1st gear selection on Euro

[yfin]

For a long time now - and only from time to time (say every few weeks) I find that my Euro will not engage first gear easily (manual). I need to shift into second and then back to first.

I haven't been able to work out whether it only happens when the gearbox is cold - it is just too intermittent and I do lots of short trips under 10kms. At my last service Honda couldn't find any issue and just bled some of the transmission oil. My dad (retired mechanic) reckons Honda should replace the transmission fluid (will do that at my next service).

Anyone have this problem or ideas? With all this talk of clutch/master cylinder problems I am being a little paranoid.

[aaronng]

Has your master cylinder ever been changed?
I found that it took me 2 goes to get into 1st when I was driving. For example, I would slow down to go over a huge speed bump, and would need 1st gear, but it would not go in at all. If I did a double clutch, it would go in, but normal shifting wouldn't.

AFTER I changed my master cylinder because of the creaking, and driving for about 1 month, I noticed that I could get into 1st gear, even when moving at 20-30km/h!

[yfin]

Has your master cylinder ever been changed?
I found that it took me 2 goes to get into 1st when I was driving. For example, I would slow down to go over a huge speed bump, and would need 1st gear, but it would not go in at all. If I did a double clutch, it would go in, but normal shifting wouldn't.

AFTER I changed my master cylinder because of the creaking, and driving for about 1 month, I noticed that I could get into 1st gear, even when moving at 20-30km/h!

No - never been changed. Everything in the clutch feels fine - no creaking. There was a very quiet clutch squeak when the car was about 1000kms but that went away quickly - car is now at 22k.

If you are moving I wouldn't expect to be able to select 1st gear at anything more than 5 or 10 kph (unless of course you rev match). In 99.9% of driving I select second gear for speed bumps, etc - unless I come to a complete stop.

That is weird that you can now select 1st gear at 30kph - I presume that is without rev matching?

[PNR888]

Has your master cylinder ever been changed?
I found that it took me 2 goes to get into 1st when I was driving. For example, I would slow down to go over a huge speed bump, and would need 1st gear, but it would not go in at all. If I did a double clutch, it would go in, but normal shifting wouldn't.



Well, I think it is a safety feature that stops people engaging into 1st gear before the car has come almost to completely stop (or the speed low enough to prevent over rev).

I found double clutch helps, but probably by the time you depress clutch twice, the speed already low enough for safe engagement into 1st gear. I dont know?

[aaronng]

I'll break down my situation.
Before master cylinder change:
Could not go into 1st. Felt like it had a lockout. If I rev-matched, it still wouldn't go in. If I double clutched (and rev matched) then it would go in fine.

After master cylinder change:
I can go in without rev matching, but there will be a slight thump through the car body when it goes in. You can feel it, but it doesn't not affect the car speed. I am guessing this is the transmission shock from the revs not matching(and hence it would be a good idea to rev match).
When rev matching, everything is as smooth as silk.

[aaronng]

Well, I think it is a safety feature that stops people engaging into 1st gear before the car has come almost to completely stop (or the speed low enough to prevent over rev).

I found double clutch helps, but probably by the time you depress clutch twice, the speed already low enough for safe engagement into 1st gear. I dont know?
After double clutching, I am still about 20km/h, and it goes in. If just going into 1st or rev matching into 1st, it doesn't go in the first time, even at only 5km/h (which is too low for 2nd gear!). I remember I couldn't get it into 1st, and had to go 2nd, and ended up lugging the engine to keep the car moving.... my poor baby!

[yfin]

I am more talking about a situation when I am stationery - sometimes gearbox will not select 1st.

Aarong I think you are talking about selecting 1st whilst moving which I am not worried about.

[aaronng]

I am more talking about a situation when I am stationery - sometimes gearbox will not select 1st.

Aarong I think you are talking about selecting 1st whilst moving which I am not worried about.
Yeah, you're right. If the engine is off, do you get the same problem getting into 1st?

I've heard of this problem in Integra Type R 6MTs. Something about a worn synchro I think. I'll check now and look for that forum thread. It was a US or UK site I think.

[yfin]

Yeah, you're right. If the engine is off, do you get the same problem getting into 1st?

I've heard of this problem in Integra Type R 6MTs. Something about a worn synchro I think. I'll check now and look for that forum thread. It was a US or UK site I think.

Not sure if it happens when engine off. I don't think it is a worn synchro as this has happened since the car had less than 5000kms. It is also intermittent. My mechanic dad assures me a fresh transmission oil change will do the trick. Just wondering if anyone else has noticed this?

[aaronng]

Dammit, hondaforums.co.uk is down. With your problem, can you get the dealer to do an oil change? (under warranty of course ;)) But I reckon that with the dealers, if you can't reproduce it in their face, they won't want to have anything to do with it.

[yfin]

Dammit, hondaforums.co.uk is down. With your problem, can you get the dealer to do an oil change? (under warranty of course ;)) But I reckon that with the dealers, if you can't reproduce it in their face, they won't want to have anything to do with it.

I am confident they will change gearbox oil free of charge - is not a big deal and their suggested solution last time did not work.

[Pum[Z]]

Yfin u might as well try to change the transmission oil on ur next service.. Since Honda cannot rectify the problem u might as well try different options to tackle the prb. If changing the transmission oil don't work then maybe try to put in a comptech short shifter :D

It will probably make ur gear changes faster...

[coladuna]

I've had a few occassions where I was standing stationary at the traffic light and when I tried to shift into 1st gear, it would sort of get stuck mid-way.

I'd then have to shift into 2nd and then try again.
This happened even when the car was pretty much brand new.

[yfin]

That is exactly it.

[aaronng]

Damn... I haven't had this kind of problem (touch wood). Hope you can find a way to fix it.

[baboo]

I have this thing too, only happens occasionally. when going into 1st or reverse.

But I don't think it's a problem as it may be just not engaging properly, ie. tooth of the gear meets the tooth not slots, if you know what I mean.

I usually just rev a bit in neutral and can successfully select 1st again.

[yfin]

Bringing this thread back to life - has anyone else experienced this? It is a situation when you are stationery and the gearbox will not select first gear unless you clutch in and out again or select 3rd then 1st (or another gear).

Pretty much had this since new (now at 30,000kms). Dealer replaced manual transmission oil at 20,000kms - didn't do anything. Dealer says coudn't find any problem.

This seems to happen quite often (less so if the car is REALLY hot - ie after a 45 minute drive). I have found that if I hold the clutch down for a long time (eg between traffic lights) - it will select 1st easily. I hate doing that though as it wears out the clutch.

Any ideas? I think it must be syncro related - as if I hold the clutch down for more than 2 or 3 seconds it will engage 1st. Quite anoying as I like to sit in netural at traffic lights and then engage 1st when the lights change.

[yfin]

I usually just rev a bit in neutral and can successfully select 1st again.

Thanks baboo - I tried this earlier and it works!

[albii]

no probs at all with mine and i got 13000km

[VirIIx]

i've experienced that quite alot, as i do also sit in neutral.

I just avoid first gear nowadays unless i'm taking off, but it's hard sometimes in traffic.

But giving it a bit of a small rev and shifting works a charm. I know with older cars you do that sometimes.

[stephen8512]

Bringing this thread back to life - has anyone else experienced this? It is a situation when you are stationery and the gearbox will not select first gear unless you clutch in and out again or select 3rd then 1st (or another gear).

Pretty much had this since new (now at 30,000kms). Dealer replaced manual transmission oil at 20,000kms - didn't do anything. Dealer says coudn't find any problem.

This seems to happen quite often (less so if the car is REALLY hot - ie after a 45 minute drive). I have found that if I hold the clutch down for a long time (eg between traffic lights) - it will select 1st easily. I hate doing that though as it wears out the clutch.

Any ideas? I think it must be syncro related - as if I hold the clutch down for more than 2 or 3 seconds it will engage 1st. Quite anoying as I like to sit in netural at traffic lights and then engage 1st when the lights change.


yeah yfin ive noticed this as well
ive had it ever since i got my car as well.......gets annoying at times.....sometimes, it would go into the 1st position, but not "click" all the way in if u know what i mean.....
like, when u select 1st gear from say, neutral, it would go towards the 1st gear position, but would get stuck in the middle somehow and u'll have to put it back to neutral THEN try again and only THEN will it pop right into 1st.....
annoying as hell but gotten used to it

[Usual Suspect]

its a common thing in manual gearboxes, baboo is spot on.

THere is a thread about this in another section of OH, about manual gearboxes not engaging first and reverse, put into a nother gear or rev a lil bit in neutral.

[EuroAccord13]

Was talking to euro77 about this problem I have earlier today... I think I'll change the tranny oil and see what happens...

Sometimes when I can't engage 1st from stationary, I de-clutch and clutch again or go to second then first....

[Suntzu]

Does anyone get a slight rattle from the box under load when downshifting? Mines only done 1800km and does this. weird

[yfin]

Was talking to euro77 about this problem I have earlier today... I think I'll change the tranny oil and see what happens...

Sometimes when I can't engage 1st from stationary, I de-clutch and clutch again or go to second then first....

I didn't know you experience this Nick. I used to just pick a different gear (eg 2nd and then shift back to 1st). A little rev baboo suggested works and is a little easier.

I wonder whether changing the tranny oil to a different brand might work - eg Motul. When my dealer changed the oil they probably just used the OEM honda stuff and that definately didn't work.

[yfin]

yeah yfin ive noticed this as well
ive had it ever since i got my car as well.......gets annoying at times.....sometimes, it would go into the 1st position, but not "click" all the way in if u know what i mean.....
like, when u select 1st gear from say, neutral, it would go towards the 1st gear position, but would get stuck in the middle somehow and u'll have to put it back to neutral THEN try again and only THEN will it pop right into 1st.....
annoying as hell but gotten used to it

You are describing it exactly right.

[EuroAccord13]

yfin;

The problem only occured recently... I'll give my tranny oil a change and see what happens.. As and when I get time to do it now that school's started again :(...

[aaronng]

Does anyone get a slight rattle from the box under load when downshifting? Mines only done 1800km and does this. weird
Are you sure it is not your goodies in your CD holder that are vibrating?

[Suntzu]

Nope. Its definately the gear train. I hope it ok, my mitsuibishi had gbox problems from new also. I get back luck I guess. Ive been babying the car also.