Tach it up, tach it up, buddy gonna shut you down

[NickPieMan]

Hi hows it going, I'm new to this forum

I've got a classy 93 Accord. Last week we had a little rainstorm here in Melbourne and I accidentally drove my car into an invisible lake. Water was sucked in through the air filter and now 'I need a new engine' according to my mechanic. He did a compression test whatever that is and there was next to nothing in the four cylenders.

Lucky for me I have access to another car

So seing as how I need a new engine, I figure it's also time to upgrade the interior, install a nice sound system, maybe put in a more powerful engine, turbo charge it or something. Not that she was slow to begin with! She hasn't been beaten at the traffic lights.

So starting at the start, I hope someone can tell me exactly what a compression test is? And why a head gasket (which is one of the things I have blown) is so expensive to fix?

[Indie]

Hi. I recently drove my '93 Accord which is worth next to nothing into an 'invisible' lake, so now I'm going to spend money on an interior, a sound system, a more powerful engine and a super turbo-charger or something. She already kills all the other people who drag me at the lights. They're definitely racing me. Unluckily for the owner, I have access to their car. I hope an invisible kangaroo doesn't hop in front of it!

So starting at the start, and beginning at the beginning, can somebody tell me how cars work? Because I thought they could float, but it turns out they can't. Now it turns out they have more parts than an 'engine' and a stereo. And can somebody tell me why it's such a stupid idea to waste so much money on a shitty old car, spending more than it's worth on ridiculous 'upgrades', rather than buying a new car? Because I am an idiot.

Thanks!

[mugen_ctr]

if u have zero idea as to cars, u got a lot of reading to do, an NOW!, wiki, google....

My opinion, go buy another car, an dont touch it, as it seems you have not a single drop of knowledge as to modding cars, let alone any information as to the workings of a car

heres a thought, give a mechanic 10k an see what he does with ur car, he will either dump in a old engine an say its new, an scam u into 10k, or he will be a good mechanic an use that 10k to build a much nicer, more powerful accord as u said.... choice is ur buddy :D

[NickPieMan]

Thats why I'm here to learn what I can

I am not buying a new car, I like the one I have now. I would like it even more if it worked.

My mechanic said that to get a new engine installed it would cost me five thousand. Like you said though is he being honest or not?? I dont know

That is why I want to know exactly wtf is wrong with my car and why it needs a new engine to fix it.

Now lets try again - what is a compression test?

[V8KLLR]

By the sounds of it, you have hydraulic locked you car, which led to some serious internal damage. Hydraulic lock is when water has entered your combustion chamber, and created excessive pressure because water does not combust like air and fuel. So with all that back pressure something had to give. A compression test is checking how much compression there is in the combustion chamber and the piston when it is at the bottom of its stroke.
Most engines should have 140 to 160 lbs. of cranking compression with no more than 10% difference between any of the cylinders.

Low compression in one cylinder usually indicates a bad exhaust valve. Low compression in two adjacent cylinders typically means you have a bad head gasket. Low compression in all cylinders would tell you the rings and cylinders are worn and the engine needs to be overhauled. Picture a cylinder and its combustion chamber with the piston at the bottom of its stroke containing 1000 cc of air (900 cc in the cylinder plus 100 cc in the combustion chamber). When the piston has moved up to the top of its stroke inside the cylinder, and the remaining volume inside the head or combustion chamber has been reduced to 100 cc, then the compression ratio would be proportionally described as 1000:100, or with fractional reduction, a 10:1 compression ratio.

Alot of dudes will burn you for your thread. Just by the way you wrote it illustrates an image of a kid who doesnt know squat. What those guys fail to realise is that we all started somewhere. And to be honest, there are alot of jerks on Ozhonda, but admist all the trash talking and e-thuggery, you do find some useful information.

Use wikipedia, e-how and howstuffworks for more info.

[Indie]

Oh come now... It's nice to give him advice on what the mechanic said, but somebody needs to illustrate the fact that spending money on this car will never be a good idea. They need to tell him how prohibitively expensive and pointless it would be to put a turbo charger on an almost twenty-year-old FWD sedan. They need to explain that, unless he can do much of the work himself, which he clearly can't, he will certainly be ripped off by almost any mechanic.

Anybody who talks about driving their car into an invisible lake, beating every other car in traffic light drags, and talking about turbocharging a family sedan before asking what a compression test is... They have it coming.

You drove your car into a lake. I assume it isn't comprehensively insured. Unless you can get it done for a decent price, it makes more sense to buy another used Accord than to replace the engine in this one, and try not to drive the next one into a large puddle.
.

[e240]

errr.."Hydro Locked"??


...hydraulic locked ....

[V8KLLR]

Yes. That was what the NRMA dude that came and helped me called and Adrian from Toda. Hydro locked is slang i guess but still has the same meaning.
Hydrolock (a shorthand notation for either hydraulic lock or hydrostatic lock) is an abnormal condition of a reciprocating engine in which an incompressible liquid, commonly water, has been introduced into one or more cylinders, causing immobilization or damage. - Wikipedia.

I used to think the same thing too.

[V8KLLR]

Oh come now... It's nice to give him advice on what the mechanic said, but somebody needs to illustrate the fact that spending money on this car will never be a good idea. They need to tell him how prohibitively expensive and pointless it would be to put a turbo charger on an almost twenty-year-old FWD sedan. They need to explain that, unless he can do much of the work himself, which he clearly can't, he will certainly be ripped off by almost any mechanic.

Anybody who talks about driving their car into an invisible lake, beating every other car in traffic light drags, and talking about turbocharging a family sedan before asking what a compression test is... They have it coming.

You drove your car into a lake. I assume it isn't comprehensively insured. Unless you can get it done for a decent price, it makes more sense to buy another used Accord than to replace the engine in this one, and try not to drive the next one into a large puddle.
.

"Alot of dudes will burn you for your thread. Just by the way you wrote it illustrates an image of a kid who doesnt know squat. What those guys fail to realise is that we all started somewhere."
Yea I further elaborated on what the mechanic said. Im just saying, he asked this question in the noob forum, cause he obviously is a noob. Bagging him out isnt gonna solve anything, why not asnwer his question and further educate him about how we roll on ozhonda? We are not a bunch of street light warriors. If he doesnt change his act he'll realise there's no place for him here or anywhere really. Thats my opinion.

[jeremydawg]

Hi. I recently drove my '93 Accord which is worth next to nothing into an 'invisible' lake, so now I'm going to spend money on an interior, a sound system, a more powerful engine and a super turbo-charger or something. She already kills all the other people who drag me at the lights. They're definitely racing me. Unluckily for the owner, I have access to their car. I hope an invisible kangaroo doesn't hop in front of it!

So starting at the start, and beginning at the beginning, can somebody tell me how cars work? Because I thought they could float, but it turns out they can't. Now it turns out they have more parts than an 'engine' and a stereo. And can somebody tell me why it's such a stupid idea to waste so much money on a shitty old car, spending more than it's worth on ridiculous 'upgrades', rather than buying a new car? Because I am an idiot.

Thanks!

HAHAHAHAHA, this made me lol so friggin hard, made my day.

How the hell did you drive it into a lake? Get another car man, aint worth fixing it up

V8killer needs to chill, Indie is right he had it coming.

[euromandeluxe]

http://trollercoaster.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/trollface_hd.png ?

[V8KLLR]

HAHAHAHAHA, this made me lol so friggin hard, made my day.

How the hell did you drive it into a lake? Get another car man, aint worth fixing it up

V8killer needs to chill, Indie is right he had it coming.

Yea bro you know what your right, LETS ALL GANG UP ON THE KID AND DISS HIM ON THE NET! instead of helping him or something.

Unsubscribing from this thread now.

[jeremydawg]

^^^ i think your a little sensitive man lol

[Lukey]

its the noob forum for a reason, for noobs to ask noob questions.

let it be and help the kid out with advice / suggestions.

kthxbai

[mugen_ctr]

ok suggestions......, if there was no insurance, than the next best thing would be a engine conversion, But of the same one, im guessing its a F22a motor? next thing is, how deep was the car submerge? if it was waist deep, odds are the ecu is fried... if u source a half cut of the same car, half the price of what that mech quoted, as its all labour an no needing for sourcing parts, than next thing is to register the motor to the chassis, as its a replacement motor, no need to do a roady worth cert, but if the vehicle was deemed as a repairable write off, than thats a different story

hope this is some useful info

[grifty]

its an old accord, max id pay for a low km engine would be $600, so what hes gonna charge u 4.4k to install? yeah right.........

i would just DIY it with a mechanically minded friend and i would pay him abit aswell.

5k sounds good if its a brand spanking new engine from honda, but putting a brand new engine in it would be a waste....

[aaronng]

Guys, invisible lake means a huge deep puddle created by the rain. He does not literally mean an actual lake.

[NickPieMan]

i would just DIY it with a mechanically minded friend and i would pay him abit aswell.

That is what I am hoping to do


5k sounds good if its a brand spanking new engine from honda, but putting a brand new engine in it would be a waste....

I dont see why. The car has a nicer body than most of the cars I see on the road today. I'd much rather spend my five thousand on fixing this car, not buying another

When your dog catches a cold and snots all over you, do you chuck him out and buy a new one? I dont think so

[NickPieMan]

how deep was the car submerge? if it was waist deep, odds are the ecu is fried...

i dont think it was that deep. no water got into the cabin, but the front of the car was submerged to the top of the bumper bar. i read somewhere that the accord's ecu is located near the passengers seat, if that is true then it should be ok

[NickPieMan]

Guys, invisible lake means a huge deep puddle created by the rain. He does not literally mean an actual lake.

Quoted for truth. It was dark and I didnt see the sheet of water turning on to the Eastlink freeway.

[NickPieMan]

We are not a bunch of street light warriors..

I assumed that an internet forum about cars would have been full of such people?

[integragsi96]

I assumed that an internet forum about cars would have been full of such people?

not quite...
most people on here go to track days and drag strips.

but if your really hung up on your car do a h22a or h2b conversion for around $5k.
but dont turbo an old engine...its like jumping on a granny and telling her to run...she is just gonna crumple under you lols.
now if you are gonna get an old engine to turbo may i suggest an engine rebuild then turbo it...
for 6k you can get a h2b conversion, a member is selling one here and making alot of power..heres the link:
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?143706-COMPLETE-H2B-Conversion-FS-PRICE-DROPPED.

[integragsi96]

oh and built with stronger internals

[Indie]

That is what I am hoping to do



I dont see why. The car has a nicer body than most of the cars I see on the road today. I'd much rather spend my five thousand on fixing this car, not buying another

When your dog catches a cold and snots all over you, do you chuck him out and buy a new one? I dont think soI'm sure it's straight and clean, and you love your car, but listen to him. Putting a 5k engine into that car is a waste of money; the chassis simply isn't good enough to justify it. But if

When you accidentally drown your dog in a puddle, do you give it a lung transplant? No, you put it to sleep.

Anyway, the more people tell you not to do it, the more you're going to want to do it. That's how teenagers work. But you're wasting your money if you spend more than 1k fixing that car...

[NickPieMan]

Why isn't the chassis good enough? Is it going to fail after a few thousand more kms? Are there parts besides the engine that will wear down and need changing in the future? I don't understand where the waste is.

[V8KLLR]

Why isn't the chassis good enough? Is it going to fail after a few thousand more kms? Are there parts besides the engine that will wear down and need changing in the future? I don't understand where the waste is.

What his trying to say is do something up worthwhile and something thats designed to be fast. Like turbo a dc2, or dc5. EK,EG or EM civic with a kswap. Something that people will wow and gawk at. You can full do up an ancient accord. But it wont have the same wow factor as a done up EM1 or DC5 etc. Its a family car anyways.

[NickPieMan]

Ok thanks I get what you're saying

[V8KLLR]

No worries. Hop on carsales. Alot of nice civics and integras to choose from. What body shape do you like?

[Indie]

Ha. Nobody but Honda owners wow at Hondas. You may see your pride and joy Civic or Integra that you've spent 10k on modifying, but almost everybody else will see a pensioners' hatchback with ugly wheels. I'm not telling him to modify a flashy car to impress people, not at all. In many ways, he's better off with an Accord than a Civic or an Integra. It's just stupid to throw money away on a sporty engine and a sporty interior when the car itself isn't at all sporty.

[V8KLLR]

Ha. Nobody but Honda owners wow at Hondas. You may see your pride and joy Civic or Integra that you've spent 10k on modifying, but almost everybody else will see a pensioners' hatchback with ugly wheels. I'm not telling him to modify a flashy car to impress people, not at all. In many ways, he's better off with an Accord than a Civic or an Integra. It's just stupid to throw money away on a sporty engine and a sporty interior when the car itself isn't at all sporty.

So EG6's EK9's DC2R's and DC5R's are not sporty?. This is something he wants to do. He wants to buy a fast engine and do the whole shebang. Right now he wants to have fun, cant do that with an accord really, they are a family car, not really designed with performance in mind . Atleast he can enjoy him self with something quick he can call his own?

Ha?

[Super-DA9]

It's up to you bro but you will have a lot of trouble squeezing the performance you want out of an old accord engine, I hate to say it but it's usually the truth about old engines designed for family cars etc. not saying that a family car can't look tough, but you will blow a lot of money and not get what you're seeking in return. not to mention how hard it would be to find performance parts for that car.

B series VTEC engines found in the civic, integra and CRX are much better for performance purposes and are easier to squeeze power out of, and find parts for. maybe it'd be a good idea to think about whether you'd be happy with a car like that as your project, you could afford a civic b16 with a bit more ontop of that 5Gs'. then you can look into turbocharging or supercharging it later? turbo B series are fkn quick. (so USDM haha)

when I had my first car, 1990 DA9 integra B18A non-VTEC, I was so keen on doing it up in every way. but even though I poured lots of money into it I barely got any performance increase. I guess my '95 DC2 isn't a whole lot newer, but the mileage is low and it's got a much better base engine with higher potential.

and best not to talk about traffic light drags here man haha, i mean everyone is a spirited driver sometimes, but dragging every car at the lights is like, what you see guys in commodores doing who are probably thinking "i need to show everyone ever that i live my life a 1/4 mile at a time yoooooo!" not meaning to flame you bro but yeah it's not impressive at all lol..

if you wanna do up the accord man it's totally up to you, but if you do you should make it a nice cruiser rather then a performance car. low, comfy, classy cruisers with just a nice sound system (nothing over the top like 12" subs) are cool as well :)

good luck mang

[Indie]

So EG6's EK9's DC2R's and DC5R's are not sporty?. This is something he wants to do. He wants to buy a fast engine and do the whole shebang. Right now he wants to have fun, cant do that with an accord really, they are a family car, not really designed with performance in mind . Atleast he can enjoy him self with something quick he can call his own?

Ha?When did I say they weren't sporty? The Civics have good suspension setups, so they can make for a good FWD toy. Tegs are obviously sporty, to some extent. You're just echoing what I'm saying; he needs to buy a different car. Having said that, anybody who talks about dragging people off the lights and driving their Accord into a lake in the same sentence really needs a reality check.

[anzai]

Unsubscribing from this thread now.

:confused:

[ricerockets]

just seems to me that he really likes his car, and wants to do it up maybe if he wants something faster down the track then he'll upgrade to a turbo eg or dc, but for now he wants to modify his accord that he has grown to really like.

like all my mates bag me out about modifying my euro which is also a family car, telling me i should get a 180/S15/R34... etc but im really happy with my euro at the moment

just my 2c

[beeza]

Take your time man,spend heaps of on the net looking at options,then GO FOR IT!!

Money is always the deciding factor on how far U can go.

Do it within your budget and U will be stoked!

[NickPieMan]

Before I go any further can someone explain the gist of this forum? I think I crossed some sort of line with that traffic lights comment. I am not some bogan teenager with a V8 Commodore, stupid licence plate 'KOPKLA' and a baseball cap that spends all his time racing other roads users and masturbating over how hardcore he is.

Obviously I have 'no clue' about cars I have come here to 'get a clue'.

And thanks to the guys who explained what a hydro lock is. Guess my next question would be, if the valves have been damaged, or the head gasket, why does this mean I need a new engine? The parts themselves can be replaced can't they? I have had a look on the net and the head gasket is just a piece of metal with lots of holes in it. Anyone can open up their engine and replace this part as long as they have the service maual for their car. Why do mechanics charge so much for this job?

Is it just that there is so much work involved in getting to the gasket and replacing it that it would be cheaper or easier to buy a new engine? I don't accept that.

Where do you buy parts from anyway? Say I wanted to find a new engine, or a part for an engine. Are there places on the net that you can buy these things from?

[grifty]

its not worth the money to strip down the engine to see whats wrong with it, it could either be a bent conrod or valve.

If you get a workshop manual for your car it should have the procedure on how to change a headgasket, but i wouldnt attempt it without some godd mechanical knowledge.

the reason is costs so much is that alot of time is required to strip down the engine to get the head off, once the head is off is also needs to be machiened at a specialst workshop. getting a workshop the change the headgasket usually costs upwards of $600+

there could be other problems in you engine that you dont know about since its hydro locked, maybe bent valves or bent conrod.

You are really better off getting a low kms 2nd hand engine with warranty

[NickPieMan]

That's probably true, but I don't need to ge tthe car back on the road in a hurry, and the way I figure it if I am going to end up replacing the engine anyway, I might as well open it up myself and see exactly what damage I have caused. Mechanics isn't all that hard, it's just like meccano only bigger.

I have been looking at pictures of hydrolocked engines and bent rods and I'm starting to understand why a new engine might be required.

[beeza]

yeah,just cant talk about racin' on da streets,tis' all :)

[NickPieMan]

Just out of interest, is that because some members are police officers? Coz there might be some other stuff I also shouldn't mention

[beeza]

lol would be wise my child lol

[gumus89]

The reason a second hand engine is the best bet is because the individual parts to replace new would cost more than the whole engine.

That guy didnt mean your cars body will fail with a more powerful engine... He meant that the chassis of the car wasnt made to handle a lot of extra power. People that do these things to old cars have to upgrade a lot of other parts of the car to get it all to work.

You throw in a turbo with stock suspension and see how far you get. You might even rip apart the drivetrain on a car that old.

[Indie]

That's probably true, but I don't need to ge tthe car back on the road in a hurry, and the way I figure it if I am going to end up replacing the engine anyway, I might as well open it up myself and see exactly what damage I have caused. Mechanics isn't all that hard, it's just like meccano only bigger.

I have been looking at pictures of hydrolocked engines and bent rods and I'm starting to understand why a new engine might be required.You have no knowledge of how an engine works. You will not be able to do this yourself. There's a reason that qualified mechanics charge so much (and not just because they're rip-offs); it's difficult and time-consuming. You could source a replacement engine from a wrecker, have it installed, and have your car back on the road. Simple. Anything else that you do to that car, apart from some nice wheels, window tint and a sound system, will be a massive waste of time and money.

Also, dragging people off the lights really is immature. Bragging about how your '93 Accord family sedan has never been beaten is even more so. And it's definitely not beating anybody when it's been driven into a large puddle. I imagine it's an auto?

[NickPieMan]

That's interesting. You'd think they could build cars to withstand a little extra power (or maybe a little extra water)

It looks like a turbo is more trouble that it's worth, at least on the Accord. I am not too worried about that since it is the visual appeal of the car I want to improve more than the performance. Still I can't believe an extra 10% or whatever would risk blowing apart some other bit.

Forget the turbo or a supercharger. Are there any little tweaks you can do to make an engine a little better? Any equipment, like a spark plug or an air filter or whatever, that is slightly better than the stock parts? And where would you look to learn or buy?

[Indie]

That's interesting. You'd think they could build cars to withstand a little extra power (or maybe a little extra water)

It looks like a turbo is more trouble that it's worth, at least on the Accord. I am not too worried about that since it is the visual appeal of the car I want to improve more than the performance. Still I can't believe an extra 10% or whatever would risk blowing apart some other bit.

Forget the turbo or a supercharger. Are there any little tweaks you can do to make an engine a little better? Any equipment, like a spark plug or an air filter or whatever, that is slightly better than the stock parts? And where would you look to learn or buy?Yes, they should build family sedans with prohibitively expensive performance parts already installed in case some idiot wants to turbo-charge it. And they should definitely make waterproof combustion engines and electrical systems, it would make so much more sense!

This must be a troll, surely. I'm getting far too much entertainment out of this guy for him to be legitimate.

[beeza]

Ahahahahahaha YEAH!!

Ahahahahahahah,Good work.

Nice nice.

[jeremydawg]

^^^^ This thread is gold!!

Like said before its not worth doing anything to a 93 family car, even if you got yourself a schmick intake, extractors, exhaust etc it would be pointless and a complete waste of money. Your engine isnt a performance engine, it was made to drop the kids off at school and take the wife shopping with max comfort. If you want to spend money just save up for a eg or integra like the v8killer said. do an engine conversion or buy one thats already had a bit of work, thats what i did. Got myself an eg with jdm b16 and good mods for 6k, money well spent! If your going for performance get a manual, dont go Auto

Good luck though mate, keep an eye out theres heaps of decent hondas out there that you would be more than happy with, they will be a fun daily and any money spent on them will be worth while
Also, before doing anything to your car or another keep reading on OH, get some knowledge about cars. Soon you will look back and laugh.