Few more questions about audio.

[90civicGL]

So as some of you know, I picked up an Alpine MRP-M1000 amp and x2 4 ohm SWS-1243D subs.

Head unit wise I am pretty set on the Pioneer DEH-4450BT

With the speakers I'm after something cheap and effective. I am looking at the

6.5" Sony SW-GTX1641 front, How much benefit does having the splits have? Cause coaxial just seems way easier. (have a 2" mounting depth which is fairly good I think)

5.25" Sony SW-GTF1326.

So the reviews Ive read of the sony speakers is the highs and mids are great, and the bass is just mediocre, but having subs I don't mind that, I'm mainly after mid and high in my speakers.

So with the Headunit, speakers, amp and subs mentioned above, would they make a balanced decent sounding reasonably cheap setup?

This brings me to my next question, I can figure what speaker sizes I can fit in the 1990 ED civic hatch. Every place I find is just all arguing that it is 6.5" front and rear, then others say only 5.25's will fit front rear, others 6.5 front and 5.25 rear.

I don't mind having to clip away a little bit of plastic to let the magnet fit, but I don't want it scraping against the window/glass or to have to do any major custom work, and I want the stock grill covers to go back on without modification.

And wiring wise I will need to buy an adapter harness for the head unit correct?

What would be a rough estimate of length of cable I would need to wire up headunit, speakers front and rear, amp and subs. Subs are in back, and would try get amp under passenger seat.

I guessed.

3 meters for REMOTE ??? ga wire.
1 meter for GROUND 8 ga wire
4 meters for POWER 8 ga wire
25 meters for SPEAKER 12 ga wire.
3 meter for BIG 3 upgrade 0 ga wire.

And I have no clue what ga wire has been used inside the sub box to connect the subs to the terminals on the box and so on.

Thank you guys.

[trism]

Dont worry about rear speakers. You sit in the front, cater for yourself. Its just wasted money and time fitting rear speakers.

Fronts will take a 6.5" easily.

Id get a cheap 2 channel amp for the front speakers as well. Its amazing the difference it makes. I can sell you one for 50 bucks.

As for wiring, just go get yourself a prepacked amp wiring kit from a car parts store, Aerpro is fine.

[90civicGL]

Dont worry about rear speakers. You sit in the front, cater for yourself. Its just wasted money and time fitting rear speakers.

Fronts will take a 6.5" easily.

Id get a cheap 2 channel amp for the front speakers as well. Its amazing the difference it makes. I can sell you one for 50 bucks.

As for wiring, just go get yourself a prepacked amp wiring kit from a car parts store, Aerpro is fine.

I think it would bug me not having speakers in the rear, I know im in the front, but surly having another whole lot of sound 1 meter away from you, with the speakers facing you makes a noticeable difference. Looking at 2 ch amps, seems like 100w at 4ohms seems standard for a lot of the cheaper ones. Would this be fine for speakers rated at 75w rms 40hms?

Also is it only the amp that needs to be connected to the positive on the battery? Speakers get power through headunit, which gets power through the wiring harness correct?

[trism]

when you go see a band, or go to a music festival, or anything like that, where does the music come from? infront of you, not from behind you, or all around you.

Seriously, sound coming from behind you doesnt matter.

As for amps, it doest matter that the amp is more powerful that what the speakers can handle. In fact its better. It means the gains can be turned down nice and low, and you wont overwork the amp.

And yes, only the amp is connected directly to the battery. The speakers dont need a power supply, they receive the signal from eeither the amp or the headunit.

[90civicGL]

Good point, but I still think it would bug me not having speakers in the back.

As for an amp wiring kit. Would something like this work? Do you think it provides enough length of everything with the position of my set up? Amp under seat and subs in boot.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/CADENCE-4-8-GAUGE-PURE-COPPER-DUAL-DIGITAL-AMP-KIT-/300514992354?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item45f816e0e2#ht_4232wt_1139

And then I guess i just need some more speaker wire to connect the other speakers.

[Drifter995]

ok, i'll cover a few things here:

1. You don't need speakers in the back, save your money and purchase a set of decent splits for up front. get some ones that sound great to you, who cares what other people think? if you go out and buy a set that is apparently good, you could put them in your car, and find they sound like arse to you. As trism said, at a concert, sounds come from infront of you, not behind.

2. if you get a headunit, you'll want something with 2rca's (sub out/ rear out left and right, front out left and right) so you can run the monoblock and 2 channel.

3. If you so desperately want rears, keep the stock ones and run them off the headunit. you'll get your rear fill, and it'll be cheaper.

4. To be safe, it's a good idea to get something around this:
6 meters 4awg minimum for power (by minimum, I mean 4awg minimum. I'd probably opt for 2awg myself, just to be safe, but 4awg will suffice)
1 meter of same awg as power, so if you go 4awg power, get 1 meter of 4awg for ground.
6 meters of 16awg i think it is remote wire
2 rca's
10 meters 12awg speaker wire for speakers. (that should be enough to get from front doors to boot and sub to monoblock.
at least 4 meters of same sized wire as power wire for big 3 upgrade. so at least 4 meters of 4awg. can use 0awg if you want, up to you really.

5. you sound like you're going off maximum power for a lot of things, always go off rms, as rms is pretty much the actual power.

6. Power on an amp is not like a light switch, it can be turned up and down. if the amp runs 100wrms x 2 it doesn't mean your speakers will get 100wrms in them. same with your monoblock, if you turn the gains down, you won't overpower them :D

[90civicGL]

Ok thank you for the wire measurements. Main thing that had lost me. As for measurements I always use RMS ;), learned that peak was all marketing a few years a go.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/RCA-2m-Pair-HiFi-Solid-Core-Carbon-/130493637249?pt=AU_Television_Accessories&hash=item1e6206e281#ht_2307wt_905 Do cables like that actually make a difference? Or being a digital cable will a $10 one perform the same? I'm wanting to get the wiring and that kind of stuff set up properly so it will last and only have to be done once. So I want quality. And before someone says its only powering cheap speakers, I want to have the ability to power some better stuff without ripping it all apart and re doing it later.

Its really bugging me not knowing what wire was used inside the sub box.

So putting good speakers upfront and cheap speakers in the back wouldn't work would it, because the cheap ones wouldnt be able to keep up with the front ones when turned up and start to sound bad correct?

[Drifter995]

All good :D was hoping you didn't take it as a rant, was meant to be helpful :>

doesn't matter all that much if you're running them off the headunit... they're mainly for passengers in the back...
As for rca's, those would work well, else you can get stuff like stinger pro3 I think it is, and they are good quality.

As for the wires in the sub box, just use 12awg wire in it.. it'll be right. afaik.

and yes, if you wish to upgrade, putting good quality stuff in is a great idea. Leaves room for upgrading in the future. which I'm sure you will end up doing, haha

[TbM]

Good info here guise, 100% agree with drifter and trism that you dont need rear speakers, last 2 systems ive had have only been with front speakers with subs and it works great. It allows you to spend more on the speakers you will be listing too and you can still have plenty of volume if you buy decent splits.

Ive never been a fan of sony's car audio products, depending on your budget the main 2 speaker brand i recommend are Focal and Morel.

Yes you will either have to buy harness adapter or you can do it old school and just cut off the old plug then solder and heatshrink/tape the new harness onto the old.

If its bugging you not knowing what wire was using in your sub box take the sub out and have a look, this will also confirm if the coils are hooked up in series or paralell.

Whats your budget for the speakers?
Have you thought about sound deadening/enclosing the front doors?

[90civicGL]

Yer not taken as a rant at all, didn't quite catch on with the RCA cable. So the stinger is roughly $20 odd dollars, and the HiFi solid core is $70ish, So would there be a noticeable difference? Like physically looking at it on the pictures the HiFi solid core looks MUCH thicker. So although it might not matter with s type subs, what about say a couple of P2 or P1's?

And what is the quality of the stinger wire as a whole? Cause I see a lot of their stuff on ebay in pretty good priced roles. Seem to have all the gauges.

[TbM]

stinger is fine i use them in my current setup. You will also need an anl fuse and holder if you dont already have a fuse.

[90civicGL]

Sound deadening not atm, maybe one day if I put in a nice system. But this current system is more to just get one in the car. The current headunit is some old school sony with a 7 disc stacker. The speakers in the car are dead, and there is just a cheapish set of bookshelf speakers in the back. All my money has been going into restoring the car, so speaker and budget wise its more just anything that is good value/performance. So that there is something in the car. That's why I want to get all the wiring done correctly. So I can put in some better stuff later with a proper battery and stuff.

At repco while browsing for some tools I heard the sonys, they where the only speakers playing at the time so thats all I heard. Friend has some JVC's from SCA in his car and they sound OKish, as cheaper speakers should I guess. Diff friend had S type speakers all around connected to a 5ch amp, they didnt sound very nice. Now he has type R all around connected to a 4ch amp, they dont sound as good as what I thought they would.

But I guess budget wise maybe $250ish. Would it be better buying something around the price of the sony's and a 2ch amp, or some expensive speakers with no amp. And as I know the first reply will say good speakers and then buy an amp in a few months time. For the sake of this question lets assume the amp would have to come in 1-2 years time. If it helps at all am looking at purchasing in america even though shipping is like $100 for 2 sets speakers and an amp :(

So subs and mono amp I have, Am set on that headunit. So leaves speakers and wire open to suggestions.

[90civicGL]

stinger is fine i use them in my current setup. You will also need an anl fuse and holder if you dont already have a fuse.

only need an in line fuse on the battery end correct? And the amp has the built in fuses (x4 25)

most wiring kits seem to come with 150w in line, is that around the right size?

And also, in some of the wiring kits they mention like gold plated distribution blocks and those kind of things, are they needed/what do they do?

[TbM]

Sound deadening the doors isnt just for nice systems it makes any speaker sound better, you dont have to do the whole car just do some of the outer-skin inside the door with dynamat and cover the service holes with mdf to create an enclosure. give you alot better sound IMO. Think the door kits of dynamat are pretty cheap on ebay.

If your happy with how the sony's sound then thats great, main thing is to find speakers that you like listining to.

Yes the anl fuse goes near the battery, fuses are usually rated in amps are you sure its not 150A?

Distro blocks help if you are using multiple amps, you can run a high gauge cable though the cabin to a distro block then run smaller gauge cable to multiple amps.

[90civicGL]

Sound deadening the doors isnt just for nice systems it makes any speaker sound better, you dont have to do the whole car just do some of the outer-skin inside the door with dynamat and cover the service holes with mdf to create an enclosure. give you alot better sound IMO. Think the door kits of dynamat are pretty cheap on ebay.

If your happy with how the sony's sound then thats great, main thing is to find speakers that you like listining to.

Yes the anl fuse goes near the battery, fuses are usually rated in amps are you sure its not 150A?

Distro blocks help if you are using multiple amps, you can run a high gauge cable though the cabin to a distro block then run smaller gauge cable to multiple amps.

oh ok, sorry did mean 150A, so used to talking watts with car audio haha. So if I was to get a 2 way amp, then I would run 2ga wire to a ditro block, then 4ga wire out to each amp from the block?

http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/p_23919_Hifonics_HFi1002.aspx This seems like a pretty decent amp, I know hifonics doesn't have the most reliable reputation, but 100w rms each channel seems like an excellent price.

EDIT: The only name brand ANL inline fuse i can find is a narva 150A one for $38, dont really want a cheap imported one from ebay as I want it to work if I need it! :P

[Drifter995]

that amp worries me... the picture has 6 plugs... generally a 2 channel amp would have 2, 4 at most... 2 for input 2 for output.. so 6 is a bit curious. Anyone else know?

As for your wiring thing, 2awg into the dist block, then 4awg out should be perfect.

[TbM]

Morel maximos may be a good option, i think they are about 200-250 for a set IIRC
Heres a link to morel dealers in QLD if your interested in listening to some, http://www.rmaudio.com.au/html/qld_mc.htm

150 amp should be fine so long as the second amp you get doesnt draw much power. I dunno what you mean by 2 way amp but if you had 2 amps then yes thats how i would hook it up.

I cant comment on the hifonics as ive never heard of them, trism has offered to sell you a cheap 2 ch amp so maybe hit him up and see what its specs are.

Stinger and other brands make anl holders but you have to buy the fuse sepratly IIRC, its easy to pick them up from the local audio store.

[90civicGL]

that amp worries me... the picture has 6 plugs... generally a 2 channel amp would have 2, 4 at most... 2 for input 2 for output.. so 6 is a bit curious. Anyone else know?

As for your wiring thing, 2awg into the dist block, then 4awg out should be perfect.

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_22698_Hifonics-HFi100.2-HFi-100.2.html Thats same amp, just on a diff site. So onlinecarstereo must just use that same picture on all their hifi range of amps. So to wire up a car properly so it can handle a full high end system ends up costing a fair bit in the end.

[TbM]

So to wire up a car properly so it can handle a full high end system ends up costing a fair bit in the end.
Yephttp://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/tbmindustrys2/shortanswer-1.jpg

[Drifter995]

It's an expensive hobby, but it's a fun one.

as for that hifonics amp, it looks completely different to the one listed on onlinecarstereo... I wouldn't get the one from onlinecarstereo then... far too cheap, and the picture isn't the actual amp as far as I can tell.

[90civicGL]

So with my sub box, ive got x2 banana plugs. A positive and negative terminal on each side of the box, 1 for each sub. So I assume I have to connect the 2 subs together before running to the amp, so how would i go about doing this? Cause cant i only plug one lot of banana plugs in?

So if I plugged in one sub to the other sub, then there would be no where to plug in the amp. So is there some kind of special plug I get or how do I go about it?

[TbM]

So with my sub box, ive got x2 banana plugs. A positive and negative terminal on each side of the box, 1 for each sub. So I assume I have to connect the 2 subs together before running to the amp, so how would i go about doing this? Cause cant i only plug one lot of banana plugs in?

So if I plugged in one sub to the other sub, then there would be no where to plug in the amp. So is there some kind of special plug I get or how do I go about it?

If the coils on the subs are wired in series then you have to paralell the "bannan plugs" to the amp. ill draw some pics in paint and upload so you know what i mean, beware my paint skills are sub par so you have to use your imagination lol.

[TbM]

Like this
http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/tbmindustrys2/ererwer.png

Or this

http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/tbmindustrys2/sdasd.png

Hope they make sense ill redraw if you dont understand

EDIT: lol i just reliased i spelt banana plug plug wrong in paint lol, damn i fail at spelling/typing

[90civicGL]

Like this
http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/tbmindustrys2/ererwer.png

Or this

http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/tbmindustrys2/sdasd.png

Hope they make sense ill redraw if you dont understand

EDIT: lol i just reliased i spelt banana plug plug wrong in paint lol, damn i fail at spelling/typing

hahaha, all is well. So if I went with diagram 1, how would i go about connecting the 4 wires to one plug?

EDIT: The 2 wires to each plug i guess it would be, but isnt a banana plug just like a jack, and only one can fit in?

[TbM]

hahaha, all is well. So if I went with diagram 1, how would i go about connecting the 4 wires to one plug?

EDIT: The 2 wires to each plug i guess it would be, but isnt a banana plug just like a jack, and only one can fit in?

I dont use banana plugs i just use speaker wire, the banana connectors on my car sub and home audio can be screwed out(grab the top and twist counter-clockwise) to reveal a hole to slide speaker wire through then it screws back down to clamp it in place, would take a pic for you but am without camera phone at the moment, wouldnt be surprised if yours is the same and if they are then its easy to run multiple cables to one jack.

[90civicGL]

I dont use banana plugs i just use speaker wire, the banana connectors on my car sub and home audio can be screwed out(grab the top and twist counter-clockwise) to reveal a hole to slide speaker wire through then it screws back down to clamp it in place, would take a pic for you but am without camera phone at the moment, wouldnt be surprised if yours is the same and if they are then its easy to run multiple cables to one jack.

Had a closer look at mine, and it has a similar thing, has the hole for the wire, but it uses a spring mechanism, hole is only 2mm wide or so though, so I think I would have trouble fitting both wires in there, So I guess I could use the spring mehod to connect the 2 subs together, and then use a banana plug to connect one of them to the amp. I assume that will connect it all together.

[TbM]

Found this pic online (http://www.google.com.au/imgres?q=banana+connectors+for+speakers&hl=en&safe=off&sa=X&biw=1173&bih=818&tbm=isch&prmd=imvns&tbnid=qPj_Mk3zqNyz5M:&imgrefurl=http://www.lesjones.com/2010/02/08/follow-up-with-pics-converting-raw-speaker-wires-to-banana-plugs/&docid=U12_N58TH3ZtDM&imgurl=http://www.lesjones.com/www/images/posts/dsc_8619-600x397.jpg&w=600&h=397&ei=tfhyT-KQBqPkmAXeqIHaBg&zoom=1) to show you what i mean,
http://www.lesjones.com/www/images/posts/dsc_8619-600x397.jpg

See how the wires go into the side of it and are clamped down? thats how i usualy connect mine, but obviously alot neater

[TbM]

Had a closer look at mine, and it has a similar thing, has the hole for the wire, but it uses a spring mechanism, hole is only 2mm wide or so though, so I think I would have trouble fitting both wires in there, So I guess I could use the spring mehod to connect the 2 subs together, and then use a banana plug to connect one of them to the amp. I assume that will connect it all together.

Damn mine are quite large so can easily fit multiple wires in, if yours is too small then connecting it the way you describe will work.

[90civicGL]

Damn mine are quite large so can easily fit multiple wires in, if yours is too small then connecting it the way you describe will work.

Ok, Ill get a picture of what I have to work with and post it up tomorrow, really appreciate the help, I'm sure somewhere in this forum you have answered all these questions. But i really do appreciate it. Then hopefully one day I can pass on this knowledge.

[TbM]

Ok, Ill get a picture of what I have to work with and post it up tomorrow, really appreciate the help, I'm sure somewhere in this forum you have answered all these questions. But i really do appreciate it. Then hopefully one day I can pass on this knowledge.

No worries glad to help.

[90civicGL]

Another question came up in my mind. Think we may have briefly gone over it but want your opinion on it. Know I know everyone seems to recommend just spending the extra money on the front speakers but Im not sure if I can do that. After spending the whole night researching speakers and reading reviews, there seems to be a lot of people out there that like the diamond audio speakers. Apparently the aluminium tweeters are really nice, and easy to install. So if they arn't to hard to install I guess components would be better of over coaxials.

So if I was to stick like a set of diamonds 6.5" D363.5 components hooked up to a 2 ch amp, then like some sony 5.25" speakers in the back hooked up to the head unit, would this make it sound bad as a whole? And then if the volume was cranked up would the sonys start to distort while the diamonds had lots left in them, ruining the sound? I have a feeling it will.

[TbM]

Another question came up in my mind. Think we may have briefly gone over it but want your opinion on it. Know I know everyone seems to recommend just spending the extra money on the front speakers but Im not sure if I can do that. After spending the whole night researching speakers and reading reviews, there seems to be a lot of people out there that like the diamond audio speakers. Apparently the aluminium tweeters are really nice, and easy to install. So if they arn't to hard to install I guess components would be better of over coaxials.

So if I was to stick like a set of diamonds 6.5" D363.5 components hooked up to a 2 ch amp, then like some sony 5.25" speakers in the back hooked up to the head unit, would this make it sound bad as a whole? And then if the volume was cranked up would the sonys start to distort while the diamonds had lots left in them, ruining the sound? I have a feeling it will.
if you had the fronts amped and the rears running off the headunit IMO you would be better not running any rear. At full volume a decent set of amped speakers will drown out speakers running off the head unit.

Why not do it this way, spend what you can now on the fronts then if you really want you can wait a bit and save up and get a set for the rear if you need them, but if you get a decent set up the front you should be happy with the output unless you want something that will cause permanant hearing damage.

Unfortunately you cant research speakers online like you can most other things, you need to hear them to know how they sound to you. Ive never heard of diamond audio so cant comment on them sorry. Beware of buying speakers online as there are fakes of certain brands going around, speakers is one of the few things i dont buy online.

Where are you located roughly? might be able to name some stores near you to go check out so you can listin to the difference.

[90civicGL]

if you had the fronts amped and the rears running off the headunit IMO you would be better not running any rear. At full volume a decent set of amped speakers will drown out speakers running off the head unit.

Why not do it this way, spend what you can now on the fronts then if you really want you can wait a bit and save up and get a set for the rear if you need them, but if you get a decent set up the front you should be happy with the output unless you want something that will cause permanant hearing damage.

Unfortunately you cant research speakers online like you can most other things, you need to hear them to know how they sound to you. Ive never heard of diamond audio so cant comment on them sorry. Beware of buying speakers online as there are fakes of certain brands going around, speakers is one of the few things i dont buy online.

Where are you located roughly? might be able to name some stores near you to go check out so you can listin to the difference.

Loganholme, I've only been to places like JB and SCA and repco. They have like kenwood and sony and JVC and not much more.

[TbM]

Loganholme, I've only been to places like JB and SCA and repco. They have like kenwood and sony and JVC and not much more.
Damn im close to the Cbd area so most of the stores ive been too arnt close to you :(

Is this store closish?
Autobarn Beenleigh
131George Street, Beenleigh, QLD 4207
Ph: 07 3807 9822
sales@beenleigh.autobarn.com.au
According to http://www.rmaudio.com.au/html/qld_mc.htm They are morel dealers so maybe give em a call and see if they have any morels on display and pop in and have a listin.

[90civicGL]

Damn im close to the Cbd area so most of the stores ive been too arnt close to you :(

Is this store closish?
Autobarn Beenleigh
131George Street, Beenleigh, QLD 4207
Ph: 07 3807 9822
sales@beenleigh.autobarn.com.au
According to http://www.rmaudio.com.au/html/qld_mc.htm They are morel dealers so maybe give em a call and see if they have any morels on display and pop in and have a listin.

Yer that shop isn't to far a way, might have to go down and see what they have on offer, so had a look in my car today and I have no rear speaker slots, so that is awesome, means I can get decent quality fronts and 2ch amp.

EDIT: Dont think this has been answered yet, how much of a difference does a component set and coaxial set of the same speaker make? Cause all the speakers I have in mind offer them in both, and well lets face it, coaxial is easy. Component is a bit harder to install, but if it will make a big difference I might go to the extra effort.

Also, should I get a fused distribution block, or is unfused ok, both outlets will be going to fused amps, and the inlet will be fused at the battery end. 0ga In and 2 or 4 ga out if that helps.

And one last thing, I only run power back from the positive correct? Not the negative?

Thanks a million.

[Drifter995]

1. Splits can offer better staging, and aside from that, I'm pretty sure you can make better quality drivers if they are both seperate.. you don't have the crossover, tweeter and woofer all in one thing... But imo, it's worth the extra effort.

2. I would get fused, just to be safe... It's not needed, but I just prefer to be safe than sorry :)

3. Yes, that is correct, only run positive back from the battery. Your grounds will come from a bolt nearby the amps. As close as possible is recommended. The idea is to get something that bolts directly into the cars body or so, and rub away any paint, so it has direct metal to metal contact.

[90civicGL]

1. Splits can offer better staging, and aside from that, I'm pretty sure you can make better quality drivers if they are both seperate.. you don't have the crossover, tweeter and woofer all in one thing... But imo, it's worth the extra effort.

2. I would get fused, just to be safe... It's not needed, but I just prefer to be safe than sorry :)

3. Yes, that is correct, only run positive back from the battery. Your grounds will come from a bolt nearby the amps. As close as possible is recommended. The idea is to get something that bolts directly into the cars body or so, and rub away any paint, so it has direct metal to metal contact.

Ok, thanks. Do you know what fuse I would put in the distribution block? 200A near the battery I know. Off the dis. block there would be a 200rms 2ch amp (100rms X2) and a 600 rms amp both at 4Ohm. So would I need something like a 50A fuse in there if I was running 4ga wire to the amps?

EDIT: also do I need to run a fuse anywhere on the big 3 upgrade? In one video i saw a guy put a fuse inbetween the battery positive and the alternator (close to battery). Not sure what size it was, guessing 200A or something.

[Drifter995]

for the dist block, I think it's the larger fuse halved.. so that makes sense, wire is splitting into two...

as for the fuse in big 3 upgrade.. Not actually sure. I suppose you could if you wanted to be safe. I don't know if it's a must or not

edit: is all good tbm :D

[TbM]

the fueses in the distro block are to protect the wire after the block incase of short, should use a fuse larger than what your amp is rated but lower than the max current of the cable.

Heres rough examples from http://www.bcae1.com/
Suggested Fuse Sizes

Wire Gauge Recommended
Maximum Fuse Size
00 awg 400 amps
0 awg 325 amps
1 awg 250 amps
2 awg 200 amps
4 awg 125 amps
6 awg 80 amps
8 awg 50 amps
10 awg 30 amps
12 awg 20 amps
14 awg 15 amps
16 awg 7.5 amps
These are the recommended maximum fuse ratings for the corresponding wire size. Using a smaller fuse than what's recommended here will be perfectly safe.

With regards to fusing the alt wire, its definately better to fuse it but there are people who have gotten away without doin it with no problems so up to you how safe you want to be.

Safest way is to fuse at both ends as the alt and battery can output current, if you just fuse at battery end and it shorts close to the alt the fuse at the battery will be useless.

Example:
Alt-Fuse------------Fuse-Battery

many would consider that overkill but if you like to be safe thats the safest way i know.


Not 100% sure on fuse size for alt wire IIRC its meant to be between 10-20% over the output of the alternator but less than the max current draw of the wire used.

[90civicGL]

Thank you TbM and drifter,dont know what I would do without you. Ill do some digging with the fusing and big 3 side of things. So a fuse protects the wire down stream of it correct? So if I fuse the distribution block, then it protects the 4awg wire leading to the amps?


As for being safe and adding fuses, will a fuse restrict the power going through? So like if I fused the bat and alt on the 0 awg wire in big 3, would it then be like putting 2 awg wire down since it has to travel through more components?

[TbM]

Thank you TbM and drifter,dont know what I would do without you. Ill do some digging with the fusing and big 3 side of things. So a fuse protects the wire down stream of it correct? So if I fuse the distribution block, then it protects the 4awg wire leading to the amps?


As for being safe and adding fuses, will a fuse restrict the power going through? So like if I fused the bat and alt on the 0 awg wire in big 3, would it then be like putting 2 awg wire down since it has to travel through more components?

Correct.


Current should be limited by the A rating on the fuse. IIRC there will be a slight voltage drop across the fuse, weather this is noticable or not i have Nfi but i would assume it wouldnt be noticable in your case.

Regards,
http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j480/tbmindustrys2/0c478a5b87102d3700fa683784d58838.gif

[TbM]

Heres some more info on fuses.
http://www.bcae1.com/fuses.htm

[90civicGL]

Heres some more info on fuses.
http://www.bcae1.com/fuses.htm

Thank you once again.

[TbM]

No worries mate, good to see people trying to learn instead of just paying someone else to do it.

That bcae1 site is a good site too look through, has heaps of info.

[90civicGL]

Another quick question, How does a dedicated 2 channel amp compare to a bridged 4 channel amp? I'm guessing the dedicated 2 channel would put out cleaner power? Or would it not make a difference if the bridged 4ch has same RMS rating as the dedicated 2ch?

Thanks

EDIT: One last thing I hope. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/STINGER-1-0-AWG-GAUGE-PRO-SERIES-RED-AMPLIFIER-POWER-CABLE-WIRE-SPW10TR-/190647197648?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c63755fd0#ht_1450wt_1139 So I guess my question is this cable 1 awg or 0 awg. Cause it determains which fuse I need, 325A vs 250A, atm I've got a 300A to go with that cable. Using that bcae1 website as a guide.

[TbM]

Another quick question, How does a dedicated 2 channel amp compare to a bridged 4 channel amp? I'm guessing the dedicated 2 channel would put out cleaner power? Or would it not make a difference if the bridged 4ch has same RMS rating as the dedicated 2ch?

Thanks

EDIT: One last thing I hope. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/STINGER-1-0-AWG-GAUGE-PRO-SERIES-RED-AMPLIFIER-POWER-CABLE-WIRE-SPW10TR-/190647197648?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2c63755fd0#ht_1450wt_1139 So I guess my question is this cable 1 awg or 0 awg. Cause it determains which fuse I need, 325A vs 250A, atm I've got a 300A to go with that cable. Using that bcae1 website as a guide.

Depends on the specs of the amp.

That cable is 1 aught. its written as 1/0.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_wire_gauge

[Drifter995]

as tbm said, it depends on the specs of the amp, but in some cases, the 4 channel can put out more power.. really depends on the amps and their bridging power, etc.

As for that cable, It is 0gauge.. once it hits 0 (or 1/0), the next thickness is 00 (or 2/0) as tbm's link shows. so therefore, 1/0 is 0gauge. :D

[90civicGL]

Ok thanks guys, got it now. :)

[90civicGL]

Another question, and cant promise its my last.

I was reading more about fuses today and some people said that at the distribution block, don't put in fuses that are higher then the added sum of fuses on your amp. Now 4 Ga wire needs 100-125A fuse, So my alpine amp has 4x 25A fuses so 100A is fine for it, but then the 2 ch amp I'm looking at only has x1 40A fuse, it states it accepts 4 ga wire input, so I will use that. But I guess the question is, can I still put a 100A fuse at the distribution block for the wire leading to the amp. I'm thinking yes as i'm fusing for the wire's rating not the amp. But just wanted to check and get your opinions on it.

[Drifter995]

You're good man, haha. Ask as many questions as you see fit. I find asking more questions better than asking none at all, and running the risk of blowing something up.

I'm not actually sure about the fuse question, so hopefully tbm can help you out xD
I would assume the fuse is to stop the wire from melting and catching fire, and the amp one is to stop it from blowing, etc... so in my messed up theory it wouldn't matter, but I don't know... so hopefully tbm can clear it up :>

[90civicGL]

Is there a limit to how big a MDF speaker spacer can be? Cause There are some components that are 4"s deep, so I would need a spacer of like 2"s to clear the windows. Would a MDF spacer hold up and still let the speakers sound decent?

[Drifter995]

Pretty sure the thickest is like 32mm, but you could a few and glue them together. Your only problem then would be your door trims... You'd most likely have to modify the trims to accommodate for the new speakers popping out :D

[TbM]

Another question, and cant promise its my last.

I was reading more about fuses today and some people said that at the distribution block, don't put in fuses that are higher then the added sum of fuses on your amp. Now 4 Ga wire needs 100-125A fuse, So my alpine amp has 4x 25A fuses so 100A is fine for it, but then the 2 ch amp I'm looking at only has x1 40A fuse, it states it accepts 4 ga wire input, so I will use that. But I guess the question is, can I still put a 100A fuse at the distribution block for the wire leading to the amp. I'm thinking yes as i'm fusing for the wire's rating not the amp. But just wanted to check and get your opinions on it.

Yes 100A fuse would be ok to use as its just for fusing the wire after the distro. Having a lower rated fuse just gives you a little extra safe guard, personally i would probably run a fuse rated around 40A-50A on that line that way if there is a problem the fuse will blow quicker than a 100a.

[90civicGL]

Yes 100A fuse would be ok to use as its just for fusing the wire after the distro. Having a lower rated fuse just gives you a little extra safe guard, personally i would probably run a fuse rated around 40A-50A on that line that way if there is a problem the fuse will blow quicker than a 100a.

Ok, cause since the amp doesn't take more then 40A, the line in also shouldn't exceed that, so a 50A fuse shouldn't blow unless there is a problem correct?

And then gluing 2 25mm MDF spacers together wouldn't put to much weight on the door or anything making it flex to much I hope. As for the grill I would cut it so the speaker can stick through, and get some of that Computer PC Case moding grommet striping and tidy it up with that. Reason I ask is I could a set of RE Audio XXX 6.5 comps (4" mounting depth) for $250 US. I wouldn't get a chance to listen to them, but they sell for $900 in aus, so its very temping. Or from an aus dealer I can get the Morel Tempos for $270 (dropped in price cause out of stock on the maximo's) or wait a couple weeks and maximo's for $205 aus.

Hopefully Ill get around to listening to the Morels sometime this week.

As for amp boston acoustic is pulling out of car audio, so big savings on some of their amp's over in the states.

[TbM]

Ok, cause since the amp doesn't take more then 40A, the line in also shouldn't exceed that, so a 50A fuse shouldn't blow unless there is a problem correct? Yep


And then gluing 2 25mm MDF spacers together wouldn't put to much weight on the door or anything making it flex to much I hope. As for the grill I would cut it so the speaker can stick through, and get some of that Computer PC Case moding grommet striping and tidy it up with that. Reason I ask is I could a set of RE Audio XXX 6.5 comps (4" mounting depth) for $250 US. I wouldn't get a chance to listen to them, but they sell for $900 in aus, so its very temping. Or from an aus dealer I can get the Morel Tempos for $270 (dropped in price cause out of stock on the maximo's) or wait a couple weeks and maximo's for $205 aus.

Hopefully Ill get around to listening to the Morels sometime this week.

As for amp boston acoustic is pulling out of car audio, so big savings on some of their amp's over in the states.
Be careful buying speakers online, some hi-end brands are copied and sold cheap on ebay, i dont know if RE's are getting copied too but i know focals do, they do not allow online sales so you see someone selling them online whos not an authorised distributer and good chance they are fake. The price you quoted would lead me to question their authenticity.
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?72842-Fake-FOCAL-speaker-Ozhonda-member-BEWARE-!!!

Internet sales policy... Focal-JMlab creates and distributes high-end speakers, loudspeakers and kits for the car. We take great care in the distribution of our products, our presentation, customer support, installation and after sale service are our number one priority. To make sure these high standards are kept we do not authorise the online sales of Focal products.

Products sold on the Internet have been obtained from questionable sources that do not meet Focal JMlab's quality standards. These products may be counterfeits. See our "Spotting a fake" article for more details.

We inform you that the warranty, after sales service and the support of these internet-sourced products will only be covered by the seller, and not by Focal. If you intend to buy genuine Focal products with Australian warranty, we advise you to get in touch with your authorised dealer as they will offer you time, advice and support.
I advise only buying from authorised dealers, copies are of much lower quality.

[90civicGL]

Yep


Be careful buying speakers online, some hi-end brands are copied and sold cheap on ebay, i dont know if RE's are getting copied too but i know focals do, they do not allow online sales so you see someone selling them online whos not an authorised distributer and good chance they are fake. The price you quoted would lead me to question their authenticity.
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?72842-Fake-FOCAL-speaker-Ozhonda-member-BEWARE-!!!

I advise only buying from authorised dealers, copies are of much lower quality.

Yer am aware that there is a rising amount of copies out there. http://www.audiosavings.com/products/6.5-and-6.75-Car-Speakers/RE-Audio-XXX6.5C-6.5%E2%80%9D-600W-Component-Car-Audio-Speakers-XXX-6.5C-Competition/XXX6.5C.aspx This is the mob I was looking at as they have fair international shipping prices, and the amp I like at a good price.

I cant find a authorised dealers list on their site. But US forums seems to like the site, and there ebay reputation is outstanding. So I'd hope they wouldn't snoop that low. But i might shoot RE Audio an e-mail before ordering if I decide to go this route.

As for the morel's they would be from http://www.fhrxstudios.com/ or Beenliegh Autobarn if they could price match.

I'll have a read through that link tonight. Looks like it might have some good stuff in it.

[Drifter995]

If you're after an authorised re dealer, there is one in SA.. ampl audio. friend of mine owns the place. they deal with sundown too iirc.
But yes, fhrx are definitely a good place to deal with. great customer service, and they post and such. But yeah, if you're keen for the re stuff, send an email or call ampl and see if they post... you may be able to get something from them :D

[trism]

to add further to your question about the fuses, they arent there to protect the amp, thats what it has its own onboard fuses for.

The fuses on the cable are to protect the cable.

Lets say you run without a fuse.

You have a nice big thick 0 gauge cable from the battery up the front, all the way too the boot. And somehow, where it runs under the back seat, it moves around a bit, and rubs on metal, where it wears through the insulation and shorts out on the metal. Its going to flow uunlimited current from the battery. Overheats, melts the insulation, catches fire, burns the car to the ground.

This is why we fuse as close to the battery as possible, to reduce the amount of unprotected cable to no more than about 30cm.

Now, when it comes to a distro block, we are stepping down wire sizes, so the main fuse no longer protects it.

The main wire may be 0 gauge, so we put a 150amp fuse to protect it, but if we step down to 4gauge, then itll catch fire at more than about 100amp, so a 150 amp fuse isnt going to do shit. So we use a fused distro block with 60 amps fuses to protect the 4 gauge.

Ya dig?

[Bludger]

Ya dig?
your explanation is too complex for most ppl here.

[90civicGL]

to add further to your question about the fuses, they arent there to protect the amp, thats what it has its own onboard fuses for.

The fuses on the cable are to protect the cable.

Lets say you run without a fuse.

You have a nice big thick 0 gauge cable from the battery up the front, all the way too the boot. And somehow, where it runs under the back seat, it moves around a bit, and rubs on metal, where it wears through the insulation and shorts out on the metal. Its going to flow uunlimited current from the battery. Overheats, melts the insulation, catches fire, burns the car to the ground.

This is why we fuse as close to the battery as possible, to reduce the amount of unprotected cable to no more than about 30cm.

Now, when it comes to a distro block, we are stepping down wire sizes, so the main fuse no longer protects it.

The main wire may be 0 gauge, so we put a 150amp fuse to protect it, but if we step down to 4gauge, then itll catch fire at more than about 100amp, so a 150 amp fuse isnt going to do shit. So we use a fused distro block with 60 amps fuses to protect the 4 gauge.

Ya dig?

Yep, loud and clear, think I'm all set on fuses. So although 4ga is rated at a 125A fuse, would I put a 60A on so it blows quicker before damage gets done? Or would I stick a 80-100A since the alpine has 100A (so I'm guessing the alpine draws up to 60A of power or something) The boston only has a 40A fuse so a 60A would be fine for its run of cable.