b18c blacktop vs b18c2 best motor to build

[sammutn90]

hey:wave:

I was just wondering if a jap b18c blacktop or a b18c2 which would be good to build im after a motor for track and street use

thanks:honda:

[stndrd]

There are very few difference between the two. If you are aftet an "OEM" build a c2 block with type r internals and inlet manifold is a tried and tested race setup. Otherwise if you want to do a complete aftermarket build, drop me a PM about Bisimoto internals, camshafts & exhaust system

[sammutn90]

ohk no worries man should i use my c2 block and head for build?

thanks

[dougie_504]

If you have a C2 I certainly wouldn't go looking for a blacktop b18c. Not worth it for all of 7kw. Get some internal mods and the c2 will be a great engine.

[cihanvtec]

keep the c2, save the money and invest in a dc2r gearbox! or a b16a gearbox with aftermarket lsd!!

[sammutn90]

Yeah true but whats the point of buying a dc2r gearbox when i can just run a lsd into my gear box it would be cheaper
and what cams and camshaft should i run???

[V73C]

Because it has shorter ratios. Your b18c gears are too long.

[stndrd]

Cam specs all depend on what you plan on doing with your bottom end and if you are staying n/a or going f/i.

For the price you pay for a second hand dc2r gearbox, I would rather put a new H.Drive Racing final drive & LSD in the C2 gearbox

[sammutn90]

Yea true man but isnt the c2 box and type r pretty much the same ratio

[u mad?]

Not even close.

This hurts my head

[Tai]

WTF blacktop, this aint a toyota.

[dougie_504]

Use the C2 and either replace the final drive and/or gears or buy a type r box

[mocchi]

red top is better than black top

[cihanvtec]

yea true man but isnt the c2 box and type r pretty much the same ratio

LOLOLOL

the dc2r rips through gears much quicker than the c2 man. thats probably one of the biggest differences between the two! if your planning on tracking, id suggest either switching the final drive or a dc2r box.

and if your a badass, get 4.9 fd.

[dougie_504]

Well an ITR box you're looking at probably $1,200-1,500 and will have no idea what it's condition is like.

I'd be tempted to use your C2 box and put in an LSD + final drive because at least you know the condition of the gears.

[Tai]

But it's not a Type R

[u mad?]

But it's not a Type R
Aint a tight car if it aint a type r

[DC2-PWR]

The acceleration is definetly noticable, the c2 2nd and 3rd ratios are quite long.

Integra vtir with dc2r gearbox

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vG8othL1SAI
Integra vtir with the gay stock gearbox

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnuhsvFXFlY&feature=related

My advice would be definetly have a good gearbox if you're planning to track, change the clutch and flywheel while your at it too.

Apart from that Dougie has pretty much nailed the topic so I'd lean more to his advice, this man knows his Hondas :)

[dougie_504]

Interesting videos. You can really spot the difference. A 4.9FD or higher would really help out

[DC2-PWR]

Interesting videos. You can really spot the difference. A 4.9FD or higher would really help out

It depends on what gearbox though, the 4.9FD sometimes slows down a car at a certain track. It depends where the FD application is needed. Mountain racing the 4.9FD would be an advantage because the gears are shorter and you will get more acceleration? Or should it be faster at any part of a circuit?

I'm not entirely sure on this, it's just that I have seen my friends experience from a stock b16 non LSD gearbox, rebuilt to 4.9FD and LSD and the lap-times I was expecting that he would probably get was actually slower than his original PB times. Maybe there was something wrong with his setup or something, but even with LSD around a track it should've been a bit better like anyone would guess.

However look at this example, the 1996 spec JDM Integra came with the 4.4FD gearbox, whilst the new 1998 spec came with the 4.7FD gearbox.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34H2MCPEUV8

What will the outcome with the 4.9FD will be lets say on the 1998 spec gearbox? I'm guessing the 96spec should take the win because he has better power through the slightly larger gears. Or maybe I'm totally confused haha

I'll try to research more though but it would be better if someone could share their honest experience on this.

[dougie_504]

It's like a multiplier. Faster acceleration but lower top speeds. It would sort of 'shorten' all the C2 gears so at a fast track with long straights it wouldn't allow for the best top speed. Highway driving might be 3,300-3,500 at 100kmph etc.

But for most daily driving (entertaining), mountain runs and slower tracks with more cornering it would be beneficial you'd think.

[u mad?]

use talk like itll drastically reduce top speed, which is bullshit. As if ull get anywhere near your topspeed on a track be it 4.4 or 4.9, unless uve got some big power.

With my k20 my top speed was 260, I put a 5.1 in, now I do about 240. Id need to be at nurburg or fuji speedway to get anywhere near my top speed lol.

[DC2-PWR]

use talk like itll drastically reduce top speed, which is bullshit. As if ull get anywhere near your topspeed on a track be it 4.4 or 4.9, unless uve got some big power.

With my k20 my top speed was 260, I put a 5.1 in, now I do about 240. Id need to be at nurburg or fuji speedway to get anywhere near my top speed lol.

Haha if you put it that way bro,

Thanks Dougie I was probably over exaggerating or thinking some shit. But good to understand it a little better I guess :).

[cihanvtec]

use talk like itll drastically reduce top speed, which is bullshit. As if ull get anywhere near your topspeed on a track be it 4.4 or 4.9, unless uve got some big power.

With my k20 my top speed was 260, I put a 5.1 in, now I do about 240. Id need to be at nurburg or fuji speedway to get anywhere near my top speed lol.

^ what he said..

btw are you on like 5000 rpm in 6th going 100km/h? loll

[joe.teg]

hey man im running a fully built c2 with aftermarket LSD and 4.9fd, shoot me a pm if you have any questions, ill be able to help you out :)

[u mad?]

^ what he said..

btw are you on like 5000 rpm in 6th going 100km/h? loll

3800rpm

[joe.teg]

with my 4.9fd im doing about 4000rpm at 100kmph

[cihanvtec]

with my 4.9fd im doing about 4000rpm at 100kmph


what car? k series engine or b?

if its a b probably coz its only a 5 speed.

[joe.teg]

nah its a b18

[connorling]

Because it has shorter ratios. Your b18c gears are too long.

change the final drive and get a clutch type LSD > type R gearbox in terms of the performance (LSD) and the cost

[Glocker]

Myth is that ur top speed drops if u switch to 4.7fd in the ITR. Only the first 3 gears are shorter, 4th and 5th are exactly the same as the 4.4FDs

[joe.teg]

Glocker, in the ITR box first is the same as the c2 box albeit shorter final drive and only second and third are shorter

[Limbo]

N/A - stick to a dc2r box.
FI - go the dc2 with a 4.4 FD and drop in an LSD from the ITR.
I got 205km in 4th gear at 7.5rpm with the dc2 box.(Boosted)
There is a noticable difference in the ratios and again with the FD

[Glocker]

Glocker, in the ITR box first is the same as the c2 box albeit shorter final drive and only second and third are shorter

oops, 2nd and 3rd is shorter, the rest are exactly the same.

if you are going to boost, C2 box with aftermarket diff, no point sticking to the stock ITR helical one