View Full Version : ** 56k Warning ** L15A Engine Internals
Ok, I have decided to get a qualified mechanic to do a full inspection on my engine.
Basically this is what happened, the connecting rod broke and the piston spun 90 degrees clockwise. The piston hit one of the valves because the valve relief has moved (because of the 90 degrees piston spin). The shreaded rod has punched 2 holes on the block causing oil leak, and engine stalled.
The mechanics have proved that this was happened during low rpm driving. At low rpm, only 1 of the intake valve will be fully opened, the other valve will only be half opened. Both valves will only fully open when VTEC is engaged. The fact that only 1 valve has been damaged proved that it was happened before VTEC is engaged.
They have proved that this is not caused by over-revving the engine or mis-shift because there wasn't any damage in the valvetrain and there no signs of overheating as well. In fact, the valvetrain appears to be in near new condition, which has ruled out the chances that it is caused by excessive wear or poor lubrication. They came to the conclusion that this is caused by manufacturer's defect.
I have already paid for the repair and inspections myself. Basically Honda has denied my warranty claim because they said it can't happen just like that at 3000rpm. They said I must have over-revved the engine or mis-shift. They said they will need to charge me for the inspection, it can range from a few hundred dollars to a few thousand dollars, and he said it will cost me $12000 to fully repair the engine. I was freaked out by the price and I have decided to tow my car away to get someone else to repair it. This is my experience with Honda, is there anything I can do to recover my loss? I'm frustrated and I don't know what to do. btw, my car is 19 months old and it has done 43000km.
Here's some photos of the open engine:
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine1.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine2.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine3.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine4.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine5.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine6.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine7.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine8.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngine9.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineA.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineB.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineC.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineD.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineE.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineF.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineG.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineH.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineI.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineJ.jpg
http://www.snc.com.au/jazz/OpenEngineK.jpg
Zimp13
07-07-2005, 12:05 PM
get a full report from the qualified mechanic and lodge this matter with the small claim tribunal.... if can get another report from another qualified mechanic to back up this fact.....
Zimp13
07-07-2005, 12:08 PM
$12,000???? better get a damaged jazz, use the engine and sell the rests as parts... may be u still make some money out of it..... so not cos of water???
get a full report from the qualified mechanic and lodge this matter with the small claim tribunal.... if can get another report from another qualified mechanic to back up this fact.....
I'm so broke at the moment I can't really afford to pay another mechanic to do an inspection on the engine. It's very expensive to get qualified mechanics or engineers to write reports.
The repair end up costing around $4000 at the end. Which is not too bad.. the Jazz engine isn't the easiest thing to source as well.. Most people are selling them at $2200-2400.
TypeG
07-07-2005, 01:08 PM
hm..... if i were you, get a report done and give it to Honda ( to whoelse tell you it cause by over rev) not the money matter but it is fxxking bad to treat a customer like that.
Philip Lee
07-07-2005, 02:34 PM
hm..... if i were you, get a report done and give it to Honda ( to whoelse tell you it cause by over rev) not the money matter but it is fxxking bad to treat a customer like that.
i absolutely agree that Honda sxx in this regard :thumbdwn:
ekslut
07-07-2005, 02:48 PM
hm..... if i were you, get a report done and give it to Honda ( to whoelse tell you it cause by over rev) not the money matter but it is fxxking bad to treat a customer like that.
:thumbsup: Agreed. You now have proof that it was not over-reved or there was no misshift that coused this. Get Honda to reimburse you for the costs, and if they don't, I would be looking at taking legal action.
ahcash
07-07-2005, 04:20 PM
Sorry Tony... Not sure where you are at with this matter... I assume....
Have you actually call Honda Customer Service regarding this? (NOT the friggin Dealers..) You should call them up and tell them about your incident and demand to speak to the Customer Service Manager and lodge a claim since they (dealers) do not want to inspect the cause of the problem and that you have done your own inspection and the technician has indicated this caused by manufacturing defects...
If they denied the claim... let them know you are taking this as far as it goes and perhaps legal action against them..
Speak to the Consumer affair to see what options you have? Take them to court with the some sort of media or government body backing you up...
Get the media to push it for you.. Publish in Herald Suns Car's Guide perhaps?
The repair end up costing around $4000 at the end. Which is not too bad.. the Jazz engine isn't the easiest thing to source as well.. Most people are selling them at $2200-2400.
The replacement of the block cost $4000 or the inspection cost $4000 ???
The replacement of the block cost $4000 or the inspection cost $4000 ???
Everything together. Including engine, labour and inspection.
strepto
07-07-2005, 05:22 PM
Its a really really sad sight to see this, but I hope that this matter will be sorted out to your benefit!
Zimp13
07-07-2005, 06:34 PM
Sorry Tony... Not sure where you are at with this matter... I assume....
Have you actually call Honda Customer Service regarding this? (NOT the friggin Dealers..) You should call them up and tell them about your incident and demand to speak to the Customer Service Manager and lodge a claim since they (dealers) do not want to inspect the cause of the problem and that you have done your own inspection and the technician has indicated this caused by manufacturing defects...
If they denied the claim... let them know you are taking this as far as it goes and perhaps legal action against them..
Speak to the Consumer affair to see what options you have? Take them to court with the some sort of media or government body backing you up...
Get the media to push it for you.. Publish in Herald Suns Car's Guide perhaps?
The replacement of the block cost $4000 or the inspection cost $4000 ???
1. time consuming
2. may be costly
3. may not win
4. cant repair the car before matter settled (common sensely)
just need to weigh all of these factors really.....
Best thing you can do is try and be forceful. With qualified mechanic inspection report and proof that it was from low rpm cruising - honda really can't say much but to accept claim. If they don't. I guess there isn't really that much to do cos in the end, Tony could lose more through legal action.
Other than that... badmouthing that dealer specficially is another viable, cheap and common 'asian' alternative.
TypeG
07-07-2005, 09:42 PM
Honda knows there are always some chicken scare to do anything. That's why the dealer treat Tony like that which is worth to do it since they can save the problem plus $ and time.
MRFIT
07-07-2005, 10:31 PM
go and see a solicitor..... even though it might cost you 200 an hour..... but you will get an idea what your chances are......
even better.... go see one of those no win no pay lawyers..... :)
ahcash
07-07-2005, 10:57 PM
go and see a solicitor..... even though it might cost you 200 an hour..... but you will get an idea what your chances are......
even better.... go see one of those no win no pay lawyers..... :)
Better still.. there is the consumer affairs type F.O.C !!!
ACE888
07-07-2005, 11:15 PM
Tony.......I think you should bypass the dealers as they have made their decision by refusing to accept your warranty claim. Now you should go to Honda Australia, whether it be customer service or management, and get them to review their decision to not accept your claim. In this instance, you can verify with the mechanic's independent report that the vehicle was damaged by a manufacturer's defect.
If they then refuse, I guess there is legal option but that is probably out of the question due to costs, time and likelihood of winning.
Or otherwise you could write to Sydney Morning Herald as they have that Drive section once a week where disgruntled owners state their case, then SMH goes get the Honda dealer to state their case, they also get Honda Australia to state their case. This publicity may be a good cause.
ACE888
07-07-2005, 11:49 PM
Just another thing, can't the Moderators on OH move this thread on another common Honda category in that way we can get more ppl's attention? and opinions?
its unfair that the they dont wanna accept your claims and even wanna charge you for performing more inspections on your engine. by the way, was the engine modified in any way when the incident happened? IF it was, maybe honda would say that its not a manufacturers defect and hence deny you any sort of warranty claim. they would just say that the engine was modified/tempered with and the case would be closed.
but if your engine was stock standard to the bone, then i'll say screw honda and go ahead with your legal action! :cool:
UH-0H
10-07-2005, 12:07 AM
well..i'd say if you got enough, you should put a K20A in it instead of finding another jazz/fit engine. we got a few for sale here in new zealand on nzhondas.com
http://nzhondas.com/phpBB2/engine-kits-for-sale-updated-18-03-2005-vtu34396.html
i could also ask another guy for you for the price of one, i think they got one in their workshop or something...he said they can put it in my jazz if i m seriously wanting it, but i dont think i'll be in near future..so yea..gimme a pm if interested. other wise, check out http://www.tau-net.co.jp often, you might find something you want there, quite cheap some of them, around NZ$2300 for one.
panda
12-07-2005, 10:53 AM
rofl JDM K20A - SPECIAL 8000+GST
uhoh you should not think a second longer, borrow finance on your house and do it!!! :wave:
TypeG
12-07-2005, 12:28 PM
Tony got all engine parts already which is more than u can think of
lol
saw the engine last weekend tony, that is one huge hole
UH-0H
12-07-2005, 05:25 PM
rofl JDM K20A - SPECIAL 8000+GST
uhoh you should not think a second longer, borrow finance on your house and do it!!! :wave:
dude, my mate found one in japan for NZ$4k, if you want it, i can get more info off him
but now i haven't got that much....even if my mum leaves nz and sells her car, she still would've give me that much.. :(
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