Lightweight rims...worth it?

[akjdfnn]

I've been thinking about buying a set of 18x8 rpf1 for my euro...but it's a very expensive wheel and im not sure what im going to get in return is worth it...can i expect any performance/fuel economy improvements over the standard 17" enkeis?

Also does any1 know how much lighter an rpf1 is compared to the oem rim?

If there's no markable improvments, i might go with a set of coilovers...can any1 recommend a set designed for street use that's very compfy? (i.e, looking to go about an inch lower, and improve on the factory ride)

[Bludger]

your penis will extend one inch.

at least it will feel like it.

[akjdfnn]

lol i was hoping there would be alittle more to it than that.

[hondapop]

your penis will extend one inch.

at least it will feel like it.

Aaaah!...... NOW I see the reason for the adult classification.

[Fredoops]

lol i was hoping there would be alittle more to it than that.
it's the weekend.... some folks here are still hungover

back to topic:
Someone here actually did a dyno couple years back comparing light weight vs normal rims, and there is actually a difference to the horsepower at the wheels.

Keep in mind 1kg of rotational mass = 5-10 kg's of static mass, so 1kg saved on the rims/tires is the equivalent of 5kg's - 10 kg's saved on the body or interior of the car.

so the car will respond better, same concept as lightened flywheel or pulleys.

The stock 16x6 wheels are about 8kg's so the 17x7 should be 9.5kg if not more, so you should be saving at least half a kg from each corner.

[Bludger]

Well someone here actually did a dyno comparing light weight vs normal rims, and there is actually a difference to the horsepower at the wheels.

Keep in mind 1kg of rotational mass = 5-10 kg's of static mass, so 1kg saved on the rims/tires is the equivalent of 5kg's - 10 kg's saved on the body or interior of the car.

so the car will respond better, same concept as lightened flywheel or pulleys.
the increased response will be felt less than increased penis size.

hence not worth it.

[Bludger]

lol i was hoping there would be alittle more to it than that.
not really, i was being srs.

buy nice suspension setup.

[Fredoops]

the increased response will be felt less than increased penis size.

hence not worth it.

the increase respons will also be felt less than shoving a block of C4 up ur arse.

whats ur point?

[Bludger]

the increase respons will also be felt less than shoving a block of C4 up ur arse.

whats ur point?



If there's no markable improvments, i might go with a set of coilovers...
my point is money is better spent elsewhere.

[Fredoops]

my point is money is better spent elsewhere.

I guess you do have a point there, but since we're all gonna be blowing $$$ on wheels eventually anyway, might as well get something thats functional, and RPF1 sells really well in the 2nd hand market.

[Bludger]

I guess you do have a point there, but since we're all gonna be blowing $$$ on wheels eventually anyway, might as well get something thats functional, and RPF1 sells really well in the 2nd hand market.
I never said mental penis enlargement is a bad thing....

[eg5civic]

You forgot about the Jdm street cred he'll get bludger.

But in all seriousness as above go coilovers, stock height and aftermarket rims looks like shit anyway.
Lower, then rims

[akjdfnn]

JDM street cred? LOL...not really after that, just after some functional mods that improve an already brilliant car.

btw, i really like the look of the OEM 17x7 luxury rims, i think they suit the car perfectly.

[ChaosMaster]

Yeah, money is better spent elsewhere. Apparently Hondas run really rich, and changing to a CAI will give a slight boost in power, whiles reducing fuel consumption by a fair bit. Read that people go from 10.5lt/100km to around 8lts. Not sure if this is true though.

[Fredoops]

Yeah, money is better spent elsewhere. Apparently Hondas run really rich, and changing to a CAI will give a slight boost in power, whiles reducing fuel consumption by a fair bit. Read that people go from 10.5lt/100km to around 8lts. Not sure if this is true though.

lol nah

The ECU will know the car's getting more air and it'll get even richer if anything.

[Rudy]

I noticed a massive difference in acceleration, braking, etc when switching to light rims, but I went like 5kg lighter a corner. Not sure if you would notice anything by just shaving a couple kgs. I will say, a lightweight tyre is just as important in selecting as the rims. Many people choose light rims and ruin the savings by getting a heavy ass tyre. I didnt notice any improvements in fuel econ tho.

[MR_LATE]

my point is money is better spent elsewhere.

i do agree with what ur saying,,,

[ChaosMaster]

I noticed a massive difference in acceleration, braking, etc when switching to light rims, but I went like 5kg lighter a corner. Not sure if you would notice anything by just shaving a couple kgs. I will say, a lightweight tyre is just as important in selecting as the rims. Many people choose light rims and ruin the savings by getting a heavy ass tyre. I didnt notice any improvements in fuel econ tho.

I guess the difference would be dependant on the person driving. I mean if your the kind that can tell the difference between 95 and 98 octane (most will), then you'll prob be able to notice a 30kg difference (assuming you get super light weight wheels and tyres). Fuel Saving are usually cancelled out by the extra grip provided by the new tyres, as their usually wider (unless for some weird reason you decide to go from 16" to 15" or stay 16" etc).

But then, these small changes make all the difference, and it's what manufacturers do when they release special track editions of their cars. Save 30kg on wheels, 15kg on exhaust, 5kg on bonnet, 5kg on seats (more if you switch from electric to race); then you gain 3kw with CAI, 5kw through exhaust (maybe a bit more if you don't mind noise) and an ECU tune and viola, a substantial increase to your power to weight ratio.

[Rudy]

I guess the difference would be dependant on the person driving. I mean if your the kind that can tell the difference between 95 and 98 octane (most will), then you'll prob be able to notice a 30kg difference (assuming you get super light weight wheels and tyres). Fuel Saving are usually cancelled out by the extra grip provided by the new tyres, as their usually wider (unless for some weird reason you decide to go from 16" to 15" or stay 16" etc).

But then, these small changes make all the difference, and it's what manufacturers do when they release special track editions of their cars. Save 30kg on wheels, 15kg on exhaust, 5kg on bonnet, 5kg on seats (more if you switch from electric to race); then you gain 3kw with CAI, 5kw through exhaust (maybe a bit more if you don't mind noise) and an ECU tune and viola, a substantial increase to your power to weight ratio.


True. I wouldnt notice 30kg reduced body mass, but 30kg reduced unsprung mass I definitely would (equivalent to taking 200+kg off body weight) The car almost felt too responsive in daily driving. I only went 10mm wider on the tyres and picked the lightest ones i could find. I mainly did it for fuel economy reasons and performance a little bit as well. After not noticing any fuel econ benefits, I just switched to 19s :)

[Fredoops]

I noticed a massive difference in acceleration, braking, etc when switching to light rims, but I went like 5kg lighter a corner. Not sure if you would notice anything by just shaving a couple kgs. I will say, a lightweight tyre is just as important in selecting as the rims. Many people choose light rims and ruin the savings by getting a heavy ass tyre. I didnt notice any improvements in fuel econ tho.
What rims did you get?

and tires make a huge difference as well, I went from Nexen to Conti and shaved a kilo off each corner, and it made noticeable difference is responsiveness.

[EKVTIR-T]

Lightweight wheels reduce un-sprung weight,which provide

More responsive steering
Improved vehicle balance
Better turn-in and directional control
Better damping/ traction
Better handling
Reduced rotational mass

[Rudy]

What rims did you get?

and tires make a huge difference as well, I went from Nexen to Conti and shaved a kilo off each corner, and it made noticeable difference is responsiveness.


te37 with contis.

[natnat]

......... a set of 18x8 rpf1 for my euro...but it's a very expensive wheel ............

Also does any1 know how much lighter an rpf1 is compared to the oem rim?

.......

the RPF1 is probably the best bang for your buck Japanese made wheels that you can get. if you look at Volk Racing / Wedsport / Advan, these would cost 2-4 times more expensive than the RPF1.

i ran Enkei PF01 18x7.5 +48 on my CL9 a couple of yrs ago.

below is some links to the cheapest RPF1 you can get from USA.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/18-ENKEI-RPF1-RIMS-WHEELS-SILVER-18x7-5-5x114-3-48-/290665511344?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item43ad03b9b0

http://www.ebay.com/itm/18-ENKEI-RPF1-RIMS-WHEELS-SILVER-18x8-5x114-3-35-/290617209261?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item43aa22b1ad

improvements, it all depends on what you intend to use your car for. for track, where you push your car to the limits, yes lightweight wheels and any weight reduction do make a difference.

for daily street use, you would have to be an experienced and sensitive driver to be able to feel the difference.

18x8 rpf1 weighs about 18lbs each or 8.16kg, based on the specs from:
http://enkei.com/rpf1.html#

another very important thing is: the tyres.. you generally get what you pay for.

if your budget for 18" tyres only is $1200, i recommend the Michelin Pilot Super Sport and buy them from Tirerack. should be around AU$1200 landed for 225 40 18.

or Goodyear Asymmetric 2 which would be around $1000 landed.

i would avoid any tyres that are made in China although they would probably cost $400 for the set.

these were my RPF1, lightweight and good quality finish, and Made in Japan:
http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6037/5899946818_880d3cc42d_z.jpg
http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6058/5889843453_6d9d82efbf_z.jpg

these were my Enkei PF01 18X7.5 +48 on my CL9 with Conti Sport Contact 2, car lowered on BuddyClub coilovers:
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3326/4626429747_b6d6996eb7_z.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3329/4626428677_6dda503190_z.jpg
http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1192/4608951468_5b61c2e911_z.jpg

ps: race type of wheels on the CL9 will expose the tiny stock brakes. VIP style of wheels are more suitable to CL9 imo.

[EKVTIR-T]

Put some cheapo heavy chrome bling wheels on,then go back to stock and see if you cant notice anything :p

[Rudy]

the RPF1 is probably the best bang for your buck Japanese made wheels that you can get. if you look at Volk Racing / Wedsport / Advan, these would cost 2-4 times more expensive than the RPF1.



problem with comparing prices is that rpf01 has limited visual appeal and much weaker than the forged wheels. Heard a lot of bending incidences. It's like they say, Light , cheap , strong. Pick any two (at most). Yeah they are good value for money though.

[-Tom]

I'm quoting figures from an Excel sheet from wheelweights.net here:

Enkei RP-F1 Cast 17x7 6.803886
Enkei RP-F1 Cast 17x7.5 6.93996372
Enkei RP-F1 Cast 17x8 7.07604144
Enkei RP-F1 Cast 17x8.5 7.16675992
Enkei RP-F1 Cast 17x9 7.2574784
Enkei RP-F1 Cast 17x9.5 7.4842746

Honda Accord Type R (Euro) Cast 17x7 9.88831432


There's quite a difference in weight.
wheelweights.net for full spreadsheet

[natnat]

problem with comparing prices is that rpf01 has limited visual appeal and much weaker than the forged wheels. Heard a lot of bending incidences. It's like they say, Light , cheap , strong. Pick any two (at most). Yeah they are good value for money though.

those bent RPF1, ask them what they hit.

as far as i know and according to a well known Sydney supplier, non forged Advan and Wedsport actually use the same technology as Enkei RPF1 MAT stuff.

if money is no issue, go with these:
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a240/Burgs/VW%20Drag%20Meet%20WSID%20Feb%202012/IMG_8754ED.jpg

[Fredoops]

^^^ those look like rpf1s out the front.

If money's no issue I'd get OZ racing or BBS.

[Evok]

You'll notice it if its massively different . I went from big 18 sex spec chromies that came on my car to 15's. Much lighter and better launch response.

Oh, traction as well...from 165/60/14 stockies to 195/50/15 made a difference

[Rudy]

those bent RPF1, ask them what they hit.

as far as i know and according to a well known Sydney supplier, non forged Advan and Wedsport actually use the same technology as Enkei RPF1 MAT stuff.

if money is no issue, go with these:
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a240/Burgs/VW%20Drag%20Meet%20WSID%20Feb%202012/IMG_8754ED.jpg


And those advans ask 4k for a non forged wheel! Makes the enkei look like coin change.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-x-tires-wheels-brakes-suspension-sponsored-tire-rack/584821-me-rpf1-weak.html

[Fredoops]

I will say some of those advan are the biggest ripoff ever... like the RS.. 4k for a non forged wheel! Makes the enkei look like coin change.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-x-tires-wheels-brakes-suspension-sponsored-tire-rack/584821-me-rpf1-weak.html

Well it bent instead of being shattered or cracked like most alloy wheels would, that tells the strength of the bond.


Hers some info on wheel construction methods
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=90&affiliate=HJ3


PS: ive looked at those:
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/WheelCloseUpServlet?target=wheelCloseUp&wheelMake=Kosei&wheelModel=K4R&wheelFinish=Light+Grey+Painted
Spun rims, 5 something kg's for 17 inch...

[Rudy]

Well it bent instead of being shattered or cracked like most alloy wheels would, that tells the strength of the bond.


Hers some info on wheel construction methods
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=90&affiliate=HJ3


PS: ive looked at those:
http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/WheelCloseUpServlet?target=wheelCloseUp&wheelMake=Kosei&wheelModel=K4R&wheelFinish=Light+Grey+Painted
Spun rims, 5 something kg's for 17 inch...

OP said it never happened to him with other wheels. Just because a wheel is constructed in a similar method to other wheels doesn't mean they have the same strength. The design is important as well. CE28n for example, are lighter than re30 and te37, but rays re30 are favoured in racing as they are 30% stiffer.

Where did you hear those kosei wheels weigh 5kg something each. The lightest wheels ive come across, buddy club QF were 6kg for 17 x8. Too much misinformation on wheel weights. The site with the excell sheet has lot of errors too as the weights are user submitted.

[Fredoops]

OP said it never happened to him with other wheels. Just because a wheel is constructed in a similar method to other wheels doesn't mean they have the same strength. The design is important as well. CE28n for example, are lighter than re30 and te37, but rays re30 are favoured in racing as they are 30% stiffer.

Where did you hear those kosei wheels weigh 5kg something each. The lightest wheels ive come across, buddy club QF were 6kg for 17 x8. Too much misinformation on wheel weights. The site with the excell sheet has lot of errors too as the weights are user submitted.

My bad, it's 14.1lb's for 17x7 which is 6.4kgs

[akjdfnn]

Thanks for all the info guys...i'll post up some pics if i end up getting some =)

[Rudy]

My bad, it's 14.1lb's for 17x7 which is 6.4kgs



wow thats still pretty damn light!

[MingZai]

can't remember how much my TE37's weigh...

[aaronng]

Remember that you are not running rims alone, but the tyres weigh just as much and even worse since the weight is concentrated on the outer circumference which gives it more inertia.

In addition, you are going from 17" 225 tyres to probably 18" 235, which means more weight on the outer edge, thus removing the advantage you got with the lightweight rims.

[thebob]

But adding to a widened wheel base which will increase cornering speed, reduce braking distance and overall grip. Power isn't everything.

[akjdfnn]

http://www.tirerack.com/wheels/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=108

found this article on the subject..quite a good read

[mrgu]

Remember that you are not running rims alone, but the tyres weigh just as much and even worse since the weight is concentrated on the outer circumference which gives it more inertia.

In addition, you are going from 17" 225 tyres to probably 18" 235, which means more weight on the outer edge, thus removing the advantage you got with the lightweight rims.

+1 I will prob stick with a set of nice 17''s with decent tyres which saves u money too. seen cu2 18'' on cl9 which is completely hot

[akjdfnn]

i had the opportunity to buy some new 18" cu2 rims without tyres for $1500, recently...almost went through with it but abit pricey imo for a much heavier rim.

[Fredoops]

i had the opportunity to buy some new 18" cu2 rims without tyres for $1500, recently...almost went through with it but abit pricey imo for a much heavier rim.
eww 1500? wayyy to pricy.

and CL9 with CU2 l18's just look vulgar

[mrgu]

1500 is a bit pricey I would think 1500 with oem Michelin tyres