Built b18c2 vs H2B

[carayan]

I always planned to go H2B with my EK, but I came into possession of a b18c2, and now I'm torn as to what road to go down.

I leaned towards a H2B swap, because a K was just crazy expensive and I figured why not? Dilemma is now, should I instead stick with the b18 I have sitting in my garage? I really only planned on building a quick streeter that I could take to the track and just generally have fun with and the h2b fit the bill really well, nice torque, decent power, and quick mated to a b series tranny.

Building the b18 (sleeves, cams, valve train, rods etc) would be a long winded road, but would it prove to be more cost effective versus a h2b swap? It's a bit difficult to word my plans, but I need opinions from both sides of the fence, from people who have had experience with both, and can give me pros and cons of both set ups.

Thank you.

[stndrd]

Both set ups have good potential but when you look at dollar vs power gains, they both really start to add up. K24 swaps can be done for not much more than a h2b set up in an eg or ek so it is definately worth looking at

[jayeg]

really not that much price difference between h2b and basic k24 like stndrd said

[gen2 CRX]

H2B will smoke a b18c

[carayan]

Both set ups have good potential but when you look at dollar vs power gains, they both really start to add up. K24 swaps can be done for not much more than a h2b set up in an eg or ek so it is definately worth looking at


really not that much price difference between h2b and basic k24 like stndrd said


H2B will smoke a b18c


but what about installing? it wouldnt be as sort of straight forward as the b or h would it?

or should i just sell the b18c2 engine and pick up a h22 and call it a day?

[stndrd]

B is the easiest to fit. Then personally i would say k then h

[carayan]

B is the easiest to fit. Then personally i would say k then h

Doesn't a k swap have a lot of fab work involved?

[PHO]

H swap should be the one that has more fab work than K.

[stndrd]

K swap stuff is mass produced amd readily available and the touch of a button

[carayan]

H swap should be the one that has more fab work than K.


K swap stuff is mass produced amd readily available and the touch of a button

i mean in terms of welding to the chassis, that's some serious stuff, after what you all said, i found a k24 i could get, but the work involved is scaring me, plus the parts required to make it run and paying someone an exorbitant amount to do it for me is out of the question.

tough lyf.

[Benson]

H2B swap isnt really worth it. Yes its 2.2L and can make some decent hp stock motor, but getting a/c and p/s to fit will be a challenge.

Is your current car B series swap? Built b18c depending how far you mean "built" will net around 150-160kw (expect no less change from 8k) which then will require drivetrain to be upgraded as well.

K20 swap will be more of a popular choice, there is no real cutting or welding required in a EK chassis.

[carayan]

H2B swap isnt really worth it. Yes its 2.2L and can make some decent hp stock motor, but getting a/c and p/s to fit will be a challenge.

Is your current car B series swap? Built b18c depending how far you mean "built" will net around 150-160kw (expect no less change from 8k) which then will require drivetrain to be upgraded as well.

K20 swap will be more of a popular choice, there is no real cutting or welding required in a EK chassis.

At the moment, I've got the good old D16Y4 torque monster. The B series engine is the one I have that I was going to drop in. I had allocated about 5k (over time) to build it up, so nothing super crazy, but respectable. The K20 swap would be too expensive for me, even after selling the b18, i'd need at least 2-3k on top just for the engine..

[stndrd]

I would save that bit extra for a K series as you will not regret it. OEM reliability for the same power as a "built" B18C.

K24 & 6 spd box can be had for up to about $4.5k (depending on condition and km's)

Swap parts, labour and tune approx $6-8k

Then later on down the track if you plan on chasing a bit of extra power, your dollar vs power gains (either by n/a or f/i) will be alot better when compared to a B or H series

[chez00]

I always planned to go H2B with my EK, but I came into possession of a b18c2, and now I'm torn as to what road to go down.

I leaned towards a H2B swap, because a K was just crazy expensive and I figured why not? Dilemma is now, should I instead stick with the b18 I have sitting in my garage? I really only planned on building a quick streeter that I could take to the track and just generally have fun with and the h2b fit the bill really well, nice torque, decent power, and quick mated to a b series tranny.

Building the b18 (sleeves, cams, valve train, rods etc) would be a long winded road, but would it prove to be more cost effective versus a h2b swap? It's a bit difficult to word my plans, but I need opinions from both sides of the fence, from people who have had experience with both, and can give me pros and cons of both set ups.

Thank you.

You don't need to sleeve the B - that's a big unnecessary cost for the power targets you're talking about. Nor will you need aftermarket rods. In fact if the bottom end still has good compression (leak down test will confirm), just focus on the cylinder head and transmission for best results (bigger inlet valves, cam, CAI, short final drive, LSD) . If you've already got it, the B is the easiest and cheapest and will still go well. Just my 2 cents.

[carayan]

You don't need to sleeve the B - that's a big unnecessary cost for the power targets you're talking about. Nor will you need aftermarket rods. In fact if the bottom end still has good compression (leak down test will confirm), just focus on the cylinder head and transmission for best results (bigger inlet valves, cam, CAI, short final drive, LSD) . If you've already got it, the B is the easiest and cheapest and will still go well. Just my 2 cents.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm that seems to be the most logical choice at this point in time, I can always go K later down the track.

[dougie_504]

For your budget i'd go the c2 with some mild cams and just enjoy it. Fun daily with respectable track potential

[curtis265]

K swap stuff is mass produced amd readily available and the touch of a button

This /10

H parts dont have as much type r tax though

[carayan]

This /10

H parts dont have as much type r tax though

the US crowd love the H series, so things are available for the h series.

[stndrd]

Just about anything is available in america but you will be paying $2k+ just for a H2B conversion kit, a K series is just so much more logical

[carayan]

Just about anything is available in america but you will be paying $2k+ just for a H2B conversion kit, a K series is just so much more logical

man you're the the k series' voice of reason...argh. a k series is the logical choice long term, thats for sure...

[stndrd]

I too was in a similar situation to you just over 12 months ago. To boost a b series, do a H2B or go a K series. When you take into consideration the age of the motors, initial outlay, power and torque figures, the K comes out on top just about everytime.

Dont get me wrong, i have a soft spot for B & H series, just value for money overall, you cant beat a K series

[dougie_504]

^ cept D15B bro haha

Seriously though it all comes down to budget. No point talking H2B VS K-series if you have a budget of $5g and need to pay a mechanic to do the work. Save up some more money or re-evaluate the project outcome.

[tripleuse]

h2b is an expensive build, I would consider a b20 instead if your low on cash. Kswaps really arent that expensive these days. a budget one can be done for under 10k given you do all the labour.

[carayan]

I too was in a similar situation to you just over 12 months ago. To boost a b series, do a H2B or go a K series. When you take into consideration the age of the motors, initial outlay, power and torque figures, the K comes out on top just about everytime.

Dont get me wrong, i have a soft spot for B & H series, just value for money overall, you cant beat a K series


^ cept D15B bro haha

Seriously though it all comes down to budget. No point talking H2B VS K-series if you have a budget of $5g and need to pay a mechanic to do the work. Save up some more money or re-evaluate the project outcome.


h2b is an expensive build, I would consider a b20 instead if your low on cash. Kswaps really arent that expensive these days. a budget one can be done for under 10k given you do all the labour.

I want to do everything myself. Granted, my knowledge isn't as great as some would say is needed for something like this, but thats part of the fun. My goal is to do this myself, expensive or not..i mean really money is money, if it has to be done (and its worth it) I'm happy to do it.

I actually never considered a b20 build to be honest...

[Vvvtec]

Kswap really isnt that hard. Pumped mine out in 14 days, just myself and a mate. First time doing a swap.

If you can afford it, kswap all the way. You will not regret it.

[neut]

^ Agree with you alex. I got my K motor in, in about 3-4days by myself after doing the 5stud conversion and stuff first. After that its just about wiring and plumbing. I was in a process of doing a b20 build, had the block cleaned out and all. Stopped it and done a Kswap. I dont regret it at all 6 spd ftw.

[mocchi]

jdm d15b ftw, kdwap suck shit bor

[neut]

lol Mocchi! Lies! I know what you have! :)

[carayan]

daaaaaaamn, I'm thinking about, a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend has a semi completed K24 set up, but doesn't want to put the work, I'll talk to him, see if he wants to swap for my b18 lol

[MassiEk4]

Since you already have the b18 might as well put it to use. If it has good compression/is in good condition, rebuild the head only; cams, valve springs, Ti retainers, mild port and polish, B16a transmission, Helical LSD with 4.7 FD and tune for max torque numbers and enjoy :D

[Vvvtec]

Too much much effort for something that will get walked by a stock Kseries motor ^^

[carayan]

Since you already have the b18 might as well put it to use. If it has good compression/is in good condition, rebuild the head only; cams, valve springs, Ti retainers, mild port and polish, B16a transmission, Helical LSD with 4.7 FD and tune for max torque numbers and enjoy :D


Too much much effort for something that will get walked by a stock Kseries motor ^^

It's a tough choice..but I don't want to go k20 cause that's just plain exxy. The only problem I have is after talking to some people, they reckon the k24 isn't as reliable. They said the timing chain messes up over time and the oil pump dies, causing everything to just spin out and die. Is this true?

[Vvvtec]

No.

Kswap is expensive though, youre correct there.

[tripleuse]

they reckon the k24 isn't as reliable. They said the timing chain messes up over time and the oil pump dies, causing everything to just spin out and die. Is this true?
the k24s are reliable. And even if something was to happen. Just buy another one. They're quite cheap.

[Benson]

People are uneducated and listen and read the wrong thing on the internet. Talk to people who have "REAL" experience and it will open your eyes to alot of things

[carayan]

No.

Kswap is expensive though, youre correct there.


the k24s are reliable. And even if something was to happen. Just buy another one. They're quite cheap.


People are uneducated and listen and read the wrong thing on the internet. Talk to people who have "REAL" experience and it will open your eyes to alot of things

yeah exactly, this from what I've heard, and I don't want to make my decisions based on hear say, I want to hear it from people who have it done and have real world experience, hence why I asked first if it was true before completely writing off the k24.

[Vvvtec]

K24 = monster

lol

[EKVTIR-T]

h22 turbo and eat k series

[Vvvtec]

True dat

[neut]

Of course..cos its turbo..duh lol...
K24 turbo and eat h22 loll

[EKVTIR-T]

Of course..cos its turbo..duh lol...
K24 turbo and eat h22 loll
k series has the advantage of gearboxes

so b and h need some extra help

[carayan]

k series has the advantage of gearboxes

so b and h need some extra help

What's the advantage?

[Benson]

Going back to the OP question, H2B is my pick

[dougie_504]

What's the advantage?

DC5R and DC5S have 6-speed trannies with short gear ratios.

B-series boxes are 5-speed only, so the gears are longer and accelerate slower.


Hence the advantage of modern technology/newer trannies.

[carayan]

Going back to the OP question, H2B is my pick


DC5R and DC5S have 6-speed trannies with short gear ratios.

B-series boxes are 5-speed only, so the gears are longer and accelerate slower.


Hence the advantage of modern technology/newer trannies.

No worries benson, I'm actually glad someone opened my eyes to a K24 and all that.

And as to the shorter ratios, isn't that the point of doing the h2b hybrid? The B series boxes would be shorter geared than the H series, no?

[curtis265]

No worries benson, I'm actually glad someone opened my eyes to a K24 and all that.

And as to the shorter ratios, isn't that the point of doing the h2b hybrid? The B series boxes would be shorter geared than the H series, no?
it is, but the k series boxes go shorter :)

[stndrd]

The main reason why people went for the H2B set up was that the B series has a wider and more comprehensive range of aftermarket gear sets available over the H series

[fatboyz39]

Shorter ratio's helps engine with no power to get going. With h22a/K24 you actually need longer gears to ultilize the torque. H2B was design to fix the hideous driveshaft angles in Honda swapped cars not to mention the added benefits of having the engine tilted forward and OEM ITR LSD + gear ratios.

[curtis265]

I wouldn't say need, i'd say 'can get away with'

[shepparton]

Of course..cos its turbo..duh lol...
K24 turbo and eat h22 loll

both will eat your integra type R more than sure

[carayan]

lol

well as the light has been shown to me. im going k24 long term. the b18 ill pop in for shits and gigs but otherwise im not going to touch it.

[Vvvtec]

Excellent choice :)

[carayan]

Excellent choice :)

Your teggy pretty much decided it for me haha. Inspirational stuff.

[MrFijiGold]

This thread has re-ignited my original plans for my EK.
R33 is now for sale and hopefully that will fund my EK project :)

[carayan]

This thread has re-ignited my original plans for my EK.
R33 is now for sale and hopefully that will fund my EK project :)

Haahah I'm glad! I'm still incredibly indecisive over my long term plans :(

[tripleuse]

lol

well as the light has been shown to me. im going k24 long term. the b18 ill pop in for shits and gigs but otherwise im not going to touch it.

waste of money IMO, save and go straight for the k24.

[EKVTIR-T]

or just buy a fast car to begin with

[dougie_504]

Agreed. Don't even waste the time. Sell the B18 if you can and go K24.

6spd will blow your mind compared to the B-series 5spd.

[EKVTIR-T]

I didnt mean a honda lol

[carayan]

waste of money IMO, save and go straight for the k24.


Agreed. Don't even waste the time. Sell the B18 if you can and go K24.

6spd will blow your mind compared to the B-series 5spd.

I'm trying to consider initial costs and final costs. At the moment, i'm looking at almost 2k to get the b18 up and running, and I already have 90% of what I need to finish, all thats left is my wiring and ancillary stuff, but to get a k24? If the end cost can be anywhere thats feasible for a 19 year old to justify then yeah sure I'll do it, I mean long term, I'd love to go k24..

[nate92]

drop the b18c2, have fun with it while on your p's and turbo it when ur off it!

lol thats what im doin,

[shepparton]

no replacement for displacement always win!!

[YeahByuddy]

no replacement for displacement always win!!

why the ford falcon slow in 4 litre compare with b16? not make sense isnt it

[shepparton]

because its ford .. hahah

[stndrd]

why the ford falcon slow in 4 litre compare with b16? not make sense isnt it

Your comment doesnt make alot of sense. You are comparing a 4 door sedan that weighs as much as 2 fat americans with a 4L straight six that is nowhere near as tuned as a b16 in a 1000kg chassis.

In engine tuning terms, there really is no replacement for displacement. Thus why we as Honda enthusiasts will take any motor that has bigger displacement and stick it in our little civic's.

Bigger displacement + lightweight chassis = win

Back to the op, as nate said, stick the b18c2 in your car, have some fun, learn to drive properly out at the track and at some driver training days then go from there when money and license restrictions allow

[tripleuse]

why the ford falcon slow in 4 litre compare with b16? not make sense isnt it

im quoting this for lols.

[carayan]

why the ford falcon slow in 4 litre compare with b16? not make sense isnt it

wat

4char

[amant02]

Hey OP,

I'm in the same situation as you. I have 2 motors sitting my garage atm , D16y4 and B18c7. I'm about to get my license back after 1 year 3 months, which has given me enough time to collect for a project or a s2k. I decided on the em1 as I would not have the balls to trash a s2k on the track. Plus this gives a b16a2 for free if you get what i mean.

Well to your point. I have deiced on the b18c7 swap. Not because of the cost involved or anything. You said you were 19 so your on Greens?? It would be great if i could drive around in a k24 and what not added to motor. Put once pulled over there goes a red sticker for nothing being engineered, then rego cancelled and what not. I have been off the road for too long to through any more hassles.

And the tops is I can build the b18c7 while i cruise around with the b16a2 for now. This is just my view of it. Everyone's life is different.

The way I see it, Quotes which i have got (2 of these business have posted on here) its not cheap.

My plans have changed to build the head of the b18 and just replace whats needed to overhaul the bottom end. After my 2 years off my greens, I'll be selling off the b18 and building a k20/k24 as a daily in the em1, also would be swapping the current b16 to my lil brothers ej6 so he can have some fun driving a slow car before he steps up.

Of course my 1st goal is suspension and handling 1st! Before I even touch the motor(even thou I already ordered head parts for the b18 lol)

[Daveho1]

maby you should spend your money on some driver education bud and learn how to drive properly on our roads.

i know many people disagree with me on this but i think that its best to upgrade parts as you reach the cars limit. i know that i personaly cant get 100% from the b18c2 in my eg so im not building the head yet, however money spent on mods like decent suspension that makes the car more predictable is money spent well.

a k24 or even k20 is a good option for alot of people out there (and here) but its alot of work and money to put in if you just wanna take your mates round the block and show off but i guess if you wanna be a that guy then its your money aye.

OP- Rok the fuk on kun7

[Daveho1]

Your comment doesnt make alot of sense. You are comparing a 4 door sedan that weighs as much as 2 fat americans with a 4L straight six that is nowhere near as tuned as a b16 in a 1000kg chassis.

In engine tuning terms, there really is no replacement for displacement. Thus why we as Honda enthusiasts will take any motor that has bigger displacement and stick it in our little civic's.

Bigger displacement + lightweight chassis = win

Back to the op, as nate said, stick the b18c2 in your car, have some fun, learn to drive properly out at the track and at some driver training days then go from there when money and license restrictions allow

but Mfactory promised to be good replacment, waddafuk

[tripleuse]

Well to your point. I have deiced on the b18c7 swap. Not because of the cost involved or anything. You said you were 19 so your on Greens?? It would be great if i could drive around in a k24 and what not added to motor. Put once pulled over there goes a red sticker for nothing being engineered, then rego cancelled and what not. I have been off the road for too long to through any more hassles.

not true, keep it looking stock and you will have no dramas.

[carayan]

not true, keep it looking stock and you will have no dramas.

for example, my valve cover is bright red, no thanks.

gonna stick with the c2 for a bit i guess..

[amant02]

maby you should spend your money on some driver education bud and learn how to drive properly on our roads.

i know many people disagree with me on this but i think that its best to upgrade parts as you reach the cars limit. i know that i personaly cant get 100% from the b18c2 in my eg so im not building the head yet, however money spent on mods like decent suspension that makes the car more predictable is money spent well.

a k24 or even k20 is a good option for alot of people out there (and here) but its alot of work and money to put in if you just wanna take your mates round the block and show off but i guess if you wanna be a that guy then its your money aye.

OP- Rok the fuk on kun7

Mate I got taken off the road for driving on a suspended license.

To lose my license I drove my dads car to woolies left in a rush cos mum was waiting in the rain, which is a manual and not displaying P plate were the offenses.

I dont see why I need driver education?(even thou for court i attended these driver courses lol didnt work, she still treathen to send me to the slammer)