Engine stalled straight away after started, help ??

[subie]

guys,

engine D16Y4, manual, and I have this problem for the last couple of days,

first thing in the morning and after work (when engine very cold), it started but stalled straight away, started, stalled, started, stalled for like 3-4 times then, finally started and fine.

fuel pump seem to be ok as I can hear it primes

what could be the problem?

Thanks in advance

[peetah]

Ignition switch, main relay, ICM is what I'd put my money on.

[subie]

where is main relay? and what is ICM? where can I get those parts from? have to be genuine Honda or can I get after market from my local auto stores?
Cheers

[charliebrown]

+1 for main relay and ICM. Common problems on the older civics, i had the same start/stall thing you're describing

Try the main relay first, its near the hood popper (next to right knee). Unscrew it and open it up with a screwdriver, then solder up all the connections and put it back in.

After this, best bet is to find someone with same engine as you and test swap the dizzy or buy a 2nd hand dizzy as ICM's are farkin expensive

Can be tedious if the problem only happens sometimes

[peetah]

ICM lives inside the dizzy.

Main relay is fuel pump related so might not be that since you mentioned you can hear it prime but easy fix to a common issue - reflow solder in the joints. There's heaps of good diys but I'm on the phone so a bit hard to look up ATM.

For ignition switch when you started it up was it like this video?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKjYuhNOtGs&feature=youtube_gdata_player
If so when you turn the key all the way hold it a bit just before when it starts to crank. If it stays on when you hold it its probably the ignition switch.

[subie]

thanks for all the info guys, much appreciates

I don't think its ignition switch tho as it started but stalled straight away unlike the video you posted

forgot to mention, once it finally started, I can turn ignition off and it starts perfectly fine

so, to change Ignition Control Module, I need new distributor cap right?

Cheers

[peetah]

ICM Guide - http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?127058-DIY-Ignition-Control-Module-(ICM)-Replacement.-Lots-of-Pics!

My issue turned out to be ignition switch so I'm a bit biased towards that. The video shows one particular day which is wouldn't even stay on but on other days it started and stayed on for a bit before stalling, others I could drive down the road and it would cut out randomly. Do all the lights go out on the dash but the radio etc stay on when it "stalls"? This is another symptom of a bad ignition switch.
Ignition Switch Guide - http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=2770383 http://techauto.awardspace.com/ignitionswitch.html


If you start the car and the radio dosn't turn on, then wiggle the key and it turns on.
Most often, the dash will go dark when the car stalls (no warning lights, no shift indicator, no electrical, except the horns.)
The speedometer and tachometer drop momentarily and come back up.
Car runs fine when key slightly held at start position.
Car stalls then can be restart, then stalls after driving or idling.
Once started the the car starts for a second and dies after letting off the key.
In some cases, the ignition key is warmer than normal and the electrical switch is hot.
On rare cases, all of the gauges go dark when in the ON position but if held between the on and start position they light up.
On rare cases, if held between the on and start position the system check bulbs light up on the instrument panel.
On severe cases, when the key turns to ON the usual clicks under the dash is not heard as well as the check system light but the horns work okay.
In severe cases when the key turns to START nothing happens (no electrical) but the horns or brake lights work okay.
How to confirm: When white and black/yellow wire on the ignition switch is shorted the car starts and run fine using the key. Doing this bypasses the electrical switch. (Do not attempt if you're not certain what this means.) See basic troubleshoot for a far safer method.




Personally I wouldn't start at the ICM as that costs the most to fix. Start with the Main Relay since it's the easiest fix - all you need to to borrow an soldering iron and some solder.
Main Relay Guide - http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?31796-DIY-Main-PGMFI-Relay-repair

[sebtoombs]

Sounds much more like IACV to me. You said after a few goes it started an ran properly? If the IACV is (for example) closed and disconnected this will cause the engine to stall when cold.

quick check would be: start it and quickly try applying throttle. if you can rev it past idle and keep it up without it stalling, this could be a likely cause.

[subie]

@peetah, Thanks heaps. I'm pretty sure mine is not the ignition switch. none of those symptoms ever happened

I will start with Main Relay first and will look into ICM later. by the way, if anyone know if we can get brand new Main Relay? where?

@sebtoombs, thanks for your input mate, I'll try a quick check tomorrow morning

Cheers

[subie]

Also, I went to local Burson today and got a couple of part numbers for D16Y4 ICM, it's Tridon brand

- TIM091
- TIM084

both have the same OE reference number of E12-303 but TIM091 is non heat sink

can anyone confirm if this is the right part for my car?

[grifty]

Solder up the main relay and see how you go.

Do this first before u send any money

[sebtoombs]

If the ICM is gone, its most likely that the engine either will not start at all, or will start, but will not consistently keep firing. I.e. it could die at any moment even with throttle applied, when warm, when cold, any time at all.

Its usually expensive to replace, so I wouldn't do that unless you can reliably rule out other possible causes.

Without actually being there, I'd say IACV or Main Relay.

If the engine fires up fine, revs jump to say 1000 or 1100 or whatever startup is, and then slowly drop to stall, I'd put my money on IACV. If the engine struggles to start or starts and then dies suddenly, its probably the main relay.

[subie]

Solder up the main relay and see how you go.

Do this first before u send any money
will do mate but I have no clue how to soldering tho


If the ICM is gone, its most likely that the engine either will not start at all, or will start, but will not consistently keep firing. I.e. it could die at any moment even with throttle applied, when warm, when cold, any time at all.

Its usually expensive to replace, so I wouldn't do that unless you can reliably rule out other possible causes.

Without actually being there, I'd say IACV or Main Relay.

If the engine fires up fine, revs jump to say 1000 or 1100 or whatever startup is, and then slowly drop to stall, I'd put my money on IACV. If the engine struggles to start or starts and then dies suddenly, its probably the main relay.

according to you information, it's not an ICM nor IACV. sounds like a main relay 99% sure. but it didn't happened everyday tho, like last couple of days it seem to be fine, started first time everytime and didn't stalled

will see if I can find someone to pull the main relay out to look at it :)

Note: anyone on central coast willing to help ???

[grifty]

You don't have a mate that can solder?

Worst case take it to a electronics repair store of some sort, they shouldn't charge more than $20.

[sebtoombs]

I can reflow the solder on the board, but you'd have to post it. There should be someone near you who can do it, its really easy.

[subie]

I'll ask around :) Thanks for all the inputs guys :)

much appreciated