Does you euro have drift to one side tendency?

[V205]

Hi guys,

Just wondering if your euro have any tendency to drift to one side. I've noticed the '05 demo manual lux was drifting to the right. Also noticed mine (05 lux manual) has the occasional tendency to drift to the right too.

If you wanna take part, please also mention what rims your running (16", 17", aftermarket etc).

Be good if you can mention other cars you've owned in comparison to the euro.

Cheers!

[The-Genesis]

mine used to drift to the left, or pulled the steering on the left side. it fixed it self lol?

[Euro2005]

My standard auto 2005 does not drift.

[PNR888]

2003 Euro Lux with OEM 16" - No problem so far (done 35000km)
With Toyota Camry and Cressida in the past, they have tendency to pull to the left (if you let steering wheel go)

V205, are you sure the road is completely flat? coz If you drive on outer lane, it tend to pull the car to left slightly.

[V205]

It drifts to the right which is why it's stranger as it's against the norm.

I might loosen and retighten the wheel nuts.... or swap the front wheels with the back.


2003 Euro Lux with OEM 16" - No problem so far (done 35000km)
With Toyota Camry and Cressida in the past, they have tendency to pull to the left (if you let steering wheel go)

V205, are you sure the road is completely flat? coz If you drive on outer lane, it tend to pull the car to left slightly.

[Slugoid]

Might need an alignment, especially if you've lowered or changed to different sized rims.

[kam]

arent cars supposed to drift towarsd the left slightly? (in case you fall asleep, or something else, so the car doesnt go into oncoming traffic), thats what ive heard about this 'drifting to the left' in the past...

[bigdongers]

cars will drift slighty due to the camber of the road. Roads are not flat to help water drainage when it rains.

[viperx]

try rotating your tyres and checking your alignment.

[^^v]

if ur really worried... get ur wheels aligned

[Pum[Z]]

My euro drifts to the left... But then again i'm using 35 thick tyres on 19inch wheels & my front suspension is very low...

I'm going to get a wheel alignment soon hopefully it will rectify this problem... Try to get a wheel alignment as well. Most probably u have hit potholes that could be the reason ur car is drifting to one side...

[TwEigh]

With my 18" my car drifted to the left
I have alligned my car 3 times (once at BOBjane, twice at Tyrepower), and still drift to the left untill i cant be bothered anymore..
Probably i will try to get it alligned at HONDA service centre later.

[EuroAccord13]

Normally, it should "drift" to the left hand side a little because of our Right Hand Drive configuration... If you're in Europe or America, the cars there tend to "drift" to the right..

I suggest you have an alignment check on your car....

[V205]

Normally, it should "drift" to the left hand side a little because of our Right Hand Drive configuration... If you're in Europe or America, the cars there tend to "drift" to the right..

I suggest you have an alignment check on your car....


Assuming the alignment is correct... something like this may be needed.

http://www.gsp9700.com/pub/features/StraightTrak_2.cfm

[PNR888]

With my 18" my car drifted to the left
I have alligned my car 3 times (once at BOBjane, twice at Tyrepower), and still drift to the left untill i cant be bothered anymore..
Probably i will try to get it alligned at HONDA service centre later.

Make sure you ask your Honda service department if they do the alignment themself or outsource wheel alignment to outside tyre shops.

With my friend's BMW 3-series. the steering wheel pull to the left straight after alignment at Bob- Jane t-mart. then he had to get a refund and have the problem ractified at BMW service centre. BMW routinely put weights in driver and all passenger's seat to simulate loaded condition and then do the wheel alignment.. BMW charges dearly for alignment.. :thumbdwn:

[Guzzy888]

Hello,

I have an 04 Auto Lux Euro Stock Standard.

This is my second Euro. My 1st one has no alignment problem. Does not drift left/right. But now i have got a 2nd Euro (after my the 1st one has been crashed...), when i got the 2nd Euro I experienced drifting towards the left!! I had not even drove into any pot holes!

I eventually had to do a wheel alignment with my 2nd dealer which cost me $170ish. It didn't fix the problem. This is NOT normal. Then I took the car back, they said one of my front tyre has worn out in some angle, they swapped it (front tyre) from left to right and now it is all straight!!

Just be aware that in some unfortunate circumstances, newly delivered car can have alignment problem. The dealer should have checked it before delivery. I have been told that I should have complaint about the alignment issue early so that it can be done under warranty! but unfortunately i didnt bothered with it until much later on. I thought it will settle by itself but it never did. I do understand that it is a pain!!! Made me want to get rid the car!

However, in your case, drifting RIGHT is quite abnormal. I have heard that due to the camber of the road, it should drift left but only slightly.

You should take your car back to the dealer and have it checked out (maybe alignment)! My car drives very straight now. If you dont do anything about it, it may wear out your tyre which is not good.

Hope this helps.

Guzzy :)

[V205]

'05 Euro Lux have bridgestone re040 tyres which are uni directional. So we can't swap left and right... but only front and rear. Which brings up another interesting question.... WHICH side will the spare tyre be catered for? I haven't bothered to unlock the spare and have a look yet.

Anyway.. I took my car out for another break in session last night and have come to notice that maybe it's not so a drift to the right but the tram tracking on road curves that can sometimes kick the steering to the left or right. It doesn't pull right all the time.. so maybe when it's drifting right.. the slope is actually to the right. Will give it another week or so and see how it goes.


Hello,

I have an 04 Auto Lux Euro Stock Standard.

This is my second Euro. My 1st one has no alignment problem. Does not drift left/right. But now i have got a 2nd Euro (after my the 1st one has been crashed...), when i got the 2nd Euro I experienced drifting towards the left!! I had not even drove into any pot holes!

I eventually had to do a wheel alignment with my 2nd dealer which cost me $170ish. It didn't fix the problem. This is NOT normal. Then I took the car back, they said one of my front tyre has worn out in some angle, they swapped it (front tyre) from left to right and now it is all straight!!

Just be aware that in some unfortunate circumstances, newly delivered car can have alignment problem. The dealer should have checked it before delivery. I have been told that I should have complaint about the alignment issue early so that it can be done under warranty! but unfortunately i didnt bothered with it until much later on. I thought it will settle by itself but it never did. I do understand that it is a pain!!! Made me want to get rid the car!

However, in your case, drifting RIGHT is quite abnormal. I have heard that due to the camber of the road, it should drift left but only slightly.

You should take your car back to the dealer and have it checked out (maybe alignment)! My car drives very straight now. If you dont do anything about it, it may wear out your tyre which is not good.

Hope this helps.

Guzzy :)

[TwEigh]

Make sure you ask your Honda service department if they do the alignment themself or outsource wheel alignment to outside tyre shops.

With my friend's BMW 3-series. the steering wheel pull to the left straight after alignment at Bob- Jane t-mart. then he had to get a refund and have the problem ractified at BMW service centre. BMW routinely put weights in driver and all passenger's seat to simulate loaded condition and then do the wheel alignment.. BMW charges dearly for alignment.. :thumbdwn:

I just looked through my allignment data, BOB Jane, they set the allignment setting to 1998 4 door honda accord :( ...

[VirIIx]

i thought that all cars would drift to the left to some extent, but only marginally.

Brand new my euro didn't drift at all, ever so slightly that u didn't notice, and the steering wheel was straight.

After 14,000km now, there is a more obvious pull to the left - but i'll get that re-aligned and balanced next service coming up.

[PNR888]

'05 Euro Lux have bridgestone re040 tyres which are uni directional. So we can't swap left and right... but only front and rear. Which brings up another interesting question.... WHICH side will the spare tyre be catered for? I haven't bothered to unlock the spare and have a look yet.



I am not sure with 05 Euro Lux, but by logic, Honda should fit sparetyre for Left hand side of the car... (that's what Lexus does for IS200)
Reasons: 1. LHS more likely to cop punctures (Kerb side)
2. LHS wears faster so Spare wheel can be used for tyre rotation on LHS to share the work load of tyres - ie longer tyre life....

Can some one with 05 Lux model check the spare please.. and also weight the wheel if you can...

[whoops21]

My 06 Euro Sport has just barely reached 8,000kms and i'm now experiencing

slight drifting to the right.. i've taken it to get a wheel alignment, and the

checks have all come up clear.

running stock 17" 225s..

the thing is .. the car never use to drift to the right when i first purchased it..:thumbdwn:

[Woogler]

Euro sport. Standard everything.

Mine pulls badly to the right. Only 2 months old now. Reported it straight away. No fix. They are "investigating it" at Honda Aust with Bridgestone.

[EuroDude]

My new Euro's wheel alignment was way out at only 5000km when I got my new rims+tyres (the original tyres were already wearing excessively on the inside of the right front wheel), so I am under the assumption that the honda factory dont do a proper alignment.

When you buy a new car, a proper laser alignment should be done asap to get good tyre life imo.

ps. The car didnt drift to the side at all on flat road, so I guess only the camber setting was out of wack.

[tanalasta]

Euro sport. Standard everything.

Mine pulls badly to the right. Only 2 months old now. Reported it straight away. No fix. They are "investigating it" at Honda Aust with Bridgestone.

Euro Sport - OEM 17" rims with Bridgestone Potenza.

3300km on the odometer, 6 weeks old. And drifts slightly to the right. I don't think it did when I first bought the car so who knows... Certainly don't remember knocking any kerbs significantly hard enough to throw it out of whack!

[Woogler]

Mine has had 2 alignments from 3 days old by the dealer. They also rotated tyres etc. Everything checked out "within specs" I was told. But it still does it. 8 weeks now I have been putting up with it and if anything, it is getting worse. The outside of the drivers tyre is scrubbing. Only 1500 km on the car to date. The dealer acknowledged the fault, but it is now a waiting game for a solution from Honda.

[EuroDude]

@Woogler if its not an alignment issue, maybe the power steering system is faulty? Just a thought...

[Ferrarista]

With my 18" my car drifted to the left
I have alligned my car 3 times (once at BOBjane, twice at Tyrepower), and still drift to the left untill i cant be bothered anymore..
Probably i will try to get it alligned at HONDA service centre later.

Nothing can be done.

Mine drifts to the left and its because its lowered. We put it on the rig (after trying to rectify it twice) and realised that the rear left have a -2.5 deg camber and the rear right had a -3.5 degree. Without a camber kit nothing can be done, saying that though we chaged the toe on the left front to point in abit which helped out.

Problem is i called Pedders and they said that there wasnt any camber kit for the Euro :(

[EuroDude]

There is a camber kit for the euro. Pedders probably only checked their supplier or their own brand range.

There is one the for TSX in the states, which will fit our euro.

Cant remember the link tho... The brand is "SPC"

[Omotesando]

Mine doesn't seem to drift left or right, but, it does tramline a fair bit.
Its actually quite tiring sometimes, especially if the road is rough and you have to fight with the steering wheel.

I like it like this on the weekend. But not when I'm tired after work. :(

[yfin]

Mine has had 2 alignments from 3 days old by the dealer. They also rotated tyres etc. Everything checked out "within specs" I was told. But it still does it. 8 weeks now I have been putting up with it and if anything, it is getting worse. The outside of the drivers tyre is scrubbing. Only 1500 km on the car to date. The dealer acknowledged the fault, but it is now a waiting game for a solution from Honda.
Woogler - like I said, you need to ask your dealer how they are doing the alignment. My dealer told me the car was within spec too (manual check) - I didn't believe them and took it to Tyre Factory for a 4 wheel alignment. They hooked up the lasers and wouldn't you know it - the alignment was out.

[Woogler]

Acknowledged.
Going there in the morning for the scratched instrument cluster and door handle. Will update tomorrow night.

[euro77]

you know, if the dealer can't align your car properly, might wanna get it somewhere else and if that other place can fix it, get your dealer to pay for the cost (if such things can be justified). I had mine lowered, then aligned at tyre power (forgot the suburb but around the north area - recommended by the workshop) and I never have problem since. The car does drift to the left slightly, which I think is normal.

[Woogler]

Update

Nothing could be done by the "touch up guy", which I am glad. It is a new car and I don't want a bodgey fix done. However, the service manager is away and no one knows what to do next unless they talk to him. So after nearly 4 weeks have passed since they scratched my instrument cluster, I am still waiting until other people return to work for their next option.

More to follow......

[Omotesando]

What I hate about the wheel alignment guys is that most of them don't tell you the truth - that your newly paid for and alien technology laser adjusted alignment doesn't even last a week in that exact setting. Ok, if the car's alignment is really bad then it does fix any annoyances, but after that it still seems to get itself slightly mis-aligned only after a short while even if you don't hit anything. :(

[cgspot]

Euro Sport - OEM 17" rims with Bridgestone Potenza.
1100km on the odometer, 4 weeks old, has drifted to the right from day ONE.
Have never knocked any kerbs to throw it out of whack!
At 1000km service was told to wait and it would correct itself.
Didn't accept that and asked for wheel rotation and/or alignment, got the wheel rotation and it is slightly better but not perfect.
Will probably hassle for a wheel alignment soon if it doesn't get better.

Other than this tendancy for the car to drift into ongoing traffic (a major thing) its a great car, hope they can fix this problem?

[clowdz]

Euro Sport - OEM 17" rims with Bridgestone Potenza.
1100km on the odometer, 4 weeks old, has drifted to the right from day ONE.
Have never knocked any kerbs to throw it out of whack!
At 1000km service was told to wait and it would correct itself.
Didn't accept that and asked for wheel rotation and/or alignment, got the wheel rotation and it is slightly better but not perfect.
Will probably hassle for a wheel alignment soon if it doesn't get better.

Other than this tendancy for the car to drift into ongoing traffic (a major thing) its a great car, hope they can fix this problem?

Ditto to that...
Euro Sport 550KM, drifting right since day 1. Will ask the dealer to look at it when I get it serviced.

[Woogler]

Honda is more than aware of the fault. It is common. Their engineers are working with Bridgestone for a fix. It is all to do with the fixed camber it has been suggested.

[avid]

I originally had the 16" rims with Dunlop tyres and absolutely no drifting left or right.Steering was beautiful.After several thousand K's i put on a set of Honda 17" '05 Lux rims and Bridgestone Potenza tyres, i immediately noticed car drifted right,and a slight tendency to tramtrack.That raises a lot of questions about the effect of rim width,rim diameter,tyres and possibly wheel alignment settings mabye needing to be different for the bigger rims.You would think if Honda were taking the problem seriously they would have a resolution by now.Dealership told me about this issue back in January.I think they are just hoping everyone with the problem will get up enough mileage so that they can claim its an alignment problem caused by kerbing or hitting potholes,thus passing the responsibility onto the consumer.In the past if a problem was a design fault, the Japs would fix the design in the next model of the vehicle,and the dealerships would be left to try and pacify the irate customers anyway they could.Whats a worry here is that this problem seems to have been around since the first model 3 years ago and is still happening even in the '06 models.
It would be interesting to also know if anyone has fitted non-directional tyres onto the 17" rims,and if they are still having the drifting issue.That might clear up one possibility at least.

[yfin]

It would be interesting to also know if anyone has fitted non-directional tyres onto the 17" rims,and if they are still having the drifting issue.That might clear up one possibility at least.
Very interesting point to raise. I switched to non directional Dunlop 3000As and the car tracks much straighter and the drift to the left is minimal (different to a pull to the left which is not normal) - but I thought it was the change in suspension, the strut brace, and the alignment which was done at roughly the same time.

It could well be the tires, but I wouldnt have thought that would be the issue.

I also note people talk about alignment here - but dont forget to get your wheels balanced at the same time. The way the tyre is balanced and mounted can impact the way the car tracks.

Has anyone with this problem on 17s tried to dial in the alignment settings for the TSX? Would be interesting to see how the car tracks with those settings - given that car comes with 17s standard. The settings are definately different (I need to go at the moment - someone else will have the numbers).

The shops I have had alignment done only had one alignment setting for the Euro - I was expecting the models with 17s and the revised suspension on the 05 lux would have different settings to the 16s. Perhaps that has been updated now.

[Chris_F]

my car seemed to do this less with the advan sports than it did with the goodyear eagle f1's... i think because the tred is less directional (if that makes sense) - ie tread pattern is different

[yfin]

Honda is more than aware of the fault. It is common. Their engineers are working with Bridgestone for a fix. It is all to do with the fixed camber it has been suggested.

Did your dealer say that the Bridgestone tyres are part of the problem? I had drifting to the left with the OEM Dunlops too.

[Woogler]

The dealer thinks it is the fixed camber because on paper the car should drift right. Honda are suggesting it is the tyres.

This could go on for ages!!!! Bridgestone apparently are not accepting responsibility, I was told.

I think it is obviously the non adjustable camber.

[aaronng]

If it is about camber.... there is a TSB in the US for the TSX where they fix the right rear camber. I wonder if it applies to us in this case.

http://img321.imageshack.us/img321/2042/06007rightrearcamberuw8.gif

[avid]

I havnt been right back through all the US TSX forums,but there doesnt seem to be as much mention of this problem in those forums.Is that right?Can any of you longer term members confirm that?
I'm taking my car into a Fulcrum shop with a very hi-tech Alignment machine soon.It will be interesting to see if the rear camber is correct.I suspect the toe in on my right rear is set too high,as i noticed the old 16" tyre from there was starting to scuff the outer edge.

[tanalasta]

Interesting... my car also drifts ever so slightly on the right although it is quite hard to tell as there are very few roads that are level.

Also on Bridgestone Potenza 17".

Does anyone know of a really good place to have a wheel alignment checked in Perth?

[benthx]

I can confirm that my euro lux 03 auto drifts slightly to the left. I did see in the service history that last service wheel alinment was done.

ben

[yfin]

The dealer thinks it is the fixed camber because on paper the car should drift right. Honda are suggesting it is the tyres.

This could go on for ages!!!! Bridgestone apparently are not accepting responsibility, I was told.

I think it is obviously the non adjustable camber.
The laser alignment can tell Honda immediately whether your car is within spec re the camber at the rear. If it is out of spec then what Aarong has suggested re the control arm is worth exploring - but not if the car is within alignment specification. Otherwise 100% of all Euros would have this issue.

I really think you are being dicked around here. Tell your dealer that I raised the same drift issue more than 2 years ago with Honda - before Honda even sold the Euro with the Bridgestones you have.

[tanalasta]

Does anyone know where I can get a laser alignment in Perth?
And does tyre rotation mean you have to redo your alignment?

[EuroDude]

If our Euro's had that right-rear camber problem, they must have fixed it in 06 since my '06 doesnt have this problem with either the original 16" dunlops or the 17" yoko's.

[aaronng]

If our Euro's had that right-rear camber problem, they must have fixed it in 06 since my '06 doesnt have this problem with either the original 16" dunlops or the 17" yoko's.
Yup, TSB was for 2004 and part of 2005 TSXs. So 2006 TSX and probably our 2006 Euros don't have the problem.

[EuroDude]

hms I bet if Honda just put equal suspension on both front wheels instead of making the left sussy higher, the rear-right camber setup wouldn't have a problem in the first place. :p

[cgspot]

If our Euro's had that right-rear camber problem, they must have fixed it in 06 since my '06 doesnt have this problem with either the original 16" dunlops or the 17" yoko's.

My 06 17" Potenza's had the problem, it got worse over time, up to the 1st service, had a tyre rotation and it seems much better, waiting to see if it develops again.

[avid]

Whats happened to this thread.
Seems to me that this is one of the most critical issues affecting Euro owners.I also think that with the large membership base of OzHonda we are in a unique position to at least eliminate whats NOT causing the problem.So far it appears that it has NOT been rectified in the 2006 model(as evidenced by CGspot and Woogler),that it affects mostly cars with anything bigger than 16"rims(until some other Standard owners post anyway),that 'out of spec' rear camber is not the cause on the majority of cars,that fitment of aftermarket coilovers and sway bars does not affect the problem(for better or worse),that front alignment set to factory specs also does not rectify the problem.
What's left,well possibly it might have something to do with directional tyres,particularly the Potenzas.That(in my case)changing up to Honda 17" rims immediately makes the problem appear.That tyre rotation seems in some cases to reduce the problem and in some cases, eliminate it altogether.Thats it so far,not bad though...i'll bet you couldn't get that much info out of Honda about the problem.
I would like to know what the front castor setting is supposed to be on the Euro, and in particular compare it to the settings on the US TSX.Castor settings closer to 0 degrees can make a vehicle want to go off in whatever direction the road/bumps sends it,whereas(in FWD CAR) more negative castor will help it maintain a centre steering position,and just possibly reduce the tendency to drift.But i also acknowledge that there are a lot of other factors which impact on steering generally as well.Its a fine line between stability and self centering.
I also wonder if in Honda's desire to eliminate front wheel drive torque effects(as they have done so well in the Euro) they havn't inadvertently created another problem.

[Omotesando]

Well I did say on the other post - if the left suspension is higher than the right, than it will upset the balance of everything and very likely be drifting to the side, obviously the RIGHT hand side...

(note: most ppl on here complain of the drift to the right. ome drift to the left however, i noticed.)

Bigger tyres (lower profile) tramline or drift to side much more, that's another reason why 17" might be more apparent with the problem.

Directional tyres also execerbate the problem, especially if the alignment isn't completely correct - they will try more and more to pull to their mis-aligned side to exaggerate the problem.

I don't really suggest it for FWD cars as I would for RWD, but dialling in a slight TOE-OUT angle on the front wheels might be beneficial. Yes it wears out front tyres slightly quicker, but it tracks better medium speed and also turns in much better. Its not good for high speed driving however, you might get slight vibrations above 120kph or something...

[avid]

Whats the toe supposed to be set to on the Euro?Have you tried this yet?

[Omotesando]

I am waiting to wear out my standard tyres as soon as possible (doing crazy wheelspins!) so I could get some better grippier tyres for the wet :)

Someone has posted the TSX settings before, I can't seem to find it again. And yes and no. I haven't got toe-in dialled in on the Euro but I've tried it on other cars, with 0.5 degree each side - it tracks muchm ,uch more dead centre, and the 'initial' turn in feel is much more precise and reassuring during cornering. None of that eerie, 'will I make this corner' kind of feeling, which unfortunately is a weak point with the Euro Accord, compared to say a Mazda 6!

[yfin]

Whats happened to this thread.
Seems to me that this is one of the most critical issues affecting Euro owners.I also think that with the large membership base of OzHonda we are in a unique position to at least eliminate whats NOT causing the problem.So far it appears that it has NOT been rectified in the 2006 model(as evidenced by CGspot and Woogler),that it affects mostly cars with anything bigger than 16"rims(until some other Standard owners post anyway),that 'out of spec' rear camber is not the cause on the majority of cars,that fitment of aftermarket coilovers and sway bars does not affect the problem(for better or worse),that front alignment set to factory specs also does not rectify the problem.
What's left,well possibly it might have something to do with directional tyres,particularly the Potenzas.That(in my case)changing up to Honda 17" rims immediately makes the problem appear.That tyre rotation seems in some cases to reduce the problem and in some cases, eliminate it altogether.Thats it so far,not bad though...i'll bet you couldn't get that much info out of Honda about the problem.
I would like to know what the front castor setting is supposed to be on the Euro, and in particular compare it to the settings on the US TSX.Castor settings closer to 0 degrees can make a vehicle want to go off in whatever direction the road/bumps sends it,whereas(in FWD CAR) more negative castor will help it maintain a centre steering position,and just possibly reduce the tendency to drift.But i also acknowledge that there are a lot of other factors which impact on steering generally as well.Its a fine line between stability and self centering.
I also wonder if in Honda's desire to eliminate front wheel drive torque effects(as they have done so well in the Euro) they havn't inadvertently created another problem.

I had the issue on both the standard 16" and aftermarket 17" rims.

The way I described "the issue" is - the car steers perfectly straight if you hold the wheel with decent grip but if you have a gentle grip on the steering wheel (with both hands) it will drift left.... Some people may experience different degrees of this.

In terms of a solution - on the stock 16" rims - a laser alignment fixed the drift to a great degree. Unfortunately, within a short period - just months - the issue was back again. In my opinion the Euro seems to lose its alignment setting very easily. I wonder whether the Ingalls kit will help as that replaces some of the rear suspension arms.

The issue was the same on the 17" with wider tyres.

But - when I changed the suspension, tyres (non directional), fitted a strut brace and a new laser alignment (unfortunately all about the same time) - the issue has not returned (over 6 months now).

[Woogler]

My experience is the same as yfin. But mine pulls to the right as I have already explained. The car will certainly track straight provided I apply appropriate pressure to the wheel, holding it to the left slightly.

I have had the wheels rotated AND swapped with another new Euro, and wheel alignments done at 2 different dealers with no change. The only outcome was that they identified the camber as being slightly incorrect. I wasn't told which wheel. I will clarify this tomorrow.

I am now trying to be patient and await the HA solution.

[avid]

Yfin,its a pity you couldnt have narrowed down whatever mod it was that fixed your cars drift.If you had to guess,what mod would you reckon cured the problem?
It will be interesting to hear how Woogler goes with Honda.
As i drove home today i tried to really take notice of what the steering was doing.The road is straight (almost no camber)and has just been recoated with incredibly smooth bitumen.Steering is better on this road,but it feels like the steering is balanced on a knife edge,any slight movement of the wheels and the steering feels like it drops 'off centre'(not a good description i know,but very hard to convey exactly how it feels)Its definitely different to the solid feel when the 16" wheels with Dunlops were on the car.

[aaronng]

Yfin,its a pity you couldnt have narrowed down whatever mod it was that fixed your cars drift.If you had to guess,what mod would you reckon cured the problem?
It will be interesting to hear how Woogler goes with Honda.
As i drove home today i tried to really take notice of what the steering was doing.The road is straight (almost no camber)and has just been recoated with incredibly smooth bitumen.Steering is better on this road,but it feels like the steering is balanced on a knife edge,any slight movement of the wheels and the steering feels like it drops 'off centre'(not a good description i know,but very hard to convey exactly how it feels)Its definitely different to the solid feel when the 16" wheels with Dunlops were on the car.
avid, what mods do you have other than your rims?
You run 225/45 R17?

[avid]

Aaronng,nothing else mechanical yet. Bog standard. Considering a set of Tein coilovers and camber kit from a Fulcrum shop up here..Hes also trying to talk me into a rear Whiteline sway bar he sells.The tyres are 225/45/R17 Potenzas.

[yfin]

Yfin,its a pity you couldnt have narrowed down whatever mod it was that fixed your cars drift.If you had to guess,what mod would you reckon cured the problem?
It will be interesting to hear how Woogler goes with Honda.
As i drove home today i tried to really take notice of what the steering was doing.The road is straight (almost no camber)and has just been recoated with incredibly smooth bitumen.Steering is better on this road,but it feels like the steering is balanced on a knife edge,any slight movement of the wheels and the steering feels like it drops 'off centre'(not a good description i know,but very hard to convey exactly how it feels)Its definitely different to the solid feel when the 16" wheels with Dunlops were on the car.

It sounds like you are noticing tramlining more - which is mostly due to a wider contact patch compared to the 16" rims you had.

I am not sure what the exact issue is - but I think lowering the centre of gravity helps both tramlining and the drift.

[badthing]

My 06 Euro Sport with 17" Potenzas just back from 1st service & still drifts slightly to the right, even though wheel alignment had been done.
It's quite noticeable & ocassionally annoying.

[aaronng]

Aaronng,nothing else mechanical yet. Bog standard. Considering a set of Tein coilovers and camber kit from a Fulcrum shop up here..Hes also trying to talk me into a rear Whiteline sway bar he sells.The tyres are 225/45/R17 Potenzas.
I know that going to wider tyres on any car enhances tramlining by a lot. On the Euro with 205/55 R16, the car already tramlines when going over grooves on the road. So I'd imagine 225 would make it even more apparent.

[Omotesando]

My 06 Euro Sport with 17" Potenzas just back from 1st service & still drifts slightly to the right, even though wheel alignment had been done.
It's quite noticeable & ocassionally annoying.

What wheel alignment settings are they, do u have the read outs handy? I haven't done my yet, otherwise I'll put them up, sorry.

2nd question is - does it still pull to the right when you have 1 or more passengers?

I wonder if it is beneficial to do a wheel alignment with a passenger sitting inside it, considering the Euro has now been said to be 'Corner balanced' from factory for 1 person, with one side higher than the other side? :o

[badthing]

What wheel alignment settings are they, do u have the read outs handy? I haven't done my yet, otherwise I'll put them up, sorry.

2nd question is - does it still pull to the right when you have 1 or more passengers?

They didn't give me the settings. I think I will call them up to see if they can let me know what the settings are.

Good question you asked because I only noticed it pulling to the right when I was driving by myself last night. I didn't notice it pulling right when I was driving my friend home. It could be that I'm more sensitive when I'm driving alone as that's the time I drive more enthusiastically.


I wonder if it is beneficial to do a wheel alignment with a passenger sitting inside it, considering the Euro has now been said to be 'Corner balanced' from factory for 1 person, with one side higher than the other side? :o

I wouldn't recommend that unless you have a passenger most of the time. I know I do more spirited driving when I'm by myself so I'm happy to stick with the factory settings (for now). I hope I can get this "steering pulling right" business fixed as I don't like having to constantly correct my steering every few seconds when I'm simply just going straight. Another annoyance is when I turn left, I notice I need to use slightly more effort than when I'm turning right at the same angle. :(

[cgspot]

I have the same issue, it takes more effort to steer to the left than to the right. Drifting or (tramlining?) to the right need to be corrected regularly, however thats not so evident after the wheel rotation.




They didn't give me the settings. I think I will call them up to see if they can let me know what the settings are.

Good question you asked because I only noticed it pulling to the right when I was driving by myself last night. I didn't notice it pulling right when I was driving my friend home. It could be that I'm more sensitive when I'm driving alone as that's the time I drive more enthusiastically.



I wouldn't recommend that unless you have a passenger most of the time. I know I do more spirited driving when I'm by myself so I'm happy to stick with the factory settings (for now). I hope I can get this "steering pulling right" business fixed as I don't like having to constantly correct my steering every few seconds when I'm simply just going straight. Another annoyance is when I turn left, I notice I need to use slightly more effort than when I'm turning right at the same angle. :(

[Omotesando]

I said: "I wonder if it is beneficial to do a wheel alignment with a passenger sitting inside it, considering the Euro has now been said to be 'Corner balanced' from factory for 1 person, with one side higher than the other side?"


MY BAD - I actually wanted to say, with the DRIVER in it.
What was I on about? Sorry to mislead you BADTHING.

If the car has been corner balanced with 1 DRIVER (not passenger) in mind, with different suspension heights, then unless the original wheel alignment settings from factory already caters for this - I believe it is actually good to have the DRIVER sitting in the car when you have the alignment done.

Hope I fixed the confusions..... My brain was thinking 1 passenger = the Driver lol!

[benthx]

Hello Guys

I will be the first to acknowledge that I am new to honda and all things technical. :o I am however skeptical about the statement

"considering the Euro has now been said to be 'Corner balanced' from factory for 1 person, with one side higher than the other side?"

From who did this information come from? The next thing you will hear that it is also dependant on the body weight of the person. We did the testing on person X who weighed X. But variations in body weight and height can affect the overall results.

It is like Home Theater setups costing many tens of thousands of dollars. If you are happy with it, then you are sold. If you are not and state accurate negative comments. Then the response will usually be, "oh its not actually set up properly yet"

Ben

[aaronng]

I said: "I wonder if it is beneficial to do a wheel alignment with a passenger sitting inside it, considering the Euro has now been said to be 'Corner balanced' from factory for 1 person, with one side higher than the other side?"


MY BAD - I actually wanted to say, with the DRIVER in it.
What was I on about? Sorry to mislead you BADTHING.

If the car has been corner balanced with 1 DRIVER (not passenger) in mind, with different suspension heights, then unless the original wheel alignment settings from factory already caters for this - I believe it is actually good to have the DRIVER sitting in the car when you have the alignment done.

Hope I fixed the confusions..... My brain was thinking 1 passenger = the Driver lol!
According to my BMW fanatic friend, they (BMW) do alignment and balancing with a person sitting in the driver's seat.

[aaronng]

Hello Guys

I will be the first to acknowledge that I am new to honda and all things technical. :o I am however skeptical about the statement

"considering the Euro has now been said to be 'Corner balanced' from factory for 1 person, with one side higher than the other side?"

From who did this information come from? The next thing you will hear that it is also dependant on the body weight of the person. We did the testing on person X who weighed X. But variations in body weight and height can affect the overall results.

It is like Home Theater setups costing many tens of thousands of dollars. If you are happy with it, then you are sold. If you are not and state accurate negative comments. Then the response will usually be, "oh its not actually set up properly yet"

Ben
It's because the Euros sit 1cm lower on the right front side while TSX sit 1cm lower on the left front. Based on corner balancing, the side with more weight should be lower in ride height through suspension height in order to balance the weight with the opposite corner.

Supposedly this was confirmed in a Best Motoring DVD as well that Honda balances the car for 1 driver when doing track testing. BTW, the JDM Accord's chassis was tested at the Nurburgring (source: Autocar UK, 11 June 2002).

[Omotesando]

According to my BMW fanatic friend, they (BMW) do alignment and balancing with a person sitting in the driver's seat.

That's good to hear they actually go to that extent.

I have service due soon. I will ask my Honda dealer if they do this.

And if they don't, I'll ask them to do it, or I'll go to do an independent wheel balance and wheel alignment with myself sitting in it :)

Seriously though, my car doesn't pull either side. I'm quite happy as it is for the time being :)

[timofytit]

Try drive the car from the passenger side, that should make it tend to drift the other way. Hehehe

[EuroDude]

Does anyone here with an 06 Euro Standard have this problem? It seems like everyone who posted has either a Lux or Sports model, which has different sussy to the Standard Euro's.

[Hoyle]

Just took my 06 Euro Sports in today for its first service with slight drift to the right. They "adjusted the steering wheel" (as if that would help when you're not actually touching the wheel!) and supposedly did an alignment.

The result? It now pulls harder to the right and the steering wheel no longer points straight. Not happy with my first experience with Honda service, and I've told them so. Waiting for a call back from service...

[ZEi20T]

They "adjusted the steering wheel" ...

hahaha! wow its a wonder they didnt tell you to hold your head to one side to correct it!

[Hoyle]

hahaha! wow its a wonder they didnt tell you to hold your head to one side to correct it!

Yeah I tried that, it didn't help.

Anyway, took my car back in the afternoon and apparently Honda have told them to adjust something in the undercarriage (sorry, I can't remember what it was...) that isn't normally adjustable to put it straight.

That would be the tie rods...

So they've put the steering wheel back straight again now, but I'll have to wait and see on the alignment. I think its straight, but not 100% sure yet.

[euroflyboy]

My lux had a similar problem from new. When you held the steering wheel straight, the car drifted slightly to the right, as though the wheel had not been put on straight. Complained about this at the 1000km service and of course they sayed that everything checked out OK. Was really peed off so the mechanic came for a run in the car with me so I could show him what the problem was. He conceeded that there was a problem He sayed that they can correct this by adjusting the tie rods at the front of the car. I booked it in the following Monday and problem solved! Car now tracks straight and true and the steering wheel now perfect. Hope this helps some guys out there with the same problem.

[Omotesando]

My lux had a similar problem from new. When you held the steering wheel straight, the car drifted slightly to the right, as though the wheel had not been put on straight. Complained about this at the 1000km service and of course they sayed that everything checked out OK. Was really peed off so the mechanic came for a run in the car with me so I could show him what the problem was. He conceeded that there was a problem He sayed that they can correct this by adjusting the tie rods at the front of the car. I booked it in the following Monday and problem solved! Car now tracks straight and true and the steering wheel now perfect. Hope this helps some guys out there with the same problem.


That's great to hear its been fixed. Seems like there was a 'toe angle' problem on one or both wheels?

I was actually thinking to have my tie-rods looked at for next service as well, because even though my car tracks straight - it has a major bumpsteer problem. Everytime I drive pass a pothole, unlevelled surface or a bump, the car pulls to one side much more than tramlining would... :(

Actually I wonder if you notice any problems like this after the change? Since the tie-rod length from factory should be set to a default setting I think.

[euroflyboy]

No, I havent noticed any changes like you have mentioned, it only seems to tramline slightly on an uneven surface, but this appears to be normal with 17 inch wheels. It appears to be no better or worse than my previous car which was a Mazda 3 SP23 which also had 17s. I would suggest you have the tie rods looked at if yours seems to pull a lot to one side, more than normal tramlining. Good luck.

[Woogler]

Yesterday the dealer turned my front tyres around on the rims. THE PROBLEM WENT AWAY!!!!

I have new tyres on order. HA tell me Bridgestone don't wanna help the HA engineers out with fixing the problem. But I will wait and see what the outcome is after the new tyres are fitted next week.

[SpeedBird]

On the Luxury model for 2006. The Bridgestone Potenza 225/45 17 91W spare tyre is set up for the RIGHT HAND SIDE USE ONLY, it has a sticker on the bottom of the wheel well saying if you use it on the left side, make sure you repair or replace that flat tyre as soon as possible.

[yfin]

Yesterday the dealer turned my front tyres around on the rims. THE PROBLEM WENT AWAY!!!!

I have new tyres on order. HA tell me Bridgestone don't wanna help the HA engineers out with fixing the problem. But I will wait and see what the outcome is after the new tyres are fitted next week.

Great stuff Woogler. I was sure the dealer tried a different set of tyres already? Directional tyres are a pain in the ass.

[Woogler]

Yes Yfin they did. From another vehicle which makes me dubious about this situation. But they reckon it was noticeably different with the tyres changed around.

[LXRY]

Yep my 06 euro lux drifts to the right side, when roads cambers to the right, camber problem i think? not alignment...dealership even stated this. It happened about 4,000 klm mark...complained to dealership, got the run around. They adjusted something according to them(did not pull AS much after this) . Did not resolve the issue though....Went back again told me that- all euro's pull to the right, your driving a fwd, you bought a sports car, it's because of the low profile tyres, three mechanics drove it and could not find anything wrong with it and told me not too worry because honda has plenty of money and if something happens down the track they would pay for it have never heard such CRAP before made me look stupid, very upset....I'm going into the dealership again to complain if that doesnt work will contact honda customer relations. This is a serious issue for me as it effects my driving experience. I can't believe the nerve of these mechanics.

[EuroAccord13]

*Hush Hush Info from Honda Insider* ----> No I am not the insider!!!!

I was told of this recently, besides the fact that we drift to the left a little because of us driving on the left hand side, the other reason is because of the car's sub frame, dealerships now know of this issue as countless wheel alignments have yielded nothing and after checking with Honda HQ it was found to be the sub frame. To correct this problem, the sub frame needs to be adjusted slightly to correct this issue...

[Woogler]

Hi LXRY,

Stick to your guns mate. HA need more people to complain about this problem because I was told I was "the first" to bring this to their attention. Yet once the topic was listed on here, the real story comes out.

I also am so dissapointed with my Euro due to the steering really wrecking the experience. It is so annoying, constantly holding the wheel to one side, always having to stay very focussed on the way the car is moving over the road as it tries to fight itself. I am having my front tyres replaced mid week but I have a sneaking suspicion that this is not the real problem. But I have never had directional tyres on a car before so I am unable to make an informed comment.

I suggest if your dealer plays stupid about the problem, then perhaps they are. I started treating mine with such contempt and started giving them solutions. Not a good sign of the times. In fact, HA have failed to return my last 2 phone enquiries about an update of their "search for a solution to the problem" which has been going for 3 months.

Good luck. I am interested to hear how you go.

[Woogler]

Adjust the subframe slightly? I am assuming this involves bending or twisting it?

[Onrmnd]

*Hush Hush Info from Honda Insider* ----> No I am not the insider!!!!

I was told of this recently, besides the fact that we drift to the left a little because of us driving on the left hand side, the other reason is because of the car's sub frame, dealerships now know of this issue as countless wheel alignments have yielded nothing and after checking with Honda HQ it was found to be the sub frame. To correct this problem, the sub frame needs to be adjusted slightly to correct this issue...


I also have a friend who could be called a honda insider. She claims that they have had multiple complaints with this issue and apparently they changed 4 tires on a car as the customer complained so much and she stated " It fixed the problem" I don't know if this is the full repair they did, but i have been told from her lips that this is what the dealership had done.:o

[yfin]

*Hush Hush Info from Honda Insider* ----> No I am not the insider!!!!

I was told of this recently, besides the fact that we drift to the left a little because of us driving on the left hand side, the other reason is because of the car's sub frame, dealerships now know of this issue as countless wheel alignments have yielded nothing and after checking with Honda HQ it was found to be the sub frame. To correct this problem, the sub frame needs to be adjusted slightly to correct this issue...
ahh an insider hey?! Well if they are adjusting the sub frame that sounds like the issue is with unequal camber left and right (rear). So even though the rear camber is within spec it might be uneven left and right.

It raises a question though - do people who have a camber kit fitted have the pull on the steering to either side?

ps - I am happy to be proven wrong on this but I seriously doubt this is a tyre only problem. I had the same issue on the OEM Dunlops and it reoccured later with Falken 512s. I also find it a bit surprising that the issue occurs on both the OEM Dunlops and now the OEM 17" Bridgestones. All 3 brands of tyres can't be defective. This has to be an alignment or suspension issue. I swap suspension and do an alignment and the issue goes away?

Something is not right and quite frankly I am surprised how difficult it has been for some of you to get resolution from Honda. Hopefully there will be a definitive answer soon. If it is unequal camber that is a relatively easy fix.

[avid]

I wonder if,rather than a camber issue as a result of subframe misalignment,it is more a problem of unequal wheelbase on either side of the car?This would change the thrust angle and cause the car to try and move to the side with the shorter wheelbase.Just a thought,because its not always checked on some wheel alignment machines,and when it is found, is often ignored as they cant do anything about it anyway.

[yfin]

I wonder if,rather than a camber issue as a result of subframe misalignment,it is more a problem of unequal wheelbase on either side of the car?This would change the thrust angle and cause the car to try and move to the side with the shorter wheelbase.Just a thought,because its not always checked on some wheel alignment machines,and when it is found, is often ignored as they cant do anything about it anyway.
Interesting point - who checks the distance between the centre of the front wheels and the centre of the rear wheels?

That would be an easy check to do - even at home. So if people are having this problem get out the measuring tape and let us know if there are differences between left and right ;)

[avid]

I thought i also heard somewhere that the Euro has some form of supplemental electric power steering assist.If that is true,could that be affecting steering in some way.If it was via electric motor could it be as a result of voltage fluctuations in the system.I could be way off here with this theory and the electric assist may be a complete load of crap,i dont know, but i'm trying to think beyond the usual suspension/alignment/tyres ideas.

[cgspot]

Interesting point
Who knows ... Honda?

A wheel rotation minimized the pull/drift/tramtracking to the right on my 06 sports with the supplied Potenza 225/45 17 @ 1000K, however after another 1000K the problem is happening again, BUT, not all he time.
Stranger than fiction (to quote Split Enz)
In this case it might be Stranger than Friction....


I thought i also heard somewhere that the Euro has some form of supplemental electric power steering assist.If that is true,could that be affecting steering in some way.If it was via electric motor could it be as a result of voltage fluctuations in the system.I could be way off here with this theory and the electric assist may be a complete load of crap,i dont know, but i'm trying to think beyond the usual suspension/alignment/tyres ideas.

[aaronng]

I thought i also heard somewhere that the Euro has some form of supplemental electric power steering assist.If that is true,could that be affecting steering in some way.If it was via electric motor could it be as a result of voltage fluctuations in the system.I could be way off here with this theory and the electric assist may be a complete load of crap,i dont know, but i'm trying to think beyond the usual suspension/alignment/tyres ideas.
Hmm, the Euro's power steering is fully run through the hydraulic power steering pump. It does not have any electrical assistance. I don't see any cables running in and out of the PS pump. It's the EuroR that has electrical power steering.

[Omotesando]

Didn't someone already mentioned they fixed the problem by adjusting with the Tension Rods and most possibly playing with the Toe angles?

Not sure if it was missed. Give this a try first.

As for subframes, I would have thought they come with rather soft bushings from standard anyway, so they shouldn't exactly alter the rear camber enough to steer the car to one side.

[LXRY]

My car was ok till 4000 to 6000 klm's then started pulling to the right HARD (I took it easy too)....when they supposedly adjusted whatever they adjusted it sort of fixed it a little bit but was still doing it not as much and most important my steering wheel was at 12:15 after they done whatever they done.....what would cause my steering wheel to be out? According to the dealership it wasn't the alignment they where 100% about that and I sort of believe them too cause iit doesn't do it on a straight road but the slightest camber and she pulls to the right.

[Woogler]

Mine does it on a dead flat road, and if the road is cambered, well then it is ridiculous!

[V205]

Is this a documented fix from Honda yet?

The demo that I drove was very obvious with drifting to the right. My 2005 euro lux when delivered new had the same feel but not as much as the demo. My car has done almost 10,000km now and It is still there. My 2002 CRV tracks normal without having too much weight difference between left and right turns.

[aaronng]

Looks like everyone who is complaining has the 17" rims with Bridgestones...

[cgspot]

Looks like everyone who is complaining has the 17" rims with Bridgestones...

If this is the case, how many have this complaint?

If there are sufficient numbers, maybe we could be proactive on mass?

May I suggest that everyone with this issue phone the Customer service Number Freecall 1800 804 954 next week????

OR: is there something else we could do?

[LXRY]

We should start with a list first I think to get an idea of numbers.

It's best we work together, I already got the run around from my dealer twice.

Give some detail on which euro you have whether it's a sports, luxury or standard, the size of rims and tyres and what year your euro is and klm's etc.

Then we work together and resolve the issue once and for all. Customer service sounds good we set a day and ALL call on that day, one customer every hour depending on how many of us there are.

That should give them a bit of a wake up call.

I'll start the list off here goes-

LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 13000 klm

[cgspot]

We should start with a list first I think to get an idea of numbers.

It's best we work together, I already got the run around from my dealer twice.

Give some detail on which euro you have whether it's a sports, luxury or standard, the size of rims and tyres and what year your euro is and klm's etc.

Then we work together and resolve the issue once and for all. Customer service sounds good we set a day and ALL call on that day, one customer every hour depending on how many of us there are.

That should give them a bit of a wake up call.

I'll start the list off here goes-

LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 13000 klm

I'll add to that (I've cut and pasted from the quote to add to the list....but maybe the guys running the thread have an easier solution?


List of drifting Euro's

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 2400klm

[clowdz]

My car is booked in today to get this problem corrected.. but until then.

06 Manual Sports. Stock 17" w/ Bridgestone Potenza RE040 225/45 R17.
1200KM's. Pulling Right since day 1.

[LXRY]

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 2400klm
3- clowdz -06 Manual Sports. Stock 17" w/ Bridgestone Potenza RE040 225/45 R17.
1200KM's. Pulling Right since day 1

Let us know how you go cloudz.........good luck.

[clowdz]

I am happy to report the problem has been fixed!

It was very weird driving the car on the way home as I kept trying to correct the pull which was no longer there! But I don't know how long it will stay like this as I've noticed a few people say the problem resurfaced a few thousand KM's after the wheel alignment (which is what I got). I'll report back if / when the problem returns... *fingers crossed*. :)

[tanalasta]

With only a slight right camber - drifts significantly to the right, particular at low speed. It's not so bad at higher freeway speeds on a straight camber.

Euro Sport with OEM Bridgestone REO40 17". 6300km

[V205]

V205 - 05 Lux (17" Bridgestone RE040 225/45/17, 9300km, noticable self drift to the right).

Being the starter of this thread, I should point out that there's many ways to 'fix' this problem. I'm very wary of all the wrong ways and warn that it should only be done when the cause if definite. At this point, the subframe adjustment seems to be the most plausible.

Some of the wrong ways would be adjusting the camber or toe of the front tyres to cancel out the pull caused by a subframe issue. Or changing tyres.

I originally thought it may be tyres. But after reading this many others noticing the pull to the right, it's very unlikely for this many people to get a bad tyre in the same configuration that leads to pulling in the same direction.

Who was mentioning the centre of the front and back tyres of both sides could be different and that may be the cause? Is that the result of the subframe misalignment?


1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts to the right 2400klm
3- clowdz -06 Manual Sports. Stock 17" w/ Bridgestone Potenza RE040 225/45 R17.
1200KM's. Pulling Right since day 1

Let us know how you go cloudz.........good luck.

[cgspot]

Seems to be a pattern occuring re: (17" Bridgestone RE040 225/45/17)???

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 2400klm
3 - clowdz-06 Sports.(17" Bridgestone Potenza) Pulling Right day 1 1200KM's
4 - tanalasta - Euro Sport with (17" OEM Bridgestone) strong pull right 6300km
5 - V205 - 05 Lux (17" Bridgestone) , drift to the right, 9300km.

[euroflyboy]

I Have 06 Lux Auto on standard rims and tyres. I never had the drifting problem but my seering wheel was not straight. The bottom spoke of the wheel was around about the 5 oclock position when the car was tracking dead straight. At the 1000 km service they adjusted the tie rods at the front and it is now perfect. Wheel is now dead centre and no drift or pulling.

[tony1234]

Seems to be a pattern occuring re: (17" Bridgestone RE040 225/45/17)???

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 2400klm
3 - clowdz-06 Sports.(17" Bridgestone Potenza) Pulling Right day 1 1200KM's
4 - tanalasta - Euro Sport with (17" OEM Bridgestone) strong pull right 6300km
5 - V205 - 05 Lux (17" Bridgestone) , drift to the right, 9300km.
I swapped my original tyres with Conti sport contact 2 from new and don't have any of the problems that you guys are talking about!!!Bridgestones look like the culprit!

[Ferrarista]

I havent got bridgestones yet mine does it but its because mine is lowered

[tony1234]

I havent got bridgestones yet mine does it but its because mine is lowered
Mine's lowered as well!Iv'e got approx.4800kms.

[Hoyle]

Mine (2006 Euro Sport) was drifting to the right from new. After the 1000 km service (after stuffing it up the first time), they adjusted the tie-rods which has now fixed the problem (at first I wasn't sure).

My new car now tracks nice and straight. Now if only I could get rid of the seatbelt beep...

[tony1234]

Mine (2006 Euro Sport) was drifting to the right from new. After the 1000 km service (after stuffing it up the first time), they adjusted the tie-rods which has now fixed the problem (at first I wasn't sure).

My new car now tracks nice and straight. Now if only I could get rid of the seatbelt beep...
After getting my car lowered i,of course got a 4 wheel alignment.I think a good wheel alignment has a lot to do with eliminating the drifting issues that some of the guys are having.I think the alignment from the factory leaves a lot to be desired!!!!:honda:

[LXRY]

After getting my car lowered i,of course got a 4 wheel alignment.I think a good wheel alignment has a lot to do with eliminating the drifting issues that some of the guys are having.I think the alignment from the factory leaves a lot to be desired!!!!:honda:


If it has something to do with the alignment from factory it would have done it straight away. Mine started at 4000klm's and dealership knew it wasn't alignment problem, I asked them to do it twice they assured me it wasn't alignment, plus it doesn't do it when it's on a straight road, runs perfectly straight on a straight road....only when road cambers.

[LXRY]

Mine (2006 Euro Sport) was drifting to the right from new. After the 1000 km service (after stuffing it up the first time), they adjusted the tie-rods which has now fixed the problem (at first I wasn't sure).

My new car now tracks nice and straight. Now if only I could get rid of the seatbelt beep...


how many klm's has your car done since it was fixed?

[Woogler]

Lets hook in. Enough is enough. Where is this outstanding HA customer service? Sounds like a prophecy!

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 2400klm
3 - clowdz-06 Sports.(17" Bridgestone Potenza) Pulling Right day 1 1200KM's
4 - tanalasta - Euro Sport with (17" OEM Bridgestone) strong pull right 6300km
5 - V205 - 05 Lux (17" Bridgestone) , drift to the right, 9300km.
6 - Woogler - 06 Euro sports (17" bridgestone potenza's) Pulls right since day one! 2700km's now.

[yfin]

If it has something to do with the alignment from factory it would have done it straight away. Mine started at 4000klm's and dealership knew it wasn't alignment problem, I asked them to do it twice they assured me it wasn't alignment, plus it doesn't do it when it's on a straight road, runs perfectly straight on a straight road....only when road cambers.

well what is wrong with the car then? It is perfectly normal for the car to follow the camber in the road.

[LXRY]

well what is wrong with the car then? It is perfectly normal for the car to follow the camber in the road.

If I knew what was was wrong I would be helping everyone on this thread.
I'm not the only one in this thread with this problem.

If it was as simple as alignment wouldn't it pull ALL the time, camber or straight road? Like i said in one of my previous post's only when road cambers not on straight road tracks perfectly straight on straight road.

I seem to be able to turn right without turning my steering wheel when road cambers (turning right only, not left). This does not happen when I'm turning left, only right. I am always fighting my steering to the left, not my right, when road CAMBERS. I am no expert on alignment or camber, but I know it's not alignment (IMO). Dont you think if it was alignment problem that honda dealership would of done it? After all I'm paying for it. I've been twice and asked them to do an alignment they keep telling me my car doesn't need it(nothing wrong with it according to them).
I'm pretty sure that I've read other ppl have done alignments on their euro's with no success.

With my 18" my car drifted to the left
I have alligned my car 3 times (once at BOBjane, twice at Tyrepower), and still drift to the left untill i cant be bothered anymore..
Probably i will try to get it alligned at HONDA service centre later.

My 06 Euro Sport has just barely reached 8,000kms and i'm now experiencing

slight drifting to the right.. i've taken it to get a wheel alignment, and the

checks have all come up clear.

running stock 17" 225s..

the thing is .. the car never use to drift to the right when i first purchased it..:thumbdwn:

I'm not here to criticise anyone on whether i'm right or they're wrong this is about a problem alot of us have with our euro's only here to help ;)

[cgspot]

[QUOTE=LXRY]
If it was as simple as alignment wouldn't it pull ALL the time, camber or straight road? Like i said in one of my previous post's only when road cambers not on straight road tracks perfectly straight on straight road.

I seem to be able to turn right without turning my steering wheel when road cambers (turning right only, not left). This does not happen when I'm turning left, only right. I am always fighting my steering to the left, not my right, when road CAMBERS. [QUOTE]

As also mentioned earlier - mine started veering to the right @ approx. 500Klm's, had a wheel rotation @ 1000Klm's which minimized the veer. Now again @ approx. 2000Klm's it's started up again.

Hard to steer to the left, easy to the right and it veer's to the right.
I know if I go back for a service I'll get the run around .... so with SIX of us now and maybe more, we might be getting close to really being able to isolate the problem??? But, I'm still no wiser on this issue.

Yes ... it's frustrating and disappointing

[tony1234]

[QUOTE=LXRY]
If it was as simple as alignment wouldn't it pull ALL the time, camber or straight road? Like i said in one of my previous post's only when road cambers not on straight road tracks perfectly straight on straight road.

I seem to be able to turn right without turning my steering wheel when road cambers (turning right only, not left). This does not happen when I'm turning left, only right. I am always fighting my steering to the left, not my right, when road CAMBERS. [QUOTE]

As also mentioned earlier - mine started veering to the right @ approx. 500Klm's, had a wheel rotation @ 1000Klm's which minimized the veer. Now again @ approx. 2000Klm's it's started up again.

Hard to steer to the left, easy to the right and it veer's to the right.
I know if I go back for a service I'll get the run around .... so with SIX of us now and maybe more, we might be getting close to really being able to isolate the problem??? But, I'm still no wiser on this issue.

Yes ... it's frustrating and disappointing
I think it's a combination of low profile tyres,tyre brand and possibly tyre pressure! and a good wheel alignment.My past exp with new cars(i've bought 6)is that the alignment(also steering wheel is not centred) is never right from the factory.I always get one done in the 1st week.that's all i can suggest:confused:

[yfin]

If I knew what was was wrong I would be helping everyone on this thread.
I'm not the only one in this thread with this problem.

If it was as simple as alignment wouldn't it pull ALL the time, camber or straight road? Like i said in one of my previous post's only when road cambers not on straight road tracks perfectly straight on straight road.

I seem to be able to turn right without turning my steering wheel when road cambers (turning right only, not left). This does not happen when I'm turning left, only right. I am always fighting my steering to the left, not my right, when road CAMBERS. I am no expert on alignment or camber, but I know it's not alignment (IMO). Dont you think if it was alignment problem that honda dealership would of done it? After all I'm paying for it. I've been twice and asked them to do an alignment they keep telling me my car doesn't need it(nothing wrong with it according to them).
I'm pretty sure that I've read other ppl have done alignments on their euro's with no success.
;)

What I was getting at is there is nothing wrong with your car. If on a straight road the car goes straight - there is nothing wrong. The problem people are describing here is a PULL or DRIFT to either side on a perfectly flat road. It is normal for the Euro to follow the camber in the road - that is why you need to hold the steering wheel.

[LXRY]

What I was getting at is there is nothing wrong with your car. If on a straight road the car goes straight - there is nothing wrong. The problem people are describing here is a PULL or DRIFT to either side on a perfectly flat road. It is normal for the Euro to follow the camber in the road - that is why you need to hold the steering wheel.

You sound like the mechanics at my dealerships...my tyres are worn only after 13000klm's, I hate my car now, will never buy a Honda again if it doesn't get fixed....You have to drive my car to understand what I mean and now i know I'm not the only one with this problem. You have to understand that my car was really bad before they done something to it at the dealership which sort of fixed it, sort of still doing it...Just for you I will go for a wheel alignment tomm. for the sake of saying I have done it. Frustrated and upset....

[cgspot]

You sound like the mechanics at my dealerships...my tyres are worn only after 13000klm's, I hate my car now, will never buy a Honda again if it doesn't get fixed....You have to drive my car to understand what I mean and now i know I'm not the only one with this problem. You have to understand that my car was really bad before they done something to it at the dealership which sort of fixed it, sort of still doing it...Just for you I will go for a wheel alignment tomm. for the sake of saying I have done it. Frustrated and upset....

Any Luck?

[Woogler]

My dealer service mgr said today that "Honda have now set a standard of acceptable drift. The car must move the distance of one full lane in less than 6 seconds to be seen as defective."

Mine does this, but if you get this lame excuse I suggest you engage the Department of fair trading. I intend to if the vehicle does not have the problem rectified.

I purchased this $40k+ vehicle with an expectation of quality. The truth is, I can buy a Korean rice burner for a fraction of the cost that steers perfectly straight! :thumbdwn:

[cgspot]

My dealer service mgr said today that "Honda have now set a standard of acceptable drift. The car must move the distance of one full lane in less than 6 seconds to be seen as defective."

Mine does this, but if you get this lame excuse I suggest you engage the Department of fair trading. I intend to if the vehicle does not have the problem rectified.

I purchased this $40k+ vehicle with an expectation of quality. The truth is, I can buy a Korean rice burner for a fraction of the cost that steers perfectly straight! :thumbdwn:

I wonder if the figure of six seconds (at what speed?) was arrived at because six of us have the problem, in time with a few more complaints it might be increased to 8 seconds. I'm not sure I'd want to allow mine to drift for that long as the oncoming traffic would look somewhat daunting.
Did they say what can be done in any case?
Thanks

[LXRY]

My dealer service mgr said today that "Honda have now set a standard of acceptable drift. The car must move the distance of one full lane in less than 6 seconds to be seen as defective."

Mine does this, but if you get this lame excuse I suggest you engage the Department of fair trading. I intend to if the vehicle does not have the problem rectified.

I purchased this $40k+ vehicle with an expectation of quality. The truth is, I can buy a Korean rice burner for a fraction of the cost that steers perfectly straight! :thumbdwn:

I agree Woogler still waiting for my car alignment, although I think I've wasted my money...I have filled out a safety report before (consumer affairs) but they can't chase it up until several reports have been made, I think we should set a day and call customer relations first, then if that doesn't work, safety report will work i guarentee this. I'll set the date if you all dont mind let's say Monday 18th sept, next week to call customer relations (Honda). Will post later when I get my car back from alignment...I am about to call my dealership again to try to rectify this problem...This is also a safety issue IMO

[yfin]

You sound like the mechanics at my dealerships...my tyres are worn only after 13000klm's, I hate my car now, will never buy a Honda again if it doesn't get fixed....You have to drive my car to understand what I mean and now i know I'm not the only one with this problem. You have to understand that my car was really bad before they done something to it at the dealership which sort of fixed it, sort of still doing it...Just for you I will go for a wheel alignment tomm. for the sake of saying I have done it. Frustrated and upset....

LXRY - perhaps you can describe your problem in more detail. If your car steers straight on a flat road it is a different issue to what other people are experiencing in this thread. Are you saying your car drifts off the road on a slanted road? If it does - that does not sound abnormal. If I was you and still concerned I would ask the dealership to loan you another Euro at the dealership and take it for a long drive. See if it is any different.

If you do get a wheel alignment get a laser alignment and a print out of the cars specifications.

Woogler - re that 6 second lane change business - I got the same story from my dealership when I raised it in early 2004. I wonder why you guys are all reporting a drift to the right - mine was a drift to the left. Weird.

[aaronng]

All those with the problem have to differentiate between tramlining and drifting (not the sport).
Tramlining is when the car pulls to the side when going over grooves, road camber or even little potholes on the road. When accelerating, this is enhanced even more. When the road is perfect and straight, your car tracks straight while only needing your hand to be resting on the wheel. If this is what you experience, then it is a normal trait of the Euros.

Drifting on the other hand is the car pulling itself to the left or right when you are on a perfectly flat road with no surface defects and just resting your hand on the wheel is not enough to prevent the slight direction change.

[yfin]

All those with the problem have to differentiate between tramlining and drifting (not the sport).
Tramlining is when the car pulls to the side when going over grooves, road camber or even little potholes on the road. When accelerating, this is enhanced even more. When the road is perfect and straight, your car tracks straight while only needing your hand to be resting on the wheel. If this is what you experience, then it is a normal trait of the Euros.

Drifting on the other hand is the car pulling itself to the left or right when you are on a perfectly flat road with no surface defects and just resting your hand on the wheel is not enough to prevent the slight direction change.

Well said - LXRY tyres have the biggest impact on tramlining. If your tyres are heavily worn or worn unevenly that could make tramlining much worse.

Read these two articles, covers everything I think

http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/article.html?&A=0879&P=1

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=47

[aaronng]

Are the bridgestones on the Lux model asymmetrical? Most companies don't make a left and right tyre for asymmetrical models. So when you look at these brands of tyres (like pirelli dragons), the thread is not mirrored for the left and right side tyres.

[LXRY]

LXRY - perhaps you can describe your problem in more detail. If your car steers straight on a flat road it is a different issue to what other people are experiencing in this thread. Are you saying your car drifts off the road on a slanted road? If it does - that does not sound abnormal. If I was you and still concerned I would ask the dealership to loan you another Euro at the dealership and take it for a long drive. See if it is any different.

If you do get a wheel alignment get a laser alignment and a print out of the cars specifications.

Woogler - re that 6 second lane change business - I got the same story from my dealership when I raised it in early 2004. I wonder why you guys are all reporting a drift to the right - mine was a drift to the left. Weird.

yfin I had and still do have the same problem as all these guys...my car was drifting right even on a straight road VERY,VERY BADLY!! at 4000-5000klm's At the 10,000klm service they (dealership) adjusted something don't know what it was to try to fix the problem. When I got my car back my steering wheel was at 12:15 and still drifting to the right but not as much, but still there!! went back the second time straight away!! and they told me nothing wrong (adjusted my steering wheel) now still pulling slightly to the right, steering wheel at 11:55 now lol (they couldn't even do that properly) tyres are worn on the outside edges. I asked them to do an alignment twice they assured me it wasn't alignment. Now if there was no problem why would I be complaining, I am an excellant driver as I was brought up on a farm, driving tractors, forklifts, trucks, paddock bombs and semi trailers have drove a wide range of vehicles through out my life I am no expert in alignment or camber I uunderstand that if the road cambers that you will get some degree of drift but our situattion is not normal. I should know if my car pulls to the right that there is something wrong and I know when something is wrong...and something is wrong. I feel as if i've just been repeatig my self lol..I'm not alone on this one yfin please offer some suggestions to help us plz

Am I asking for too much I thought I bought an engineering marvel THE HONDA EURO ACCORD from a company that THRIVES on PERFECTION and QUALITY STANDARD, HONDA. It seems that this is not the case at the moment...they can't even give us answers on this subject, not too mention i bought a NEW car....Don't get me wrong I love the car that's y i bought it..

My tractor drives straighter than my car !!

[aaronng]

yfin I had and still do have the same problem as all these guys...my car was drifting right even on a straight road VERY,VERY BADLY!! at 4000-5000klm's At the 10,000klm service they (dealership) adjusted something don't know what it was to try to fix the problem. When I got my car back my steering wheel was at 12:15 and still drifting to the right but not as much, but still there!! went back the second time straight away!! and they told me nothing wrong (adjusted my steering wheel) now still pulling slightly to the right, steering wheel at 11:55 now lol (they couldn't even do that properly) tyres are worn on the outside edges. I asked them to do an alignment twice they assured me it wasn't alignment. Now if there was no problem why would I be complaining, I am an excellant driver as I was brought up on a farm, driving tractors, forklifts, trucks, paddock bombs and semi trailers have drove a wide range of vehicles through out my life I am no expert in alignment or camber I uunderstand that if the road cambers that you will get some degree of drift but our situattion is not normal. I should know if my car pulls to the right that there is something wrong and I know when something is wrong...and something is wrong. I feel as if i've just been repeatig my self lol..I'm not alone on this one yfin please offer some suggestions to help us plz

Am I asking for too much I thought I bought an engineering marvel THE HONDA EURO ACCORD from a company that THRIVES on PERFECTION and QUALITY STANDARD, HONDA. It seems that this is not the case at the moment...they can't even give us answers on this subject, not too mention i bought a NEW car....Don't get me wrong I love the car that's y i bought it..

My tractor drives straighter than my car !!
Get a laser alignment done by a tyre place. Get the results for camber and toe printed out straight from their computer. If it is out of spec, bring a copy of that to the dealer and complain about it. Otherwise, it is some other inherent problem.

Camber
Front 0°00'±45'
Rear -1°00'±30'

Total Toe
Front 0±2 mm
Rear IN 2±2 mm

[yfin]

Your said your tyres are worn unevenly now LXRY so it is may be very hard to correct this without changing tyres.

If I was in your position I would be going to a tyre shop and explaining the issue. I would get the tyres rebalanced (around $30) and a laser alignment done (if you buy something else - eg a rebalance - some shops will not charge you for the alignment unless the lasers show the car is out of specification).

If that doesn't work I would try the rims and tyres from another Euro and see how the car drives (eg a friend or if you are REALLY persistent the dealer may help you with this).

And of course your tractor is going to steer straighter than the Euro on rough surfaces - look how soft the sidewalls are on those tyres.

[LXRY]

Get a laser alignment done by a tyre place. Get the results for camber and toe printed out straight from their computer. If it is out of spec, bring a copy of that to the dealer and complain about it. Otherwise, it is some other inherent problem.

Camber
Front 0°00'±45'
Rear -1°00'±30'

Total Toe
Front 0±2 mm
Rear IN 2±2 mm


Is that what it should be set at aarong? Are these the settings my car should be at?

[aaronng]

Is that what it should be set at aarong? Are these the settings my car should be at?
That's the settings for a stock Euro that is NOT lowered. Camber can't be adjusted without a replacement upper arm or aftermarket camber kits.

[LXRY]

Your said your tyres are worn unevenly now LXRY so it is may be very hard to correct this without changing tyres.

If I was in your position I would be going to a tyre shop and explaining the issue. I would get the tyres rebalanced (around $30) and a laser alignment done (if you buy something else - eg a rebalance - some shops will not charge you for the alignment unless the lasers show the car is out of specification).

If that doesn't work I would try the rims and tyres from another Euro and see how the car drives (eg a friend or if you are REALLY persistent the dealer may help you with this).

And of course your tractor is going to steer straighter than the Euro on rough surfaces - look how soft the sidewalls are on those tyres.

Yfin I bought a new car with new car warranty, thats why I bought a new car so I wouldn't have to worry about any problems, dealership or honda should be taking care of this, I shouldn't have to touch anything!! It has only done 13000 klm's.

Are you working for Honda?

[cgspot]

All those with the problem have to differentiate between tramlining and drifting (not the sport).
Tramlining is when the car pulls to the side when going over grooves, road camber or even little potholes on the road. When accelerating, this is enhanced even more. When the road is perfect and straight, your car tracks straight while only needing your hand to be resting on the wheel. If this is what you experience, then it is a normal trait of the Euros.

Drifting on the other hand is the car pulling itself to the left or right when you are on a perfectly flat road with no surface defects and just resting your hand on the wheel is not enough to prevent the slight direction change.

Hi Aaronng
Just wondering what you mean here by (not the sport)?
Thanx

[aaronng]

Yfin I bought a new car with new car warranty, thats why I bought a new car so I wouldn't have to worry about any problems, dealership or honda should be taking care of this, I shouldn't have to touch anything!! It has only done 13000 klm's.

Are you working for Honda?
I doubt he works for Honda. BTW, he's also right in that if your tyres are worn unevenly, they would cause drifting.

[LXRY]

Going to the dealership now will let u guyz know how I went wish me luck....as for the alignment it isn't laser DAMN I stuffed up....

[aaronng]

Hi Aaronng
Just wondering what you mean here by (not the sport)?
Thanx
LOL, drifting is a sport. Sliding the car through the corners using controlled understeering in an oversteering position. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drifting_(motorsport)

[cgspot]

LOL, drifting is a sport. Sliding the car through the corners using controlled understeering in an oversteering position. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drifting_(motorsport)
ok gotcha, I didn't go and see the movie
Just thought you might have meant the Euro Sport
Ill go back and drift to the right

[aaronng]

Going to the dealership now will let u guyz know how I went wish me luck....as for the alignment it isn't laser DAMN I stuffed up....
What were the readings?

[LXRY]

Just got back supposedly my car was not ready yet, something suss.

I hope they really fix it p!ssn me off. They said it'll be ready tommorow..

Do the dealerships have laser alignment or normal?

If laser hasn't been done I am going to do laser too just to be sure.
Will post again tomm. stay tuned ppl....

This gonna cost me....gonna be broke :(

[Woogler]

Hey,

The dealer says its all about the tyres (according to the prophecy..lol). They have ordered 2 new ones for me and they will be fitted next week.

The speed for the drift into other lanes was not detailed.

I agree with LXRY! We all buy a new car for many reasons. The aesthetics, warranty and the supposed reliability. This is an issue which destroys the driving experience for me and I am very dissapointed with my purchase. I consider this a safety issue because the car takes me into oncoming traffic if I let go of the wheel!

[yfin]

Yfin I bought a new car with new car warranty, thats why I bought a new car so I wouldn't have to worry about any problems, dealership or honda should be taking care of this, I shouldn't have to touch anything!! It has only done 13000 klm's.

Are you working for Honda?

No I don't work for Honda - I have been through a similar (but not same issue - it was a drift to the left) experience over 2 years ago. I understand your frustration! :thumbsup: I tried to get it fixed by a dealer. Initially I was told 'wheel alignments' are not included in the warranty, and I was made to feel like they were doing me a huge favour when they agreed to check the alignment at a measly 4000km. I was subsequently told about this 6 second rule on the freeway, blah, blah. Eventually I ditched the Honda dealers as every subsequent Honda dealer I went to (not that many - maybe 5) did not have laser alignment machines. The manual Honda alignments were crap - just like you experienced (the steering wheel was off or the car went in the other direction, etc).

Yes your car is still under warranty but as you said earlier your tyres are now worn unevenly. It is going to be hard to prevent some change in direction now the tyres are all over the place. Even if you get a laser alignment I am not hopeful it will solve the issue if your tyres look crap. As for the cost - get your tyres rotated every 5000km (I get mine balanced as well with alignments every 10-15,000k). To me that is the cost of owning the car and is well worth it if you want to avoid shredding tyres in 13,000kms.

As for how to fix this - I have suggested all I can. The problem is solved on my Euro as stated earlier but there are so many changed variables in my set up now I can't pinpoint for you what made the difference (different suspension set up, wider rims, wider and non-directional tyres with a higher and softer sidewall, a number of regular laser alignments, strut brace, etc). A change to non-directional tyres certainly did help reduce tramlining - I know that for sure.

[LXRY]

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 2400klm
3 - clowdz-06 Sports.(17" Bridgestone Potenza) Pulling Right day 1 1200KM's
4 - tanalasta - Euro Sport with (17" OEM Bridgestone) strong pull right 6300km
5 - V205 - 05 Lux (17" Bridgestone) , drift to the right, 9300km.
6 - Woogler - 06 Euro sports (17" bridgestone potenza's) Pulls right since day one! 2700km's now.

Date changed to Wednesday 20th sept. if anyone cant call on this day for any reason just say the word and we change the date as we need all of us to work together for this one....

[avid]

Well,i might as well add my car to the list, although i dont know what the chances would be of Honda doing anything for me as i swapped my 16" Std wheels for a set of 17" Honda Sport wheels with Potenzas when both sets had done the same milage(approx 7,000kms).I immediately noticed the car drifting right in well under this 6 secs people are talking about. Had the alignment checked and told it was all in spec.The car has done 10,500kms now and i think its gotten worse.Just for the hell of it two weeks ago i put my old 16" wheels with the non directional Dunlops on the front and went for a short run to see the result(with the 17"still on the back btw).Went down the exact same wide flat road,and guess what....no drift either way,just like it was before i added the Potenzas into the mix.
Just a bit of history here...back in the early 80's Ford produced LTD's and Fairlanes at Eagle Farm here in Bris,and i worked there.At the time there was a brand of tyre being used on them called the Uniroyal, i think from memory.
We had no end of problems with the tyre,mainly balance issues, but if i can recall, Ford had no luck getting Uniroyal to fess up and change all the dud tyres.Uniroyal stuck doggedly to their side of the story and the dealers were left carrying the can.I later worked for Mitsubishi, and they had the exact same issue with the tyre on the Sigma,and Uniroyal stonewalled on the issue with them too.Mabye they should have listened, as that tyre brand went out of existence a few years later.......Moral of the story.....dont hold our collective breaths waiting for Honda to get Bridgestone to admit any fault with the tyre.
Anyway,i'm all for calling Honda on mass next week if thats still on.

[cgspot]

Wednesday is good for me, Thanks for all the info on Tramtracking etc My car sure does tramtrack but it also veers to the right lane in less than 6sec on a flat new road, it does veer more at different speeds but I havn't worked all of that out yet, I'm sick of counting to 6.
I felt like I should take it back in again before I call, but am not sure if that is going to achieve anything at this stage except the run around, havn't got the time for that at the moment.
By the look of the number of hits on this thread I can't help but wonder if Honda's people of influence are monitoring, if so they know about this :wave: I think its the tyres but I'm no expert, I just hope that after we bring this common issue to their attention formally, that they might get back to us with a solution.

1- LXRY- 06 euro luxury (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 13000 klm
2 - cgspot-06 Euro Sport (17" bridgestone potenza's) drifts right 2400klm
3 - clowdz-06 Sports.(17" Bridgestone Potenza) Pulling Right day 1 1200KM's
4 - tanalasta - Euro Sport with (17" OEM Bridgestone) strong pull right 6300km
5 - V205 - 05 Lux (17" Bridgestone) , drift to the right, 9300km.
6 - Woogler - 06 Euro sports (17" bridgestone potenza's) Pulls right since day one! 2700km's now.
7 - Avid - 06 Euro (17" bridgestone potenza's) Pulls right 10,500klms

[avid]

Anyone happen to have the right phone number direct to whichever section at Honda handles customer issues.We would be more effective if we all called the exact same people.
Even better still, if we had their email address(or the Honda Aus CEO's, lol)and followed up the call with an email letter,then that would be harder for them to go into denial mode.Has anyone ever been in contact with Honda via email? If you've got their address,how about posting it??
Just a final thought,i notice there seems to be no complaints from those Euro Lux owners who were lucky enough to get a car with the 17" Pirelli P Zero's !!!!!

[cgspot]

Anyone happen to have the right phone number direct to whichever section at Honda handles customer issues.We would be more effective if we all called the exact same people.
Even better still, if we had their email address(or the Honda Aus CEO's, lol)and followed up the call with an email letter,then that would be harder for them to go into denial mode.Has anyone ever been in contact with Honda via email? If you've got their address,how about posting it??
Just a final thought,i notice there seems to be no complaints from those Euro Lux owners who were lucky enough to get a car with the 17" Pirelli P Zero's !!!!!

The only Customer service Freecall Number I know is 1800 804 954
Is this the best number to call?

[V205]

Sounds to me like it may specificially be caused by the uni-directional RE040.

Has anyone here tried different tyres in 17" or 18" and the problem went away?

I sure miss the good old Yokohama A509.....


EDIT: Strange that none of the 16" owners have this issue... MUST BE THE TYRES!

[tony1234]

Sounds to me like it may specificially be caused by the uni-directional RE040.

Has anyone here tried different tyres in 17" or 18" and the problem went away?

I sure miss the good old Yokohama A509.....


EDIT: Strange that none of the 16" owners have this issue... MUST BE THE TYRES!
I've changed my Bridgestones to Conti sport contact 2s from new.i now have 5900kms. on mine now and it doesn't drift at all!I think it's the tyres.I've never been a fan of bridgestones(mind you i'm no expert)you need to talk to a GOOD wheel aligner who knows his stuff.apparently you can adjust something (subframe!ithink)which can alter the way the car tracks.i don't know.Anyone in Sydney south i can give you a good contact for lowering and alignment etc.Tynan Tyres.Daniel.ph.95459333.these guys are really good.anyway.good luck to all of you with this problem.

[LXRY]

Got my car back after the alignment(laser) told me was out by miles which didn't surprise me..as soon as i left the alignment place noticed steering wheel was at 12:10 went back to tell them they couldnt believe this they drove and checked it and i was right...they took it back again to fix this by putting it back on the machine...suppossedly fixed again, drove off again round the corner only to find steering wheel was not staright again, went back again still couldn't starighten it (steering still out, not by much but not staright) they couldn't explain to me why my steering waas out. And oh yeah still drifts to the right but not as bad. They also rotated my tires...called my honda dealer spoke to the sale rep who sold me the car explained to him what had happened in full detail told me to call on monday, said that they would look into it even if they had to get someone from honda aust. to come down. will post results of my alignment later on tonight as i'm very busy now sorry. emailing them is a good idea too as this is a hard copy and can't deny they got them....$110 down the drain....my dealers mechanic was right whaen he said it's not an alignment problem.....

[aaronng]

Got my car back after the alignment(laser) told me was out by miles which didn't surprise me..as soon as i left the alignment place noticed steering wheel was at 12:10 went back to tell them they couldnt believe this they drove and checked it and i was right...they took it back again to fix this by putting it back on the machine...suppossedly fixed again, drove off again round the corner only to find steering wheel was not staright again, went back again still couldn't starighten it (steering still out, not by much but not staright) they couldn't explain to me why my steering waas out. And oh yeah still drifts to the right but not as bad. They also rotated my tires...called my honda dealer spoke to the sale rep who sold me the car explained to him what had happened in full detail told me to call on monday, said that they would look into it even if they had to get someone from honda aust. to come down. will post results of my alignment later on tonight as i'm very busy now sorry. emailing them is a good idea too as this is a hard copy and can't deny they got them....$110 down the drain....my dealers mechanic was right whaen he said it's not an alignment problem.....
At least your $110 got the attention of your dealer now. :thumbsup:

[LXRY]

At least your $110 got the attention of your dealer now. :thumbsup:


Very true aaronng but I only did this as a process of elimination cause everyone kept on about alignment, thats all...:thumbsup: I even played with my tire pressures to see if thta made any difference

[splashalot2000]

Sounds to me like it may specificially be caused by the uni-directional RE040.
EDIT: Strange that none of the 16" owners have this issue... MUST BE THE TYRES!

Have just read some of this thread, so sorry if this has already been said: These symptoms are well known when running Bridgestones - tramlining starts after ~5,000kms and gets worse as the tyres wear. I've had 3 sets of Bridgestones and each has tramlined terribly. I've just replaced my Liberty's RE030s with Michelin Pilot Preceda 2s and the improvement in tracking is huge. On the Bridgestones my car tramlined like a hound dog on speed. Now it tracks straight and true. No more Bridgestones for me.
SS

[Omotesando]

I just had my car serviced and Honda did a wheel balance and wheel alignment (I suppose non-laser). Also swapped tyres around.

The car now seems to tramline even worse, and bump steer is even more apparent when one tyre is non-level to the other one, such as going through a pothole or a speed hump. Feels like the car could steer onto oncoming traffic by itself.... need to constantly fight the wheel.

Luckily, on a flat road I don't seem to have a drifting problem. Hmmm...

When people have the drift-to-right problem on the flat road - can I ask, if their foot is on the accelerator? Does it do the same when you're just letting it cruise or going downhill? I think we could work something from here? :(

[cgspot]

Have just read some of this thread, so sorry if this has already been said: These symptoms are well known when running Bridgestones - tramlining starts after ~5,000kms and gets worse as the tyres wear. I've had 3 sets of Bridgestones and each has tramlined terribly. I've just replaced my Liberty's RE030s with Michelin Pilot Preceda 2s and the improvement in tracking is huge. On the Bridgestones my car tramlined like a hound dog on speed. Now it tracks straight and true. No more Bridgestones for me.
SS
Very interesting splashalot2000. Inspired me to do a google search for "Tramlining Bridgestones", try it, looks like a common problem with the amount of negative feedback you can find.

Also an interesting point about the downhill/acceleration issue Omotesando, as I was counting to 6sec, over and over, the drift to the right was worse while accelerating gently, not as noticable while cruising or going downhill.
Is this the same all round?

[jamchen]

Got my car back after the alignment(laser) told me was out by miles which didn't surprise me..as soon as i left the alignment place noticed steering wheel was at 12:10 went back to tell them they couldnt believe this they drove and checked it and i was right...they took it back again to fix this by putting it back on the machine...suppossedly fixed again, drove off again round the corner only to find steering wheel was not staright again, went back again still couldn't starighten it (steering still out, not by much but not staright) they couldn't explain to me why my steering waas out. And oh yeah still drifts to the right but not as bad. They also rotated my tires...called my honda dealer spoke to the sale rep who sold me the car explained to him what had happened in full detail told me to call on monday, said that they would look into it even if they had to get someone from honda aust. to come down. will post results of my alignment later on tonight as i'm very busy now sorry. emailing them is a good idea too as this is a hard copy and can't deny they got them....$110 down the drain....my dealers mechanic was right whaen he said it's not an alignment problem.....


this is exactly what happened when i had my alignment done last week... the fronts were off pretty much... and as soon as i drove out the tyre shop i found my steering wheel isn't staight up... its a bit to the right... took it back the next day.. they said they adjusted the steering rack and should be fine.. however i still find its not stright up... but CBF to go back again...
oh,,, and the pulling to the right thing is gone :P:P

[yfin]

Got my car back after the alignment(laser) told me was out by miles which didn't surprise me..as soon as i left the alignment place noticed steering wheel was at 12:10 went back to tell them they couldnt believe this they drove and checked it and i was right...they took it back again to fix this by putting it back on the machine...suppossedly fixed again, drove off again round the corner only to find steering wheel was not staright again, went back again still couldn't starighten it (steering still out, not by much but not staright) they couldn't explain to me why my steering waas out. And oh yeah still drifts to the right but not as bad. They also rotated my tires...called my honda dealer spoke to the sale rep who sold me the car explained to him what had happened in full detail told me to call on monday, said that they would look into it even if they had to get someone from honda aust. to come down. will post results of my alignment later on tonight as i'm very busy now sorry. emailing them is a good idea too as this is a hard copy and can't deny they got them....$110 down the drain....my dealers mechanic was right whaen he said it's not an alignment problem.....
If the alignment was "out by miles" the alignment was worth doing (but $110 sounds excessive!). As for the tracking problem - you cannot say alignment is not the problem if your tyres have worn uneven (that is what you said earlier). If your tyres look like / and \ no alignment in the world is going to fix tracking problems.

As you have your dealer on side ask them to fit the tyres/rims from a Euro demo in the yard. Take that for a drive. It will take less than 1 hour.

[Omotesando]

Also an interesting point about the downhill/acceleration issue Omotesando, as I was counting to 6sec, over and over, the drift to the right was worse while accelerating gently, not as noticable while cruising or going downhill.
Is this the same all round?

That's good that this was tested!

If that's really the case, I think we've eliminated that it is a Caster/Castor problem, where front-tyre to rear-tyre distance is longer on say the left side. Because otherwise it'll be apparent even when just rolling and not accelerating.

Also, it is proof that there seems to be a dynamic alignment problem that is not apparent during the static 4 wheel laser alignments, because accelerative forces manifest the problems!

[Woogler]

My ride is fixed! Today, the new pair of Potenzas arrived and they were fitted by an external tyre dealership. They checked the wheel alignment and it was fine. The old tyres were not showing any signs of abnormal wear either.

As soon as I drove off with the new rubber fitted, the difference was immediately apparent. For the first time since I have owned the car, it actually tracked ever so slightly left with the camber of the road! And on flat roads it was steering neutral!

This confirms that it is the tyres. Guys, get to your dealer and demand a pair of new front Potenzas!!!! My dealer is in Tamworth if they want to call and confirm the story.

Remember, there was NO adjustment done, just a change of front tyres and it is fixed.

[m3ntAL_l2]

^^^^ very true experienced in my teg 2day, chucked on a pair of 17" with used tyres and went for a drive the car was drifting to the left heaps i had to pull it back/keep my arm tensed holding the stering wheel, went back home chcuked on the old rims with new tryes and the "drifting" was gone and the car can keep in a str8t line even without me holdin iT

[Woogler]

So now we have the solution, and HA are obviously replacing the tyres, is it now necessary for us to go gang busters on the service line?

[cgspot]

So now we have the solution, and HA are obviously replacing the tyres, is it now necessary for us to go gang busters on the service line?

Only time will tell...
After my tyres were rotated, the problem diminished.
But now ... 1000K later the problem is back.

It's not like there is NOT a problem, it's just so hard to pin point what it is!

There seems to have been a few quick fixes, but I'm still not sure what the cause of the problem is. Replacing Bridgestone Potenza with new Potenza has fixed the problem for some, but for how long ... ?

So ... If we call ... will it really make any difference?

[V205]

Wow guys.... looks like it is pretty much the tyres. Any chance of honda Australia changing all the dodgy RE040?????

As a worst case scenerio, I presume we only need to change the 2 front tyres and keep the old RE040 for use when the back ones wear out?

Edit: anyone using Yokohama A539 225/45/17 on their euro lux?

[Woogler]

As a worst case scenerio, I presume we only need to change the 2 front tyres and keep the old RE040 for use when the back ones wear out?

This is my intent. If it steers straight I will just flog them out in due course and replace them with better shoes later on.

[cgspot]

Wow guys.... looks like it is pretty much the tyres. Any chance of honda Australia changing all the dodgy RE040?????

As a worst case scenerio, I presume we only need to change the 2 front tyres and keep the old RE040 for use when the back ones wear out?

Whatever we do ... This has confirmed my belief in forums like this ...
So ... we might not fix the problem immediately ... but it gives me enough confidence in the power of the people to join up and become a member.

Thanks ... for at least that!

Back to the issue in question ... well?

[V205]

Unless someone wants to bring this up to Honda Australia, we'll just have to shell out the $ for 2 different types of front tyres.

To think of it... $500'ish isn't too much to pay to have a neutral tracking euro lux.

[QUOTE=cgspot]Whatever we do ... This has confirmed my belief in forums like this ...
So ... we might not fix the problem immediately ... but it gives me enough confidence in the power of the people to join up and become a member.

Thanks ... for at least that!

Back to the issue in question ... well?[/QUOTE

[yfin]

Congratulations Woogler - this must have been a great relief for you. I don't think it is fair for you guys to fork out money for new tyres if they are to blame - the problem is convincing the dealer to replace them just like Woogler did.

So it looks like my solved drift to the "left" was a different issue to you guys with the drift to the right.

[cgspot]

I'm just not keen on having different tyres front and back, guess I like to rotate them and know what I'm in for.

[Omotesando]

Only time will tell...
After my tyres were rotated, the problem diminished.
But now ... 1000K later the problem is back.

It's not like there is NOT a problem, it's just so hard to pin point what it is!

There seems to have been a few quick fixes, but I'm still not sure what the cause of the problem is. Replacing Bridgestone Potenza with new Potenza has fixed the problem for some, but for how long ... ?

So ... If we call ... will it really make any difference?

Yes I question how long this solution will work. I assume Woogler got his 040s replaced with new 040s? :O

If you think about it... the 040s themselves can't be the core problem.

Something must be wrong on the car's suspension or weight distribution itself. The 040s are just exacerbating the problem as time goes by more and more.... perhaps because they 'track' too well in the direction of travel, being too 'directional'... and hence they tend to steer to one side more than other tyres. The fact that they're known to tramline, is good evidence they're just exaggerating the deeper underlying problem?

Anyway, I somehow still think (perhaps falsely) that this has to do with the fact that the left hand side of the car is higher than the right hand side.
The camber angles shown on the alignment machine might show both sides to be consistent, even when both sides have different suspension heights.
However, when someone sits in the driver seat, the weight balance is altered.

If you consider weight balancing - its trying to make turning left and turning right to be as similar as possible. That is, left front and right rear are as balanced with right front and left rear as possible. Its mainly to do with the car's characteristic 'when' it is already turning. However, it doesn't cater for the fact that, left front and left right might be imbalanced on a straight line! EDIT: I mean, it does - but not in terms of camber on an alignment machine, without the driver sitting in it..

I think people ought to get their cars balanced with themselves sitting on it? As a solution. Or dial in slightly more camber on the RHS?

[LXRY]

If the alignment was "out by miles" the alignment was worth doing (but $110 sounds excessive!). As for the tracking problem - you cannot say alignment is not the problem if your tyres have worn uneven (that is what you said earlier). If your tyres look like / and \ no alignment in the world is going to fix tracking problems.

As you have your dealer on side ask them to fit the tyres/rims from a Euro demo in the yard. Take that for a drive. It will take less than 1 hour.


The front tryes where swapped with the back tyres....(the back tyres had no wear in them at all) so now I have the back tyres on the front...no wear in the front now if that makes any difference still drifting to the right. As for $110 for alignment maybe they seen me coming, this was done at Bob Janes...did not shop around, just went to the nearest place. It drifts with no acceleration as well..

[aaronng]

As for $110 for alignment maybe they seen me coming, this was done at Bob Janes...did not shop around, just went to the nearest place. It drifts with no acceleration as well..
Even if you are not shopping around, always call beforehand for prices. If it is too high, ask them for a cheaper price to tempt you to go in.

[LXRY]

I'm still going to call and email HA tomm. around lunchtime. Also I am going to fill in a safety report at the consumer affairs website as I feel this is a safety issue...did I forget to mention that mine drifts HARD when I brake when road cambers? oops sorry..

Whether or not it'll make any difference or not I think we should all call and email HA as stated earlier also the safety report at Consumer Affairs website is very important as when more than 1 report goes to CA (consumer affairs) they have the power to act on our behalf they are there for us for this purpose.

I'm not nit picking, I am not a tight ass, I am not rich either, It shouldn't be my problem (thats why I bought a new car), it has NEW car warranty.

I will also be contacting VicRoads about this issue regarding safety...about to stir the pot hehe

[Omotesando]

I'm still going to call and email HA tomm. around lunchtime. Also I am going to fill in a safety report at the consumer affairs website as I feel this is a safety issue...did I forget to mention that mine drifts HARD when I brake when road cambers? oops sorry..

Whether or not it'll make any difference or not I think we should all call and email HA as stated earlier also the safety report at Consumer Affairs website is very important as when more than 1 report goes to CA (consumer affairs) they have the power to act on our behalf they are there for us for this purpose.

I'm not nit picking, I am not a tight ass, I am not rich either, It shouldn't be my problem (thats why I bought a new car), it has NEW car warranty.


If your car drifts hard even when you brake, then I suggest you get your Electronic Brake Distribution or VSA to be looked at as well!

[Woogler]

I'm still going to call and email HA tomm. around lunchtime. Also I am going to fill in a safety report at the consumer affairs website as I feel this is a safety issue...

LXRY

I will contact HA, even though mine now appears rectified (hopefully properly) as those arse clowns have not returned my last 3 enquiries about the problem over the past month!

I will also go to the Dept fair trading website and fill in a form. I am taking your word for it that it exists on there ;)

[cgspot]

LXRY

I will contact HA, even though mine now appears rectified (hopefully properly) as those arse clowns have not returned my last 3 enquiries about the problem over the past month!

I will also go to the Dept fair trading website and fill in a form. I am taking your word for it that it exists on there ;)
I'm calling HA today - after lunch and I'll email as well.

I've found the Unsafe product or service complaint form at the Qld Dept of Fair trading site:
http://www.fairtrading.qld.gov.au/oft/oftweb.nsf/AllDocs/29DD6F751B839AFE4A256B57002F0CEF/$File/Complaint_Form_Unsafe_Product_Service_V3_0805-FSO_1.pdf

However, I'm holding off on sending that, to allow HA some time to get back to us on the issue.

[cgspot]

I just sent the following message to HA:

I am registering a formal complaint and am asking for a solution to a problem with The Accord Euro 06 17" Bridgestone Potenza Tyres, badly tramlining and also veering to the right hand lane in under six seconds. A wheel rotation at 1000Klm minimised the issue but now it has resurfaced. This is not an uncommon problem as other owners have the same issue. Tyre rotations, tyre replacements, wheel alignments, tie rod adjustments, adjusting the sub frame, Is it the fixed camber? are some of the suggestions but I just need to know what will fix it. It is dangerous a real safety issue. Please contact me with a solution, I don't want a trial and error time wasting ad hoc approach and episodes with the dealer.

Have also called - Customer service 1800 804 954

Customer Relations will get back within 48hours.
...

[LXRY]

I too called HA customer relations awaiting a call within 48 hours, have not filled in safety report as yet as i too am awaiting HA's response.

This is the email I have sent -

"I have a problem with my car drifting to one side(the right hand side).

This happened at 5000-6000klm's, at this stage it was very,very bad drifting on a straight road. I did not hit any pot holes of any kind, was taking it easy the whole time. I took the car to my dealership at the 10,000 klm's service notified them of the problem, asked them to check the car thoroughly as it was badly drifting. I asked them to do a wheel alignment aswell, if it needed it. When I went to pick the car up they told me that it had nothing to do with the alignment of the car and that they adjusted something else which fixed the problem. As soon as I left the dealership I noticed that it was still drifting, not as bad but still drifting, mainly when the road cambered (slightest of camber). I returned the car to my dealership asking them to please check my car because it was still doing this.

The response that I got from the dealership ('edited') was that there was:- Three mechanics drove the car and there was no problem with the car, that all accord euro's do this (common), I was driving a front wheel drive, it was the low profile tyres, i'd bought a sports car, that I had to wait till my tyres wore out to 50% and that not to worry because if it was a problem that honda had plenty of money and they would fix this...I had never heard such CRAP before in my life, very disgusted actually. During the drifting if I brake the car drifts even more.

Since then I have taken it to get a wheel alignment and it has not rectified the problem not as bad though mainly because they rotated the tyres from the back to front ( the tyres on the back have no wear in them at all as for the front they are noticibly worn). I was told when I bought the car that I had bought a quality car....from a quality dealership....and a quality car manufacturer. At the moment it doesn't seem so. I had wondered if I was the only one with this problem so I started searching for other people with the same problem and found that I am not the only one with this problem.

I would appreciate some answer please as it has affected me in every way.

I am a first time honda customer. I was intending on buying another honda aswell. If I dont hear or get contacted from honda in the next few days I will be reporting this to the right authorities (Consumer Affairs and Vic Roads) as this is a SAFETY issue and should be rectified IMMEDIATELY.

I'm sure this is a minor problem and if investigated properly it can be rectified.

Kindest Regards 'edited' ( VIN number : 'edited' )


P.S i tried to fill in your contact us form in your website but it gave me an internal error."

For anyone who gets an internal error this is the direct email for honda customer relations-

hondacr@honda.com.au

[V205]

Wooger, Note that the 05' Euro Luxury were the first to have 17" rims with the RE040 and as we've seen here, thoses '05 Euro Lux also exhibited the same issue.

LXRY, why don't you try changing the 2 front tyres to something different?

In my experience, going through the grief with car dearlers is just not worth the time and effort if you can resolve the problem yourself.

[tony1234]

Wooger, Note that the 05' Euro Luxury were the first to have 17" rims with the RE040 and as we've seen here, thoses '05 Euro Lux also exhibited the same issue.

LXRY, why don't you try changing the 2 front tyres to something different?

In my experience, going through the grief with car dearlers is just not worth the time and effort if you can resolve the problem yourself.
I agree with V205.From day 1 i changed my OEM tyres (do not like Bridge stone,past exp)to Conti Sport contact 2s and haven,t looked back.I've now got 6000kms.Not a hint of drifting or tramlining.:thumbsup:

[aaronng]

Wooger, Note that the 05' Euro Luxury were the first to have 17" rims with the RE040 and as we've seen here, thoses '05 Euro Lux also exhibited the same issue.

LXRY, why don't you try changing the 2 front tyres to something different?

In my experience, going through the grief with car dearlers is just not worth the time and effort if you can resolve the problem yourself.
Because it is a Honda problem, and it is unfair for him to shell out $500 for a pair of tyres when it isn't his fault.

[Spec83]

So it looks like my solved drift to the "left" was a different issue to you guys with the drift to the right.

I am starting to get this too :(

[cgspot]

I am starting to get this too :(
What size rims, type of tyre, Klm's?

[jamchen]

just went have had a wheel alignment done at beaurepairs today...
the rear axle toe was -2.6mm and +2.9mm(which was still acceptable) but the front toe!!! god it was +5.5mm(left) and -8.5mm.... um... that wasn't good wasn't it?
but after my alignment my wheel is not straight at all(pointing at about 12:10 direction)... guys at beaurepairs adjusted the steering wheel rack twice and its the same... so they said it is because the road (camber or something)

[aaronng]

just went have had a wheel alignment done at beaurepairs today...
the rear axle toe was -2.6mm and +2.9mm(which was still acceptable) but the front toe!!! god it was +5.5mm(left) and -8.5mm.... um... that wasn't good wasn't it?
but after my alignment my wheel is not straight at all(pointing at about 12:10 direction)... guys at beaurepairs adjusted the steering wheel rack twice and its the same... so they said it is because the road (camber or something)
What was the front toe after adjustment?

[jamchen]

0.0mm and 0.0mm :P

[Spec83]

What size rims, type of tyre, Klm's?

Just the stock Euro Lux wheel and tyre at ~18xxxKms... You seem to put the car in the centre of the road and it just drifts to the left and you have to correct it constantly... :(

[avid]

Well i rang Honda this afternoon,talked to two females about the issue.First i got the standard Hondaspeak reply,you all know how it goes " well you need to take this up with your dealer who will carry out a wheel alignment and suspension check etc....yada yada ya.
After that speil i explained to her that the reason i am so sure it is the Potenzas was because when i swap back to my 16" wheels,the problem immediately disappears.Then i got put through to another woman who gave me that old dealership story we all got when we wanted to buy the Standard Euro but with the 17" rims, that is, that the Euro Lux has different suspension to the Standard and this was the cause of my drifting.I tried to explain to her nicely that this was "crap" and that as a mechanic i know that any physical differences in the suspensions are not going to cause this effect just because someone adds 17" rims ,besides which there are plenty of people out there who are running 17" and 18" rims on Standard model Euros and not experiencing this problem.
I dont think i actually achieved much, but when i told her there were plenty of other people complaining about this problem she asked me how i would know that.I told her that Honda had received a number of calls and emails today about the issue, which she initially queried.When i explained to her that there were web sites where Honda enthusiasts from all over Australia converse with each other she was surprised, and i gave her the OzHonda web address. Should be interesting reading for her.
As i said in an earlier post, i dont expect Honda will do anything for me because i am running the 17" instead of the Standards 16" rims,and this would be a good enough excuse for Honda not to consider my cars problem even though the rims and tyres came straight off a Euro Lux with 7000ks,but my experience pretty well proves that it is the Potenzas that are the problem, and if that helps the rest of you get some satisfaction from Honda then well and good.
At the end of my conversation with this woman i think i detected a willingness by Honda (after one jumps through all the dealership hoops) to just possibly replace the offending equipment,whatever that may be.The saga continues....

[aaronng]

People with Lux and the standard 17" wheels, please call up Honda Australia.

[Onrmnd]

"Page 8" My freind that i spoke to works for a Honda dealer (service) in NSW She told me that they have had 4 cases of the tyre issue and they changed them and the problem went away. I think this was before i even got to look at this thread that she told me this. I was asking about warranty and wheels, coz i wanted 20's on mine. They are taking it up witht he tyre manufacturer. So they might start changing the brand of tyre. The only thing that she did say was that the dealer (buss manager) did every thing in his power not to change the tyres. The customer or customers had to really push the dealers buttons to get them to change it. They did the same thing wheel align and every thing. As a truck mech we have seen issues on front tryes but most of the time its and alignment issue. It just seen odd that the tyres can cause this, but it looks like it might be the case.

[EuroDude]

Sounds like the potenza's have too much directional grip, which causes the car to drift right due to the raised left suspension.

would be interesting if someone changed just the Fronts or Rears of the car and see if it still happens. Or simply lowered the left sussy to match the right sussy and see if that helps.

[jamchen]

Sounds like the potenza's have too much directional grip, which causes the car to drift right due to the raised left suspension.

would be interesting if someone changed just the Fronts or Rears of the car and see if it still happens. Or simply lowered the left sussy to match the right sussy and see if that helps.

check woogler's post @ pg 14...

[LXRY]

check woogler's post @ pg 14...

I'd also take cgspot's post @ pg 14 into consideration aswell jamchen. I have my rear tyres on the front now after my wheel alignment they are like brand new mate and I still have this problem, after all we all started with brand new bridgestones from day 1 and for most of us didn't experience this problem till later say before the 10,000 klm's service and yet some have had this problem from day 1. Let's just be patiant and see what evolves with Honda Aust.

[V205]

If anyone has logged a case with HA, let us know what the case number is and those with 17" RE040 can add their experience to the same case too in order to convince them that there IS an issue.

At this point in time, I'm still not sure why the RE040 promotes this behaviour. Is it really a suspension / subframe issue that is made more obvious with the RE040 tyre? Or is the RE040 just not suited to the geometric dynamics of the Euro frame?

EDIT: How does one adjust the suspension height to match height??

[aaronng]

Hmm, a worrying situation is that if the dealer adjusts your subframe to get it to track straight, what happens when you change to a different brand of tyre? Does your car pull to the left then?

[V205]

That's exactly my concern. We need to fix the root of the problem rather introducing another wrong to cancel out the original wrong.

They dealers could have whacked out the alignment to stop the right-drift issue but may be causing uneven tire wear from un-natural force direction.

If we can put 5 other brands of tyres in the front of the euro and it tracks neutral.. then I would say just change the tyres to something else.



Hmm, a worrying situation is that if the dealer adjusts your subframe to get it to track straight, what happens when you change to a different brand of tyre? Does your car pull to the left then?

[LXRY]

If anyone has logged a case with HA, let us know what the case number is and those with 17" RE040 can add their experience to the same case too in order to convince them that there IS an issue.

At this point in time, I'm still not sure why the RE040 promotes this behaviour. Is it really a suspension / subframe issue that is made more obvious with the RE040 tyre? Or is the RE040 just not suited to the geometric dynamics of the Euro frame?

Sh1t I didn't ask or they didn't give me a case number...I still emailed them so I have some hard evidence at least that I did contact them...mmmm damn it...I will call again and ask for my case number tomm.

I suggest an email too everyone..

Customer Relations Email......hondacr@honda.com.au

[EuroDude]

Hmm, a worrying situation is that if the dealer adjusts your subframe to get it to track straight, what happens when you change to a different brand of tyre? Does your car pull to the left then?

lol good point. I doubt that would happen though. The euro should perform like any other equal-sussy car, at least after a decent wheel alignment and tyre rotation

[V205]

I thought I'd point out that when I was driving an '05 red euro lux demo at a dealer prior to buying mine, it had about 40,000km on the clock and it's pull to the right was VERY strong. I thought it was just an abused demo which may have gone over some kerbs and knocked out the alignment.

After reading some comments here, it would seemed that it just got worse over time and more wear with the RE040.

When I picked up my new new 05 Lux manual with 6km on it, I already noticed the pull to the right.

[V205]

Sent:

Hi Honda Australia,

I would like to refer you to an issue that has been noticed by many Euro Luxury owners (with 17" Bridgestone RE040 tyres) in that the car has a pull-to-the-right bias. Please refer to this forum which has been discussing the issue.

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22067&page=17

It would appear that changing to a different brand or model of tyre fixes this issue.

Please advise.

Thank you.

[jamchen]

i was just thinking... would that be just because the design of the roads and streets? as i just went to a local tyre shop and had alignment done. after the alignment i found my steering wheel isn't staight up so i drove back to them and demanded adjustments.
but even after the adjustment i still found it is not right up...and they guy told me because australia road designs so it is normal for that to happen. sothing about road camber...
so i was thinking that since the 17"s tyre is relatively low-profiled when compared to the 16" ones... will it just the tyres are too sensitive in responses to the road condition...?

[avid]

Ah....that would be NO

[EuroDude]

Aussie roads drift cars to the left for safety reasons.

If a car drifts to the right, thats a major safety concern.

Its only a matter of time one of us euro owners drift into oncoming traffic, then a lawsuit happens, and honda do a major recall...


drifting left into a telegraph pole at 70km/h is safer than drifting right into an opposing car at a combined 140km/h ;)

[cgspot]

Sent:

Hi Honda Australia,

I would like to refer you to an issue that has been noticed by many Euro Luxury owners (with 17" Bridgestone RE040 tyres) in that the car has a pull-to-the-right bias. Please refer to this forum which has been discussing the issue.

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22067&page=17

It would appear that changing to a different brand or model of tyre fixes this issue.

Please advise.

Thank you.

The pull-to-the-right bias is also evident on Euro Sports configuration (with supplied 17" Bridgestone RE040 tyres).
...

[Omotesando]

Aussie roads drift cars to the left for safety reasons.

If a car drifts to the right, thats a major safety concern.

Its only a matter of time one of us euro owners drift into oncoming traffic, then a lawsuit happens, and honda do a major recall...


drifting left into a telegraph pole at 70km/h is safer than drifting right into an opposing car at a combined 140km/h ;)

Apparently from what I was told, if that Telegraph pole doesn't move, then hitting a pole or a wall at 70km/h actually is exactly as dangerous as two 70km/h cars having a head on collision :)

Its because, two cars have two crumple zones and bodies and thus the 140kph velocity and momentum difference is shared between two bodies. Whereas a car hitting a pole or a wall, where one side doesn't move, has most of the energy being absorbed by only 1 car!

This has baffled me for a while, but in terms of physics it does make sense! In real life, hitting the pole is only very slightly less damaging, assuming the wall/pole doesn't move and dissipate some energy.

Obviously slamming into a stationary vehicle, that would then crumple as well as move, is different altogether! :eek:

But anyway, I'm starting to think my Euro Accord is starting to drift... :(

[EuroDude]

Hmm interesting theory Omotes, makes you think :p

[tony1234]

Sent:

Hi Honda Australia,

I would like to refer you to an issue that has been noticed by many Euro Luxury owners (with 17" Bridgestone RE040 tyres) in that the car has a pull-to-the-right bias. Please refer to this forum which has been discussing the issue.

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22067&page=17

It would appear that changing to a different brand or model of tyre fixes this issue.

Please advise.

Thank you.
I've done this!I changed my OEM tyres next day after picking up the car.Have 6000kms.now,no pull,drifting nothing.I've got Conti sport contact 2s on now.It's got to be the tyres.Keep on their case.The more people complain the better!!!

[Omotesando]

Hmm interesting theory Omotes, makes you think :p

Yeahhhh I remember seeing it on some news or speed kills ads and thought what the heck are they talking about! Then did some research and so ok, they are right and I wasn't :(


Anyway, you know guys... I hope I was not being hysterical.
However, after I got my car back from service last week, my car REALLY PULLS to the right as well. My rear tyres and front were swapped (but already for the 2nd time).

Someone jinxed me or something :angel:

Now add me in - I'll make the complaing tomorrow :(

[DOHCVTEC]

we have an euro its drifts to the right too :eek:

[aaronng]

we have an euro its drifts to the right too :eek:
Is it the Luxury model?

[V205]

Is it the Luxury model?

More importantly, is it the Luxury model with the 17" RE040 tyres.

[Ferrarista]

my drift problem will be fixed next week, recieved my camber kit today :)

[cgspot]

I just sent the following message to HA:

I am registering a formal complaint and am asking for a solution to a problem with The Accord Euro 06 17" Bridgestone Potenza Tyres, badly tramlining and also veering to the right hand lane in under six seconds. A wheel rotation at 1000Klm minimised the issue but now it has resurfaced. This is not an uncommon problem as other owners have the same issue. Tyre rotations, tyre replacements, wheel alignments, tie rod adjustments, adjusting the sub frame, Is it the fixed camber? are some of the suggestions but I just need to know what will fix it. It is dangerous a real safety issue. Please contact me with a solution, I don't want a trial and error time wasting ad hoc approach and episodes with the dealer.

Have also called - Customer service 1800 804 954

Customer Relations will get back within 48hours.
...
Message sent Wednesday, 20th
reply
Thursday, 21 September 2006
Please be assured your enquiry has been forwarded to the relevant department for action.

.................................................. .........

[tony1234]

my drift problem will be fixed next week, recieved my camber kit today :)
I woudn't count on it.I reckon it's the tyres.

[Monty77]

I noticed our Euro pulling to the right today, but only under deceleration. At the time, the highway didn't have any unusual camber from the norm. Might be going crazy but under acceleration....no problems (as yet!) Only done 1135k's though. I'll keep you posted.

[tony1234]

my drift problem will be fixed next week, recieved my camber kit today :)
Ferrista,how did you go with the fitting of the camber kit?Did it fix your drifting problem?

[LXRY]

This is the email:-

Dear ('edited')

Thank you for your enquiry.

Please be assured your enquiry has been forwarded to the relevant department for action.




Honda Customer Service

Recieved a phone call today:-

"Please book in your car at your dealership as they have advised my dealership....." I asked what they where going to do or what was the cause ? she, the nice sounding, sweet lady told me that she was no expert on the matter and that she had been advised to contact me and tell me to book my car in. Booking it in tommorrow...will post on outcome tommorrow

[LXRY]

Ok took the car in today.... service manager wasn't in so I had to deal with the foreman of the mechanics, good bloke...told me last time I had brought it in that they adjusted the K frame....not much but just a bit.

He also told me that this was common with the euros and the whole time that he had been working with honda that there was no fix that he knew of....

He told me to leave the car with them for a few days and they would work on it to see if they could rectify the problem.....

He said that Honda Australia might have sent something for a fix to the service manager but had to wait for the service manager to get back from holidays on Monday.....

I asked him also if I change the suspension and rims and tyres would it fix the problem, he said NO. I also asked him whether the left suspension was higher that the right, he laughed and said NO.

I explained to him that I had taken it to get a wheel alignment and that it still didn't fix the problem, showed him the results as well. I also explained to him that they had to put it on the rack twice to straighten the steering wheel (still not straight).

They are going to send the car too get a wheel alignment and checked out somewhere else in the mean time.

Will post again tomm. (crossing my fingers)

[aaronng]

Good that they are acknowledging the problem and are being serious in rectifying it.

[LXRY]

Got my car back, still the same.

When I got to the car dealership, I found my car with stock rims and stock tyres....They told me that it was because of the low profile tyres that i was experiencing this problem...They wanted me to drive it with stocks to prove this. To be honest i had a bit of a laugh about this.

I asked them then why when I brought my car in to the 10,000klm service they adjusted the K-frame if it was due to low profile tyres? They told me that it was due to tyre wear that they adjusted the k-frame. Now due to tyre wear they had to adjust the K-frame? Highly unlikely, more like adjusted it to compensate for the severe drifting.

I am not exagerating when I say my car was drifting VERY, VERY, VERY BADLY everyone. It's obviously not as bad now due to the adjustment but still pulling to the right evidently and something did go wrong at 4000-5000klms enough for them to adjust the K-frame.

As you all know I took my car in recently to get a wheel alignment and twice they tried to get the steering wheel straight, with no success as well. Now is this also due to tyre wear and low profile tyres? Don't think so!!

At the 4000-5000 klm mark the drifting started HARD AND FAST which makes this a safety issue. I am lucky that I didn't get into an accident. (no exageration).

I will be taking my car in for some tests to a few professional's (At my expense).

I will also follow through with the safety reports with the appropriate authorities (Vic-Roads and Consumer Affairs) as this is serious and it is silly to wait for an accident to happen. Honda Australia needs to be aware of the safety factor and not consider this as a warranty issue.

I recommend everyone with this problem do the same as Vic-Roads and Consumer Affairs will act on our behalf if more than one case is reported. I am in Victoria so I'm not sure on which is the right authorities in other states, but if unsure Consumer Affairs can help in with this.

Apparently some of the civic's are coming back with drifting as well, but to the left.

(At 100klm/h on a flat road if the car drifts to the next lane within 6 secs check the specs of the car....Pffft)

[Omotesando]

Thanks for your update.

What do you mean by stock rims and stock tyres? You mean they put on 16" standard euro rims/tyres for you to try?

So how were those?

I'm sure a lot of people here would be willing to get a petition going regarding this issue.

Since I started having a bit of the drift right issue - I actually found that sometimes it doesn't drift. But IF the car was to drift either left or right, depending on road conditions, the car would want to drift to the right much much harder than it would want to drift to the left.

i.e. if the camber of road is to the left, the car sometimes doesn't drift to the left.

If the camber of the road is neutral, sometimes it drifts to right. Sometimes it tracks neutrally.

If the camber of road is to the right, then it drifts to the right really really badly. :(

I wonder if others notice the same thing :S

[aaronng]

Here's a similar update for you. USDM IS250s are pulling to the right as well! Their tyres? Bridgestone RE030 tyres!!!
http://my.is/forums/showthread.php?t=306313

[LXRY]

What do you mean by stock rims and stock tyres? You mean they put on 16" standard euro rims/tyres for you to try?

So how were those?
Yes they where 16" euro rims and tyres (brand new), didn't notice it at all (drifting) seemed like the standards masked it more, but as soon as they put my 17's back on "presto" back again. Mind you my drifting isn't as bad as before, more like your problem now -



the car would want to drift to the right much much harder than it would want to drift to the left.




If the camber of road is to the right, then it drifts to the right really really badly. :(

Yep this is my case at the moment too....

But the big question is what causes the car too drift so bad that they have to adjust the k-frame? To me it's obvious it wasn't the tyre wear, low profiles and 17" rims like they are stating. The tyre wear was due to the drifting, this is obvious to me now. (tyre wear at 4000 klm's come on who are they trying to kid?)

[LXRY]

Here's a similar update for you. USDM IS250s are pulling to the right as well! Their tyres? Bridgestone RE030 tyres!!!
http://my.is/forums/showthread.php?t=306313

I read the thread sounds familiar....could it be a flaw or inconsistancies in the bridgestones? Dunno hard for me to say....not a tyre expert. Need to have a euro with different tyres from new aswell to compare. Still it shouldn't be our problem it's a Honda matter which they should test and eliminate themselves.

So that means change my tyres spend money I shouldn't have to spend and what if it still happens...?

Why hasn't the drifting got worse if it's a flaw in the tyres? And why to the right and not to the left? None of us have complained about drifting to the left. And when I got the wheel alignment done, they swapped the front with the rear (rear are like brand new) still drifts the same no difference noticed...


I will email Bridgestone aswell regarding the matter stay tuned....

[Omotesando]

Yeah Bridgestone are just crap.. :(

YFIN was the only person complaining of a drift to the left before he did his mods, I think?

[LXRY]

Yeah Bridgestone are just crap.. :(

YFIN was the only person complaining of a drift to the left before he did his mods, I think?

Yes you are right I remember yfin mentioned that...

Taken from Bridgestones site:-
"With leading high-performance vehicles fitting the Potenza RE040 as original equipment (OE), this tyre is a proven performer. Distinctive features are sports performance, comfort and enhanced handling in wet and dry conditions.

Its super slant tread design, coupled with DONUTS technology, provides sports performance with precision handling, greater manoeuvrability and superb grip. " I hope they are right...


If I change the tyres, which I shouldn't have too anyway, i'm scared that if I do and it doesn't fix the problem what then? And there's the issue of my steering wheel, can't get it straight...These goons at the dealership when adjusted the k-frame caused me another head ache damn, thats why they can't get my steering wheel straight now (pain in the ass).

[aaronng]

I read the thread sounds familiar....could it be a flaw or inconsistancies in the bridgestones? Dunno hard for me to say....not a tyre expert. Need to have a euro with different tyres from new aswell to compare. Still it shouldn't be our problem it's a Honda matter which they should test and eliminate themselves.

So that means change my tyres spend money I shouldn't have to spend and what if it still happens...?

Why hasn't the drifting got worse if it's a flaw in the tyres? And why to the right and not to the left? None of us have complained about drifting to the left. And when I got the wheel alignment done, they swapped the front with the rear (rear are like brand new) still drifts the same no difference noticed...


I will email Bridgestone aswell regarding the matter stay tuned....
It's because the RE030 is slightly asymmetrical that it pulls to the right. Also explains that LHD cars end up pulling to the right as well with these tyres.

Someone should trade their new 17" tyres back to the dealer for some other brand of tyres.

[yfin]

The front tryes where swapped with the back tyres....(the back tyres had no wear in them at all) so now I have the back tyres on the front...no wear in the front now if that makes any difference still drifting to the right. As for $110 for alignment maybe they seen me coming, this was done at Bob Janes...did not shop around, just went to the nearest place. It drifts with no acceleration as well..

Lxry, you need to try 4 tyres that are worn even front and back. Just the fronts is not good enough if you are trying to work out what is causing the tracking problem.

If on the stock 16" rims and tyres your car is tracking ok - doesn't that suggest to you that the culprit is either your 17" rims and/or tyres?

Honda, consumer affairs, etc is not going to help you now the car tracks ok with the 16" stocks - I thought you were running the OEM 17" with the Bridgestones. Maybe you are - I am just a bit confused now as to the specs of your car?

So what sort of rims are they? What size and offset? Have you had the tyres off the rim and the rims checked to see whether they spin true? What tyres are you running and in what size...?

Still lots of avenues to explore I think. If safety is a concern then I suggest you keep your stock 16" rims on until you investigate more.

[yfin]

It's because the RE030 is slightly asymmetrical that it pulls to the right.

It is a directional tyre though yeah?

[aaronng]

It is a directional tyre though yeah?
Is the Euro Lux's tyre the Potenza RE030 or the RE050?

The one on the RE030 that the IS250 owner was complaining about had this thread:
http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bridgestone/bs_potenza_re030.jpg

If you notice, when you mount the tyre on the left side of the car, you get the outer blocks pointing forwards while the inner blocks point backwards

Now, if you imagine putting the same tyre on the right side (Bridgestone doesn't make a L and R tyres for this series), you get the outer block pointing backwards and inner block pointing forwards, even if you flip the tyre around. So on your car, all left sides of you tyres point forward while all right sides point backward.

If I remember correctly, you're meant to have it sweep forward to minimise rolling resistance when moving forward. I think that since the tyres have this bias on each side that the left side of the tyres have less rolling resistance than the right side. So the tyres would tend to pull to the right since the right sides have more resistance.

In order to test this theory, you could overinflate your tyres to try to get the middle thread to bulge out more so that the side blocks have less influence on your vehicle. If with overinflation you solve or reduce your right-pulling problem, then my theory could be correct.

And for the base Euro with the SP Sport 2050m, our threads are like this:
http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/dunlop/du_sp_sport_2050_ci2_l.jpg

Notice that the outer blocks are actually straight and only point forwards much further out towards the sidewall.

[avid]

("When I got to the car dealership, I found my car with stock rims and stock tyres....They told me that it was because of the low profile tyres that i was experiencing this problem...They wanted me to drive it with stocks to prove this. To be honest i had a bit of a laugh about this.")

I've done this already as my car came with the 16"rims and i have swapped them back and forth.Absolutely no drift with these rims and tyres, and in fact a much better steering response and "feel" generally. Soon as i swap back to the 17" rims with the Potenzas....drifts to right, and also ive noticed that when braking to stop on rough, gravel or pot holed surfaces car pulls heavily to right about 1/2 turn of steering wheel.Again no such effect with the standard rims and tyres.
What is most telling about all this is that people with 17" rims and tyres, other than the Potenzas, are not having the problem.

[tony1234]

Yes you are right I remember yfin mentioned that...

Taken from Bridgestones site:-
"With leading high-performance vehicles fitting the Potenza RE040 as original equipment (OE), this tyre is a proven performer. Distinctive features are sports performance, comfort and enhanced handling in wet and dry conditions.

Its super slant tread design, coupled with DONUTS technology, provides sports performance with precision handling, greater manoeuvrability and superb grip. " I hope they are right...


If I change the tyres, which I shouldn't have too anyway, i'm scared that if I do and it doesn't fix the problem what then? And there's the issue of my steering wheel, can't get it straight...These goons at the dealership when adjusted the k-frame caused me another head ache damn, thats why they can't get my steering wheel straight now (pain in the ass).
I changed the Bridgestones for Conti Sport contact 2s when it was brand new!I now have 6500ks.Wearing well,NO drifting at all(apart from camber of road.I've also lowered it with Eibach pro springs and camber kit,Bilstein shocks.When i picked it up new the steering wheel was off centre a bit.I didn't worry getting it straightened as the week after i got it lowered.Personally i don't like Bridgestones,overpriced' too firm a ride and so on.It MUST be the tyres.Get the dealer to put some OEM 17s from another car on and see what happens????

[aaronng]

Ok, noticed that the Lux has RE040 instead which has this thread:
http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bridgestone/bs_potenza_re040_ci2_l.jpg

Could someone check that all 4 of your tyres are mounted in the right orientation with the outer blocks all facing in one direction?

[LXRY]

Yep all outer blocks are all facing the same way on mine

[aaronng]

Yep all outer blocks are all facing the same way on mine
Dammit... my theory is a failure. http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/4463/tfr7a7bs8.gif

[LXRY]

Lxry, you need to try 4 tyres that are worn even front and back. Just the fronts is not good enough if you are trying to work out what is causing the tracking problem.

If on the stock 16" rims and tyres your car is tracking ok - doesn't that suggest to you that the culprit is either your 17" rims and/or tyres?

Honda, consumer affairs, etc is not going to help you now the car tracks ok with the 16" stocks - I thought you were running the OEM 17" with the Bridgestones. Maybe you are - I am just a bit confused now as to the specs of your car?

So what sort of rims are they? What size and offset? Have you had the tyres off the rim and the rims checked to see whether they spin true? What tyres are you running and in what size...?
Still lots of avenues to explore I think. If safety is a concern then I suggest you keep your stock 16" rims on until you investigate more.


I'm back on the OEM 17"s, sorry for the confusion. They swapped them over just to show me that it wasn't the fault of the car, that it was the low profile tyres and this was normal for the car to do this with low profile tyres...this i can understand (drift when road cambers) but when i brought the car in at the 10,000klm service it was pulling that BAD to the right on a STRAIGHT road they had to adjust the k-frame to compensate for the drifting? Why adjust the K-frame? Well because it was drifting very, very, very bad, unsafe bad why didn't they tell me this was normal then...pfftt

When I talk of safety issue I mean when my car was at 4000-5000klm's, not now.

My car is still not 100% it doesn't drift on a staright road anymore, but still drifts to the right HARDER than the left, somethings not right, it's irritating to me as I'm always having to fight the steering when road camber to the right, left not a problem.

I wouldn't change to 16" even if they paid me. When i bought the car the bigger rims and low profile tyres where one of the factors that influenced me buying the car aswell, thats why I bought the luxury model and not the stock. Now because of this problem with the tyres I have to fork out of my pocket for new tyres? Does this seem fair? Is it my responsibility to do this? In the end I'll put new tyres on my car but at the moment I am fuming...and will do whatever it takes to prove that they are wrong, not only for me now but for everyone who buys and has bought euro's with this problem. :(

[aaronng]

My car is still not 100% it doesn't drift on a staright road anymore, but still drifts to the right HARDER than the left, somethings not right, it's irritating to me as I'm always having to fight the steering when road camber to the right, left not a problem.

Waitaminutethere... you mean your car pulls to the left as well???? If it pulls in both directions, then it is a low profile tyre issue following imperfections in the road (no public road is perfect. Go to a track or airstrip for perfect roads). Most people who complain about pulling only get it in one direction, and that is clearly a problem.

[LXRY]

Waitaminutethere... you mean your car pulls to the left as well???? If it pulls in both directions, then it is a low profile tyre issue following imperfections in the road (no public road is perfect. Go to a track or airstrip for perfect roads). Most people who complain about pulling only get it in one direction, and that is clearly a problem.

Left is normal, it will drift a bit when road cambers, I understand this aaronng, but right is not within normal sorry. You make it sound as if I'm nit picking lol...Like I said in my previous posts my car is not as bad as before now.

wish I posted when my car was at 4000-5000klm's.

Does anyone believe me :confused:

[aaronng]

Left is normal, it will drift a bit when road cambers, I understand this aaronng, but right is not within normal sorry. You make it sound as if I'm nit picking lol...Like I said in my previous posts my car is not as bad as before now.

wish I posted when my car was at 4000-5000klm's.

Does anyone believe me :confused:
My Euro has 16" on them. It also follows road cambers left and right. Even grooves on the road.

I'm not denying the fact that you have a problem with the car pulling to the right. I'm just wondering if the drift to the left and right that you have is the same as tramlining that all Euros have as a sacrifice for better steering response.

[LXRY]

My Euro has 16" on them. It also follows road cambers left and right. Even grooves on the road.

I'm not denying the fact that you have a problem with the car pulling to the right. I'm just wondering if the drift to the left and right that you have is the same as tramlining that all Euros have as a sacrifice for better steering response.

No not tramlining issue here aaronng, definite problem with drifting to the right buddy. I enjoy the steering response actually, love the feel of the road. hehe...

[cgspot]

Honda Australia replied to my complaint about the car pulling to the right.
They have issued a service notice, which my local service centre got; it's a checklist of procedures to follow in the event a car is pulling, which they followed.

Yes, Service Manager confirmed ... it pulled to one side (all the way to the other lane) in less than 6 sec @ 100Kph.

They rotated the tyres ... problem rectified (for now) @ 3300Klm.

However, I pointed out that they had already rotated the tyres @ 1000Klm, for exactly the same problem (it's on record) and asked if they would need another rotation in another 2000Klm?

The Service Manager replied that if so, it would confirm in his mind that it is the tyres and not a problem with the car.

[Type R Positive]

It sounds stupid to me that you guys are blaming the tyres for the "drift".

[cgspot]

It sounds stupid to me that you guys are blaming the tyres for the "drift".

Hi Type R Positive

I'm not blaming the tyres, I'm utilising the Honda Service Notice through a Honda service department to find and rectify the problem.

When the tyres were new (no problem) at 500Klm's drifting to the right (problem), at 1000Klm's tyre's rotated (no problem), then at 2000Klm's it started drifting again (problem), at 3000Klm's tyres rotated (no problem) if it starts up again at 4000Klm's ... I'll be asking for new tyres.

"Must be the tyres" Honda Service Manager.
Do you have any other suggestions?

[cgspot]

Left is normal, it will drift a bit when road cambers, I understand this aaronng, but right is not within normal sorry. You make it sound as if I'm nit picking lol...Like I said in my previous posts my car is not as bad as before now.

wish I posted when my car was at 4000-5000klm's.

Does anyone believe me :confused:
I believe you LXRY

[avid]

It sounds stupid to me that you guys are blaming the tyres for the "drift".
Type R Positive,not sure why you seem so reluctant to believe the tyres could be at fault.These types of problems have occurred many times with different brands of tyres in my 30 years of experience as a mechanic.
How many times do i have to say it.When i fit the 16" rims with the Dunlop non-directional tyres i have no steering problem with my car.As soon as i swap back to the Honda 17" rims with the Potenza Re040's my car drifts right.Lots of people on this forum are running 17" and 18" rims with other tyres and not getting the problem.You dont have to be Einstein to work it out.

[Omotesando]

I think what LXRY meant with his car drifting to both left and right is exactly what I said a few pages ago.

1) If road cambers left, car drifts to left slightly as 'normal', or sometimes not at all despite the uneven road.

2) If road is straight and flat, the car sometimes track straight, sometimes drifts right.

3) If road cambers to the right, then the car pulls to the right very HARD.
Just say in condition 1, the road cambers at 10 degrees to left - the car will drift left only slightly.
But if it now cambers at 10 degrees to the right, just exactly opposite to above condition - the car will drift very very hard to the right. So the effect isn't proportional.


Anyway, yes the Bridgestone RE040's don't have that anti-directional tread on the outer blocks, its pretty much one directional everywhere, so that reason can't explain why it pulls to the right.

I'll never put a tyre like that RE030 on my car btw!
I'll never buy one of those Goodyear Eagle GS-D3s either, coz with that kind of aero tread, when it runs down a bit the car wants to skate everywhere in the wet. Nearly got killed by them a few times, even though they're tops when brand new...

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I think that the Honda Service or Honda Australia might be wrong to blame it on the tyres if you need to rotate them continuously. Because, most people's LUXURYs don't drift at the beginning, but only does so after a few thousand kms. Then you rotate them front and rear, and the problem goes away for the time being.

What does this say? It means, the front and rear tyres are geometrically wearing differently. This sounds more like the car caused the tyres to wear this way rather than the other way around.

The other thing - 16" tyres NOT drifting doesn't mean the problem isn't there. The fact that 16" have higher profile and softer tyre sidewalls just means they're not wearing out in the same manner that the 17's RE040's do, because the tyre contact patch on the 16" can adapt perpendicularly to the road more easily.

3rdly, most people on this forum with OTHER 17" and 18" tyres are using aftermarket suspension of springs & shocks or coilovers, etc. You can't compare those with a car still on the stock suspension and tyres package!