H22A or B18C?

[Omgeezus]

I have a 1989 Honda Accord Hatch and I love it to death. I want to turn it into my personal little project car and I want to go all out on it. Now I cant make up my mind on which engine I could swap into it and turbo. I want to know which one would be worth while more? Now I know swapping in a B18C will be around about 1 billion times easier than the H22A since I only got a A20A4 in it right now, but I want to know with which one do I have more upgrade options with and which one I will actually be able to turbo once inside the car, as space I think will be an issue. Please be gentle with the comments on here D: this is my first post!

[michaelz]

B has more aftermarket support than H. You can get a B18C turbo kit pretty easily from the states.

[Omgeezus]

thanks for that, its all i really wanted to know :)

[jeremydawg]

alot of people will say bseries, but h22 has the torque! b18 has the aftermarket support, its not like h22 doesnt...just b18 has more options. imo they are both just as good as each other. I was speaking to a honda mecho the other day and he said a couple of people he knew that did hswaps wondered why they ever loved bseries. Then again you would prob get people saying the same thing but the other way around.

What i suggest is do some intense research and decide on what you find suits your needs. Personally i would go jdm Hswap 147kw 2.2! or even h22 type s if youve got the dough 163kw.

There are alot of helpful people on here so dont be afraid to ask around :)

[tiah313]

go k24

[trism]

k24 if you wanna straight out ballin, otherwise go H2B

[crobaa]

How about axle position with each motor? I know h series in some car put the axles on a bit of an angle

[trism]

Supposedly HASport mounts will sit the engine so the angle is not so extreme

[mugen_ctr]

umm i doubt he would go K24 Turbo, seems hell lot of dough to spend, and alot of customizing, definate go B18 turbo, simply cause theres heaps of aftermarket gear out there already, prefabbed turbo kits, and its been proven to work, 180 - 250kw easy.....

H22a on the other hand, displacement = torque, but on a FWD, torque steer like a mofo..... especially if ur running more than 200kw an pushing more than 350nm torque

[trism]

Run a good lsd and torque steer is not much of a problem

[shepparton]

i think he is asking which engine best for his 89 model accord hatch not civic?

[DC2-PWR]

B18C worked will munch your H22's ;D

If not then B20 w/ ITR gearbox all the way

[trism]

Well, hold up, what sort of budget do you have for the swap, and what sort of power figures are you looking for?

Is this gonna be a daily, a weekender, or a track warrior?

Answer these questions, and we can give you a much better answer

[jeremydawg]

^yes

And yes to the h2b swap too! a build i hope to do in the future

[honda_zivic]

h22 definitely, becoz i been in my mates car and it has heaps of torque at low revs and pulls real hard.
theres plenty of parts available for h22.

only down side is that:

real **** to install
really heavy, the front of the car will be lowered so u need to upgrade to stiffer springs
h22 gearbox is shit, gears r too long, def get a b series gearbox conversion.
and in most cars like civic's it will sit a lil higher and wont clear the hood properly without spacers or it could sit lower where ur oil pan and headers will scrap the floor also depending what parts u use, like mounts n shit.

[honda_zivic]

or k24 would be good choice.

[u mad?]

i say sell car and start with a better base

but if you must go through with it, i say b20 vtec/ itr gearbox.



^h22 isn't much heavier than a b18c, you think 400cc increase in displacement is going to dramatically increase weight? lol.

[DC2-PWR]

h22 definitely, becoz i been in my mates car and it has heaps of torque at low revs and pulls real hard.
theres plenty of parts available for h22.

h22 gearbox is shit, gears r too long, def get a b series gearbox conversion.


Wow I never knew you can get a H22 and wack a bseries gearbox, mad!

[honda_zivic]

i say sell car and start with a better base

but if you must go through with it, i say b20 vtec/ itr gearbox.



^h22 isn't much heavier than a b18c, you think 400cc increase in displacement is going to dramatically increase weight? lol.

not sure how much heavier it is compared to b18 but when i was in the car it felt heavy as at the front.

[trism]

i say sell car and start with a better base

but if you must go through with it, i say b20 vtec/ itr gearbox.



^h22 isn't much heavier than a b18c, you think 400cc increase in displacement is going to dramatically increase weight? lol.


lol, go fcuk your mother.

nothing is worse than people who say "sell and buy a better base car"

whats the point of modding cars if everyone takes the easy way and does this?

[Omgeezus]

well i was thinking around 220kw and daily driver. so i would want it to be pretty damn reliable :P

[Omgeezus]

you see i want this thing to be unique, its the whole point of my project :)

[trism]

Budget?

[jeremydawg]

sigh.... H22 is 30kg heavier than b18, its NOT heavy! If i take a massive crap shave all my hair off and cut my balls off it would even out. Lets leave the weight issue there, its been done to death

Unique and fast? H22 type s swap, 163kw and LSD gearbox. Can pick one up for around 3-4k.

[Omgeezus]

Around 5k on just the engine and install. With engine upgrades I don't want to say anything :P cause knowing me I'll blow whatever I calculated right out of the water haha. @jeremydawg I doubt I'll get the H22 S. A bit pricey, I already found a H22A2 with 80k on the dial for $1350. The only reason I would get the H22 is because of the torque in the first place, but I am kind of doubting I really need so much torque in such a light car (1132kg roughly). Kinda leaning towards the B18C, also I'm worried about clearance issues. I don't wan to have to COMPLETELY butcher my car.

[MWAKU]

yea as said, the h22 is only about 20kg heavier, its fools like that who always say its heavier, everyone thinks its a billion kg heavier.

1. someone said worked b18 > h22? wtf? im pretty sure u can source out a h22a cheaper than a b18c, and all the money ur going to "work" on the b18, spend it on the h22a? will you not have a better outcome?


EVERYTIME a h22a thread comes up, these are the two most ALWAYS talked about, cause everyone jsut assumes
1. its 5000kg heavier than a b18
2. its gunna sit on a 45 degree angle and there is nothing that can prevent/lessen it.

the only hold back imo is the gearbox, as said its LONG. so as usualy ppl will tend to get the adapter plate or whatever and stick a b=series gearbox on. otherwise just buy new gear ratios :)

idk, why r u opting for a b18c? who said its going to be any easier? and plus the engines gunna cost you on top 2-3k, unless u get an AUDM (c7) maybe just about 2, and if u get a c2.. dont even bother. not worth the conversion if u can do better.

the only real reason why i would opt for a b18c or b18c7 is mainly for its gearbox and LSD.

you could get ab18c2 with a s80 gearbox, but ah, ud rather have started off with a h22a then get a s80 box........... imo, start looking around and asking ppl who've done the conversion in their accord (if any) , try US websites sohuld give u better info than a lot of the guys here who just spit out information they've read before without any concrete proof, otherwise just talking shit

AND i dont know if u can put an engine in with a smaller displacement than original

[MWAKU]

http://hondaswap.com/accord/88-accord-swap-86577/

[u mad?]

lol, go fcuk your mother.

nothing is worse than people who say "sell and buy a better base car"

whats the point of modding cars if everyone takes the easy way and does this?

relax man, i was just stating what i'd do in his situation.

everybody so fukin agro on this forum

[crobaa]

Does a h22 sit further forward and on an angle or is it an illusion? Even though it's only 20kg heavier, being further forward makes cars crap to drive. I have a b18 and even so I've removed air con and planning to remove ps and battery in boot. Weight on the front wheels is bad. Weight in front of the front wheels is really bad. Not to mention my axle question from earlier, no point having all that torque if you can't put it down

[Omgeezus]

http://hondaswap.com/accord/88-accord-swap-86577/

thanks for the thread link! :D really helpful.
you're a wiseman MWAKU, pretty sure you have convinced me for the H22 haha. thanks for all the help guys :)

[jeremydawg]

very knowleageable and good advice from mwaku!!

[Jccck]

umm i doubt he would go K24 Turbo, seems hell lot of dough to spend, and alot of customizing, definate go B18 turbo, simply cause theres heaps of aftermarket gear out there already, prefabbed turbo kits, and its been proven to work, 180 - 250kw easy.....

H22a on the other hand, displacement = torque, but on a FWD, torque steer like a mofo..... especially if ur running more than 200kw an pushing more than 350nm torque

No joke, that's close to the worst advice i've ever read. Lol =)
Torque steer has NOTHING to do with the Torque/HP Ratio of a motor.
Torque steer eventuates because of the "Torsion" (rotational stress) force imposed on the drivetrain.

Honda solved the "Torque Steer" problems that plagues most FWDs with their Transaxle system.. Note the CVs are the same length? And a very solid Transaxle bridges the gap to the Gearbox
I don't know if all Hondas use this system, but anything with an F or H series motor sure does.. And most Mazda's do also.

Aftermarket support is no question, you shouldn't be buying any parts that aren't from the USA anyway.
And there is a vast market for H and B series, more than you could ever hope to need.. Even my F22A has massive support from many places.

Keep the B, for the price of putting the H in you could pull more power from the B anyway.

[shepparton]

well i was thinking around 220kw and daily driver. so i would want it to be pretty damn reliable :P

220kw ... turbo b series or h series is more to your taste...imho extracting 220kw all motor way is possible but could cost alot more than the turbo for that figure... btw is that atw or at bay

how bout b16 turbo with the works instead

[jeremydawg]

i doubt he means atw lol.

as for 220kw...not gonna happen with your budget.

[tripleuse]

"Around 5k on just the engine and install" h22a ! :)

[jeremydawg]

A Hswap for 5k is very possible.

[fatboyz39]

H2B>H22a > B18c

[jeremydawg]

^true dat.

[gumus89]

Weight on the front wheels is bad. Weight in front of the front wheels is really bad.

Just so you know, for FWD's, the weight up front is better. You gun it with 220 kW you want some decent weight over the wheels. Not to mention corner-exit traction.

[trism]

More weight doesn't always equal more good. Yes in a straight line. But try to do the whole corners thing and it'll just plow forwards in a cloud of understeer.

Sent from my custard cannon like Peter North.

[gumus89]

I know more doesnt mean better, but less doesnt always mean better either. Not just in a straight line, putting your foot down as you exit the corner needs some weight up front.

[jeremydawg]

Its only 30kg anyway, relocate the battery, maybe cf hood and your all good

[crobaa]

If you have good tyres and suspension setup you shouldnt have to rely on weight over the wheels for traction. Either way it's not nice driving a car with big weight over the nose, our hondas are crap enough as it is with regards to understeer. We should be trying to fix the issues from the factory not make them worse. If you want a car that's quick in a straightline and handles like balls get a commodore

[trism]

Ever driven a properly sorted commodore? They're just as good as a Honda with the equivalent suspension mods.

Sent from my custard cannon like Peter North.

[crobaa]

I have actually their ok, wasn't trying to hang it on commodores, just making a point. 999 in 1000 commodores don't have good suspension mods anyway.

[shepparton]

civic h22 vs civic b18 vs crx b16 :honda swap battle

onboard camera h22 civic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odwrYMSQrnI&feature=related


onboard camera b18c civic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31QT8cZfLRo

[crobaa]

Those videos are really really awesome! But only really relevant if all 3 cars are identical and driven by the same person. Regardless really cool vids