GD3 rear sway bar

[ss-rotel]

Do they exsist? is there part from another car that will fit, (long shot), or is the front sway that i see is available good enuf?

i've had King spring fitted, but i'm guessing that it'd going to still pitch hard through an S bend....

rah... sometimes i wish it was a GE... rear disks, rear sway...

[fillit]

yes i believe so, from memory kongfu has/had one as i've enquired about it a while ago.

[ivanh]

ultra racing makes em' and i think progress do as well

[ss-rotel]

ok, sweet, i saw the ultra racing one, i just wanted to know if someone here had looked @ the whiteline parts list, and there's one that fits, just not listed in the cat. most suspension shops are useless... :)

[GU357]

i looked at a picture of one, and well they dont look like they would even work.

[ss-rotel]

there is a link arm that attaches to the suspension.

hey, i got it back, and there is minimal body roll anyway, (i only drove it for like a day before it went to the engine builders after i had the springs fitted), so i'm thinking it's the last thing i'm going to worry about.

Have to put some K's on the clock, so i can get the rune finished up, as it's set to 4,000 RPM, just as the fun REALLY starts, rev limit. RAH.

[GU357]

i mean all that the anti sway is capable of really doing is limiting the suspension travel
it wont make as much of a difference as it should if it had independent rear suspension.

[ss-rotel]

ummm... ok, that's complete right, but anyway. TOOO tired to REALLY going into this in detail, so ppl, FEEL FREE to correct, or expand on this...

In real world terms, a rear sway decreases the amount of grip you rear has, making it overstear, (in extremes). making a front wheel drive car turn faster.

why a rear sway is a good 1st upgrade to a FWD car. and the best thing, it only comes into effect when you're turning, so it doesn't effect the ride.

You can do the same by increaseing the stiffness of the suspension, but you will change the ride quality.

The Jazz with it's fuel tank in the middle of the car, there's very little weight over the rear, so it tend to overstear anyway. the GD1's had a tendancy to lift off oversteer quite easily, and the GD3 had the suspension softened to compensate. I hate it, my VTi 2003 GD1 was awesome. anyway...

the nerfed it as most of these things weren't really sold to ppl like us... so there was some complaint that is was a little "unstable" should have just sent out a "this is how you drive" memo.

[GU357]

i know what an anti sway bar is, and how they work.

what im trying to say is the underbelly of the GD3 already has an anti sway bar setup.
if u look at it, u see that the original swing arm set up on the rear is the same, by installing the UR one its just going along with it, the difference would be minimal.
In first year motor sports i learnt that FWD cars go for softer springs on the front because its easier to put power down, and all that type of stuff.

but just structurally it would make no difference. take a look under there u seem pretty knowledgeable about racing products that or you've read the adverts ahaha.
but srsly take a look, i made a lil thread if u can show where i went wrong it would be good but so far there is no reason for it to work.

[gre03]

In first year motor sports i learnt that FWD cars go for softer springs on the front because its easier to put power down, and all that type of stuff.

Off topic, but what do you mean first year motor sports? is there some sort of uni/tafe course or something?

[GU357]

yes its a engineering course that revolves around the physics and manufacturing of racing cars for motor sport. at university

[patsdc2]

Yes they exist. From what I know, progress, ultra racing, whiteline. Personally I prefer the how whiteline swaybar is being installed. You might wanna do a search around for their product. Part number should be BHR86Z. The reason for not recommending progress and ultra racing is basically because of the design of the sway bars, they are bolted directly underneath the 'pocket' where the rear springs are located. I've read many complaints from those who have installed with regards to the bolts/nuts rubbing against the springs which causes alot of unwanted noise etc. As for this whiteline, they designed their swaybar to use with endlinks, which solved the noise issue.

Link (http://www.fitfreak.net/forums/fit-suspension-brake-modifications/65478-whiteline-rear-sway-bar.html)

[ss-rotel]

pat - the link you posted, that's for a GE, not a GD, won't fit. Whiteline i think, or they did once list a front sway, but that was only really a good upgrade for the "pre-nerf", as logically would increase understear.

stiffening the rear, or softening the front, would have the same effect, to different exstents. the downside i see with softening the front would be too much weight shift during a quick directional change. depending on the track, that wouldn't been that big a deal, but if there's a tight S bend, you'd move too much weight over the outside wheel in the second part of the turn, and understear.

the rear is acutally a torsion beam setup, which has been setup to act something like a rear sway, but not completely. My old Pug 205 had the same setup, but in that car, the beam acts like the spring in the assembly. Adding the sway would still decrease the amount of roll in the rear of the car, increasing the turn in. the reason why this doesn't REALY exsist is the orginial GD jazz's had too stiff a rear end. they already had a tendancy to overstear, and honda "fixed" this after the general consensis was the jazz was a little "unstable" and "twitchy"

they changed bushes and damper rates.

i can vouch for this, i had a 2003 VTi, like a week after the Aust release, which i traded for my current mid 2005 VTiS 2.5 yrs later. the handling is different, with the 2003 having better turn in.

The king springs i have had fitted to the stock shocks are a definate improvment, i'd sat pretty mucht the perfect street upgrade for the $$$. Now i have a bigger exhuast it does bottom up if i'm not careful, but it's not as bad, (or as low), as some of my other cars.

was hoping i could pull a little more understear out without doing anything drastic, (read expensive). i guess i need to start saving fo 1way.

[patsdc2]

I am pretty sure that's for GD, not GE. I can confirm this from whiteline.com.au. Do a search for Honda Jazz and you will see that BHR86Z is for Honda Jazz GD (FIT) 10/02-7/08

[ss-rotel]

ok, i just followed your link and it was for a GE. I've asked the boys @ fulcrum, (admidedly they are useless), and they couldn't give me a part number.

Once it's had it's final tune, i'll go for a real blast, and workout if i REALLY need it. currently thinking, (when i started this thread, i'd only just got it back, after it being off the road for 10 months), i might not need it, and it would be money better spent elsewere.

[patsdc2]

ok, i just followed your link and it was for a GE. I've asked the boys @ fulcrum, (admidedly they are useless), and they couldn't give me a part number.

Once it's had it's final tune, i'll go for a real blast, and workout if i REALLY need it. currently thinking, (when i started this thread, i'd only just got it back, after it being off the road for 10 months), i might not need it, and it would be money better spent elsewere.

Part Number is given as BHR86Z. Mine arrived and installed.

[ss-rotel]

awesome, what's it like? did it make much of a difference?

[sPoOnD_]

so would you guys recommend spending that $200+ on a rear sway bar for the GD model?

[ss-rotel]

all things being equal, it's the most cost effective FWD handling mod, espeically if your car tends to understear.

I've had a 2003 VTi and currently own a 2005 VTiS. Both ran/run 15inch mags. The 2003 didn't need suspension mods. it was already a little tail happy, and very easy to get it to drift with lift of overstear. it just didn't ave the guts to keep the drift going for more than say 5m. My pug, with only 66kw did a better job.(thou it weighed in @ 700kg @ that stage.)

i think it was about 2004 they softened the rear, to make the jazz more stable @ the back, but increasing understear, so the car tends to push a little in corners.

So, you can add a rear sway, or change the springs/dampers to 2003 spec. the sway is cheaper. i lowered my 2005 with king springs, which seem like a good fit for the stock shocks, but they are already 170,000km old, so this is really just a stop/gap, (was orginially hoping i was going to get the jazz ready for the FFR Jambooree last yeah... but that didn't happen... hell, i doubt i'll have time to get it ready this year), and orinigally planned to replace them with a coilover setup, but it's low enough, and i dont think it's tooo stiff.

Spring were $250 + fit, i think. they did it and replaced all wheel bearings, and wheel align, cost me $1200. (wheel bearings are like $150 each for the front, and $80 each for the rear)

[patsdc2]

$1.2k is a ripped off.

[ss-rotel]

you're right, and there's a long story behind that. but anyway...