LSD gearbox Oil

[040501912]

i've been trying to find whats suited for the
1.5way Mfactory Plate LSD

I've used
HONDA MTF - it clunks like no tomorrow, Okay on corners

MOTUL FF TYPE 2 LSD - It was very good for the LSD but killed 2 synchros on my box on 1 race meeting
Now I Already replace them with mfactory carbon lined synchros 1st to 5th and too scared to go back to motul...

REDLINE MT90 (yellow) - Too tight for the LSD and bad on slow corner, so bad until its shakes the whole car.. not driveable on slow corners...


Now im back on MTF to flush out the box and looking for the next one..

Have you guys got any recommendations?

The LSD is only about 3000k kms or so..
and did figure 8's on run in etc etc

Cheers..

[Limbo]

Ask e240 what he recommends on these LSDs

[e240]

Thanks Limbo

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?131297-MFactory-Words-of-Wisdom

for daily drivers and weekend warriors, honda mtf is more than adequate. If it is just a daily driver that sees no harsh shifting whatsoever, then 10w30 engine oil is also more than adequate.

Honda mtf is just 10w30 engine oil + friction modifiers i.e helps the synchros to "bite" better.

E240 did not state that you should use engine oil in a race car, so i don't know why you keep asking that.

For a honda transmission, used on something that will see a lot of track time, what you want is:

1) low viscosity fluid. This is 100% necessity, as the fluid needs to lubricate the bearings. Thick "gear oil" cannot do this, and will clog up the oil pathways

2) friction modifiers + yellow metal friendly. The modifiers help the synchros to to "bite" better against the gear cone. A synchro ring after all is just a brake pad. The additives in the fluid must also be yellow metal friendly (i.e brass synchros). A lot of the "performance gear oils" on the market are not yellow metal friendly, and every special "lsd oil" on the market has the wrong type of friction modifier i.e they make the plates "slip", thus they also make the synchros "slip", which is not want you want when shifting at high rpm.

3) shock additives. These make the fluid more shear stable at high temperatures, and help cushion the shock loads generated by the transmission.

Now, the following is probably hard for most to take in, as they've been brainwashed by the lsd manufacturers for god knows how many decades now:

Helical/torsen lsd - this is a gear type lsd, it does not require any special sort of fluid. Just use fluid that meets the requirements stated above

plate lsd - this type of lsd uses plates, which rub against each other causing the "lock" (helical lsd's do not lock as they are torque biasing). The more friction there is, the harder the plates will lock. A by product of this though is "chatter" i.e the noise commonly associated with a plate lsd. As with the helical lsd, a plate lsd does not require a special type of fluid. Just use fluid that meets the requirements stated above. However, if you do not like the "chatter", then you should add ford friction modifier in very small quantities until the level of "chatter" becomes acceptable to your ears. Noise control is the only reason to use this type of friction modifier (which has the opposite effect of the friction modifier used in mtf or synchromesh-type fluids) on the average street/weekend warrior. If it is a race only car, then you shouldn't be concerned with noise. In this scenario, using friction modifier is so that you can fine tune how much the plates "lock".

The only reason why an lsd manufacturer insists that you must use their "special oil" is because they are trying to make more money from you. And 90% of car enthusiasts, unfortunately, have been brainwashed and believe them (or believe their tuner/mechanic, who are just as brainwashed).

So to conclude:

Street car/daily driver - honda mtf
street car/weekend warrior - honda mtf/torco mtf/amsoil mtf/pennzoil synchromesh
race car - torco mtf/amsoil mtf/pennzoil synchromesh
+ plate lsd - add ford friction modifier until the noise level becomes acceptable to you. Everyone is different. However, the more you add, the less effective your synchros are at high rpm.

P.s if you are wondering why i left out redline, it is because with 70% of our rebuild customers who had used it, it had destroyed their bearings. Some have luck, some don't.