Question about sway bars

[p33r]

Noob question,

I have a DC5S. If I upgrade the rear sway, say to a Whiteline or Cusco 25mm, what else do I need to upgrade?

I have no idea whether the d links, end links, bushings etc need to be replaced, much less what they even refer to.

Asking because I'm wondering on everything I need if I purchase a second hand RSB, or whether new RSBs will come with everything.

Cheers

[Jccck]

D Rubbers, are the D-Shaped rubber bush that holds the Swaybar to the chassis.
End Links are Grommet-Like bushes that attach the Swaybar to the Linkage which connects the ends of the Swaybar to the Suspension.

A more solid rear swaybar, will cause every bush it has an effect on to wear out more quickly.
Upgrading your D-Rubbers is recommended, because standard ones will now wear out rapidly with harsh driving.
Everything else is optional.

http://martybugs.net/magna/images/IMG_3695_600.jpg

You can see here, the bush in the upper left is a 'D-Rubber'.
Bush on the lower right is a bush on the end link.

Link Pins/End Links & the Bushes associated with these differ in style from car to car also!
But the D Rubbers always look like a D, haha.

And to answer your new/used question.
Buy it used, and order new bushes.
Swaybars don't wear out.

[p33r]

Very helpful thank you! So in my DC5 I just need to grab d links with the sway bar?

Why are end links and everything else optional if everything wears faster anyway? How long will the other bushes last if I change my sway?

And also, what are the differences between say a hollow 25mm and a solid 25mm rsb?

[curtis265]

It's optional because you can run the new RSB without any issues for that shortened amount of time. The decision's more of a do it all at once' kinda thing.

Solid is stiffer than hollow

[NeedVtec]

good information here guise

[senna]

All aftermarket swaybars that are larger than OEM will come with new D-Bushes, the bar is bigger so your original bushes won't fit since they are smaller...

You won't need to change the Link Pins though, they are a ball jointed style link that does not run any bushes. So unless there is free play in the links you should have no need to worry.

[p33r]

Thanks guys.

Ok here is another for you ppl which applies more specifically to my situation.

Right now I feel my DC5 is slightly understeer biased. I have an alignment of -2 F, -1 R. I have Eibach pro kit (i don't think they list exact spring rates) and Koni yellows F/R. However the rear is set quite stiff (front is 0.75/2.75 turns from soft, rear is 1.25/1.5 from soft)

Not sure what DC5S stock sway bar is but I'm planning on going up to a Cusco 25mm solid rear with stock front. Will this induce too much oversteer for daily driving? I don't want a ride that's too oversteer biased (closer to neutral if anything).

If it is too much, what should I do to balance it?

Bigger front sway? Soften the rear shocks? (These two are my most viable options)
Or should I reduce front wheel camber or get different springs (I'd prefer not to)

[curtis265]

generally stiffer rear will mean more oversteer. Get the swaybar and then adjust the shocks to suit. Keep your camber the same for now and experiment with things that you can do easily/free.

what do you mean 'from soft'? as in all the way soft, then turned 3/4 of a turn? or do you mean 2.75 turns?

[senna]

Fit the bar and set your rear shocks to full soft, then tune from there.

If the shocks are too firm with the swaybar you will get lift off or under braking oversteer.

[p33r]

all the way soft, then 3/4 of a turn. i wrote 0.75/2.75 for those who don't know the amount of leeway you get in DC5 konis.

i heard understeer/oversteer should be induced through spring rates rather than shocks though, is that correct? will there be any difference in anything softening the rear shocks compared to say, an alignment or installing a front sway?

[senna]

Yes it is very different - the sway bar will have a similar effect to increasing the rear spring rates. For a street car you really want the shocks to be as compliant as possible since the road surface varies and the initial hit of a bump can make the car hop so if the shocks can't extend to keep the tyre on the ground easily the car can become very skittish

[p33r]

Yes it is very different - the sway bar will have a similar effect to increasing the rear spring rates. For a street car you really want the shocks to be as compliant as possible since the road surface varies and the initial hit of a bump can make the car hop so if the shocks can't extend to keep the tyre on the ground easily the car can become very skittish

Yea that's what I thought..

Do you agree with this comment about sway bars? I've heard some agree and disagree with this.
http://automobile.hondaciviclx.com/showpost.php?p=40356764&postcount=14

Btw props to Wholesale Suspension, I got my konis installed at their penrith location a while back, did a great job :)

[senna]

I agree with this, I run stock bars on my falcon. I'm considering removing my rear one actually!

The important thing to remember about suspension is balance - you can't just change one thing and assume it will fix or complete a set-up, there are no silver bullets

[curtis265]

I agree with it, but I just like having soft, comfy springs with a flat body

[senna]

With low power you can do this quite easily, when you have high power and faster corner speeds the car can overcome the lateral grip of the tyres and break out into oversteer or understeer quite quickly