honda mech

are the leaks visible? wouldnt the brakes be playing up if the mc was leaking?

[markismaximus]

are the leaks visible? wouldnt the brakes be playing up if the mc was leaking?

Not necessarily, if the cups in the cylinder aren't sealing properly fluid will push past it without actually leaking anywhere.

Brake mc and clutch mc are completely different components

[blabla]

Not necessarily, if the cups in the cylinder aren't sealing properly fluid will push past it without actually leaking anywhere.

Brake mc and clutch mc are completely different components

so its more likely tht it is the clutch mc? i just bought a clutch.

[markismaximus]

could be master or slave. In my experience its more likely to be the master though. I'd say replace the mc and sc before changing the clutch. You doing this yourself or paying a workshop?

[mugen_ctr]

check the clutch fluid, that happened once to me, where i thought it was the clutch but wasnt the case

[markismaximus]

check the fluid as mugen_ctr has mentioned. if its empty/low bleed the system. If its low you have a leak somewhere though.

If the fluid is fine a possible way to check if its the cups in the cylinder that are stuffed is to get a mate to look at the slave cylinder on the gbox whilst you press the clutch in. if the slave cylinder starts moving while you still have your foot on the clutch the cups in one of the cylinders is allowing fluid to pass (which means it needs replacing)

I know you can get rebuild kits for brake mc's but not sure about clutch mc's. Might be worth giving honda a ring to find out

[blabla]

check the fluid as mugen_ctr has mentioned. if its empty/low bleed the system. If its low you have a leak somewhere though.

If the fluid is fine a possible way to check if its the cups in the cylinder that are stuffed is to get a mate to look at the slave cylinder on the gbox whilst you press the clutch in. if the slave cylinder starts moving while you still have your foot on the clutch the cups in one of the cylinders is allowing fluid to pass (which means it needs replacing)

I know you can get rebuild kits for brake mc's but not sure about clutch mc's. Might be worth giving honda a ring to find out

bought master and slave going to replace master first and if its the master woohoo if its the other return it. what could it be more slave or master? or could it be both?

[blabla]

could be master or slave. In my experience its more likely to be the master though. I'd say replace the mc and sc before changing the clutch. You doing this yourself or paying a workshop?

ye im doing it myself just picked up the mc and sc $120 all up. I think the clutch is still good no slip at all.

[blabla]

this is some f@*-/d shit i have been changing without the clutch and seems as though is has fixed itself up wtf. is the sc and mc failing?

[markismaximus]

how does flat changing prove its fixed itself?

[blabla]

how does flat changing prove its fixed itself?

its doesnt, but what i am asking is how come its working poperly all of a sudden? im going to change sc first.

[markismaximus]

read this thread: http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?5872-quot-Flat-changing-quot

think you are getting confused between flat shifting and changing without a clutch

[blabla]

ye sorry changing without my clutch anyways. when i put it in reverse it makes a buzy sound.

[blabla]

ye so today it got sticky again so out of the sc and mc what could it be more? Or should i just change both?? I have both the mc and sc.

[bennjamin]

change both bleed properly and see if that helps.

Besides...if its been a good 4-5 years since the clutch has been replaced i would hazard a guess its time for new setup

[blabla]

change both bleed properly and see if that helps.

Besides...if its been a good 4-5 years since the clutch has been replaced i would hazard a guess its time for new setup

i would hazard a guess its time for new setup? sorry not sure what u mean by this.

[aaronng]

i would hazard a guess its time for new setup? sorry not sure what u mean by this.

Means it is time to replace the clutch with a new set.

[aaronng]

clutch is engaging randomly at a complet stop. car is in gear, clutch in all the way and it engages wtf!

What I'd do is the following in order:
1) Check for any wet patches underneath your clutch pedal to rule out a failed master cylinder
- If it is wet, replace your master cylinder.

2) Bleed fluid at the clutch slave cylinder.

3) Confirm that the clutch release fork is moving when you press and release the clutch pedal.
- If the fork is not moving or if it moves when your foot is pressing down the clutch pedal fully, then replace the slave cylinder.

4) If nothing is moving and everything seems to be working fine but your clutch still engages on its own, then I suspect your clutch pressure plate is damaged or worn.

[blabla]

What I'd do is the following in order:
1) Check for any wet patches underneath your clutch pedal to rule out a failed master cylinder
- If it is wet, replace your master cylinder.

2) Bleed fluid at the clutch slave cylinder.

3) Confirm that the clutch release fork is moving when you press and release the clutch pedal.
- If the fork is not moving or if it moves when your foot is pressing down the clutch pedal fully, then replace the slave cylinder.

4) If nothing is moving and everything seems to be working fine but your clutch still engages on its own, then I suspect your clutch pressure plate is damaged or worn.

It was working fine on the way home yesterday and today until i stoped to grab myself a coffee. then it like seezed up.. I will use this advise and check prob tomorrow.

[markismaximus]

you figured this out yet? replaced MC, SC and bled the system?

[blabla]

you figured this out yet? replaced MC, SC and bled the system?

no update yet guys will be doing the work tomorrow. been busy with family stuff for christmas also replacing tie rods and putting back oem drive shafts that have been reconditioned.

[e240]

ffs can someone give a straight answere

Seriously, you're asking for help and demanding answers? You're never going to get a straight answer because everyone is simply guessing the issue from what you described. If you want a straight answer, its very simple, take it to a shop to get diagnosed rather than try and fish for answers.

If I had a guess, something's broken off the clutch plate and is intermittently jamming up the plate movement causing random engagement and dis-engagement.

[blabla]

changed master cylinder and slave blead the system and still getting the same thing.:-(

[bennjamin]

Clearly clutch or pressure plate is rooted get it replaced.

[mugen_ctr]

If getting a new clutch, get the exedy clutch an lightned flywheel package... ask The Saints about it, its pretty good deal an price wise as well if ur gonna get a new clutch kit... no point in getting H.D clutch if ur gonna leave the power as it is

[na-118]

why would you go replacing them 2 items without diagnosing it properly? was there any signs of leakage before you replaced it?

[blabla]

why would you go replacing them 2 items without diagnosing it properly? was there any signs of leakage before you replaced it?

In saying the above what if i changed the clutch and it was doing the same thing. Been reading that it could be more problems then just a clutch or those two cylinders.

[bennjamin]

In saying the above what if i changed the clutch and it was doing the same thing. Been reading that it could be more problems then just a clutch or those two cylinders.

what else exactly ? You seem to know more than anyone here !

IF its been 4-5 years since the clutch has been replaced , and this issue suddenly happens and isnt fixed with the replacement of the MC and SC - id drop the gearbox replace clutch machine flywheel and inspect everything you ( your mechanic ) can

[blabla]

what else exactly ? You seem to know more than anyone here !

IF its been 4-5 years since the clutch has been replaced , and this issue suddenly happens and isnt fixed with the replacement of the MC and SC - id drop the gearbox replace clutch machine flywheel and inspect everything you ( your mechanic ) can

RELEASE PROBLEMS

If the clutch does not release completely when the clutch pedal is fully depressed, the disc will continue to turn the input shaft. This may prevent the driver from shifting the transmission from neutral into gear, cause grinding when the gears are changed, or cause the engine to stall when coming to a stop.

A clutch that won't release may have a misadjusted linkage, a broken or stretched release cable, a leaky or defective slave or master clutch cylinder, air in the hydraulic line or cylinders, corroded, damaged or improperly lubricated input shaft splines, a worn pilot bearing/bushing, a worn bearing retainer, bent or worn release fork or pivot ball, bent clutch drive straps, bent or distorted clutch disc, a clutch disc that was installed backwards, or mismatched clutch components (if the clutch was just replaced).

Other things that can cause the clutch to drag or not release include heavy gear oil in the transmission that's too thick for cold weather, defective or worn clutch pedal bushings or brackets, or flexing in the firewall or any release component attachment point.

I am using dot 4 brake fluid could the higher rating of the fluid be the problem... This is the site

http://automotive-clutches.com/basic_clutch_info.html

[bennjamin]

dot 3 or dot 4 fluid is used for hydraulic systems such as brakes and clutch lines.

Next - all the other stuff you have ripped from a google search involves dropping the gearbox and inspecting. Incorrect fluid wont directly cause a sudden issue...unless the issue is a failure of a part/s from incorrect fluid. Stop diving for possibilities on the internets and get someone to drop the box

[blabla]

dot 3 or dot 4 fluid is used for hydraulic systems such as brakes and clutch lines.

Next - all the other stuff you have ripped from a google search involves dropping the gearbox and inspecting. Incorrect fluid wont directly cause a sudden issue...unless the issue is a failure of a part/s from incorrect fluid. Stop diving for possibilities on the internets and get someone to drop the box

You offering to drop the g/b, car cant go not were towed it out of the garage with another car.

[blabla]

called hrc in wetherill they said its prob he springs on the clutch but they also said to get it checked... they quoted like 1500-2000 for a clutch change with rear main seal changed and special oil and additives to make sure the gears dont crunch...

[mugen_ctr]

right... so that special oil must be royal purple or redline shock proof gear oil right? lol... seems alot, im sure u can find a cheaper quote else where

[blabla]

Quotes

Shift
flywheel machined, spigot bearing changed, release bearing, clutch plate and cover, oil and labour about $1100.

Toda
spigot bearing changed, release bearing, clutch plate and cover, plus oem gear oil and labour 800-900, no machined fly $825.

[bennjamin]

called hrc in wetherill they said its prob he springs on the clutch but they also said to get it checked... they quoted like 1500-2000 for a clutch change with rear main seal changed and special oil and additives to make sure the gears dont crunch...

additives are like snake oil...dont do shit. Where your gears crunching before ?IF not dont worry about additives.
Grab a HD organic exedy clutch kit off TODA AU , EG5 etc , then pm me or TODA AU or another diy on this forum.

[blabla]

Just called hannys they said that when they do clutch jobs they dont machine the flywheel is there any specific reason they wouldnt apart from it it being extremely worn out? They said they use some paper?

[TheSaint]

lol you remind me of one of my mates - lots of money, no patients

clutch should be changed every 5 years or so - its roughly how much life i get out of mine
a properly looked after gearbox will last at least 300 000 kms
and you still havnt ruled out the fact that the input shaft and main bearings could be stuffed
you also havnt told us how you treat the gearbox and what condition it was in when you bought it

ignore anyone that suggests using additives - the only additive that should go near your car is the occasional high quality injector cleaner for your fuel

Pro tip: Dont stand in the fire.

1. Buy Exedy sports organic clutch + Lightened Flywheel from ebay
2. Buy NEO HD Gearbox oil from the supplier in sydney (ill look it up for you)
3. Buy J's Racing sump plug bolt from ebay (for gearbox)
4. Call your favourite reputable mechanic (possibly Honda)
5. Shouldnt cost more than $600 in labour to do the change
6. Get them to inspect the car for any other problems while its in the shop
7. Adjust your attitude
8. Do your own research
9. ???????????
10. Profit?

[blabla]

lol you remind me of one of my mates - lots of money, no patients

clutch should be changed every 5 years or so - its roughly how much life i get out of mine
a properly looked after gearbox will last at least 300 000 kms
and you still havnt ruled out the fact that the input shaft and main bearings could be stuffed
you also havnt told us how you treat the gearbox and what condition it was in when you bought it

ignore anyone that suggests using additives - the only additive that should go near your car is the occasional high quality injector cleaner for your fuel

Pro tip: Dont stand in the fire.

1. Buy Exedy sports organic clutch + Lightened Flywheel from ebay
2. Buy NEO HD Gearbox oil from the supplier in sydney (ill look it up for you)
3. Buy J's Racing sump plug bolt from ebay (for gearbox)
4. Call your favourite reputable mechanic (possibly Honda)
5. Shouldnt cost more than $600 in labour to do the change
6. Get them to inspect the car for any other problems while its in the shop
7. Adjust your attitude
8. Do your own research
9. ???????????
10. Profit?

See the problem is I'm not loaded! Called like 5 mechanics and they all have narrowed it down, they all say the clutch is the problem. I will be getting Exedy Hd clutch. I have found some1 to do the work for me already. I run a type R flywheel, the age of the clutch is 5yr old and a little bit. U do know that some items arent any cheaper on ebay....Bearings will be changed with the clutch... flywheel and thrust. Oem oil will be used. spoke to lsvtec on here he had the same thing happen and he just changed the clutch and that was it. Called shift, hannys, hrc racing, p N R automotive & Tam Automotive.

[TheSaint]

ebay was a hell of alot cheaper when i bought my clutch and flywheel

flywheels do need machining or replacing after time - if your doing the clutch i would do the flywheel as well

i got my Exedy HD Clutch and Exedy 10.9lbs Alloy (exedy include the bearings and cover) fly for $400 posted to my door and than my mechanic charged the same to put it in

but hey - it doesnt really sound like you want help or advice from anyone on here - so good luck

[blabla]

ebay was a hell of alot cheaper when i bought my clutch and flywheel

flywheels do need machining or replacing after time - if your doing the clutch i would do the flywheel as well

i got my Exedy HD Clutch and Exedy 10.9lbs Alloy (exedy include the bearings and cover) fly for $400 posted to my door and than my mechanic charged the same to put it in

but hey - it doesnt really sound like you want help or advice from anyone on here - so good luck

Question to you what engine u running? I picked up a std clutch for 250 for my old motor... and how long ago did u buy this clutch?

[TheSaint]

i have a D15b7 - i believe the B series will be about $100 more

got mine a couple of months ago from Gripforce on ebay

heres a USDM Exedy Stage-1 Organic Clutch and Exedy 9.5lbs Flywheel kit for just under $500 - shipping shouldnt be much more

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/EXEDY-RACING-STAGE-1-CLUTCH-KIT-FLYWHEEL-CIVIC-SI-B16-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem5d295c082bQQitemZ40012 5855787QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccesso ries

[blabla]

i have a D15b7 - i believe the B series will be about $100 more

got mine a couple of months ago from Gripforce on ebay

heres a USDM Exedy Stage-1 Organic Clutch and Exedy 9.5lbs Flywheel kit for just under $500 - shipping shouldnt be much more

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/EXEDY-RACING-STAGE-1-CLUTCH-KIT-FLYWHEEL-CIVIC-SI-B16-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem5d295c082bQQitemZ40012 5855787QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccesso ries

Well i have contacted the seller when I got skunk sleeves the freight for that was around the 100 mark thats via usps. I can get the clutch for 370 not too sure abt the cost with the fly wheel.

[jim57a]

http://gccorp.com.au/ for the NEO GB fluid

[blabla]

i have a D15b7 - i believe the B series will be about $100 more

got mine a couple of months ago from Gripforce on ebay

heres a USDM Exedy Stage-1 Organic Clutch and Exedy 9.5lbs Flywheel kit for just under $500 - shipping shouldnt be much more

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/EXEDY-RACING-STAGE-1-CLUTCH-KIT-FLYWHEEL-CIVIC-SI-B16-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem5d295c082bQQitemZ40012 5855787QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccesso ries

So the above is 630 inc freight... i will be checking with turbo auto spares tomorrow for a price with flywheel. 134 US for freight.

[TheSaint]

Well i have contacted the seller when I got skunk sleeves the freight for that was around the 100 mark thats via usps. I can get the clutch for 370 not too sure abt the cost with the fly wheel.

it will probably work out about the same domestic or international ... doesnt really matter - as long as u get quality parts at a fair price and solve the problem

labour for the install shouldnt be over 1000$ tho - thats way over priced


http://gccorp.com.au/ for the NEO GB fluid

that stuff is liquid gold

[blabla]

whats the correct p/n for the clutch disk been sold a hcd015 and od is 219 instead 220. how can i tell if its a true hd kit.

[TheSaint]

australia gets a 'HD' kit ... america has a 'O.E.' kit

they are pretty much the same thing - but different part numbers

if its going on a B16 - i would get the Stage1

[blabla]

car fixed broken clutch disk spring bracket