[CU2] Excessive oil consumption

[bugeater]

I was wondering if anyone else has had an oil hungry Euro?

Mine is brand new and between 1000 km and 8000 km it consumed almost exactly 2 litres of oil. Took it to the dealer to check it out and got the 6 month service at the same time (i.e. a $260 oil change), and no explanation, but it is now on "consumption watch", which means taking it back every 1000 km for 5000 km, so they can check the oil level. Somewhat inconvenient.

Has anyone else had to do this?

[natnat]

this is something rare on a Japanese Normal Aspirated non rotary engined car.

Sometimes the way the engine was run in does affect the oil usage in a turbo car, eg: Golf Mk5 GTI.

[marquee]

If your worried drive as hard as possible they will put in a new engine if it is too excessive

[sensei_]

my cuz X1 also consumes oil like no tomorrow. i would like to know what tends to be the cause of it. she drives it like a granny, so there is no reason why its burning up that quickly

[curtis265]

you have bad piston rings, and a badly broken in engine

The issue is that if you don't drive the car hard enough/keep it at a constant RPM for too long, your rings aren't able to wear themselves in properly and dont' form a clean seal with the sleeves. Some of t he air/fuel mixture gets past the piston rings into the crank case, vaporises a bit of oil and sends it back into the intake manifold through the PCV.


my cuz X1 also consumes oil like no tomorrow. i would like to know what tends to be the cause of it. she drives it like a granny, so there is no reason why its burning up that quickly

as above..

[sensei_]

cheers. so what can i do to solve this problem?

drive it hard, break the engine in more? my cuz doesnt drive all that much, maybe 200km/week.

[curtis265]

Too late, it's gotta be on a freshly built engine

[sensei_]

thanks mate.

maybe ill raise the point with bmw if i happen to go past it one of these days.

[redseven]

Mine's hit 10k km and it hasn't consumed any oil. I ran it in gently up to 500 km, then I ran it closer and closer to the redline as I got near the 1000 km mark. I think it's important to keep using VTEC to keep it running smooth. I did an oil change at 1000 km to flush out the crap from the factory. Sometimes ya gotta drive it like ya stole it :)

I would've thought Honda have much better quality control than an Italian make which shall be unnamed ;) Run-in probably doesn't mean much because the piston rings and cylinder bores are machined well from the factory. 2 liters of oil in 7000 km is excessive especially for a new car... could be an inherent defect rather than a run-in issue.

[curtis265]

thanks mate.

maybe ill raise the point with bmw if i happen to go past it one of these days.

yeh dude basically u shouldn't ever be burning oil in an engine's life, ever

burning oil a sign of wear

[bugeater]

I certainly didn't baby it, nor did I thrash it when I ran it in. I seriously doubt it was run in poorly. I think there is something not quite right with it.

[curtis265]

I certainly didn't baby it, nor did I thrash it (much) when I ran it in. I seriously doubt it was run in poorly. I think there is something not quite right with it.

might be worth doing a compression test

maybe they broke it in wrongly.

[tron07]

cheers. so what can i do to solve this problem?

drive it hard, break the engine in more? my cuz doesnt drive all that much, maybe 200km/week.

I do about 150km per week... lol

[aaronng]

I certainly didn't baby it, nor did I thrash it (much) when I ran it in. I seriously doubt it was run in poorly. I think there is something not quite right with it.

When the car is started first thing in the morning, does it get driven off immediately or do you wait about 30 seconds to let it idle and circulate the engine oil?

When driving off in the morning, do you use 1/4, 1/2 or 3/4 throttle?

While running in the engine is important, modern engines are built with tighter tolerances and such should not consume engine oil if not run in the hard way. I do notice that for Euro's that if the car is started in the morning and then driven off straight away with a good amount of throttle that I smell burning engine oil and blue smoke. This was from my neighbour's Euro and every day she would start the engine, put it straight into D and drive off with serious throttle, probably getting to 3000-4000rpm when the engine was still cold and the oil had not yet properly circulated the engine. I suspect this caused premature wear to the piston rings seeing that the time taken from start to driving off was under 5 seconds. Not sure why she was always in a rush.....

An engine in good condition shouldn't burn oil at that high rate. For my engine, I've even pushed it at 4000-7000rpm constantly for a total of 90 minutes in a day and it did not consume any oil at the end. The level on the dipstick was still the same.

[bugeater]

It only gets used on the weekends with reasonably long runs (out into the countryside to fish). The warmup is pretty gentle and certainly doesn't get pushed hard from cold. It probably takes at least a minute or two to get out of the garage and once out I don't push it for a while.

[aaronng]

Are your exhaust tips black and oily?

[bugeater]

Ha! been a long time since I looked at this, but in response to the last question: No, the exhaust tips are not black and oily.

Plus to update, they put it on oil watch. At the 1000km check, they said it was fine and there was no need to come back. I did check it myself and it did look okay. But the next time I checked (maybe 2000 km later), it was low, so I topped it up. Basically it seems to have consumed about 1L/3000km. It's in the shop today and they told me that Honda claims that excessive oil consumption is >1L/1000km. But they did say they would talk to Honda Australia about it.

Question is: do you all think 1 liter of oil consumed per 3000 km is acceptable? Basically if you did the full 10,000 km between services you would almost change the oil once. I don't think this is acceptable.

I'm also worried about the cause. What could it actually be? Plus, if my driving style changes (say I start commuting with it), will the consumption get worse? Last thing I want is the warranty to run out, start using it as a commuter and discover I have to add a liter of oil with every fill up. This is what I used to do when I rode a 2 stroke motorcycle, I shouldn't have to do it with a car.

[curtis265]

Ha! been a long time since I looked at this, but in response to the last question: No, the exhaust tips are not black and oily.

Plus to update, they put it on oil watch. At the 1000km check, they said it was fine and there was no need to come back. I did check it myself and it did look okay. But the next time I checked (maybe 2000 km later), it was low, so I topped it up. Basically it seems to have consumed about 1L/3000km. It's in the shop today and they told me that Honda claims that excessive oil consumption is >1L/1000km, which is rediculous. But they did say they would talk to Honda Australia about it.

Question is: do you all think 1 liter of oil consumed per 3000 km is acceptable? Basically if you did the full 10,000 km between services you would almost change the oil once. I don't think this is acceptable.

I'm also worried about the cause. What could it actually be? Plus, if my driving style changes (say I start commuting with it), will the consumption get worse? Last thing I want is the warranty to run out, start using it as a commuter and discover I have to add a liter of oil with every fill up. This is what I used to do when I rode a 2 stroke motorcycle, I shouldn't have to do it with a car.

absolutely not, that's quite a lot. Do you play with the high cams a lot?

Have you had a leakdown and compression test done?

[bugeater]

Hmmm, I might suggest those tests to the dealership, though it's a bit poor they haven't done them already.

By high cams, I'm assuming you mean do I thrash it? I don't. A lot of its kays are in sixth gear on cruise control.

Anyway, it is back on oil watch, but we will keep it up this time. Now apparently >500ml/1000km is excessive according to Honda Australia, so my car isn't far off that when driving in reasonably benign conditions. Also, the dealership basically admitted that most of these cars use effectively no oil at all. So we will see.....

Also found out that one of the new guys at work is an ex-mechanic and he thinks this oil consumption is way, way high for a new car.

[Jasemas]

You probably got a defected K24 engine
There have been reports that some K series engines use alot of oil and it may be a design flaw in the engine - in the U.S
Just keep checking the oil regularly and keep on contacting Honda Australia as this sort of thing should of been stopped years ago - oil consumption
If they wont do anything about it go to fair trading
i you're lucky Honda may buy back your car
Hell my car is 18 years old and uses 100mls/1500kms and has done over 250xxx kms
Good luck

[curtis265]

Hmmm, I might suggest those tests to the dealership, though it's a bit poor they haven't done them already.

By high cams, I'm assuming you mean do I thrash it? I don't. A lot of its kays are in sixth gear on cruise control.

Anyway, it is back on oil watch, but we will keep it up this time. Now apparently >500ml/1000km is excessive according to Honda Australia, so my car isn't far off that when driving in reasonably benign conditions. Also, the dealership basically admitted that most of these cars use effectively no oil at all. So we will see.....

Also found out that one of the new guys at work is an ex-mechanic and he thinks this oil consumption is way, way high for a new car.

ur mate's right

no healthy engine should consume oil

[aaronng]

I fang my CL9 heaps and even after 90 minutes of true constant 4500 - 7000 RPM, it doesn't consume any oil....

[tw586]

all internal combustion engine should use oil, if they dont the upper area of the cylinder wall is not being lubricated. this will result in wear at the top ring land on the bore and engine life will be reduced. most modern light automotive SI engines are manufactured so well they dont need to be run in like the old cars did. But driving like a little old lady will glaze the cylinder bore and result in oil consumption. industry standard for oil consunption is 400ppm( HC) in the exhaust at operating temp, idle 5min , pre cat con. This is a very long and difficult test to do and most dealers wont have the equipment to do it. 1000cc oil for 3000klm is not that excessive but for 1000klm is getting a bit high. Incorrect oil choice appears to be the main cause. full synthetics around 5w are just a little to thin for my taste, I use 10w30 shell full mineral and change every 6 mts in my my12 euro and it uses about 250 cc between changes so I am happy with that. Also note KA24 engines have a low rod ratio at @1.56 to 1 so the piston is working hard on the bore thrust side, a little extra lube can't hurt.

[sensei_]

What are the side effects of excessive oil consumption? Basically, if the oil level is always topped up, will it have any detrimental impact on the engine?

[Jasemas]

Not as much side effects
but the condition of your engine and its health
You also need to confirm whether or not your engine is leaking oil or consuming it
Consuming is okay (in terms of oil loss)
But leaking oil is a whole other problem

[tw586]

Merc trucks actualy have a oil injector into the intake system to burn off engine oil on purpose, they have a self top up system to keep the oil level at the full mark in the sump and a 80L reserve tank to supply oil to the engine, when the tank is empty time to change the oil service interval is @80k so topping up the oil is good for the engine as you are introducing fresh oil to maintain good lube properties

[curtis265]

I dunno how true this is, but i read somewhere that oil in the intake stream reduces the effective RON of the petrol, so there's a risk of predetonation.

[tw586]

not with diesel and diesel is rated in cetain which is a slower burn scale compaired to RON, diesel will burn at about half petrol speed. oil in a petrol intake wont actualy effect the speed at which the fuel will burn however it will have a effect on the combustion process, and on lpg fuel systems they add oil into the air stream for upper cylinder lube, I think the brand name was Valve Saver, some old fart like me even used it when we couldnt by super for our old iron head V8's in the early 80s

[bugeater]

My worry is we don't really know what is causing the loss, plus it is clearly different than the majority of other Euros out there. If they all did it, then the situation would be different. I also don't mind a small amount of loss, but having to top up between services with a new car seems pretty crap.

Plus, once the thing gets older and starts consuming oil naturally, this will just add to the current loss.

[tw586]

I have a small but simple test to determine where oil is being used
drive the car untill it is at operating temp, allow to idle for 5 to 10 min
attach a 4 gas exhaust gas analizer to the exhauxt and monitor HC in ppm
blip the throttle quickly and only go to 2500rpm, then monitor HC if it rises sharply about 10 to 20 sec after you have bliped
the throttle is lead me to think it is a valve guide seal issue.
next hold the rpm at a steady 3000 to 3500 and watch the HC, if it rises slowly and continues to rise above 800 ppm then rings are the issue
Note when connecting the 4 gas it must be done before the Cat Converter so it may have to go to a work shop to do this test

[Luppifs]

Folks, was wondering what the outcome was for those undergoing the "oil consumption watch" exercise ?

Sorry to revive an oil thread, but I've recently discovered my 2012 CU2 is consuming oil, to the point where i've already had the oil pressure warning light come up before the car even hit the 5,000km mark. When i measured it, there was barely enough oil to touch the end of the dipstick.

I owned a 2007 CL9 Euro for 5 years (drove it for 78,000km), and it didn't lose a drop of oil whilst i had it.

[Fredoops]

Some recent cu2 are a bit lemon-y......

[bugeater]

My CU2 is the one with the issues. I'm still taking it back every 1000 km and usually it is stable around 0.3l per 1000 km, which is below where Honda Australia claim they will do anything. However, on one check it was slightly below 0.5l per 1000 km which is where their cutoff is. At the next service I'll be asking what is to be done. Should nothing be done I'll be considering legal options. I don't think 0.3l per 1000 km to be acceptable. With a brand new car you should not have to top up between services, which means it should consume less than 0.1l per 1000 km as far as I am concerned.

I would like to know what "normal" is though. So I might put a poll up if I can.

[bugeater]

Update: last oil check is at 1l/1000 km. They'll have to do something now. I'm a bit worried about the sudden increase in consumption though.

[curtis265]

Update: last oil check is at 1l/1000 km. They'll have to do something now. I'm a bit worried about the sudden increase in consumption though.

that's alright, you'll just get a new engine. no worries!

Are you comparing cold to cold readings?

[bugeater]

I'm not taking the reading, Honda are. They basically top it up and measure how much goes in as far as I can tell. So the car is warm when they do it.

[curtis265]

I'm not taking the reading, Honda are. They basically top it up and measure how much goes in as far as I can tell. So the car is warm when they do it.

Oh i see. well as long as they've seen the 1l themselves then that's the main thing

Congrats on a new engine!



Is there any known cause of this consumption yet?

[bugeater]

Unsurprisingly, after a very long period of time, the response from Honda Australia has been that the level of consumption is "acceptable". They have the consumption at 0.49 litres per 1000 km, which is just the average over the whole test period. To say I am angry is an understatement. I now need to consider my next move.

[Jasemas]

To fair trade/aca/today tonight

[curtis265]

Unsurprisingly, after a very long period of time, the response from Honda Australia has been that the level of consumption is "acceptable". They have the consumption at 0.49 litres per 1000 km, which is just the average over the whole test period. To say I am angry is an understatement. I now need to consider my next move.

what the **** x 100^100

that's bullshit

[sensei_]

i have a feeling honda is becoming like apple in the car industry. their dealers are only keen to sell/service the cars but not provide any after sales support.

in singapore i remember browsing with a relative. when i asked for a brochure/catalogue they outright told me that "honda cars dont need catalogues to sell". their sales staff are also less than acceptable.

i come to australia and the experiences whilst not as bad as back in singapore isnt much better.

[dougie_504]

Beat the living crap out of your engine and get a new one under warranty. That oil consumption is nowhere near acceptable IMO and you might need to force Honda's hand on this one.

And next time you get a brand new engine make sure you break it in properly (http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm).

[bugeater]

I greatly doubt the break in is responsible. It might make a difference on the margin, but the reality is that these high oil consuming Euros have some sort of defect in construction.

[I CU2]

That's normal for a VW but maybe not so much for a Honda...

[BigBen]

So where is the oil going? Is it going pass the rings or just flashing?

[curtis265]

So where is the oil going? Is it going pass the rings or just flashing?

Air/fuel Blowby is going past the rings into the crank case. Since it's very hot it's exceeding the flash point of the oil, evaporating some of it and pressurising the crank case

whic goes out the pcv

then into the intake

then through the combustion

[Fredoops]

In otherwords:

Shit, ****, shit, shit, ****.

[bugeater]

Air/fuel Blowby is going past the rings into the crank case. Since it's very hot it's exceeding the flash point of the oil, evaporating some of it and pressurising the crank case

whic goes out the pcv

then into the intake

then through the combustion

So can this actually damage anything over time?

[bugeater]

I've spoken to the dealership and Honda Australia.

Honda Australia were a complete joke. They just denied any argument I made and stated repeatedly that it is "within specification". Wouldn't tell me where it would have to be to be outside specification (trade secret). When I mentioned that few other Euro owners have this problem (and those that do complain) this was basically dismissed as being meaningless.

So essentially you make a complaint and to respond to the complaint they just repeat what you are complaining about and say it is fine.

I also pointed out that consumer law isn't about what the manufacturer deems to be okay, but what would affect the purchasing decision of said consumer. I know I wouldn't have bought the car had I known about this.

Also, apparently within specification means the car is fine. Not just fine within the warranty period (which it probably is). So I asked if they would extend the warranty for me, since the car is apparently fine and therefore this wouldn't cost them anything. They refused.

Even my concern that commuting in the car will increase oil consumption was met with basic derision. My driving is pretty tame at the moment (a lot of freeway and highway driving), but this is likely to change just outside the warranty period.

Oh and the funniest was that the low oil pressure light is apparently a "drive somewhere to top up the oil" light. And not "oh shit my engine will die if I don't stop right now" light.

Oh and the Acura TSX isn't at all comparable because it is built with different specifications in the US (not sure how true this is).

[curtis265]

why would you drive differently within and after the warranty period?

[bugeater]

why would you drive differently within and after the warranty period?

Life circumstances change. We use PT at the moment, but intend to move house into suburbia and then the car will be used as a commuter. I'd expect stop-start traffic would consume more oil (and petrol) than the current highway/freeway driving it mostly does.

[dougie_504]

High-load driving will use more oil. Stop-start will use more petrol.

My honest advice would be to do things the other way around. Beat the living crap out of the engine so the oil consumption gets worse and goes above the 'acceptable limit' for oil use. Only baby it when it's cold and you're outside warranty. Will cost you more in petrol but whatever you'll live :(

For now, I'd personally try to run it into the ground and get a new engine/rebuild while it's under that warranty.


Unfortunately this is just proof that warranties are usually only worth the paper they're written on.

[stndrd]

You will find that this has ALOT to do with the fact that Honda are now using 0W20 engine oil, instead of a 5W30 due to emissions regulations. Get rid of the 0W20, use some Penrite HPR5 5W40 and watch that consumption plumet to next to nothing

[bugeater]

Actually, it is using FEO 10W30 according to the dealer.

As to conditions that cause the oil consumption to rise, its been hard to find much of a correlation, but it was very variable over the test, from about 0.3L/1000 km to 1L/1000km. About the only thing that seemed correlated was the amount of stop start driving i.e. more oil consumption with more stop-start/suburbia driving. That said, correlation does not imply causation :)

[Luppifs]

Folks,

I’ve just had the engine replaced by Honda in my 2012 Manual Lux Euro. (is this a first for any Australian Euro ??)

In short, my engine was a lemon from the moment is was manufactured.

To provide some history to this, my car had to be towed in March 2013 at 4,600km due to insufficient oil in the engine.
(yes, a very sad day for my 5 month old $40,000 vehicle)

The oil consumption tests then commenced. It soon became apparent the oil consumption was getting worse. The exhaust tips were full of thick carbon residue.

I would check the oil level myself and noticed the oil was as black as tar on the dipstick. Not only did it look burnt, it actually smelt burnt.

When the car had 7300km on the odo, i brought it in for its routine 1000km check.
It required 1.3 litres of oil to bring it back to level.

Given the severity of the oil consumption, i was expecting Honda Australia at this point to begin some form of remediation, but they wanted me to continue for another 1000km of driving. <insert expletives here>

So it was topped it up with oil, but the car only survived 600km of driving after this.
My all-time favourite warning light appeared (the Oil Pressure light) due to lack of oil.

The vehicle was then towed back to the Service Dept, where it sat on a hoist for 5 weeks in total. Lets just say they didn't bother to even measure how much oil it had gone through, as this event marked the official end to their consumption tests.

The first 2 weeks were spent disassembling the engine. Initially they were planning on only replacing the piston rings and valve stems, however they continued to disassemble the engine to discover the cylinder walls were ‘scored’ (ie… scratched)

A replacement engine known as a “Short Block” was then ordered and installed, which is basically the bottom section of the engine block containing the pistons etc.
The existing engine head was sent away to a 3rd party head specialist, who refit the engine stem seals using a micrometer and other fancy tools.

I only just picked up the car last week from the Service dept, so i can't comment on whether it has corrected the issue, but i would assume the manufacture issue has since been sorted out in the Honda factory. Fingers crossed...

The cause of all the oil burning was discovered to be faulty Oil Control Rings, which I had confirmation were not installed correctly at the time of manufacture in the factory. The wrong amount of torque was applied, which caused them to spin around, when they aren't supposed to. These were also were responsible for damaging the cylinder walls.

I believe what we have here is a simply a bad batch of motors. The vehicles that appear to be affected are a small set of 2012 Manual Euros.

Including my Euro, I'm aware of 3 other people with vehicles exhibiting this issue, and they are all recent (2012) manuals. (one of them is in Canberra and isn't an OzHonda member, but i tracked them down and have personally spoken to them to confirm their model/year details). Ah, the wonders of the internet :)

Prior to this vehicle, i owned a 2007 Euro (CL9 Manual Lux) from new, which i drove for 78,000km, which didn't consume a single drop of oil during its 5 years of me owing it.

For those interested, there are threads on TSX forums about their 2012 manuals having the exact same issues as us (our Euro is known in the states as the "Acura TSX").

Anyways, i hope this info helps some owners who may be going through the same thing...

[curtis265]

thanks for the story

good to see things for fixed.

[Jasemas]

Jesus your engine died
And they didn't replace the 'whole' thing
just the block? how ****ing cheap are they...
At least it got sorted
So moral of the story... you need to go back to Honda and explain to them about the oil control rings in the pistons

[curtis265]

Jesus your engine died
And they didn't replace the 'whole' thing
just the block? how ****ing cheap are they...
At least it got sorted
So moral of the story... you need to go back to Honda and explain to them about the oil control rings in the pistons

that's not even cheap

considering the labour they'd have to use putting the motor back together..

[Fredoops]

So the threashold is 1litre plus?????

Some tolerance level

[stndrd]

A new complete short block from Honda will be around the $3.5-$5k mark. Add in their labour at $100+ p/h and it is not cheap at all to them

[Fredoops]

Lol my k24 is 10 years old this year, still don't consume a single drop

[Luppifs]

Jesus your engine died
And they didn't replace the 'whole' thing
just the block? how ****ing cheap are they...
At least it got sorted
So moral of the story... you need to go back to Honda and explain to them about the oil control rings in the pistons

I argued this exact point of not replacing the 'whole' thing with Honda Australia (amongst other points), but they wouldn't budge at all. They kept re-iterating that the fault was only in the short block, so that's all they were offering to replace.
They told me that if i believed the issue was also related to the head (top) of the motor, i was welcome to pay for this part of the engine out of my own pocket.

I was pushing for my cat converter and sensor to be replaced, as it would surely be contaminated and its overall lifespan impacted due to the more than 5.5 litres of oil being burnt through it in less than 8,000km of travel, but as Andrew O'Keefe says on the show.... "NO DEAL !!" . They didn't want to know about it.

Something that i didn't mention was that Honda Service Dept had to send my existing engine head to a local head specialist, who had to check and refit the valve stems with a micrometer device. I believe the cost of this whole exercise would have been less on their part if they had just supplied a new block. Yep, it was alot of labour hours that went into this job, and alot of hours of missed sleep that i won't get back.....

[Fredoops]

Honda might've started to import engine blocks from their Thailand operations lol

[Jasemas]

Do we link these kinda pages to Honda Australia's facebook page?
And make some sort of ruckus and get everyone here to like the post and comment about it - thus Honda Au coming clean

[sensei_]

more like you link the page to honda au FB page, and then the owner of the site gets a "cease letter" claiming some sort of rubbish laws. of course, the big boys have money for lawyers and plenty of time, im guessing the owners of the site do it out of passion, and would fold like a deck of cards. sad but true.

[bugeater]

So the threashold is 1litre plus?????

Some tolerance level

Yeah and the guy I spoke to at Honda was saying how they are have very high tolerances...:thumbdwn: yeah right. High tolerances for consumer complaints perhaps. I can't believe oil consumption multiple orders of magnitude higher than average is still considered "within specification". Mind you, they weren't willing to discuss average consumption of Accord Euros with me because "we are talking about your vehicle". :?:

Isn't it funny that you trust that a warranty will mean when you purchase something very expensive, if it doesn't work properly, then things will be made good. But if a company wants to make things difficult and apparently don't care about the bad reputation it will get, it will just redefine what is a "problem" to evade its responsibilities.

Filthy, filthy behaviour and exactly what consumers should and do punish.

[Jasemas]

Hmmm i thought that in some cases Honda bought back the cars?

[philipminge]

yeh 2L is not normal regardless what anyone says.

i drive my CL9 euro hard as... its has 165xxxkms and in 5xxxkms it might consume 2-300ml.

maybe try a thicker oil. do they use like a 5W30... maybe try 10W40.

strange.... if that was my new car from factory.... i would be demanding a new one.... not an engine swap.... coz some apprentice will be pulling it apart and putting it back together..... hell no!

if they dont solve it, man take it further.

my uncle bought a brand new DC5 type r... one of the last ones... the glovebox didnt close properly... they said it cant be fixed.... after threatening to drive it through the show room window at 100 clicks, they magically fixed it!

some apprentice couldnt fix it....

different issue but im just saying dont let them say its normal.... 2L is huge. even though its new it might use a bit but not that much.

my s2000 does not burn that much oil.... not even close... and they burn oil - nature of high comp... same as a C63 amg... they burn oil. not 2L though.

i'd be using thicker oil- if it still does it.... go to honda n tell them its bs and u want a new one. lol

[curtis265]

more like you link the page to honda au FB page, and then the owner of the site gets a "cease letter" claiming some sort of rubbish laws. of course, the big boys have money for lawyers and plenty of time, im guessing the owners of the site do it out of passion, and would fold like a deck of cards. sad but true.

yes, defmation time.

[sensei_]

Isn't it funny that you trust that a warranty will mean when you purchase something very expensive, if it doesn't work properly, then things will be made good. But if a company wants to make things difficult and apparently don't care about the bad reputation it will get, it will just redefine what is a "problem" to evade its responsibilities.

Filthy, filthy behaviour and exactly what consumers should and do punish.

Looks like exactly what apple did. Look where it got them :p

the one where more people could relate to was the iphone 4 = operator holding it wrong

there are others out there that mac users will be familiar with

[kjs]

I'm checking my oil levels tomorrow! 2012 manual.

[tron07]

yes, defmation time.

if you are not defaming them, then they cant send you a cease letter.... its a fine line, you can say how bad your car is, but not honda cars and never say that they are incompetent or not doing their job.

[gambate]

maybe try a thicker oil. do they use like a 5W30... maybe try 10W40.



that is a no no, it is harder for the piston ring to scrap thicker engine oil from the cylinder wall = more oil burn with thicker oil
same with engine that uses hydraulic lifter, thicker oil = louder cylinder head/valvetrain tick.

however, thicker oil might temporarily "fix" leaky valve stem seals.

[dougie_504]

^
I disagree. I've moved from 10W-40 semi to 10W-50 full-synth and I'm retaining about 1L extra oil every 5,000KMs.

[curtis265]

that is a no no, it is harder for the piston ring to scrap thicker engine oil from the cylinder wall = more oil burn with thicker oil
same with engine that uses hydraulic lifter, thicker oil = louder cylinder head/valvetrain tick.

however, thicker oil might temporarily "fix" leaky valve stem seals.
I disagree

it's not about scraping oil off the cylinder wall, it's about having a different flash point

[bugeater]

So a quick question - I was just in the garage and checked inside one of the exhausts. It is certainly sooty (my finger was black from running my finger along the inside). Is this normal? Should it be essentially clean?

Most cars I've cared to inspect this way over the years have been dirty, but they were also old - not a modern car with all the emission restrictions they now have.

[Fredoops]

So a quick question - I was just in the garage and checked inside one of the exhausts. It is certainly sooty (my finger was black from running my finger along the inside). Is this normal? Should it be essentially clean?

Most cars I've cared to inspect this way over the years have been dirty, but they were also old - not a modern car with all the emission restrictions they now have.

Running rich perhaps?


^
I disagree. I've moved from 10W-40 semi to 10W-50 full-synth and I'm retaining about 1L extra oil every 5,000KMs.
Might that have something to do with the fact you switched from semi to full synth?

[dougie_504]

Running rich perhaps?


Might that have something to do with the fact you switched from semi to full synth?


Should burn more then I'd think mate.

[bugeater]

Running rich perhaps?



I was more wondering if this is a symptom of the oil consumption.

[stndrd]

Best way to tell is to get a leak down test and do a dry/wet compression test

[curtis265]

running rich causes soot, not burning oil - sometimes this mixes with condensation and then people also seem to think this is oil... Touch it and see if it's oily

fuel mixture is also controlled by the enigne's computer and won't be affected by the compression

[pesad42]

My 2009 cu2 is burning 4l of oil don't know what to do
Honda should have a oil reservoir as they have one for the radiator

[curtis265]

My 2009 cu2 is burning 4l of oil don't know what to do
Honda should have a oil reservoir as they have one for the radiator

4L?

that's like me saying my car uses 50L of fuel.

Either way, if you lost 4L then your engine would have fried itself.

DId you go back to the dealer?

[pesad42]

4L?

that's like me saying my car uses 50L of fuel.

Either way, if you lost 4L then your engine would have fried itself.

DId you go back to the dealer?

4L every 10k

[kera_1]

Technically you shouldnt, do you guys change the oil yourself or do you go back to the dealers?
I change mine every 5000ks and 5000ks at the workshop.
Mines a MY12 - Facelift auto. Which should not be any different. Only follow the same weight and visc of the condition you drive in.
Also smell your oil(anything other than engine oil). Most likely its how you ran the car in. But its not the end of the world cos you know its a problem, buy yourself a spare bottle check it every week.
If its under warranty bring it back.
But to be honest mine does too. But I don't drive it in D too often as keep it in S and shift myself. Keep the engine in different ranges.

[blabla]

Honda Penrith have said tolerance is 1liter of oil per 1000km is OK

[Fredoops]

Lol a rusted great wall doesn't even drink 1L per 1000km

[I CU2]

Honda Penrith have said tolerance is 1liter of oil per 1000km is OK

Seems a bit too much IMO, although by VAG/Audi standards it's fine but they use forced induction so it's expected they'd drink a bit more... unlike the Euros.

[ChaosMaster]

Perhaps they decided to up the "tolerance" because these days they use 0w20 to help improve fuel consumption, as the current crop of engines are over a decade old.

[Jasemas]

All about meeting those fuel emissions
But at the cost of engine longevity

[blabla]

All about meeting those fuel emissions
But at the cost of engine longevity

Yep thats true

[Lozer]

I am a new Eccord euro owner. There is one thing i found that if you put the oil dipstick in the wrong way it showes a lot less oil that the right way.