[Euro] Hondata Update

[Matell]

Today myself and probably a few others of you received an email from James at Hondata regarding the progress of development of Hondata for the Euro's ECU.

As James gave consent to feel free to share this information here it is for all you guys out there who may not have received the original email.





Information Regarding Hondata and the Accord Euro

Final Testing is getting very close; this is just a quick group email to many Accord Euro owners, on my database to update you of the following information for those interested in the test process.

Have a read of the following URL, feel free to share this information to other Euro Owners.

http://www.hondatech.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=210

Regards James

[PNR888]

Very nice to know that it will be available soon.... Matell, will you have one on your Euro?

[Matell]

Very nice to know that it will be available soon.... Matell, will you have one on your Euro?

Yes :p

Removing my ECU to get the serial number on Saturday or Friday after work.

[PNR888]

Do they charge you $350 for a trial kit ??? or trial kit is free plus they give you a couple of lollies as being the sunbject?

[Matell]

No idea at this stage. Awaiting a reply from James.

[stephen8512]

i want my hondata dammiT!

[VirIIx]

do we get discount bulk order rates? :b

[kam]

What is this HonData? some sort of performance upgrade chip ?

[LOC888]

Ive heard the K-Pro works on K24 can anybody verify this?

[Thorn2004]

What is this HonData? some sort of performance upgrade chip ?

I was wonderin the same thing, it's nice for those who don't keep up with all of the tech news to know what you guys are on about ;)

WTF is HonData?

[BLKCRX]

Ive heard the K-Pro works on K24 can anybody verify this?

Yes this is true… other wise known as the k100/kpro will work, if you want to loose your drive by wire... swap over your throttle body to cable driven, not have your dash work what so eva, no air con, and all features of the car lost… including traction control temp control etc other than the engine working... if you call that working ;-) then sure it works…

The new solution is specifically for Euros to maintain all stock features and gain more power ;-)

Regards James

[stephen8512]

Here's a link from TEMPLE OF VTEC that does a review on the TSX with Hondata ECU reflash.
Theres a few things that are upgraded. first, Vtec engagement down to 5000rpm from 6000rpm, and redline from 7200 to 7600rpm. also, theres more lower end torque.

http://www.vtec.net/articles/view-article?article_id=339233

Remember, the K24 motor in the acura is a K24A2. our oz euro's are K24A3 motors and are a little less powerful than the american counterpart.

[LOC888]

Ive heard the K-Pro works on K24 can anybody verify this?

Yes this is true… other wise known as the k100/kpro will work, if you want to loose your drive by wire... swap over your throttle body to cable driven, not have your dash work what so eva, no air con, and all features of the car lost… including traction control temp control etc other than the engine working... if you call that working ;-) then sure it works…

The new solution is specifically for Euros to maintain all stock features and gain more power ;-)

Regards James
Thanks...

[aaronng]

Could someone post up a photo guide on where the ecu is (I know passenger side glovebox, but where? Under or behind the dash?) and how to remove it?

[EuroAccord13]

Could someone post up a photo guide on where the ecu is (I know passenger side glovebox, but where? Under or behind the dash?) and how to remove it?

It's behind the center console. you can access it by removing the side panel (somewhat triangular piece) on the right side of the passenger side footwell...

[VirIIx]

should i have any worries about taking the ecu out? :S

i won't wanna break my car :(

lol

[aaronng]

It's behind the center console. you can access it by removing the side panel (somewhat triangular piece) on the right side of the passenger side footwell...
Cool! I was looking at the wrong place then. I'll have a poke around this evening to see how it's set up. Thanks.

[Matell]

Save yourselves the hassle of removing the ECU to find out the code.

Stop in at your nearest Supercheap and pick up a telescopic inspection mirror. I grabbed one on the way home for $9.99.

http://img148.echo.cx/img148/5787/inspectionmirror7eg.jpg

Use a torch to illuminate the ECU and work the mirror up between the side of the ECU (which faces the front of the car) and the centre tunnel so you can read the numbers off (they'll be backwards obviously) and have a helper write the numbers down for you as you read them out.

Simple painless and done in less than 5mins :)

Oh and I believe the number you'll be looking for is above the barcode. My May 2004 build ECU number is: 37820-RBB-Ö01 (Ö=O for Oz :p )

[VirIIx]

lol.. smart thinking there matell

[euro77]

I'd love to have my car tested but how does it work with VAFC?
Also, I need my car running 7 days a week, so I guess I'll have a miss.

[baboo]

dayyyyynmmm matt, no wonder your an engineer!!

[Matell]

I'd love to have my car tested but how does it work with VAFC?
Also, I need my car running 7 days a week, so I guess I'll have a miss.

No idea about the interaction with VAFC, or time without a car...that's what I keep my Camira registered for! :)

[Matell]

dayyyyynmmm matt, no wonder your an engineer!!

lol. There's always an easier, more efficient, and common sense way to do things.

[albii]

u coming on sunday matt........?

[Matell]

Might do if I can be bothered wasting 4hrs on Saturday washing, polishing, and waxing my car. Poor thing needs a wax, but it's just such hard work!:(

[Slugoid]

I have an auto Euro....is that worthy to be a lab rat??

After June or so I will have to another runabout car, so I am definately interested.

[Matell]

I have an auto Euro....is that worthy to be a lab rat??

After June or so I will have to another runabout car, so I am definately interested.

Give James an email and find out :D

[Matell]

Save yourselves the hassle of removing the ECU to find out the code.

Stop in at your nearest Supercheap and pick up a telescopic inspection mirror. I grabbed one on the way home for $9.99.

http://img148.echo.cx/img148/5787/inspectionmirror7eg.jpg

Use a torch to illuminate the ECU and work the mirror up between the side of the ECU (which faces the front of the car) and the centre tunnel so you can read the numbers off (they'll be backwards obviously) and have a helper write the numbers down for you as you read them out.

Simple painless and done in less than 5mins :)

Oh and I believe the number you'll be looking for is above the barcode. My May 2004 build ECU number is: 37820-RBB-Ö01 (Ö=O for Oz :p )

Just noted the post from Hondata on acura-tsx.com announcing their success at reflashing the Aussie ECU where the ECU code is RBB-Q01, not "RBB-Õ01" which is what I interpreted it to be using this lazy persons method of finding out the ECU number.

I blame it on trying to focus on small font text, reflected and inverted on a piddly little reflecting surface with my eye's at all sorts of strained angles ;) lol

James is going to think me a total jackass with all my correcting emails :o

[blkeuro]

Have been too lazy to check, but can anyone confirm if the code is the same for 05 built models?

[baboo]

05 built models might have different code.

This is going to be great....

who said EURO can't fly....

[Matell]

Have been too lazy to check, but can anyone confirm if the code is the same for 05 built models?

http://tsx.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22990

[aaronng]

In the US, I read that Hondata still hasn't come out with the 05' ECU version of the upgrade.

[blkeuro]

http://tsx.acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22990

Ah - that answers my question. Well Im not too keen to be the 05 ECU guinea pig, so I'll just sit tight and wait. I am keen however, to pay for a fully tested official release .. :D

[MiSloVic]

actually, closer to home, powerchip.com.au has just released a chip for the euro. power claims are 151kw/240Nm. But it cost a cool $1990.

[baboo]

powerchip is crap.

[blkeuro]

actually, closer to home, powerchip.com.au has just released a chip for the euro. power claims are 151kw/240Nm. But it cost a cool $1990.

A dyno will be the way to determine if its worth it.. :thumbsup:

[blkeuro]

If its like the Kpro for the DC5R then it should be around the $1800 mark...hopefully cheaper :)

[yfin]

If its like the Kpro for the DC5R then it should be around the $1800 mark...hopefully cheaper :)

Well it is not like the Kpro - this is a reflash. KPRO includes hardware - this is just a software change.

The reflash should be cheaper than Kpro - in the USA the TSX reflash is $599USD. I would expect us Aussies to pay a little more - say $1000AUD but we need to wait and see and I am just speculating.

[kam]

is it really worth $1000 for just a little bit more power ? (that according to the hondata website isnt really that noticible)

[VirIIx]

1000 is a bit of dosh :S

[yfin]

is it really worth $1000 for just a little bit more power ? (that according to the hondata website isnt really that noticible)

Depends on what you want. People fork out $500 for those silver plastic trims kits in the Euro. Just a few pieces of plastic. The Hondata will be noticeable - don't focus so much on peak power gains - look at the change in the curve - the power arrives sooner and there is much more. For the TSX there is 29hp increase at 6000rpm.

The Euro may also see a bigger gain as it is detuned compared to the TSX - or is that just wishful thinking! Time will tell.

[blkeuro]

The reflash should be cheaper than Kpro - in the USA the TSX reflash is $599USD. I would expect us Aussies to pay a little more - say $1000AUD but we need to wait and see and I am just speculating.

well what I was trying to do was do a price comparison...since we never got the re-flash for the DC5R like the RSX-S in the states, so I figured that would give an indicative price...but yeah I guess the re-flash would be much cheaper.

[Chris_F]

i think it'd be worth it even for a grand... just depends what type of gains we'd be looking at.

like yfin said there's even a chance will notice more than a 29hp gain at 6000rpm if the difference between k24a3 and k24a2 is only in the tuning.

But yea, powerwise this mod should make a big difference and coupled with a good intake and headers you could be looking at close to a 50hp gain in some part of the rev range... all for under 2 grand :p

[kam]

Im a cruzer, i enjoy driving slow and easy. im about all 'looks' and no 'go'. and thats fine with me. if i wanted "go" there are a lot of other cars out there. And what with all the stupid speed limits and the huge fines for doing 3kph over the limit, 60kph would be the average maximum speed that i drive at...

[VirIIx]

1000 could go into a nice set of extractors and a catback.. would that do more wonders over an ecu?

[blkeuro]

1000 could go into a nice set of extractors and a catback.. would that do more wonders over an ecu?


No way could headers+catback give you a gain of 25hp at any range RPM!!!

[blkeuro]

Check out the dyno graph (attached) that is supplied with the PowerChip product - not even a true reflection of the euro's power/torque curve!! what are these guys trying to pull?! Sounds like a bunch of BS to me.... :thumbdwn:

[blkeuro]

Hmmm...couldn't attach any files for some reason...try this link

http://www.powerchipgroup.com/Datasheets/1/Hon0064.pdf

[Matell]

There are too many dubious claims and data in that brochue to warrant any further comment. Buyer beware..........

[euro77]

that sure can't be euro on that dyno!!!

[yfin]

They say the powerchip does not interfere with the Honda warranty.

I think Honda may have a different view if, for example - there was a problem with the Honda ECU and it needed to be replaced. Or perhaps if there were engine problems due to the increase in power.

Sure there is speculation in all of this - but I don't think Powerchip can say how Honda may view the chip.

[adammet04]

Damn this is exciting to heaar...hopefully the bang will = the hype so far around it..

since its software change as discussed..i assume this means you could flash back to stock?...i dont know why you would want to ... but yeah whats the go with that ?

[Chris_F]

any more news on the hondata?

Extractors and exhaust would probably provide similar or slightly greater peak gains but they would be much less noticable than the ecu treatment given the huge gains throughout the rev range.

[tanalasta]

Also waiting to see if HonData will be available in Perth for 2006 Euro Sport/Euro models.

And if there will be a local installer / tuner in Perth :)

[Peekay34]

More news..... Doug from Hondata USA was here the other day and they did some more testing. I am now running DC5 Cam gear on my engine which I beleive James maybe offering as an option this alters the cam angle by up to I think 50 degress (but don't quote me). I don't know the full story but they were running better than 135+KW at the wheels with the honda standard exhaust and extractors and only the ECU tuned. I don't know the full details but I will ask James to post information on his other site. The exhaust and extractors are being shipped as we speak so they should be here in a week. Once double checked against the car they should be on the market... Sorry I can't say anymore cause I am not sure about the finer details.

[enkay]

OMG woot =D this is the best news i heard all week

[tony1234]

Check out the dyno graph (attached) that is supplied with the PowerChip product - not even a true reflection of the euro's power/torque curve!! what are these guys trying to pull?! Sounds like a bunch of BS to me.... :thumbdwn:
The nm figures thru parts of the rev range don't make sense!!!They're overvalued.325nm@6500 rpm in std form???i thought max.torque is 223 nm@4500?There's something not right here.:confused:

[tony1234]

More news..... Doug from Hondata USA was here the other day and they did some more testing. I am now running DC5 Cam gear on my engine which I beleive James maybe offering as an option this alters the cam angle by up to I think 50 degress (but don't quote me). I don't know the full story but they were running better than 135+KW at the wheels with the honda standard exhaust and extractors and only the ECU tuned. I don't know the full details but I will ask James to post information on his other site. The exhaust and extractors are being shipped as we speak so they should be here in a week. Once double checked against the car they should be on the market... Sorry I can't say anymore cause I am not sure about the finer details.
Sounds GOOD please keep us posted.I'm hanging off doing any mods to my car untill the Hondata gear arrives.By the way,Peekay,the cam gear you are testing is it a replacement cam actuator(i think that's what it's called)or replacement cams.Cause i've heard you can rep.the euro actuator with one from an integra or crv!Apparently these allow for cam angle up to 50 deg.wereas the euro 1 only allows for up to 25 deg.can someone here verify this?cost is approx.$240.00 plus fitting(4 hrs to fit):p

[Peekay34]

I can confirm the Cam timing Gear was replaced not the Cams.

[tony1234]

I can confirm the Cam timing Gear was replaced not the Cams.
This must be what my guy is talking about!

[BusterSonic12]

sound so sweet :D

[enkay]

o mans wheres the update on the exhaust!

[Peekay34]

Deliverey is suposed to be this week. Will update when I know....

[yfin]

Deliverey is suposed to be this week. Will update when I know....

Bring it on Peekay... That wait is almost over. :thumbsup:

[enkay]

yes im gettin all excited and having wet dreams hahaha =P

[BusterSonic12]

lol i wanna see the numbers vs prices ^^

[tony1234]

Deliverey is suposed to be this week. Will update when I know....
Please keep us updated re:price and packages available.Also if there's going to be a group buy.I,like the others are quite keen!!!:thumbsup:

[Omotesando]

They say the powerchip does not interfere with the Honda warranty.

I think Honda may have a different view if, for example - there was a problem with the Honda ECU and it needed to be replaced. Or perhaps if there were engine problems due to the increase in power.

Sure there is speculation in all of this - but I don't think Powerchip can say how Honda may view the chip.

This product is shocking. I remember reading an article, and they sell like $4.0million worth of them per year. They've advertised regularly on MOTOR and WHEELS for countless years, which means the mags themselves have never written anything bad about it..

And then, some golfer decided to put some money and to a joint venture to promote it overseas - I think it could be Allenby..

This world is weird indeed. At least Unichip actually works.... :D

[msnealo]

This product is shocking......

Why is it shocking?

Know any one who's had one fitted?

To a Honda?

To a Euro?

[jamchen]

this product is still under road tests.. but there's a superb short film at hondata website where they compare two 04 euros one with the flash and one without...
so u will kno why it is shocking!

[tony1234]

Why is it shocking?

Know any one who's had one fitted?

To a Honda?

To a Euro?
I had one fitted to an 02 Subaru liberty that i used to own.cost $900.00 fitted.I thought it was good value for the money.The figures they're quoting for the Euro though don't make sense!!!!

[msnealo]

so u will kno why it is shocking!

Why Powerchip is shocking or Hondata is shocking?

Got a link to the clip?


I had one fitted to an 02 Subaru liberty that i used to own.cost $900.00 fitted.I thought it was good value for the money.The figures they're quoting for the Euro though don't make sense!!!!

I can't get any quoted figures from the Powerchip website.

[Chris_F]

this thread is starting to get very confusing... its what happen when the information people really want to know if kept under wraps for so long.

[aaronng]

this product is still under road tests.. but there's a superb short film at hondata website where they compare two 04 euros one with the flash and one without...
so u will kno why it is shocking!
That clip is a vid of 2 TSX's. Not Euros.

[sports06]

this product is still under road tests.. but there's a superb short film at hondata website where they compare two 04 euros one with the flash and one without...
so u will kno why it is shocking!

could post a link to the vid? cant find it

[jamchen]

could post a link to the vid? cant find it
http://www.hondata.com/reflash_tsx_06.html
and scroll down to "feedback from 04 TSX owners" and click on the pic to download the video...:wave:

[msnealo]

Thanks for the link. :)
Still not convinced.

[jamchen]

considering u can still (possibly) maintain ur warrenty and no modifications required... i reckon its on my must-do list..

[Omotesando]

Why is it shocking?

Know any one who's had one fitted?

To a Honda?

To a Euro?

This is a notorius product in the tuning world that nobody actually wants to touch (to people confused, this is NOT HONDATA I'm talking about but something else. Hondata seems to be a better product). Why? Because it can affect the car negatively in too many ways. There are many cases of known engine failures, idling and stalling problems, hesitations during acceleration, and unfortunately for turbo car owners, it likes to 'pretend' to work well on a turbo car application when it hideously installs a pneumatic bleed valve to increase boost without the owner knowing, which easily increase seat of the pants power, but then leads to the car actually pinging as shown on a dyno. UNKNOWN to the owner because they can't even hear the pinging going on, but its picked up on the dyno time and again.

I've seen it installed on BMW M3s (E36), Commodores, Nissan Pulsars, S14 or S15 200sx, Porsches, Audi A3s. I haven't seen on installed on a Honda Euro Accord because its not available. A lot of people I know had problems with this chip, i.e. Commodores engine breaks down. Pulsar rev-limit is raised but the car hesitates and blows out white smoke. S15 200sx owner so distressed because not only his car produces less power than my S15 with a stock ECU, but it stalls.

The biggest reason and suspicion that should tell u to be weary of this product? Because, they ALWAYS advertise the wrong 'potential' power gain of the car models. The common mistake customers make is that, they always buy the chip or ECU or piggy-back system that promises them the most power. That is 100% the WRONG APPROACH.

In reality, as long as any ECU works well enough - all cars should only make similar power when tuned properly. Putting an APEXi PowerFC or E-Manage or Unichip or SMT6 on a certain car might net you say 8-10KW. Putting a full MOTEC worth thousands more, doesn't actually mean you'll get 15KW out of it. You'll still be restricted to around 8 or 10KW, as a figure of speech. As long as the potential's already realised, and the ECU hasn't any problems, AND a good Tuning Safety Margin has been put in, and even considering that the Aftermarket or Factory ECU is able to pull off Timing in case of bad fuel or problems, that maximum power gain is always similar between good-enough ECUs. The choice between ECU's should be mainly because of the other optional fine tuning parameters, ease of retuning, tuner's knowledge, price, etc, NOT advertised power output.

To say it simply - a product which advertises it gaine MORE power than everyone else, ESPECIALLY when the dynographs shown are very dodgy or falsified and/or the aftermarket dynographs shown are 'wrong' or 'too good to be true', you can rest assure that in the long run, this product is killing your car.

This chip isn't tuned in Real-Time specifically for your car either (actually so is Hondata in that respect). This is a very bad thing in general, especially if your car is modded. The other thing - under their website, they list Synergy/Ultimate/Optimax as under one category of fuel. In reality, these 3 fuels have very different amounts of boost and Ignition Timing that could be run.

The problem with most 'chip' owners is that they never even bother to put their vehicle on a dyno after installation. Because when they do, they'll realise they might have only gained slight throttle response, but power hasn't actually gone up, yet the car is pinging its head off due to excessive timing. And on turbo cars, the boost has crept up, power has gone up, but for that boost level the car is actually down on power even compared to a stock ECU running exactly the same boost. That's because, the tuning is completely wrong for that boost level... even though power is slightly up, its damaging the car :p

[tony1234]

Why is it shocking?

Know any one who's had one fitted?

To a Honda?

To a Euro?
Have a look at this and see what you think???Page 5 blkeuro.:thumbdwn:

[msnealo]

Thank you very much Omotesando. Your time to write out that response is appreciatted.:thumbsup:

Thanks for the link tony1234.:thumbsup:

[Omotesando]

That's alright! Sorry my previous answer was really really short, because I thought their PDF file with the dubious figures (for a totally different car) was obvious enough to deter potential buyers LOL! Can't even get the information right :( I pity those who pay $1990 for one...


Its hard to get the right ECU for an Euro Accord. Might go Hondata one day.. Can't wait anymore!

[tony1234]

That's alright! Sorry my previous answer was really really short, because I thought their PDF file with the dubious figures (for a totally different car) was obvious enough to deter potential buyers LOL! Can't even get the information right :( I pity those who pay $1990 for one...


Its hard to get the right ECU for an Euro Accord. Might go Hondata one day.. Can't wait anymore!
I spoke to James last Thurs.He says it's a matter of weeks before the Hondata gear is released:p (he told me $1000.00 approx.for ecu reflash).Why would you consider the Powerchip?

[curik]

A matter of weeks? He is running short on time before the euro is replaced with an all new version

[tony1234]

A matter of weeks? He is running short on time before the euro is replaced with an all new version
We'll all have to be patient.I've done research outside this forum and the feedback is positive,so i think it's worth the wait.What other viable options do we have?Does anyone here have any other ideas???

[Chris_F]

A matter of weeks? He is running short on time before the euro is replaced with an all new version

the previous model euros will be around long after the new one comes out... also once they get cheaper second hand more ppl will be inclined to modify them. The aftermarket support for the euro will still be strong years to come.

I think at around 1000 they've hit the nail on the head price wise, 1500 was gonna be a bit over the top but 1000 sees it closer to the price it costs in the US than i thought.

The other option is the fully tuneable DBW compatable ecu from EFI - user: pornstar is offering a special deal for euro owners for the next couple of months, and although its more expensive it has a lot of extra features and can be removed and replaced with the stock ecu easily - I assume the reflash will require the stock ecu to be modified. I'd prefer a stand alone but tahts just me.

At least now euro owners in australia have the opportunity to unleash some more potential (whichever way they go about it):thumbsup::thumbsup:

[yfin]

The other option is the fully tuneable DBW compatable ecu from EFI - user: pornstar is offering a special deal for euro owners for the next couple of months, and although its more expensive it has a lot of extra features and can be removed and replaced with the stock ecu easily - I assume the reflash will require the stock ecu to be modified. I'd prefer a stand alone but tahts just me.

At least now euro owners in australia have the opportunity to unleash some more potential (whichever way they go about it):thumbsup::thumbsup:

Hondata looks promising although I will have lots of questions to ask when it is released! As for other options - Chris mentioned that tuneable ECU. Funny you mention that because yesterday I found some info on that "Euro1" ECU. I have no idea who these "Compsystems" people are so don't ask me for more info - i just "googled" the name of the ECU. According to that table it doesn't support traction control so whether it works with VSA is still a question mark. Even though there are benefits of a stand alone system - I wouldn't want to lose a safety system like VSA even if 99.9% of the time driving the car it is not used.

Getting real world info about how these work with the CL9 seems to be veiled in secrecy at the moment. Hopefully more info will be released soon. Check out the last link - with the Euro1 (and some other mods like camshafts) they claim they upped the power on the Peugeot 206GTI from 135 to 200hp (still NA). Fairly significant!

http://www.compsystems.com.au/efi_technoogy_spa.htm

http://www.compsystems.com.au/euro1.htm

http://www.compsystems.com.au/News/011005spotlight.htm

http://www.compsystems.com.au/images/EFIEuro/Euro1-prs1_1_0002.jpg

[aaronng]

ECU alone doesn't make power. It allows you to make the potential power of all your mods that are on your car. In the case of the base Hondata reflash, the power gain is from leaning out the mixture and running on 98 octane.

The 206 GTI has such a big gain because of ITBs, cams and exhaust.

[ALN]

here is another info I found about EFI euro products
http://www.efitechnology.it/main_eng.html

About Hondata reflash, when is it gonna be released actually ?
last time I talked to him which is on march 06, He said gonna be released on April 06. Well it's almost october though. so what's happening?

[BusterSonic12]

can't wait >.<

[Suntzu]

I personally think that now is the time Hondata should have made the initial announcement. Not 9 months ago or whateva and strung people along. Announcements should be made just before supply or as suppy is delivered.

They could have said nothing til now then BAM , announce and then deliver with immediate feedback from real users

Stringing faithful hopeful's along isnt very professional in my opinion.

I still look forward to some results but I think im going to turn over my vehicle before i see any results at this rate.

[yfin]

I personally think that now is the time Hondata should have made the initial announcement. Not 9 months ago or whateva and strung people along. Announcements should be made just before supply or as suppy is delivered.

They could have said nothing til now then BAM , announce and then deliver with immediate feedback from real users

Stringing faithful hopeful's along isnt very professional in my opinion.

I still look forward to some results but I think im going to turn over my vehicle before i see any results at this rate.

I have kept the faith so far... The first announced release date was to be September 2005. Product was then announced as finished in April 06. A pre-order was going to be announced in August 06.

I don't mind them releasing info about it - I think that is a great thing. The only thing I don't like is dates being put on a release when such indications have proven highly innaccurate. I hope (i really hope) support during the sale and after sale process is excellent.

I think all will be forgiven once this is released.. :D

[tony1234]

I have kept the faith so far... The first announced release date was to be September 2005. Product was then announced as finished in April 06. A pre-order was going to be announced in August 06.

I don't mind them releasing info about it - I think that is a great thing. The only thing I don't like is dates being put on a release when such indications have proven highly innaccurate. I hope (i really hope) support during the sale and after sale process is excellent.

I think all will be forgiven once this is released.. :D
I agree with yfin.It'll be great when it's finally released.Wouldn't you rather wait a bit longer and have a product that is properly developed than one that is rushed onto the market to fit in with a previously promised date?

[Chris_F]

According to that table it doesn't support traction control so whether it works with VSA is still a question mark. Even though there are benefits of a stand alone system - I wouldn't want to lose a safety system like VSA even if 99.9% of the time driving the car it is not used.


That's a good point, i was assuming VSA would be kept in tact, but we'd need to ask Andy (pornstar) about all of this.

If anythng, the EFI ecu is more suited to those euro owners who want to take their car to the next step and make the most power possible. A forced induction setup, for example, isn't out of the question - neither are quad throttles or internal work.

I'm just glad the option of a fully tuneable ecu is finally available - im sure some people will jump on board then we'll get to see the full potential of the k24a in the euro platform. Motec and the more expensive ones have always been there but generally out of the publics reach cost wise.

I think peeka34's car - being custom tuned - is already showing us some of this potential (i bet that thing feels fast!). Personally I'd only go for a reflash if it could be customised to my specific application so hopefully this is something hondata can offer. The idea of a universal "reflash" just doest sit well with me.


ECU alone doesn't make power. It allows you to make the potential power of all your mods that are on your car. In the case of the base Hondata reflash, the power gain is from leaning out the mixture and running on 98 octane.

The 206 GTI has such a big gain because of ITBs, cams and exhaust.

that's a really good point... I don't think a universal ecu reflash will ever take full advantage of peoples modifications like a standalone can. It's a halfway solution that might signficantly increase power but without seeing maximum gains. For $1000 or so though it's reasonable value for what you seem to get.

[tony1234]

That's a good point, i was assuming VSA would be kept in tact, but we'd need to ask Andy (pornstar) about all of this.

If anythng, the EFI ecu is more suited to those euro owners who want to take their car to the next step and make the most power possible. A forced induction setup, for example, isn't out of the question - neither are quad throttles or internal work.

I'm just glad the option of a fully tuneable ecu is finally available - im sure some people will jump on board then we'll get to see the full potential of the k24a in the euro platform. Motec and the more expensive ones have always been there but generally out of the publics reach cost wise.

I think peeka34's car - being custom tuned - is already showing us some of this potential (i bet that thing feels fast!). Personally I'd only go for a reflash if it could be customised to my specific application so hopefully this is something hondata can offer. The idea of a universal "reflash" just doest sit well with me.



that's a really good point... I don't think a universal ecu reflash will ever take full advantage of peoples modifications like a standalone can. It's a halfway solution that might signficantly increase power but without seeing maximum gains. For $1000 or so though it's reasonable value for what you seem to get.
From what i can work out the Hondata reflash seems to be the best allround option for price and performance.

[Chris_F]

Seems to be... we'll have to wait untill all details are confirmed.

[Omotesando]

I might hazard a guess that Hondata is hoping to wait until EVERYTHING such as their exhausts, cams, intakes, etc, manufacturing to be completed and then shipped into Australia, before they announce the whole Euro Accord Hondata packages.

I mean - obviously with all the research that's been done, they want to sell a Stage 3 or Stage 4 all at once instead of only a Stage 1 Hondata reflash or something.

Unfortunately manufacturing of the items takes a long time to finalise, also not to mention the quality assurance takes time I mean the first batch of finished samples might not be up to par or something, who knows.

Like some others said - I'd rather they have done their due diligence and checked everything is GOOD ENOUGH for market release, before they actually start selling.

Coz - as an example, I don't want it to be like my bloody Sony Ericsson K800i mobile which has so many bugs and problems, I've had it in warranty repair for the 3rd time :(

[Peekay34]

Latest news....Exhaust has landed and will be quality checked against car today or tomorrow. Looks very bling bling...... Very good quality welds. Nice unit overall.

[tony1234]

Latest news....Exhaust has landed and will be quality checked against car today or tomorrow. Looks very bling bling...... Very good quality welds. Nice unit overall.
Great news.What about the CAI and ecu reflash?Any news on them?.......Thanks.:thumbsup:

[sports06]

Latest news....Exhaust has landed and will be quality checked against car today or tomorrow. Looks very bling bling...... Very good quality welds. Nice unit overall.

any chance of some pics aswell?

[Peekay34]

Great news.What about the CAI and ecu reflash?Any news on them?.......Thanks.:thumbsup:


CAI is there as well. Ask James re reflash I believe he is waiting on equipment from US to do reflash instead of sending to states to do.

[enkay]

woo soo excited!!! cant wait..

[tony1234]

Thanks Peekay34 for keeping us up to date.

[Omotesando]

Yeah thanks Peekay34.... sounds promising :)

[Unkie]

I'm glad he's getting equipment over from the States, as I'd really hesitate to send my ECU off across the ocean for a reflash.

[Type R Positive]

Latest news....Exhaust has landed and will be quality checked against car today or tomorrow. Looks very bling bling...... Very good quality welds. Nice unit overall.
Come on mate, where are the pics?

[enkay]

here u go mate.. a sneak peak
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/5555/dsc05911ny1.jpg

[Type R Positive]

Come on mate......................
You can do better than that!!!

[enkay]

Come on mate......................
You can do better than that!!!
i dunt work for hondatech.. lol i just found the pic from thier forum hehe

[Type R Positive]

i dunt work for hondatech.. lol i just found the pic from thier forum hehe hehe sweet!

[Type R Positive]

That does look like the comptech header though........
Same flange and 4 > 2 > 1 design.

[Peekay34]

This was not copied from anywhere it is their own design.... How much can you change flange has to be simular if not the same as they bolt to the same head?????????... after that they depart each from other from looks and design. They are totally different trust me.

[Type R Positive]

I wish they would hurry up..........

[Peekay34]

As far as I am aware James was going to post something on hondatech today or tomorrow.

[tony1234]

As far as I am aware James was going to post something on hondatech today or tomorrow.
Thanks Peekay.Can you keep all of us up to date on any developments?

[yfin]

i dunt work for hondatech.. lol i just found the pic from thier forum hehe

can you please post up a link to where that photo came from.

1 - it helps people who want to read the thread where that photo came from;
2 - it is fair to the author of the thread on the other forum.

[Chris_F]

Even though there are benefits of a stand alone system - I wouldn't want to lose a safety system like VSA even if 99.9% of the time driving the car it is not used.

Getting real world info about how these work with the CL9 seems to be veiled in secrecy at the moment.



yfin, ALN has been making enquiries about the efi ecu and he confirmed with me that the Euro1 ecu retains all standard functions (including DBW with an optional module).

Did you put your email adress down for pornstar (andy) to send you the details about this ecu? It contained a lot of information and pricing etc.

[yfin]

yfin, ALN has been making enquiries about the efi ecu and he confirmed with me that the Euro1 ecu retains all standard functions (including DBW with an optional module).

Did you put your email adress down for pornstar (andy) to send you the details about this ecu? It contained a lot of information and pricing etc.

Thanks Chris - I have seen that email but it doesn't say anything about retaining standard functions. That Euro1 table must be wrong as it says traction control is not supported. So has anyone signed up for it yet? Would be good to see more info re test results.

Cheers

[Chris_F]

I believe the 'traction control' featured on the other efi ecu's is actually a part of the ecu (an added feature). For cars that already have a traction control system this added feature is probably obsolete, unless of course the efi traction control system is better than the standard one.

That's just a theory, but it would explain why it's retained.

Like you I'm really looking foward to seeing the results a fully tuneable ecu can achieve on the euro. It'll be even more interesting to see how it compares to the hondata reflash performance for dollar wise :P

[enkay]

WOO http://www.hondatech.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=863 INFO!
its now called JTUNE =P

[tony1234]

WOO http://www.hondatech.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=863 INFO!
its now called JTUNE =P
Woohoo.Finally.I'm going to check it out NOW.:thumbsup:

[Chris_F]

Full Custom tunes - For those who think their modifications are beyond a Flash upgrade, i.e wildly crazy NA cars or forced induction, we have a fully tunable ECU solution, based on the K100 / K Pro technology – This product is a direct plug and play product, with all the features of the K100 / K Pro Technology. At this time I can’t release any specific information to the public, as were still finalizing this product.

from the link enkay posted... I'll be waiting to hear more details about this...

[Type R Positive]

WOO http://www.hondatech.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=863 INFO!
its now called JTUNE =P
Nice. I would have preferred cannon style mufflers though.....

[aaronng]

I'm liking the header and exhaust system. I don't like cannons, so I might go for this.

[yfin]

If the price is competitive these will sell well. I am glad they are sticking with a dual muffler setup - that extra muffling capacity will help keep the noise increase to a minimum.

[tony1234]

I'm with aaron.I reckon it looks the goods.There will be a once only group buy with packages at a discounted price apparently!!!!:thumbsup:

[Type R Positive]

I'm with aaron.I reckon it looks the goods.There will be a once only group buy with packages at a discounted price apparently!!!!:thumbsup:If they can sell them cheap once, they can sell them cheap all the time................

[BusterSonic12]

for me... the exhaust looks alright, not the best tho. But the header looks damn nice :P i will think about it.

[mugen88]

Finally good 2 c some product and quality looks good so far.

Headers look good from the limited shots but exhaust is not doing it for me.

[Omotesando]

I think that exhaust as stated on the link is the hand-welded sample they got back from overseas, before batch production?

So the final product should hopefully look better :)

[sodaz]

Looks like we'll have hondata here real soon!! :D

The only issue I have with hondata is that you can't flash it back to stock.
Should any reliability issues arise I would really like the option of being able to return it back to its factory form. And since the tune is optimised for 98 octane fuel, if i'm planning to sell my car i'd have to tell the new owner or else he/she might damage the engine by putting in the wrong fuel.

[Chris_F]

give me a single outlet exhaust and a tuneable ecu anyday

[Omotesando]

They will have a tuneable ECU one day from what is said?

Sigh - at the moment its just too much talks. By the time I'm ready for the upgrade, I think I might as well sell my 05 and get an 07 or when the new Euro comes out. sigh..

Always want to catch up with the latest models :(

[Peekay34]

Nice. I would have preferred cannon style mufflers though.....


Why would you have fart cannons they produce to much noise. This exhaust has been designed to produce power without noise taking into account the type of car it is. The design has been taken into account that the car is an upmarket exec type car not a boy racer car. Also the question of single outlet.... Why ....the car is from factory a twin outlet car not single. This exhaust took this into consideration. Also power is not lost with this system but gained... The welds on this exhaust are very good quality but is only the first prototype.

[tony1234]

Why would you have fart cannons they produce to much noise. This exhaust has been designed to produce power without noise taking into account the type of car it is. The design has been taken into account that the car is an upmarket exec type car not a boy racer car. Also the question of single outlet.... Why ....the car is from factory a twin outlet car not single. This exhaust took this into consideration. Also power is not lost with this system but gained... The welds on this exhaust are very good quality but is only the first prototype.
I agree.The main reason i'm going for the JTUNE gear is exactly what Peekay34 states.Cannons,noisy exhausts and intakes etc.do NOT suit the style of car that the Euro is.Not to mention that the idea of a "sleeper"style of car appeals to me as well!!!!

[Chris_F]

Why would you have fart cannons they produce to much noise. This exhaust has been designed to produce power without noise taking into account the type of car it is. The design has been taken into account that the car is an upmarket exec type car not a boy racer car. Also the question of single outlet.... Why ....the car is from factory a twin outlet car not single. This exhaust took this into consideration. Also power is not lost with this system but gained... The welds on this exhaust are very good quality but is only the first prototype.

of course there is a reason for the design, and i think the whole package will suit the character of the euro well like you said. honda implimented a dual outlet exhaust from factory becuase it's quiet and looks good depending on your taste (most people appreciate symmetry and having 'more')

So why a single outlet exhaust? It's a less compromised design... function over form, lighter in weight (j's racing = 6kg for the cat back system) and in theory will always have the potential to flow more exhaust gasses on a 4 cylinder car (assuming there is a collector that meets at a single point). Like you said the hondatech system is designed to retain the 'exec.' character of the euro - no denying it is a well rounded / more conservative upgrade, but optimal performance? that's questionable.

No offense intended here, just offering my view point: the hondatech way isn't the only way to tune a euro and if a single outlet exhaust is for 'boy racers' so is a 3ft wing, wouldnt you say?

[Chris_F]

I agree.The main reason i'm going for the JTUNE gear is exactly what Peekay34 states.Cannons,noisy exhausts and intakes etc.do NOT suit the style of car that the Euro is.Not to mention that the idea of a "sleeper"style of car appeals to me as well!!!!

the hks silent hipower is one of the quietest exhausts on the market for the euro and has adopted a cannon style dual exit muffler as has the mugen exhaust system. So don't generalise.

the euro could be considered an entry level luxury car but it's in no way a status symbol like a mercede's or bmw...

[BusterSonic12]

CHris F... great stuff :D i totally agree with you

[Type R Positive]

Peekay34 - I like the look of the cannon mufflers, I think the hondatech ones look shite. I also prefer the two muffler design over single. But hey, that's my thoughts... The Greddy twin design is quiet, the HKS design is also quiet, so what makes you say that the cannon mufflers are loud?

The only thing that appeals to me about hondatech is the reflash and depending on how expensive, the headers too. that's it. Unless they are using metalcat's catalytic converter, then forget about it too.

Saying that, it is awesome that we are getting some more parts for the euro. They are just not for everyone.

What's the intake going to be like? Comptech airbox design or CAI?

[BusterSonic12]

i guess comptech, mayb if i remember correctly, they first tested the ecu on a euro with comptech intake.

[Type R Positive]

But I hear all this talk about CAI? As they said, they tested everything.

[Chris_F]

a design similar to comptech could be considred a CAI.. anything that draws in cool air (not from the bay) is essentially a CAI..

[yfin]

Ok internet kiddies, a response has been posted up re why that exhaust was chosen.

http://www.hondatech.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=863

I think we should let the dyno graphs and real world driving experiences do the talking here. A couple of photos (which to me look real nice) mean little don't they?

ps.. The internet kiddies remark is just tounge and cheek - if you read the link you will see why I am saying it. lol :D.

[Chris_F]

hahaha I just read it

3" sounds good to me, I'm sure it'll be a great package with all the effort that's been put into it.

One point though.. if hondata didn't want to be rushed by 'internet kiddies' then they shouldn't have generated hype about the product when it was nowhere near release, I'm sure people find it hard to stay patient for so long

[yfin]

One point though.. if hondata didn't want to be rushed by 'internet kiddies' then they shouldn't have generated hype about the product when it was nowhere near release, I'm sure people find it hard to stay patient for so long

Yeah, I am sensing some frustration over there. I mean they have spent A LOT lot of technical time on this and then read over here some of our pretty basic discussions about single vs dual and why not a different muffer, etc , etc (well basic talk to them anyway - great talk for us mere mortals as we can't all be 'tuners').

As for saying some of us are 'internet kiddies' - not sure how smart that is given we are all potential customers. Oh well, perhaps customer service is not their forte. I am counting on the actual product to do the talking which I am sure it will. :thumbsup:

[Type R Positive]

a design similar to comptech could be considred a CAI.. anything that draws in cool air (not from the bay) is essentially a CAI..Hehe, so is the stock airbox!
Anyways, you know what I mean.....

[Chris_F]

haha, its getting cold air so yep ;P

[Suntzu]

Yeah the "internet kiddies" response is NOT professional and is a direct result of them hyping a product far too early.

Im 50-50 on whether to keep my Euro or not depending on real world results on Hondata. Hope theres something concrete on the flash soon. Im not that interested in the exhaust chatter.

[sodaz]

Yeah the "internet kiddies" response is NOT professional and is a direct result of them hyping a product far too early.

Im 50-50 on whether to keep my Euro or not depending on real world results on Hondata. Hope theres something concrete on the flash soon. Im not that interested in the exhaust chatter.

Not a good idea to piss the "internet kiddies" off because they'll be the ones spending the money haha.

[Chris_F]

Not a good idea to piss the "internet kiddies" off because they'll be the ones spending the money haha.
couldn't agree more...



Yeah, I am sensing some frustration over there. I mean they have spent A LOT lot of technical time on this and then read over here some of our pretty basic discussions about single vs dual and why not a different muffer, etc , etc (well basic talk to them anyway - great talk for us mere mortals as we can't all be 'tuners').
it's unwarranted frustration though. If anything they should be greatful for the consumer insights. If information was released when it was supposed to be and the product wasn't delayed for so long there would also be a lot less general banter and speculation.

[Type R Positive]

Yeah, I am sensing some frustration over there.
Frustration or arrogance?

[yfin]

Frustration or arrogance?

It doesn't matter. All I care about is that these guys do a good job of the project, there are no problems down the track, and the price is competitive. Mechanics are notoriously bad at customer service. My dad is the prime example. Great at working on cars in his day - terrible when a customer complained - lol. :D

[Peekay34]

Frustration or arrogance?

What arrogance are you talking about...I can't believe you guys. If anyone should be frustrated here it is me I have lost my car for months and months with this work. All you guys had to do is sit and wait. The only one I see here about arrogance is your statements. How much money have you invested in this ...absolutly nothing not one brass razzo. Do you think it is cheap to do this stuff or easy to organise with overseas manufacturers. If you can do better then go off and do so. No one is forcing you to buy this stuff anyway... you still get to drive your car and benefit if you decide to buy when it is released.


In frustration....

[stephen8512]

What arrogance are you talking about...I can't believe you guys. If anyone should be frustrated here it is me I have lost my car for months and months with this work. All you guys had to do is sit and wait. The only one I see here about arrogance is your statements. How much money have you invested in this ...absolutly nothing not one brass razzo. Do you think it is cheap to do this stuff or easy to organise with overseas manufacturers. If you can do better then go off and do so. No one is forcing you to buy this stuff anyway... you still get to drive your car and benefit if you decide to buy when it is released.


In frustration....

im sure everyone here is greatful for ur contributions peekay. but on the flipside, i guess losing your car and all is all part of being the first guinea pig for the product.

[tony1234]

What arrogance are you talking about...I can't believe you guys. If anyone should be frustrated here it is me I have lost my car for months and months with this work. All you guys had to do is sit and wait. The only one I see here about arrogance is your statements. How much money have you invested in this ...absolutly nothing not one brass razzo. Do you think it is cheap to do this stuff or easy to organise with overseas manufacturers. If you can do better then go off and do so. No one is forcing you to buy this stuff anyway... you still get to drive your car and benefit if you decide to buy when it is released.


In frustration....
Everyone should just relax.The JTUNE gear is only a matter of weeks away now.I'm sure once we've all got the gear installed on our cars all this "frustration" will be long forgotten.:)

[yfin]

What arrogance are you talking about...I can't believe you guys. If anyone should be frustrated here it is me I have lost my car for months and months with this work. All you guys had to do is sit and wait. The only one I see here about arrogance is your statements. How much money have you invested in this ...absolutly nothing not one brass razzo. Do you think it is cheap to do this stuff or easy to organise with overseas manufacturers. If you can do better then go off and do so. No one is forcing you to buy this stuff anyway... you still get to drive your car and benefit if you decide to buy when it is released.

In frustration....
I feel for you Peekay. You are a stronger man than me to stand up for Hondatech if you were without your car for "months and months". I would be pulling out my hair after 3 weeks I think.

Anyway, I feel bad for highlighting that "internet kiddies" remark now as it has obviously caused a reaction. I wouldn't have said it if I was selling something - but it is not going to stop me from looking at the product once released. So lets all move on :D

[Chris_F]

What arrogance are you talking about...I can't believe you guys. If anyone should be frustrated here it is me I have lost my car for months and months with this work. All you guys had to do is sit and wait. The only one I see here about arrogance is your statements. How much money have you invested in this ...absolutly nothing not one brass razzo. Do you think it is cheap to do this stuff or easy to organise with overseas manufacturers. If you can do better then go off and do so. No one is forcing you to buy this stuff anyway... you still get to drive your car and benefit if you decide to buy when it is released.


In frustration....
he was reffering to the 'internet kiddies' comment i believe... a lot of consumer goods require R&D and whilst everyone in the euro community is grateful for your contributions to the development of the Jtune products we should be entitled to discuss them in whichever way we see fit.

when people are finally able to buy these products they will be making a significant investment... and hondatech will be making a profit - for that reason i believe consumer feedback/general banter & discussion about the products is a positive and something hondatech is fortunate to have access to - regardless of whether it is positive or negative. Professionals should be professionals because consumers will be consumers :p

edit: just read your comment yfin - and i feel the same way (though i won't be selling off my current modifications for the hondatech gear i may be interested in a tuneable ecu)

[Suntzu]

Still nothing about this or is it still a talk fest from Hondata?

[tony1234]

Still nothing about this or is it still a talk fest from Hondata?
Spoke to James yesterday.Apparently some minor mods had to be made to the collector(i think)!which will delay the release till early Nov.:(

[enkay]

o reali thats not to bad then, gives me time to focus on HSC 1st lol =P instead of just thinkin bout hondata

[cleary]

I got an email today saying pre-orders were being taken - has anyone done this?

[tony1234]

I got an email today saying pre-orders were being taken - has anyone done this?
I thought this wasn't happening for a couple of weeks.Besides i haven't seen pricing!.:confused:

[Pumped]

believe the email says "The final product's are very close to shipping, and a pre order will begin in a few weeks"


Looking promising :)

[tony1234]

believe the email says "The final product's are very close to shipping, and a pre order will begin in a few weeks"


Looking promising :)
Yeah.Hope there's no more delays.

[cleary]

believe the email says "The final product's are very close to shipping, and a pre order will begin in a few weeks"


Looking promising :)

I stand corrected :)

[Suntzu]

Yeah looks promising.

I need to see some pretty hard performance data before ordering. Im a bit reluctatnt to pre order as Im keen to hear some real world comments from users first after a few months.

Hope to see some dyno graphs etc soon.

good stuff

[msnealo]

http://www.hondatech.com.au/forum/hondatech_index.php

[TypeG]

those exhuast look like some 3A muffler.....

[Gibbo]

I know this is an OLD thread but surely someone out there has some info on price and availibility ??? I cant wait to hear from ppl that get this and see some dyno figures... Cheers Gibbo...

[tony1234]

I know this is an OLD thread but surely someone out there has some info on price and availibility ??? I cant wait to hear from ppl that get this and see some dyno figures... Cheers Gibbo...
Iv'e heard a group buy will be announced early Dec.Del and install approx. early Jan.Pricing:reflash'$1000,headers,$1200,ex.$1700,C AI,$400.approx.pricing should be better for group buy!!!

[Peekay34]

They redesigned the Intake and Headers, as the initial units that were made came back they were not happy with them. The redesigned units were sent back to be remade approx 1.5 weeks ago so the new design should be back soon.

[yfin]

Iv'e heard a group buy will be announced early Dec.Del and install approx. early Jan.Pricing:reflash'$1000,headers,$1200,ex.$1700,C AI,$400.approx.pricing should be better for group buy!!!

Good to see some approx pricing. Was that exhaust price inclusive of the high flow cat? And do you know if these prices include all labour? Cheers y

[Peekay34]

Yes it is inclusive with the CAT.

[TypeG]

that's quite pricy for what they are

[Suntzu]

Yeah. It is a fair bit in total. Im im going to drop $4000 + then im going to trade and get a new car with more stock performance and potential. The headers seem the most expensive to me.

Hope we see some info soon as I really want to make my decision about getting a new lease or not. I test drove a Liberty B4 turbo ( 60 00kms manual) yesterday to replace the Euro but found the Euro to be a VASTLY superior car in almost everyway. I was shocked frankly how good the euro was next to a $55 000 car ( when new). Its only the extra power that even make the B4 worth looking at and that was underwhelming.

[tony1234]

Good to see some approx pricing. Was that exhaust price inclusive of the high flow cat? And do you know if these prices include all labour? Cheers y
Pricing is approx.James gave me these prices but i forgot to write them down so am going by memory!Yes it does inc.cat but not labour.Main labour is with reflash.ECU keys and imobiliser has to be sent to Melb.reinstall,dyno and road tune.:(

[yfin]

Pricing is approx.James gave me these prices but i forgot to write them down so am going by memory!Yes it does inc.cat but not labour.Main labour is with reflash.ECU keys and imobiliser has to be sent to Melb.reinstall,dyno and road tune.:(
I was more thinking about the labour cost to fit the headers and exhaust. Obviously that costs something in time - just wondering whether that approx price includes fitment. Happy to wait and see if you don't know.

[Gibbo]

can you elaborate more on the install process please Peekay ?? I live in Mount Isa and there is just no way i could get the car down to melb. for a road tune and afford the hondata products as well... Would they also allow the DIY install of their products and still honour warranty etc.( Oh, Thanks for being the Test dummy for hondata :) we all appreciate the "extra mile" you and your euro have gone for us all..)

[tony1234]

I was more thinking about the labour cost to fit the headers and exhaust. Obviously that costs something in time - just wondering whether that approx price includes fitment. Happy to wait and see if you don't know.
No,pretty certain it doesn't.Labour for exhaust +headers wouldn't be much(2hrs???)

[Peekay34]

can you elaborate more on the install process please Peekay ?? I live in Mount Isa and there is just no way i could get the car down to melb. for a road tune and afford the hondata products as well... Would they also allow the DIY install of their products and still honour warranty etc.( Oh, Thanks for being the Test dummy for hondata :) we all appreciate the "extra mile" you and your euro have gone for us all..)


Of course I don't see why they wouldn't. Thanks for your thanks it has been a long road with this very very long. Anyway should be good. Engine is more responsive I also have DC5 valve gears as well which also makes a big difference as well.

[Chris_F]

I also have DC5 valve gears as well which also makes a big difference as well.

awesome! i really wanna know what sort of gains the extra 25 degrees of duration gives

[tony1234]

Peekay34.What's involved with the DC5 valve gears?could you give us more info(cost,what was replaced etc.)......Thanks.

[martizzle]

don't need hondata jtune!!!.....if u got one of these.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB7zwYCZcaY

[BiLL|z0r]

don't need hondata jtune!!!.....if u got one of these.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB7zw...elated&search=

Bad link d00d.

[martizzle]

Bad link d00d.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB7zwYCZcaY

sorry try again its really worth it, its someone in Japan thrashing a real euro-r.
man it goes hard :thumbsup:

[curik]

this J-tune K24a will thrash that car, right Peekay?

[BusterSonic12]

that's just a stock euroR, right? wouldn't a honda tuned k24 beat it easily? :confused:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB7zwYCZcaY

sorry try again its really worth it, its someone in Japan thrashing a real euro-r.
man it goes hard :thumbsup:

[Peekay34]

Peekay34.What's involved with the DC5 valve gears?could you give us more info(cost,what was replaced etc.)......Thanks.



James did it ask him..... sorry I can't elaborate more. But I am running standard cams only with DC5 gear ...but you also need the Hondata ECU upgrade.

[TypeG]

why would using DC5 running gear will need Hondata ECU upgrade
lol

[tony1234]

James did it ask him..... sorry I can't elaborate more. But I am running standard cams only with DC5 gear ...but you also need the Hondata ECU upgrade.
Do you have reflash or ECU replacement???

[Chris_F]

why would using DC5 running gear will need Hondata ECU upgrade
lol

the vtc mechanism is controled electronicly so with a dc5 valve gear youll need an ecu for it to have any affect...

[Peekay34]

The ECU was reflashed.

[Chris_F]

^ yep, do you knwo the maximum degree of duration the flash allows for? In an article i think i read 45 degrees or so was safe for the k24

[TypeG]

the vtc mechanism is controled electronicly so with a dc5 valve gear youll need an ecu for it to have any affect...

okay... actually any piggyback ecu will do the job

[tony1234]

okay... actually any piggyback ecu will do the job
I've spoken to a few tuners and it's apparently not as simple as that.(don't ask me to explain why!!!!):confused:

[Chris_F]

okay... actually any piggyback ecu will do the job

which piggyback can control the vtc mechanism?

[stephen8512]

i was wondering the same thing

[TypeG]

which piggyback can control the vtc mechanism?

I am asking are there any exist. like the new HKS Fcon IS and E-manage Utlimate

[ALN]

I am asking are there any exist. like the new HKS Fcon IS and E-manage Utlimate


I don't think those 2 piggy back could run VTC tuning or have variable cams tuning. These piggy backs simply features air fuel ratio tuning plus ignition tuning and for the vtec car can adjust the vtec engagement point.:D
so far I found only EFi euro ecus, Motec M 400 or above series(optional to variable cams), Hondata K- Pro, and Hydra ems could run this variable cams tuning. If there is any piggy back could run this features would be very interesting.

[TypeG]

for B series engine, ppl can change cam and value springs without tuning or without tuning with standalone ecu
why would Euro need that?

[Chris_F]

because the euro doesn't have a b series lol

the vtc mechanism is unique to i-vtec engines (its the i in i-vtec) not to mention dbw

[aaronng]

for B series engine, ppl can change cam and value springs without tuning or without tuning with standalone ecu
why would Euro need that?
With Euro, all you can do with a piggyback is change A/F ratios and vtec engagement point. That's it. You can't change timing nor VTC.

[TypeG]

because the euro doesn't have a b series lol

the vtc mechanism is unique to i-vtec engines (its the i in i-vtec) not to mention dbw

ok that's clear

[martizzle]

that's just a stock euroR, right? wouldn't a honda tuned k24 beat it easily? :confused:

Euro-r in daytime http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1NBYPap2cQ

Flash Vs Stock http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyO-XP-ApTA

[yfin]

Ok - it is January 2007. Does anyone have any updates regarding the release of the J-tune packages? :)

[BusterSonic12]

.... sigh... so long

[adammet04]

.... sigh... so long

* 2 to that :)

all i want is the chip now... i dont care anymore about the other j-tune mods...im sure they will be great, im only intersted in the chip..

[Pumped]

Hope its ready soon!!!!!!!!

Been waiting for ages :(

[stephen8512]

wats the odds that they will delay it until next year?

[adammet04]

just looking around the hondattech website, not much activity..

it is the christmas period,

i would hazard a guess and say maybe end of jan or feb is when an announcment must be made.?

maybe they are waiting for 07 model ?

--edit -- Im also glad they didnt do a pre-order in november, I would have been fuming if i was still waiting now for it --

[sodaz]

I'm guessing at least Feb 2007 before they release it.

[Gibbo]

WTF ??? This is crazy - It cant take this long to get a reflash for our car !!! Dude if they are waiting to release all the products together in the hope they will sell more, Tell 'em they're dreamin... We all have money and want it now!!! they are doing more harm than good for their product - I'm starting to have doubts that the reflash is reliable if it needs this many remaps. My 2 cents.

[mugen88]

Like anything that needs developemnt it does take time but I do agree it is taking forever and with very few premature updates.

[yfin]

Hope its ready soon!!!!!!!!

Been waiting for ages :(

lol pumped - you have an 06 Euro so you haven't waited long.

[Pumped]

lol pumped - you have an 06 Euro so you haven't waited long.

:p lol its almost a year old now, its been long enough :p

[tony1234]

Spoke to James mid Dec.He told me mid Jan.:(

[Pumped]

*holds breath*

[msnealo]

Spoke to James mid Dec.He told me mid Jan.:(

Yep he also told you back in September it would be a matter of weeks! I feel sorry for you guys getting stringed along. BUT "good things come to those who wait".

[mr747]

im hanging

[Suntzu]

Yeah im on the cusp of selling my euro to get a faster car but if the mods are decent I can keep it. Its hard to know what to do.

[tony1234]

Yep he also told you back in September it would be a matter of weeks! I feel sorry for you guys getting stringed along. BUT "good things come to those who wait".
I know but i think it'll be worth the wait.150kw ATW sounds good to me.:p

[albii]

don't know about you guys but the whole hondata thing for the euro has got me disinterested.
if it was ready the first time they said it would be ,fair enough but the all new euro will be out in about a year from now and we still have not got it.
i just hope the new 08 euro reflash doesn't take 3.5years to get to us.

[yfin]

don't know about you guys but the whole hondata thing for the euro has got me disinterested.
if it was ready the first time they said it would be ,fair enough but the all new euro will be out in about a year from now and we still have not got it.
i just hope the new 08 euro reflash doesn't take 3.5years to get to us.

I am prepared to wait a bit longer. I just pray the repeated misinformation about release dates is not an indication of what after sales service is going to be like. We will all be screwed if there are problems with the maps as 1. there is no other tuner out there who can reflash the stock ECU, 2. returning the ECU back to the stock map is not possible at the moment - not even dealers can do it. I am quietly confident it will work out.

[euro69]

how is this ECU going????
is it finish yet....
waiting to get it asap......
let me know....

[tony1234]

I am prepared to wait a bit longer. I just pray the repeated misinformation about release dates is not an indication of what after sales service is going to be like. We will all be screwed if there are problems with the maps as 1. there is no other tuner out there who can reflash the stock ECU, 2. returning the ECU back to the stock map is not possible at the moment - not even dealers can do it. I am quietly confident it will work out.
Yeah.I agree.James told me the ECU can be taken back to stock after the reflash.:confused:

[sodaz]

Yeah.I agree.James told me the ECU can be taken back to stock after the reflash.:confused:

I think you can flash it back to stage one but not stock.

[tony1234]

I think you can flash it back to stage one but not stock.
Mmm.you may be right.I'll check with James when i speak to him next about how the JTUNE gear is going!

[Peekay34]

Update New Intake and Extractors have arrived....I have not seen them yet but I can only pray they are correct. With a bit of Luck this will be the end and the final product........

[BusterSonic12]

damn good to hear!!! let us know asap

[tony1234]

Update New Intake and Extractors have arrived....I have not seen them yet but I can only pray they are correct. With a bit of Luck this will be the end and the final product........
Good news Peekay34.Please keep us updated.when you say the extractors have arrived do you mean both headers AND exhaust?:)

[Gibbo]

I'm praying that all this extra research dosen't make the reflash beyond too many peoples budget. I think we are all in agreeance that it will be worth it and the critisim is probably meant to be more constructive (Any products down the track should just be "they will be out when they are out") Cant wait for it !!!!

[Peekay34]

Good news Peekay34.Please keep us updated.when you say the extractors have arrived do you mean both headers AND exhaust?:)

Exhaust section has been complete for a long time the issue has been with the extractors.

[adammet04]

Exhaust section has been complete for a long time the issue has been with the extractors.

How does this stop the selling of the exhaust or chip ? or intake ??

this isnt a flame at you peekay, you know more than all of us about the issues that have happened..

my boss would shoot me if i was to say that A B C cant be released because A not ready even tho they all separate components.

[TypeG]

they want to max the output in which each element may have to re-adjust when an element has been re-design.


How does this stop the selling of the exhaust or chip ? or intake ??

this isnt a flame at you peekay, you know more than all of us about the issues that have happened..

my boss would shoot me if i was to say that A B C cant be released because A not ready even tho they all separate components.

[yfin]

they want to max the output in which each element may have to re-adjust when an element has been re-design.

But the stage 1 and 2 reflash did not require the J-Tune bolt ons. So they could have sold the reflash for 1 and 2 quite a few months ago when it was announced the testing was finished. There are plenty of people who have no interest in pulling out an existing i/h/e setup.

But, that said - if they offered 1 and 2 early that would possibly reduce sales of 3 and 4. I imagine there is a healthy margin in the bolt ons too.

[adammet04]

But the stage 1 and 2 reflash did not require the J-Tune bolt ons. So they could have sold the reflash for 1 and 2 quite a few months ago when it was announced the testing was finished. There are plenty of people who have no interest in pulling out an existing i/h/e setup.

But, that said - if they offered 1 and 2 early that would possibly reduce sales of 3 and 4. I imagine there is a healthy margin in the bolt ons too.

Agreed !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! to a point..

i doubt offering would reduce sales of 3 and 4..there are plenty of people out there wanting an instant hit of power to their cars without bolt-ons (raises hand)..those wanting 3 and 4 would not really be settling with 1 and 2...

its like buildings , people move in the bottom floor when the middle or top not even finished, those who want the extra will wait for it....

[TypeG]

but the point is how JTune think on this matter
like building, 1st floor and 2nd floor is totally the same thing while 1st floor = exhuast and 2nd floor as well = exhuast

Jtune may see it as a whole
will anyone move in an apartment with finished bedroom (exhuast) while the toilet(intake) is still under construction.

[mr747]

i cant wait untill this is ready but i totally agree with you guys

[Chris_F]

these analogies are becoming really confusing

I'm opting for the unfurnished pent house (stand alone tuneable ecu lol)

[adammet04]

but the point is how JTune think on this matter
like building, 1st floor and 2nd floor is totally the same thing while 1st floor = exhuast and 2nd floor as well = exhuast

Jtune may see it as a whole
will anyone move in an apartment with finished bedroom (exhuast) while the toilet(intake) is still under construction.

Lolz

i was talking about an apartment building....

but if we remove the analogies for a second (yes my fault)

The stage one and 2 seem to be reflash only (based on feedback and talk on forums)

the 3 and 4 are with the boltons and reflash..

surely a bolton at stage 3 would not affect a stage 1 reflash..

I also cant believe that a company (with aim of making money as all do) would not release something with instant returns, because of something that isnt perfect...

maybe its not that i cant believe it, but i just dont understand it..

:o :o :o

[ok2]

As the title says. My 2 cents is that maybe they are too much "engineers" wanting a complete and perfect set of products to release and not enough "businessmen" to sell what is ready to go. This assumes that the stage 1 and 2 (?) will not affected by changes required for the later versions. I would assume not but we don't know precisely how they have built it do we.

The real problem, as I see it, is that they are not providing enough feedback to potential customers so here we are all making guesses and getting frustrated or even worse going off to find something else instead. Theirs may be better but if you can't buy it then it just doesn't exist.

[stephen8512]

ive given up hope with JTUNED and hondata as far as im concerned
by the time it comes out, current owners of euros would either be selling their euros to move on to something else, or it will be too expensive, or the new euro will be out before the reflash is....

[Suntzu]

ive given up hope with JTUNED and hondata as far as im concerned
by the time it comes out, current owners of euros would either be selling their euros to move on to something else, or it will be too expensive, or the new euro will be out before the reflash is....

That is the problem alright. Im on the cusp of a new lease or I could release my current '05 model. Im running out of time waiting.

Also theres an issue with the "discount for early adopters" when its released. I would rather wait 5-6 weeks after release to get REAL world comments/results from Hondata customers to see how good it is. Then I would have to pay a premium for not jumping on the unknown performance release special bandwagon.
I would then elect to give it a miss is I could not get it at the same price.

My 2 cents

[TypeG]

ive given up hope with JTUNED and hondata as far as im concerned
by the time it comes out, current owners of euros would either be selling their euros to move on to something else, or it will be too expensive, or the new euro will be out before the reflash is....

bingo

[yfin]

Now I am back in Oz I had the opportunity to call James today about the reflash. He sounds like a top bloke and really enthusiastic about the release. Realistically we are looking at 4 weeks until the pre-order stage (with photos, clips and dyno charts avail) and then the actual hardware and bolt ons will be ready for fitment in about 8 weeks time. The software for the reflash is ready - the wait is mainly for the hardware to conduct the reflash.

James had some interesting things to say about the revised intake (uses a high quality K&N pod). From what I understand it is going to be in a similar position to the injen (behind the bumper and out of the engine bay) but rotated differently. Apparently there is a huge difference in power shown on the dyno by pointing the pod towards the bumper. The induction pipe will be 3 inches. They have conducted lots of testing and found this to be the best design. Sounds very good, however, I think I am sticking with my Icebox for now as I don't want the induction note of a pod style filter and I have just replaced the filter with ITG. James said it is ok if I stay with the Icebox but the output is not as good as the new design.

Not sure if this is subject to change but he said the separate pricing will be $1850 for the 4 muffler exhaust including the high flow cat (which can be purchased seperately for $450). Headers will be $1200 and the intake $450. Reflash will be $1000. There will be some opening specials for the group order (I think he said 10% discount but please don't hold me to that as it was a long conversation and lots to remember).

I asked James how much it will cost to reflash the car back to the "standard" flash (lets say you want to remove all the items and sell the car). It will be $150 :thumbsup: Sounds alright to me. James confirmed that the standard flash can use 95 ron which is also what I wanted to hear.

On another positive note - there will be a few Honda dealers around the country that will be reselling the reflash and apparently honouring warranty in that respect (but only honoured at those dealers). That is one of the reasons why he wants everything perfect before release.

With the stage 4 flash James said there is a dramatic difference compared to stock. I can recall him saying it is much smoother and "power on demand". Very nice. James really recommends aftermarket headers (but not the DC style - I think he said too small primaries and stock headers are better!) and aftermarket exhaust to realise the full potential of the flash.

Please don't be upset if I have got a few of the details incorrect - I did my best to remember the main points. Obviously there is more detail to come. The call was enough to renew my excitement in this :p

[BiLL|z0r]

Sounds good. The bits are a bit more exy than I thought though. $1850 for an exhaust & $1200 for headers, OUCH! Thats $3K just for a full exhaust system. It better be damn good. The reflash price is what I expected though.
Since he'll be reselling to some dealers I understand why it's taken so long. Be nice to put a post up every once and while though to let everyone know. I know he's very busy so the Internet is prolly last on his cards.

I'm hangin out for the auto vs manual dyno's to see how far behind they fall.

[Chris_F]

thanks for the update yfin, I'm sure heaps of euro owners are excited to finally hear some details.

I think $1000 for the reflash is quite reasonable

you didn't get a chance to ask him about the standalone ecu he mentioned on his website?

[yfin]

Sounds good. The bits are a bit more exy than I thought though. $1850 for an exhaust & $1200 for headers, OUCH! Thats $3K just for a full exhaust system. It better be damn good. The reflash price is what I expected though.
Since he'll be reselling to some dealers I understand why it's taken so long. Be nice to put a post up every once and while though to let everyone know. I know he's very busy so the Internet is prolly last on his cards.

I'm hangin out for the auto vs manual dyno's to see how far behind they fall.

Pricing isn't too bad. Hopefully the discount is the 10% I mentioned (or hopefully more) for the pre-order. $1850 sounds a lot for the exhaust but that includes the high flow cat which costs $450. You also need to compare dual exhaust pricing - not single. I had a look on TSX parts to see a rough idea on dual stainless steel exhaust pricing and the Comptech Stainless is $1210 AUD (plus shipping to Oz) which has 1 less muffler. Add shipping, add the cat and the Jtune price doesn't look unreasonable. But of course there are cheaper dual exhausts out there too.

What I don't really understand is why the headers cost $1200 - but we need to remember there are JDM stainless steel headers available for over $2000 (eg Maxim Works).


thanks for the update yfin, I'm sure heaps of euro owners are excited to finally hear some details.

I think $1000 for the reflash is quite reasonable

you didn't get a chance to ask him about the standalone ecu he mentioned on his website?

Nah I didn't ask about the standalone ECU. Give him a call.

[Pumped]

Good to hear some genuine feedback, sounds positive, lets hope all goes well :)

[tony1234]

Good to hear some genuine feedback, sounds positive, lets hope all goes well :)
Yeah.hope there are no more delays.