Damn Cluth on Euro... [Archive]

VirIIx

10-02-2005, 09:01 AM

I took the car in for it's 10,000km service yesterday.. it's actually sitting on 9700km. That's not the issue though.

A few days ago, I was in cruise control driving home at night, sixth gear, when i noticed that the revs just slipped up... that generallly not being a good sign. Cruise was off once i got back into suburban traffic and throughout the next few days, i noticed it got worse. My worst fear, that the clutch had been worn out was true. It slips and revs without holding any power at any gear even with the slightest acceleratin sometimes.

Now... im pretty sure in general clutches don't go out in 10,000, that's ridiculous, considering i haven't even started to thrash the car around, like i've seen my other mates cars thrashed around in manuals.

When it was in for service, i got them to look at it for me, and the guy said yeah, uh worn clutch - im like WTF? they're like yep.. hafta talk to Honda, get approval to strip it.. and if they decide it's not warranty, then you pay.

Im like stuff that.. Im not happy with any of this at all. Either i've gotten a dodgy batch of a car with a crap clutch - extremely bad.

So im wondering i anyone has heard of anything similar?

On a side note, it gives me an excuse to put in a performance clutch, so im looking around for prices and brands at the moment, and want it put in asap, so any advice on that would also be appreciated :)

yfin

10-02-2005, 09:46 AM

There was one chap - BlueEuro who posted about his clutch going on the Euro. Then he dissappeared - literally. Didn't answer any follow up posts about the circumstances or anything - or whether Honda covered it.

Then there is one other person I know of on this forum who had their clutch replaced under warranty - but they weren't exactly doing the right thing at the time - so special circumstnaces. Honda fixed that one.

I think yours will be fixed under warranty - wait to see what honda say. There are performance clutches out there - i think by Exedy - not worth spending the money if you can get this fixed under warranty.

Considering the number of Euros sold worldwide - I think this is a problem in only a very very small percentage of Euros. Otherwise I think I would have read more posts about the issue. That is what I am hoping anyway :(

VirIIx

10-02-2005, 09:52 AM

yeap i read up on those posts,

i didn't want to take the chance with honda, seeing i was talking to the head mechanic and he told me (not that it means much) that he would hafta look at it and honda probably won't cover it. Seeing as the other guy was lucky, i personally don't feel like the force is with me on this one.

I've had my fair share of experiences with car manufacturers and they all suck when it comes to warranty. Funny enough the other car also had the same problem, only it died after the warranty period - because they pushed my service 2 weeks out of warranty period. :\

Regardless, ill just put a new clutch inside, saves the whole messing around. Sure it's money from my pocket, but at least i know what is going in my car and hopefully it'll give the car that extra bit of durability and performance.

baboo

10-02-2005, 09:57 AM

VirIIx

10-02-2005, 10:05 AM

i don't hear any squeaking.

aaronng

10-02-2005, 10:08 AM

does your clutch pedal squeeks when u press it?

Could be the faulty clutch master cylinder causing the clutch not releasing properly.
there's a case in USA where the guy had the same problem as yours, a burn out clutch. He took it back to Honda and they said it was caused by a faulty MC.
That reminds me, I had the clutch creak and a grind when shifting 1-2. After changing the master cylinder, the creak went a way but the grind stayed for a while. After 2 more weeks, the 1-2 grind is now very rare!

wynode

10-02-2005, 11:47 AM

Could be the faulty clutch master cylinder causing the clutch not releasing properly.
there's a case in USA where the guy had the same problem as yours, a burn out clutch. He took it back to Honda and they said it was caused by a faulty MC.

That's an idea.....and the only reason I can think of for the clutch wearing out soo quickly.

VirIIx

10-02-2005, 12:14 PM

I guess i could always talk to them about that. Thanks for the advice.

Pum[Z]

10-02-2005, 01:24 PM

I had a burnt out clutch on my euro but that had to do with me flooring it... I was lucky it was under warranty but maybe it was under warranty because i paid for the extended warranty that honda offered when i bought the car...

Does ur clutch smell of burnt plastics when u park it in the garage??

Well hopefully Honda will change the clutch under warranty. It takes a while to change the clutch.. Took them 2 days...

ECU-MAN

10-02-2005, 08:17 PM

if your dealer gives your a hard time deal directly with Honda, there quite good and they will look after you, at least for the 1st clutch. Honda try to keep there customers happy, but at the same time there not a charity, Im sure if you write them a polite letter you will get a positive result.

anyway I was able to make my clutch slip bigtime, scared the crap out of me.

spiller

10-02-2005, 09:58 PM

I don't think you will have any problems with being covered by warrently. Afterall, that is the whole point of it! 10,000km from a new clutch is very unacceptable, even if the car has been drven hard (which you say you haven't done) and any good car manufacturer should acknowledge that. My dad went through two clutches on his WRX before it reached 20,000km (and he didn't really thrash his car) and both were changed no questions asked.....hopefully honda will do the same

wynode

10-02-2005, 10:44 PM

Warranty doesn't cover normal wear and tear (IE a clutch) unless the failure was during manufacturing.

coladuna

10-02-2005, 11:03 PM

Catcha

10-02-2005, 11:33 PM

Without seeing the driving of people whose clutches fail, I'm inclined to say it's the driver's fault.

It's not whether you drive it hard or not.
Maybe you are riding your clutch too much.
For example, you could be riding your clutch on the uphill starts instead of using the handbrake.

I can't see how such a manufacturing defect can be that common.

Classic example was when motor tested two ford typhoons turbos and both the clutches gave way, Ford said it cars where not designed to be flat shifted. Motor said they don't test there cars out like that.

blueeuro

11-02-2005, 09:16 AM

It wasn't me that had the clutch problems that didn't respond to posts, I've got an auto, and I'm still here. :wave: It must have been another blueeuro.

yfin

11-02-2005, 09:47 AM

It wasn't me that had the clutch problems that didn't respond to posts, I've got an auto, and I'm still here. :wave: It must have been another blueeuro.

Sorry - it is this guy - BlueaccEuro- 3 posts - 2 about putting a turbo on his euro then 1 about a blown clutch! he then dissappeared.:(

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14042&highlight=euro+clutch

VirIIx

11-02-2005, 10:49 AM

ahh well, i don't ride the clutch on hills, im always sitting with the brake on and in neutral, only shift and go when everyone starts moving.

in any given case, 10,000km is pretty poor in my opinion.

yfin, thanks for the link - i found that after my initial post :)

coladuna

11-02-2005, 11:31 PM

ahh well, i don't ride the clutch on hills, im always sitting with the brake on and in neutral, only shift and go when everyone starts moving.

Riding clutch doesn't refer to having ur clutch depressed when u r stationery.
The most common thing people do with manual car is to roll backwards on hill starts and the ride clutch to get the car going. This is extremely bad for the clutch as you can imagine, which is why you should always use the handbrake if you are rolling backwards excessively.

Sometimes i see idiots constantly riding their clutch on hills going backwards and forwards.

VirIIx

05-03-2005, 02:41 PM

ahh well there is close to no roll back, and i don't roll up and down - that's just stupid :)

however, an updated on my situation, i finally got a decent price from one of the dealers to get it fixed, Honda Australia has looked at it and says it's wear and tear. Blah.. i haven't even started to flog the thing.. but i should sit back and look at how i drive - just in case :)

I will be paying for the whole thing as it won't be covered and nothing is faulty either eh. master cylinder.

$700 for the parts + labour :(

hopefully will be ready soon, the other dealer (won't be mentioned) can go jump for a quote of $2500 total. :)

smoknhothonda

06-03-2005, 08:43 AM

Man I wouldnt be happy with that!!!!

2.5K to change a clutch, What da f@!#

I would be visiting ray martin for a story on ACA man!

My sisters old Hyundai Excel clutch stuffed up after about 12 months and they replaced it for nothing on a $15k car.....

My 95 Accord still has the original clutch after 120 kays and nearly 10 years of service, and thats with a fair amount of flogging involved also!

I would be looking at an Exedy clutch for a replacement if I was you

EuroAccord13

06-03-2005, 03:27 PM

VirIIx

06-03-2005, 07:12 PM

smoknhothonda, funny you mention that - ray martin comes into our store to shop and i've dealt with him a few times hehe

tho, i'm at the dealers getting it fitted for 700 + labour, hopefully not ripped off for labour charges.

I personally would fit an exedy clutch inside, but as far as im aware with warranty and crap like that, if i fit anything non honda etc into the car - and if anything does go wrong it'll screw my warranty for quite a few things.

But i did get a few quotes, 1200 all up for an exedy clutch.

IF anything does go wrong again... ill be getting an exedy, and i'm going to be one very unhappy person taking this matter up with a lot of people.

BTW, love that avatar EuroAccord13 :D

aaronng

07-03-2005, 01:58 PM

I am getting this knotty/squeaky feel when I press my clutch nowadays... it happens occassionally.. Should I get it back to the dealer for warranty repairs?

Sounds like the problems u guys are getting...

If you can reproduce the squuek for the dealers, then it should be covered under warranty. Mine was. The first time they lubed it up, the 2nd time they replaced the clutch master cylinder.

Back to the topic, I was driving with the cruise control the other day in 6th and was going up a slight incline at 80km/h. I put my foot down on the accelerator to my usual amount of throttle and turned off cruise control. There was quite a big deceleration. I suspect that when using cruise control in 6th gear, there will be situations where the cruise control will try to give heaps of throttle to maintain the speed, but 6th gear being an overdrive means there is a lot of resistance to increase the speed due to the long ratio. Hence, there will be a point at which the friction force of the clutch will be overcome and it will start slipping. It'll be ok for the first few times, but after that, you would have worn your clutch out quite a bit. I personally am going to lay off cruise control in 6th unless it is a totally zero or downwards-inclined road, or use it in 5th.

EuroAccord13

07-03-2005, 03:23 PM

Geez... the problem only creeps up as and when it likes.. What happens if I take it to the dealer and it decides to go away... man... Euros... :(

aaronng

07-03-2005, 04:39 PM

I notice that it only comes after driving for about 15-20 minutes. Observe it and see how long it takes before the squeek appears.

yfin

07-03-2005, 07:56 PM

tho, i'm at the dealers getting it fitted for 700 + labour, hopefully not ripped off for labour charges.

I wouldn't accept this and roll over - 9,700kms is not enough for a stock clutch. The goods sold have to be fit for the purpose they were intended. Get it fixed then speak to your lawyer about a letter to Honda.

Kandy

07-03-2005, 08:18 PM

My friends Accord was just out of 5 year warranty by 6 months and the automatic transmission went kaput and needed to be rebuilt. After a week of phone calls Honda finally agreed to pay 75% of the Parts but no labour.

Link from Choice:
http://www.choice.com.au/viewArticle.aspx?id=100739&catId=100392&tid=100008&p=1

You probably can argue the case but it's a difficult situation though. :(
$700, I would not be happy, Jan!!

EuroAccord13

07-03-2005, 09:26 PM

I wouldn't accept this and roll over - 9,700kms is not enough for a stock clutch. The goods sold have to be fit for the purpose they were intended. Get it fixed then speak to your lawyer about a letter to Honda.

Yoram, if the Dealer plays "Runaway from responsibilities" with me, can I get you to draft a legal letter for me since you're a certified lawyer? I'm asking because generally, dealers do tend to play the runabout with you.... :)

yfin

07-03-2005, 09:39 PM

Yoram, if the Dealer plays "Runaway from responsibilities" with me, can I get you to draft a legal letter for me since you're a certified lawyer? I'm asking because generally, dealers do tend to play the runabout with you.... :)

I'll do what I can :D - but I don't like your chances even with a QC! :p. It will be so easy for Honda to blame your mods - your extra power is fairly significant at the wheels. It will be much easier for someone like VirIIx - stock car, he sounds like a sensible driver, and 9,700kms is not very far for a new car. I can't believe honda gave him the "wear and tear" line.

VirIIx

08-03-2005, 12:25 AM

Thanks for all the input so far,

aaronng, i've only ever used cruise control on fairly flat roads (most of the time).

yfin, i'll be looking into it further as i've asked for the dealers to give me all my original parts back once the car is fixed, this way i will take it to my mechanic as well as NRMA to get a 2nd opinion on what has happened.

I'm not very pleased about any of this, clutches are made to last for quite some time, and perhaps less with a very hard life given to them, but less than 10,000km is ridiculous.

I'll be taking your advice and writing a formal letter to Honda about this taking into account of what everyone here has said, and their own experiences with other cars manufacturers.

On a side note, my old Chrysler Neon's automatic transmission died, 2 weeks out of warranty, it actually was damaged before the warranty ended but was pushed out of warranty because it couldn't be booked in for service. That wasn't covered and i wasn't pleased about it from Chrysler.

VirIIx

20-03-2005, 01:20 AM

Just a bump in the posts, I picked up my car Friday, adjusting to the new clutch - it really grips well, better than when the car was brand new, feels so much nicer :)

Cost wise, $700 for the clutch and stuff, and $800ish for labour.

Total of $1500 for the whole ordeal.

Chris_F

20-03-2005, 11:03 AM

bloody hell, thats a bit steep - im really suprised ti wasnt covered under warranty. i took my car in for a 10,000k service recently... told them about the dashboard rattle, a faulty armrest and the creaky clutch. the first two problems they'd had b4 but never a creaky clutch apparently... that same day they placed three parts on order a new armrest, new glovebox/dash components and a lubricated clutch part (maybe mastercylidner? or they are just lubing the current one).

Pum[Z]

21-03-2005, 02:27 AM

Sorri to hear about u having to pay for ur clutch VirIIx...

$1500 is actually the price i had in my mind when my euro clutch gave way as well.. But then i had bought the extended warranty so that covered me...

It takes a whole day to 2 days to change the Clutch.. It aint an easy job and to this day i still have the fears of the smell of a burnt out clutch in my memory..

aaronng

21-03-2005, 03:14 AM

VirIIx

21-03-2005, 09:57 AM

You feel the Hondata mod will be ready that soon? :D

industrie

21-03-2005, 10:11 AM

1500 for a clutch? WTF..you can get a heavy duty sports clutch for $800 installed..any aftermarket clutch would be better than the standard crap..as long as your car is running well

aaronng

21-03-2005, 10:26 AM

You feel the Hondata mod will be ready that soon? :D
Well, TSX version is out and supposedly they are testing on our Euro. Since they cracked the new ECU, it is now just testing to remap the fuel that we have and whatever small differences between our K24A3 and their K24A2.
I'd predict 6-12 months if there is market potential in Australia (which they are persuading Hondata over at tsx.acurazine.com) and all goes well.

VirIIx

21-03-2005, 12:06 PM

well as long as they map it out for Optimax and BP Ultimate :D
caltex vortex is ok too :b

but god damn if it maps it out for Mobil, god help us all :(

Pum[Z]

21-03-2005, 04:07 PM

Does the extended warranty cover items that go through wear and tear such as premature wear of clutch and brake pads?
I have my brochure here, but it doesn't say it covers clutch friction material. How did you get your clutch covered, Pum[Z]? If they do cover, then I might take up the extended warranty. Then again, the Hondata mod is out, so..........

Hell if i know how i got my clutch covered under warranty.. I have extended warranty and if they didn't change the clutch i would have wrote a major complaint to the dealer and to honda. They changed it under warranty for the clutch plate, fluids and etc etc. But they gave me a warning if the clutch burns out again it would be out of pocket....

Honda's extended warranty covers so much more then the standard warranty... Just check out the extended warranty compared to the standard warranty and u will see why its a sound investment to pay the extra dosh for the extended warranty. Plus its a 5-6 year warranty when bought from new so its pretty good...

VirIIx

21-03-2005, 06:21 PM

i wouldn't think extended warranty would cover it.. they kept stressing that point to me.. i'm still considering writing a letter to honda to complain, especially if your clutch was burnt out (wear and tear) and was covered :|

SuperVince

06-05-2013, 10:40 PM

I know I'm new to the forum and this is my second post, but fwarrrkkkk, don't ever listen to the car company when they say warranties wont cover this or that. Especially if something as ridiculous as the clutch wearing out after ten thousand K's happens.

CONSUMER LAW VOLUME THREE SECTION 54 Sub Section 2 (e)
54 Guarantee as to acceptable quality
(1) If:
(a) a person supplies, in trade or commerce, goods to a consumer; and
(b) the supply does not occur by way of sale by auction;
there is a guarantee that the goods are of acceptable quality.
(2) Goods are of acceptable quality if they are as:
(a) fit for all the purposes for which goods of that kind are commonly supplied; and
(b) acceptable in appearance and finish; and
(c) free from defects; and
(d) safe; and
(e) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! durable; !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! as a reasonable consumer fully acquainted with the state and condition of the goods (including any hidden defects of the goods), would regard as acceptable having regard to the matters in subsection (3).!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.comlaw.gov.au/Details/C2011C00003/Html/Volume_3

http://www.youtube.com/embed/uE8BB-ioNRw

SPQR

08-05-2013, 06:03 AM

As with all consumer law, you have the powerful with the money and then you have consumers. The powerful use every bullying tactic available designed to wear-down the resolve of the consumer. Try getting the ACCC to help and you'll find that they won't. It's up to each individual consumer to pursue their statutory rights and that process is very tiring and the powerful rely on that.

BG-33P

08-05-2013, 08:34 AM

Only 8 years too late guys!

SuperVince

08-05-2013, 02:14 PM

$95 dollar filing fee at the Queensland Civil and Administrative Tribunal (or your states version) , one Consumer Dispute form, One affadavit of service, one mediation and one hearing. Then you get your money back, sounds like a good deal to me. I just took Youi insurance to the tribunal and won. There's a thing called 'Rule of Law' built into the constitution that says every man or woman is seen as equal before the eyes of the law, and it holds true today. If you have a legit case like the guy above you will win, doesnt matter how much money they have, all it takes is some minor research into the statutes and legislation, which in this case I've done for you, some evidence gathering, and the ability to speak. Also the tribunal is the peoples court, so solicitors aren't allowed, which means money isn't an issue again.