Coil overs vs Koni yellows and King spring

[Astrodice]

Hey all, On my ek4 sedan, I've been running king spring lows and stock shocks for about 6 years +. I'm biting the bullet and looking at either coliovers or just installing Koni yellows to mate with the springs.

From the outset I've done many a hour researching coilovers and reading reviews etc. Whilst I know many on here prefer coilovers I've done some research on them from local stores in Melb and summarised as follows:


A local tyrepower owner who i know, tell me that coilovers are not worth getting as they are too hard and bone jarring ride on a street car. He said that every time they were adjusted you'd have to do a wheel alignment on them. He suggested I should just buy Koni yellows with a cost of $1150.

A specialist suspension place suggested going BC BR coilovers for $1800 installed or just the Koni yellow for $1100

Another specialist suspension place tells me that they don't stock coilovers and just go the Koni yellows for $1150

A performance place here in Melbourne offer to install BC BR coilovers for $1600 or install XYZ branded coilovers for around $1500.

So question is what is the general consensus for just street driving do I go coilovers in particular BC BR or stick with the Koni yellow / King Spring combo, on a budget of $1500 - $1800 installed ?

Thanks
Astro.

[chargeR]

Whoever is quoting you $1150 for the Koni yellows is not your friend. You can get them for around $650 shipped from eBay, for example: LINK (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Koni-Yellow-Sport-Shocks-Set-96-00-Honda-Civic-EK-/200927033747?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2ec82f3993&vxp=mtr) and you could buy all the tools needed to install them, buy a few slabs of beer for mates to help you and still come out ahead of that 1150 price.

If you're happy with the ride height and comfort of the king springs, then there's no reason not to go for the koni shocks to match with them. Just changing the shocks should give you a noticeable difference in cornering feel, as the Koni's will have a lot more rebound damping in particular when compared to your stock shocks. I'd expect ride comfort to improve a bit too. It also gives you the option of upgrading to a set of GC coilover sleeves down the track if you want different ride height or higher spring rates for a pretty moderate cost (approx. $400).

[bennjamin]

OP


are you considering actual track work ? Or what 99% of people do - hoon around and want your car low ?

Just get the cheaper end of the fully adjustable coilover range that you can afford. Make sure its damper adjustable (bound / rebound or both) and dual perch adjustable.
This will give exactly what you are after.

Try ebay , or pm a trader on this forum such as STNDRD (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/member.php?22313-stndrd) who is in melbourne and can help you out


Koni yellows are sports dampers with only 2-3 perches of height adjust-ability.While they are great shocks , you will not be able to properly set them up and you wont be happy with the ride height mis-match front and rear.

[Astrodice]

Thanks for the advice guys.

I don't plan to track it at all, just a daily ride. I've noticed on Honda-tech it is all recommended to go the GC coilover sleeves with the Koni's. Is there anyone here on this forum running this config? In all honesty I don't mind the height of the car as it is now with the king lows, though I am sure I will notice the difference if I went the Koni's as ChargeR said.
Bennjamin, have you come across these in your workshop ie. Koni's and GC's? What is your most common setup, if there such thing as a standard setup?

I will also hit up STNDRD and pick his brain on it as well. He is a busy man to get hold of ;-)

[bennjamin]

IMO


Get BC racing , buddyclub etc. In your position Id go straight for the coilovers as suggested - just easier to install and setup - and better resale value too.


Here - Ive done a quick ebay search top help you out (http://www.ebay.com.au/bhp/ek-civic-coilovers)



If you are interested in the koni / GC combo here are some links
koni yellows for EK (http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xkoni+ yellow+ek&_nkw=koni+yellow+ek&_sacat=0&_from=R40)
ground control for all 92-00 civics including EKs (http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_odkw=ground+control&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xground+contr ol+civic&_nkw=ground+control+civic&_sacat=0)




Thanks for the advice guys.

I don't plan to track it at all, just a daily ride. I've noticed on Honda-tech it is all recommended to go the GC coilover sleeves with the Koni's. Is there anyone here on this forum running this config? In all honesty I don't mind the height of the car as it is now with the king lows, though I am sure I will notice the difference if I went the Koni's as ChargeR said.
Bennjamin, have you come across these in your workshop ie. Koni's and GC's? What is your most common setup, if there such thing as a standard setup?

I will also hit up STNDRD and pick his brain on it as well. He is a busy man to get hold of ;-)

[DreadAngel]

Whilst I know many on here prefer coilovers...

Not really, there are two camps on OH ;) Though this is highly dependent on application...

On this forum there are many running the Koni Yellow + GC Sleeves and most have been happy. Those unhappy usually have pushed the setup beyond its specs.

Anyway as Bennjamin said, Coilovers in general are 'easier' as you don't have to match the shocks and springs to each other. However as you may also have noticed coilovers especially the lower end ones tend to be harsh and compromised by being underdampened/undervalved and/or running stiff springs..

So this comes down to your application, personal preference and tolerance. If possible have a ride in EKs with the setups you're considering while taking into account their settings + specs. You can then decide what you want to go with. There are quite a few threads here with the info you need ;)

[Astrodice]

Thanks again guys for the advice :)

[Rudy]

Koni + Ground control is a great setup and only slightly more expensive than the chinese coilovers

[Honda_FD]

Hey all, On my ek4 sedan, I've been running king spring lows and stock shocks for about 6 years +. I'm biting the bullet and looking at either coliovers or just installing Koni yellows to mate with the springs.

From the outset I've done many a hour researching coilovers and reading reviews etc. Whilst I know many on here prefer coilovers I've done some research on them from local stores in Melb and summarised as follows:


A local tyrepower owner who i know, tell me that coilovers are not worth getting as they are too hard and bone jarring ride on a street car. He said that every time they were adjusted you'd have to do a wheel alignment on them. He suggested I should just buy Koni yellows with a cost of $1150.

A specialist suspension place suggested going BC BR coilovers for $1800 installed or just the Koni yellow for $1100

Another specialist suspension place tells me that they don't stock coilovers and just go the Koni yellows for $1150

A performance place here in Melbourne offer to install BC BR coilovers for $1600 or install XYZ branded coilovers for around $1500.

So question is what is the general consensus for just street driving do I go coilovers in particular BC BR or stick with the Koni yellow / King Spring combo, on a budget of $1500 - $1800 installed ?

Thanks
Astro.

Coilovers arent necessarily Stiff or "Bone Jarring" Most BC coilovers have a 6:6kg front and rear with Damper Adjustments.
Im running BC BR Gold Series with 10:8 springs and on the Softest settings its not event bad.

Where did you get your quote for your BC Coilovers? $1,800 is HEAPS for BC BR Gold Series.
I got mine for $1,150 with Custom Springs & Camber Top.

Did you ask Suspension City in North Melbourne for Koni Shocks? They've been around for
for than 20 years so talk to them. They may be old but they know their shit.

If you do decide to get coilovers let me know and I'll see if I can get them for you at the same price.


I heard GAB isnt too bad aswell. Brand new
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?174118-(-EK-Civic-)-GAB-SS-coilovers-B18c-BC-cams./page4

[DreadAngel]

Coilovers arent necessarily Stiff or "Bone Jarring" Most BC coilovers have a 6:6kg front and rear with Damper Adjustments.
Im running BC BR Gold Series with 10:8 springs and on the Softest settings its not event bad.

Remember its highly subjective...

And 10:8 is soft for me in an EG/EK/DC2 lolz

[Honda_FD]

Remember its highly subjective...

And 10:8 is soft for me in an EG/EK/DC2 lolz

lol yeah. All comes down to personal preferences

[EKVTIR-T]

Depend how fat your ass is for road to butt comfort ratio

[Honda_FD]

Depend how fat your ass is for road to butt comfort ratio

Might need some Kim Kardashian for anything above 16kg

[curtis265]

Coilovers arent necessarily Stiff or "Bone Jarring" Most BC coilovers have a 6:6kg front and rear with Damper Adjustments.
Im running BC BR Gold Series with 10:8 springs and on the Softest settings its not event bad.


that is where people seem to go huh and not enquire any further

damper adjustments between marshmallow and bread? or rock and concrete?


Also don't forget that different cars have different configurations and effective spring rates depending on the suspension design

[Honda_FD]

that is where people seem to go huh and not enquire any further

damper adjustments between marshmallow and bread? or rock and concrete?


Also don't forget that different cars have different configurations and effective spring rates depending on the suspension design

Thats true. But with 6:6 spring rate. Max Damper isnt going to be as stiff and people think it is.
I cant say that it will be soft and what not because my car has had coilovers in them for a while now
so having 10:8 isnt uncomfortable for me cause I'm used to it.

But stock suspension with lowered springs to 6:6 coilovers. I wouldnt say there is alot of different with the cars stiffness

But like I said. comes down to personal preferences

[rhys.l]

Coilovers are useless for street cars. The majority are way oversprung and not only does this massively decrease ride comfort, it also actually decreases the grip of your car in a lot of street situations. With an overly stiff spring your suspension and hence your wheels lose the ability to follow the road surface where it is not racetrack-like flat. People spend thousands on coilovers then run a spring so stiff their fancy damper doesnt even get the opportunity to do anything useful.

I'd go for the Konis with a reasonable spring rate. They will be much better for the street than a cheap poorly damped coilover, even one with a lower than usual spring rate.

[DreadAngel]

that is where people seem to go huh and not enquire any further

damper adjustments between marshmallow and bread? or rock and concrete?

Also don't forget that different cars have different configurations and effective spring rates depending on the suspension design

Dem Feelz, so correct, try a 10:8 in an EG then in an EP/EU XD

You'll be like WTF, concrete up much?


Coilovers are useless for street cars. The majority are way oversprung and not only does this massively decrease ride comfort, it also actually decreases the grip of your car in a lot of street situations. With an overly stiff spring your suspension and hence your wheels lose the ability to follow the road surface where it is not racetrack-like flat. People spend thousands on coilovers then run a spring so stiff their fancy damper doesnt even get the opportunity to do anything useful.

I'd go for the Konis with a reasonable spring rate. They will be much better for the street than a cheap poorly damped coilover, even one with a lower than usual spring rate.

Word

[Chr1s]

I'd just like to clarify something.

The ground control kit is still a very streetable setup, they don't have much provision for running slammed like the other types of coilovers, but they will certainly give you enough adjustment for what you need on the street and track. I ran Koni RACE shocks (shortened) with GC kit and they were by far the best combo I have ever had. I will admit to have them done properly you will more than likely need the top had spherical extenders and helper springs to keep the spring captive at full droop.

This is usually too much trouble for the average guy so my advice is buy the cheapest coilover you can find (while still being a known item - not total junk) and you will be satisfied..

Cheers,

[Astrodice]

Coilovers arent necessarily Stiff or "Bone Jarring" Most BC coilovers have a 6:6kg front and rear with Damper Adjustments.
Im running BC BR Gold Series with 10:8 springs and on the Softest settings its not event bad.

Where did you get your quote for your BC Coilovers? $1,800 is HEAPS for BC BR Gold Series.
I got mine for $1,150 with Custom Springs & Camber Top.

Did you ask Suspension City in North Melbourne for Koni Shocks? They've been around for
for than 20 years so talk to them. They may be old but they know their shit.

If you do decide to get coilovers let me know and I'll see if I can get them for you at the same price.


I heard GAB isnt too bad aswell. Brand new
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?174118-(-EK-Civic-)-GAB-SS-coilovers-B18c-BC-cams./page4

Thanks for the offer Honda_FD.. Damian from Suspension City is very knowledgeable and super friendly. He was the one that put in my original Kings. I spoke to him about a week ago and interestingly does not sell coilovers but will install them. He said he installs quite a few BC's for Tyrepower next door and recommended the Koni's.

The BC's were quoted installed / aligned by Chris at Centreline. Very friendly and knowledgeable as well. Both places were very helpful.

I was talking to some other forumites and they also spoke highly of the AMR coilover. Andy from AMR suggested 6/8 coilovers and a lead time of about 3 weeks for them to be mad for an EK. He quoted $1535 usd for a set of 450/350 custom coilovers. I am leaning towards these at the moment.

Question is though if your a DIY or getting pro's to install them, other than an alignment, is anything else necessary. I did some research and another shop said you would need to do a corner balance as well as an alignment and wait a week or two after installation of coilovers before you get an alignment?

Thanks for the comments guys.

[amant02]

I pretty much got a wheel alignment straight away, after installing my super streets my wheel alignment was way off about 1/2 a turn lol. DIY the Best

[Honda_FD]

Thanks for the offer Honda_FD.. Damian from Suspension City is very knowledgeable and super friendly. He was the one that put in my original Kings. I spoke to him about a week ago and interestingly does not sell coilovers but will install them. He said he installs quite a few BC's for Tyrepower next door and recommended the Koni's.

The BC's were quoted installed / aligned by Chris at Centreline. Very friendly and knowledgeable as well. Both places were very helpful.

I was talking to some other forumites and they also spoke highly of the AMR coilover. Andy from AMR suggested 6/8 coilovers and a lead time of about 3 weeks for them to be mad for an EK. He quoted $1535 usd for a set of 450/350 custom coilovers. I am leaning towards these at the moment.

Question is though if your a DIY or getting pro's to install them, other than an alignment, is anything else necessary. I did some research and another shop said you would need to do a corner balance as well as an alignment and wait a week or two after installation of coilovers before you get an alignment?

Thanks for the comments guys.

Yeah. Suspension City is a well known distributor for Koni, Kings, Eibach and some other brand of shocks. I forgot.
But yes. They are VERY good at their job and very helpful. They installed my coilovers for me once. Quick and easy.

TyrePower North Melbourne sells alot of suspension parts aswell. Ask for Mark when you go in. They distribute BC BR, Megan,
Skunk2 and heaps more.

OR you can try OTR in Clayton. They have ALOT of high performance parts but they're bit of an asshole. They discriminate
and look down on Honda people. But their prices and items are very good.

I've never owned an EK or have done anything to their suspension but im pretty sure its generally the same.
Install them, Doesnt matter who, Set to desired height and you can get an Alignment any time.
You dont necessarily have to wait two weeks. That two week wait is for the coilovers to settle in.
Most coilovers will drop another 3-5mm after they settle in.

But I would say take your time and do research then decide what you want. Dont rush into buying stuff like that and regret it later.
End up wasting $1,000 Do it once, Do it right

[DreadAngel]

I've never owned an EK or have done anything to their suspension but im pretty sure its generally the same.

Install them, Doesnt matter who, Set to desired height and you can get an Alignment any time.
You dont necessarily have to wait two weeks. That two week wait is for the coilovers to settle in.
Most coilovers will drop another 3-5mm after they settle in.

But I would say take your time and do research then decide what you want. Dont rush into buying stuff like that and regret it later.
End up wasting $1,000 Do it once, Do it right

EK very different setup to FD spec wise, Double Wishbone ---> Macpherson. Generally more of a pain to get the Macpherson to a level I found satisfactory without going to a track setup ><

Everything else, spot on ;)

[Honda_FD]

EK very different setup to FD spec wise, Double Wishbone ---> Macpherson. Generally more of a pain to get the Macpherson to a level I found satisfactory without going to a track setup ><

Everything else, spot on ;)

Yeah. Thats why i said that I've never owned or have had any experience with them.
But the Internet is a very helpful tool nowadays.

Just print this out or bring your laptop to the garage and follow the steps
http://www.clubcivic.com/board/showthread.php?t=158121

[DreadAngel]

Yeah. Thats why i said that I've never owned or have had any experience with them.
But the Internet is a very helpful tool nowadays.

Just print this out or bring your laptop to the garage and follow the steps
http://www.clubcivic.com/board/showthread.php?t=158121

Npz man, wasn't @ you ;)

Just helping others looking at thread to know difference between EK and FD Chassis :)

[Renaissance_x]

If you are already happt wuth your sprungs and height just get new shocks... Why spend 1000-1300 on shit coilovers when you like your height and wouldprobably be just as happy spending 600ish on quality shocks.

[Honda_FD]

Npz man, wasn't @ you ;)

Just helping others looking at thread to know difference between EK and FD Chassis :)

:D


If you are already happt wuth your sprungs and height just get new shocks... Why spend 1000-1300 on shit coilovers when you like your height and wouldprobably be just as happy spending 600ish on quality shocks.

^^ True. But he said them Koni Shocks were little over $1,000 Which are the same price as coilovers.
I would say a Spring + Shock combo beats Coilovers BUT since its only a street car.
With coilovers you have that ability to adjust height and stiffness making the car a perfect height down to the last
millimetre where you want the car to sit. So if he changes his rim or bodykit in the future you can make changes to that.

Thats just my opinion anyways.

[curtis265]

koni GC then loll