DC5R throwing up engine light after having header + catback installed...

[Nuci]

Hey all,

Just had a Buddyclub header and J's Racing catback fitted to my car. I noticed that after about half an hour of driving, an engine light appeared. Also, when the car is up to running temperature, when it is at idle the revs sometimes drop quite low, and the car feels like it wants to stall. Ive also noticed that occasionally the header knocks on the floor of the car under hard acceleration. The exhaust is also a de-cat system. Whether thats worth noting im not sure.

But can someone please help explain the engine light and how to remove it? The car seems to run fine, just the issue with the revs dropping at idle.

Any help would be great. Cheers.

[seihoa]

1st of all the headers shouldnt be touching the floor under any circumstance.

2nd you shouldnt be running a de-cat system =P

3rd Maybe try reset the ecu? might fix the problem.

[Nuci]

Well they dont always touch the floor, i can just hear them knock against it occasionally. And because of the Buddyclub header's design, the only way to fit a cat wouldve been to cut a chunk out of my header and catback, which i didnt want to do since they cost me a fortune. Its a race header, so having no cat is something i just have to deal with lol. But ill try the ecu reset. I just disconnect the battery for a few mins dont I?

[Vvvtec]

Wild guess, but could it be O2 sensor related?

As for resetting your ECU, everything you need to know is in here:

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?38742-Resetting-your-ECU-with-BIG-O&highlight=Ecu+reset

:)

[Mattski_VTIR]

At guess mate, your engine light is due to the lack of cat in your exhaust system, have you still got the O2 sensor and the A/F sensor connected?? My brother had a similar problem when we fitted his toda headers, also race headers, but Adrian at Toda modified the headers to suit a cat, i would definantly recomend you to do this.
You can reset your ecu but it will most probably come back. Are you running an aftermarket ecu?? because K-Pro you can change settings in the ecu that will throw DTC's for certain emmision devises. Best bet is to check what DTC/DTC's have come on, here are a few codes that are related to O2 and A/F.

O2 Codes = 63-1 low voltage, 63-2 high voltage, 65-2 heater circuit malfunction. A/F codes = 48-3 circuit malfunction, 41-4 heater system malfunction, 41-1heater circuit malfunction, these will probably not be the codes you will have, my brother said his threw (catalictic converter not working efficiently/ not sure what code this is) you will need a HDS or a general scan tool to extract these codes, an advantage to the older hondas (2 pin bridge).

As for the knocking, not normal but not unheard of, might pay to check clearance of the exhuast to body and swaybar, most aftermarket headers will require you to swap from standard swaybar to EP3R swaybar, this will help with clearance issues and its a straight swap, you dont want to crack those nice new headers!!!. engine mounts are another important thing to check, if any of them are split you might want to replace them with stiffer ones, or inserts.

hope this helps you with your dilema.

[V8KLLR]

I made a post on DTC codes listing all of them for dc5r. Check it out. Hope it helps.

[45SET]

Engine light - There is an o2 sensor before and after the cat in a DC5R. The secondary sensor probably isn't liking the amount of CO2 gases after the "cat", so thinks something is wrong. Also note there are hefty fines for not running a cat, and any cop that knows anything is going to be able to smell the lack of a cat... not to mention the DOT. In all seriousness, I would be running a cat if you intend to use the car on a regular basis (Would also reccomend a cat if you intend to use the car for street use).

Knocking - I beleive these headers are deisgned to be used with the stock sway bar. But the stock engine mounts in a DC5R are VERY soft. If you replace them with something stiffer you should avoid this knocking noise.

[Nuci]

I tried the ECU reset, and the light is still there... It also hasnt fixed my weird idle issue... This is what is concerning me the most, as im worried it might be damaging my engine. As for the light itself, im pretty sure that its the lack of cat that is causing it. I do intend on putting one in, but since the exhaust system cost me a mint i need to save up a bit first. Can anyone explain the abnormal idle? The car will start fine, ill be driving along normally, then as i put the car into neutral to come to a stop, the revs drop low and the car almost stalls. However it hasnt actually stalled yet, just feels like it wants to. and it only does this for say 10-20 seconds, if i leave it idle for a while the revs will go back to around normal. But if i start off again and then come to another stop itll do it again. It only started doing this after the exhaust was fitted.

Any ideas?

[45SET]

It's fairly obvious.

You have no cat. The 2nd sensor is going "WTF is going on here, I shouldn't be reading this much CO2 gas", so it's putting less petrol into the engine, and making less CO2.

The stock ECU and sensors are designed to have a cat in the exhuast system. I wouldn't be surprised if you ruin the 2nd sensor with not having a cat there, as they are quite brittle.

GET A CAT! Even if you put the stock headers back on until you have enough money to get a cat fitted to the other headers.

[sneakyEG]

Like 'Mattski_VtiR' and '45SET' said.... basically the 2 sensors are normally there with the cat, the 1st sensor (A/F) sits in front of the cat and the 2nd sensor (actual o2s) is in the middle of the cat. The 2nd sensor (o2s) compares readings of c02 gas in the exhaust continuously against the 1st sensor, and as the cats job is to reduce the c02 (which it isnt in your case without a cat) the ecu is making adjustments that are out of spec and therefore turning ON the engine light to notify you there is a problem (which is your missing cat).. The idle problem is related to the same issue of a missing cat too.. So if you GET A CAT FITTED or get an AFTERMARKET ECU as suggested you can resolve all issues and gain some performance too!!
Oh and if you run ur car with the engine light ON without the cat more than likely you will soon start to melt the rear bar around the exhaust pipe due to excessive heat from lean a/f ratio! and you will also damage your motor and probably sensors too if left long term.

[r3ckless]

just skimmed hrough his hread in 30 seconds.. knocking is because u have stock mounts, get billet mounts.

like i said in my PM, get a defouler.

resetting the ecu only eliminates the light until the ecu geos crazy n goes wtf at so much air passing though.

[bennjamin]

You will need this

1. Install an aftermarket cat
2. Install a cat defouler. This is a bung or small pipe that decreases the emissions to the secondary o2 sensor. It means less exhaust is read from the ecu , so it tricks it to think there is a standard cat installed and running fine.
After installing simply remove your ecu (unplug it ) for a minute or so and the check light should be gone - and the car should run slot better

As for the clunk under the car - this is the header touching the chassis or swaybar as the engine pivots
You either need a new rear engine mount or others , or perhaps you need the ep3 front swaybar ( required when installing some jdm headers on a dc5)

[WATAJK]

BTW....
By going the buddyclub route with headers.. this is what you get.. tbh...
Not going to flame you but seriously...
For the extra $500 roughly... You coulda got brand new TODA Headers which have a MUCH better clearance then BuddyClub

[Nuci]

The knocking isn't on the swaybar. There's plenty of clearance there. It's on the floor of the car. And it occurs because the buddyclub header is a two piece header, meaning the spring bolts that join the two pieces allow for some slight movement. I know this because I was under the car and had it demonstrated to me by the mechanic. My concern wasn't where the knock was coming from, it was whether it was the cause of the CEL. But it's been established that it's my cat (or lack of). So thanks guys for clearing that up, I'll look into the defouler asap.

As for buying toda headers over buddyclub, you have to have rocks in your head. Adrian quoted me approx. $2500 for the toda header, cat and ep3 sway. I got my BC header for 1150, and I don't need another swaybar. Anyone who pays nearly 1500 more for a toda header is an idiot. Unless it's going to make me twice the power, it's a huge waste that could be spent on other parts. And I know for a fact it won't make anywhere near twice the power. Heck, you'd barely notice the difference with a kpro, which is next on the list. Sorry to burst your bubble pal, but value for money, and for a street driven car, the BC header eats the toda header.

[45SET]

Not when it comes to fitment... obviously.

You get what you pay for.

Also, if your mechanical showed you what was hitting, why did you ask? It's not hitting on the chassis because of the springs, its hitting because you have stock mounts, and stock mounts move... A LOT! Like others and myself have said, get stiffer mounts.

[bennjamin]

As for buying toda headers over buddyclub, you have to have rocks in your head. Adrian quoted me approx. $2500 for the toda header, cat and ep3 sway. I got my BC header for 1150, and I don't need another swaybar. Anyone who pays nearly 1500 more for a toda header is an idiot. Unless it's going to make me twice the power, it's a huge waste that could be spent on other parts. And I know for a fact it won't make anywhere near twice the power. Heck, you'd barely notice the difference with a kpro, which is next on the list. Sorry to burst your bubble pal, but value for money, and for a street driven car, the BC header eats the toda header.

sorry almost $1500 more for the toda header ? you mean toda header , new swaybar AND new cat. Thats the requirement if need be using the toda header , without a tuneable ecu id hazard a guess that all aftermarket headers are quite similar in peak power figures. But if you want to compare you must be idiot for getting the buddyclub header - when you could of got a kiddracing ( RMF copy) header for $400 and had more power(band). For a street driven car ITS ALL THE SAME SHIT. No header will make any difference more than any other ON THE STREET. Can you feel 5,10hp difference between two cars ? No.

Each to their own lol !

[Nuci]

Not when it comes to fitment... obviously.

You get what you pay for.

Also, if your mechanical showed you what was hitting, why did you ask? It's not hitting on the chassis because of the springs, its hitting because you have stock mounts, and stock mounts move... A LOT! Like others and myself have said, get stiffer mounts.

The fitment issues were with the catback, not the header.

[Nuci]

sorry almost $1500 more for the toda header ? you mean toda header , new swaybar AND new cat. Thats the requirement if need be using the toda header , without a tuneable ecu id hazard a guess that all aftermarket headers are quite similar in peak power figures. But if you want to compare you must be idiot for getting the buddyclub header - when you could of got a kiddracing ( RMF copy) header for $400 and had more power(band). For a street driven car ITS ALL THE SAME SHIT. No header will make any difference more than any other ON THE STREET. Can you feel 5,10hp difference between two cars ? No.

Each to their own lol !

Funny you should mention kiddracing, I was going to buy the clubrsx header, but for some reason I couldn't get the authorization on my credit card. I cbf mucking around so I just bought the buddyclub one. It's was at a workshop on the other side of town so I didn't have to wait, or pay postage.

And that's the exact reason I didn't go toda. You can't feel the difference! So it's a waste. Since i was having trouble with the crsx header, the BC one was the next best option.

[l__i__l]

Lol ppl who have been in this game long enough will know toda is nothing but overpriced.

Ive tried their products for years from header to cams and the results have been pretty average

[Vvvtec]

Lol ppl who have been in this game long enough will know toda is nothing but overpriced.

Ive tried their products for years from header to cams and the results have been pretty average

What do you recommend? In general I mean.

[45SET]

The fitment issues were with the catback, not the header.

Read your original post


Ive also noticed that occasionally the header knocks on the floor of the car under hard acceleration.


I would call this some type of a fittment issue.


Lol ppl who have been in this game long enough will know toda is nothing but overpriced.

Ive tried their products for years from header to cams and the results have been pretty average

I've been in the "game" for a while, and I would have to say Toda is worth the money.

You have to remeber that you are modding a N/A 2L 4. Power is hard to come by (At the best of times), so it's not so much the max power, but power delivery.

When I went from OEM AUDM DC5R headers to OEM JDM DC5R headers, I noticed a massive difference in the mid to top end

When I went from OEM JDM DC5R headers to Toda headers (With Cat) I noticed a massive change across the entire rev range (Including low end power), then when I had my K-Pro retuned (By Adrian from Toda), there was even more of an increase.

But this thread is about Nuci's engine light, and knocking, not a "my headers are best".

[l__i__l]

What do you recommend? In general I mean.

The ssr replica- kiddracing header is the best bang for buck header out there!



I've been in the "game" for a while, and I would have to say Toda is worth the money.

You have to remeber that you are modding a N/A 2L 4. Power is hard to come by (At the best of times), so it's not so much the max power, but power delivery.

When I went from OEM AUDM DC5R headers to OEM JDM DC5R headers, I noticed a massive difference in the mid to top end

When I went from OEM JDM DC5R headers to Toda headers (With Cat) I noticed a massive change across the entire rev range (Including low end power), then when I had my K-Pro retuned (By Adrian from Toda), there was even more of an increase.

But this thread is about Nuci's engine light, and knocking, not a "my headers are best".


Lol you’ve been in the game for a while? please fanboy the game only game your in is need for speed.

you’ve tried what audm, jdm, and the toda header, and now you think you know the game?

how about you come and see me after you try companies like ssr, smsp, hytech etc They make custom header for your specific car not like the jdm crap you’re used to buying, and will be cheaper than a toda too.

my smsp shat all over the toda, 0.4 sec quicker on the mile, I use the toda as my sewerage pipe now, “jdm” pffffffft

[burak213]

my smsp shat all over the toda, 0.4 sec quicker on the mile, I use the toda as my sewerage pipe now, “jdm” pffffffft

cool story bro.

how about you stick to the topic and not bash people for giving their opinion.

[Nuci]

^^^

I tried the ECU reset, no good. Im trying the defouler option next. If that doesnt work ill just get a kpro, was going to do that down the track anyway.

[r3ckless]

^^^

I tried the ECU reset, no good. Im trying the defouler option next. If that doesnt work ill just get a kpro, was going to do that down the track anyway.

U can do that, u are aware when u throw the cel light, the ecu throws thecar into limp mode... U losr power, and have terrible fuel consumption

The defouler is a simple soulution. Like i said to u, i have a spare and for a few bucks.. Its easily eliminated until you get kpro.
Let me know if u want mine.

[Vvvtec]

This ^^

My car is in limp mode right now... Pain in the butt

[WATAJK]

The ssr replica- kiddracing header is the best bang for buck header out there!





Lol you’ve been in the game for a while? please fanboy the game only game your in is need for speed.

you’ve tried what audm, jdm, and the toda header, and now you think you know the game?

how about you come and see me after you try companies like ssr, smsp, hytech etc They make custom header for your specific car not like the jdm crap you’re used to buying, and will be cheaper than a toda too.

my smsp shat all over the toda, 0.4 sec quicker on the mile, I use the toda as my sewerage pipe now, “jdm” pffffffft

God your as bad as another idiot on these forums....
He ain't a JDM Fanboy... He's expression his view point as well as i am...
TODA is worth the money, kidraccing and Buddyclub are in a league of there own...
I don't understand why you'd buy the buddyclub header that has really bad clearance when the TODA Header offers better gains and better clearance for what?? An extra $500?? (I don't mean to slander the buddyclub product, im just stating the facts)

BTW... I've had custom exhaust's made up for my DC5R before and i will NEVER EVER go back to that rubbish again.
Stick to something that will benefit your car..

If you lower your car Nuci, it wouldn't surprise me if you hear some knocking sounds.....

Settle big boy, im done now so i'll be tieing the rubbish bag now and take you to the bin too =)
Enjoy the rest of your day :p

[Nuci]

I'm going to change the engine mounts, as I reckon that is what's causing the knocking. Not the fitment of the header itself. And what will I use to pay for the mounts? Probably the huge lump of cash in my pocket leftover from going with the buddyclub header over the toda ones.

I'm by no means saying that the toda product is no good. I've seen and heard the benefits you get from it. But when I get an email from Adrian saying it'll cost me 2550 to get the header, cat and swaybar, I have to think to myself is it really worth all that extra money? Because I bought my buddyclub headers from 999 for 1150. That's 1400 bucks! And you WILL NOT be able to justify that much more money for the toda header by pointing to power gains.

Like someone stated earlier, the k20a is tough to extract power from. It's not like a rb25 or 2jz whereby bolting on an exhaust can net you 50+ horsepower. We are talking 10-20 MAX. So with my 1400 bucks left over, I could buy cams, or a kpro, or a catback, or a gruppe m intake... All top shelf products that when paired with the buddyclub header, will have many more benefits than just the toda header alone. Not trying to flame anyone here. I'm just being smarter with my money. It doesn't matter how you try to justify it, it's not worth more than TWICE as much money.

[r3ckless]

I reckon solid mounts (hasport) + cai (injen) + coilovers (alot) are the three best mods for the dc5.

The mounts for more feeling and the vibrations are cool. After sitting on trains, riding in Daily's.. When I jump in my car every weekend to just drive it out to wash it. The rattles feel good(dunno why). The injen cai for really waking the engine up, and finally a coilover setup for looks as well as handling.

[Nuci]

I reckon solid mounts (hasport) + cai (injen) + coilovers (alot) are the three best mods for the dc5.

The mounts for more feeling and the vibrations are cool. After sitting on trains, riding in Daily's.. When I jump in my car every weekend to just drive it out to wash it. The rattles feel good(dunno why). The injen cai for really waking the engine up, and finally a coilover setup for looks as well as handling.

I was going to get inserts but if you reckon the hasport ones are better then maybe I should go with them. They're billet ones so they'll be rock hard won't they?

[r3ckless]

I was going to get inserts but if you reckon the hasport ones are better then maybe I should go with them. They're billet ones so they'll be rock hard won't they?

My opinion is do things right the first time. Why go for inserts when you can get hasports,i remerb geting mien for like $530 shipped from hasport.com when the aussie dollar was buying 81 cents LOL.. be sure to email hasport directly for an invoice shipped to Australia. Australia doenst appear on their shipping list on the site :( get 62A, im sure if u go any stronger, the vibes will be OTT>