Hondata + wideband

[grifty]

Just wondering if purchasing a wideband is absolutely necessary with a S300? Or am I able to just run the stock O2 sensor?

Cheers

[DakDak]

Should work with a stock o2 sensor. Isnt a wideband just to monitor AFRs?

[Daveho1]

nope runs fine on a stock o2 however the wideband puts an exact number on the AFR which is excellent when tuning, much more accurate then the tail pipe sniffers

[ECU-MAN]

tail pipe sniffers are widebands

[Daveho1]

they are but there position at the end of the exhaust isnt ideal for tuning. the few tuners i hve spoken to agree that a wideband o2 is better when its much closer to the engine (pre-cat, near the stoc o2 )

[ECU-MAN]

so very ture

[Sexc86]

Be careful when choosing / purchasing a wide-band - specifically in regards to what O2 sensor the package uses. Different sensor types have different life cycles, accuracy's and possible common problems etc

Most mainstream cheaper Wide-band packages utilise the Bosch Lsu 4.2 series sensor which can be prone to having their accuracy compromised (value drift). This is usually from the O2 sensors being poisoned from high heat and no maintenance (they can be proven to last with regular alcohol cleaning and zeroing to atmosphere).

More to the point, when selecting a wide-band - do research on the sensor type and and common problems that the sensor maybe prone to. Im pretty sure the Bosch Lsu 4.9 is quite a good reliable sensor (not prone to heat decay or zero shift)

[grifty]

I was thinking of purchasing the AEM 30-4100 UEGO wideband, ill do some research about it.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/AEM-30-4100-DIGITAL-WIDEBAND-UEGO-CONTROLLER-AIR-FUEL-RATIO-FULL-WARRANTY-/360538007974?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53f1bd69a6&_uhb=1

or what about just using the wideband for tuning only then replace it with a stock unit?

[Daveho1]

from what i have seen these units.are good value for money and i love the interface plus install is a breeze. verry goos bit of kit imho

[Chernoby1]

I was thinking of purchasing the AEM 30-4100 UEGO wideband, ill do some research about it.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/AEM-30-4100-DIGITAL-WIDEBAND-UEGO-CONTROLLER-AIR-FUEL-RATIO-FULL-WARRANTY-/360538007974?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53f1bd69a6&_uhb=1

or what about just using the wideband for tuning only then replace it with a stock unit?

Back in the day that was how it was done most of the time. Tune it on a dyno relying on the WB and then revert to using a NB for safety only and not closed loop fuel control.

http://wbo2.com/2j/default.htm < 2j9 unit comes with the lsu 4.9 ;)

[Sexc86]

very nice ^ :)

[grifty]

alright so i can just purchase the sensor only, no need for the gauge + connectors right? I can wire it up myself

[Chr1s]

If you will be doing any tuning yourself, get one, otherwise you don't need it. WBO2 sensor's have a finite life and the heating control unit that powers them can affect this, some are better than others. As Sexc86 said, the Bosch 4.9 is a good sensor.

[Adrian @ SAS]

You'll need to buy a kit with the guage/wide band controller as the S300 can't control the wide band.
Then connect the 0-5v output from the guage to D14 (ECU)
Enter the software & configure per instructions supplied with guage/wide band controller (As comes with the AEM product you mentioned)
Ie: 0v = 0.xx lambda / 5v = 1.xx lambda etc

[cbauto]

So much knowledge from the above 2 members.

[Chernoby1]

Can the s300 do digital input for the wideband signal? If it can, much better going down that route than using 0-5v analog. Thought its not very common, ive seen solid levels of EMI in some cars that send things out of whack (imagine like +-0.1v of noise... if the controller output is linear between 0.5-4.5v your looking at 5% inaccuracy simply due to EMI).

If you do go down the analog route and the s300 has some flexibility, try to avoid setting 0v/5v as any reading. Rather set it up so that if it hits either of those two so the CEL comes on. if it ever hits 0v/5v you know somethings gone wrong with either the sensor or wiring ;) (nothing to do with the wideband really, but rather any analog sensor system.. try to avoid using power source voltage or ground as a valid measurement)

[Adrian @ SAS]

Only S300 V2 & only with digital output capable controller.
FWIW most engine management sensors run on a 0-5v analog system.
When wired correctly, there is generally no issue & why shielded wiring should be used (analog or not)

[Chernoby1]

Ive never had issues inside the engine bay, but have with cables running past electric motors (I had a huge "nu duh" moment when wiring up a hybrid....not the powertrain motor but the interior electric fan!)

[Chr1s]

To be completely fair with the whole "inaccuracy" issue - the wideband is simply a tuning tool, it's not a 100% figure you can hold to the wall, a high end exhaust gas analyser (a WB02 is essentially this) will give you a more accurate figure. Depending where you place the sensor in the exhaust will change the value slightly and if the controller has been calibrated to the sensor properly (Bosch print the calibration numbers on the sensor housing) - I think some units don't allow for "self calibration", they just go off the numbers printed on the housing - it's fine until you get towards the end of it's life. I've never seen a highly erratic WB02 plot, with 5% error and a known base of 14.7, the value would be fluctuating +/- 0.735 which for idle would be quite strange for a typical engine/placement.

Anyway, you use these to work in delta not to aim for a specific absolute value to the nearest decimal place.

[infurNOS]

Most dyno's have wideband already for you. I believe they stick a device in your exhaust pipe? Best to have a discussion with your tuner.

[Chernoby1]

I used the wrong word again!

By inaccurate, I meant the problem of noise/jitter... without some form of filtering makes closed loop control very difficult. If they're not looking into doing closed loop (for whatever reason), most of my input us irrelevant.

Im just a computer systems guy and who doesnt like analog in general... mainly because I work on prototype stuff near exclusively; so take my words as those of the guy who hates designs that are difficult to troubleshoot when they dont work... and troubleshooting software/digital signals is wayyyyy easier imo

[Super-DA9]

I have an AEM UEGO setup. While it was hooked up by itself it was sweet. But for some reason once it was hooked up to the ECU the gauge fluctuates a lot, especially when cruising.

However the signal the S300 was getting from it was fine, so it must be something with the gauge.

[Adrian @ SAS]

Nothing wrong with the guage, just means the closed loop function in ECU is working properly

[Super-DA9]

Nothing wrong with the guage, just means the closed loop function in ECU is working properly

Oh really??

I thought we couldn't figure it out LOL. Shows how good my memory is...

Is there a way to have it read accurately with closed loop active?

[Chernoby1]

Adrian is saying, well i think he is saying at any rate, that it is reading accurately. The ecu is reading the data, adjusting the fueling and therefore you have a different AFR right afterwards.

Is the tune set up with a target AFR and the ecu compensates based on current AFR? (usual sort of wideband setup).

Also we might want to clarify what you mean by reading accurately. do you mean you expect the figure to be more stable? If so, what sort if range is it going up/down? +-0.05 Lambda?