b18c block question with pic- do you think this is safe?

[MrJDMCivic]

b18c block question with pic- do you think this is safe?
i bought this block of a guy that had these beads installed into the block pictured.... he claimed that its good for high rpm, but im worried that it might cause trouble... what do all you people think....

http://tnttec.net/honda/b18c.jpg

[MrJDMCivic]

anyone?

[DLO01]

Beads? What the? Or are they Posts? Not that I claim to know a lot about engine building, but I think that is bad news. Just imagine the engine warming up. The sleave expands with heat but those Posts are holding it in place at cirtain spots and may warp the sleaves so to speak. Its just comon sense to me that it is trouble. :thumbdwn:

[michael_antoi]

wat is normally spose to be in the spot between the sleeve and the block

[DLO01]

wat is normally spose to be in the spot between the sleeve and the block
Nothing, its an open deck.

[MrJDMCivic]

so its a bad move.... i should get them removed?

[Flanderz]

doesn't water flow through there to cool the cylinders?, this would restrict the flow which is bad for overheating?? I was thinking that they may have been a form of a sleave guard. True the block would heat up and expand causing these to push against the cylinder walls and could warp them. Not too sure but very interesting

[DLO01]

so its a bad move.... i should get them removed?
I am not one to say, probably best to speak to somone with more experience in engine building. Posting is "supposed to" strengthen the cylinders, but I have heard and read they cause more harm then good. It will restrict water flow and may cause warping. The cylinders in stock form are pretty dam strong, especially for NA applications.

[Weq]

umm it doesnt look like ur average block gaurd.. hmmm no idea. its bad if it was done wrong!

[fly_vti]

looks like he was trying to 'sleev' it.

[wynode]

That block looks posted. Have a look at the side of the block and you should see filled up wholes where the 'pegs' were put through. Hopefully they used the same material as the actual block itself so it will expand at the same rate.

[tinkerbell]

dont remove them, it may cause more damage than if you left them there...

[wynode]

For anyone wondering about 'posting'

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8467&highlight=posting

[epren]

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10566&page=1&pp=12

[WhiteDC2]

I would at least bore it, make sure teh shop machines it with a dummy head in place.

[ALLMTR996]

If your that worried about it I will give you $100 for it, the advice you are getting on here is not worth shit other than Tinkerbell everyone is just posting SHIT.I sent you a PM and told you who to ring about it.
ALLMTR996

[MrJDMCivic]

If your that worried about it I will give you $100 for it, the advice you are getting on here is not worth shit other than Tinkerbell everyone is just posting SHIT.I sent you a PM and told you who to ring about it.
ALLMTR996

thanks.

[tinkerbell]

If your that worried about it I will give you $100 for it, the advice you are getting on here is not worth shit other than Tinkerbell everyone is just posting SHIT.I sent you a PM and told you who to ring about it.
ALLMTR996

glad you could help, i knew what i had to say was not much, but it was as much as i knew about the subject (which by the way is not actually called 'posting')

[WhiteDC2]

If your that worried about it I will give you $100 for it, the advice you are getting on here is not worth shit other than Tinkerbell everyone is just posting SHIT.I sent you a PM and told you who to ring about it.
ALLMTR996

Getting an open deck block bored and honed with a dummy head in place shit advice? Righto :rolleyes:

[tinkerbell]

Getting an open deck block bored and honed with a dummy head in place shit advice? Righto :rolleyes:

it does not relate to the original question (do you think this is safe?), nor help the original posters concerns... :rolleyes:

[WhiteDC2]

Well, to explain myself better, to answer the original question of "do you think this is safe?" - no I don't believe it's an ideal situation to have dis-similar metals in contact with each other (esp with a 0.02 - 0.03mm piston to bore). But, as you mentioned before, it might not be ideal to remove the dowels as it may cause further issues.

Now if this is the same person who was looking to use 84mm pistons in this block I would be sending the whole thing over to Darton to be resleeved with correct sleeves for 84mm piston size. Running 84mm pistons on stock sleeves is a tragedy waiting to happen.

However, if the thread starter isn't prepared to outlay $2000+ for resleeve and shipping to run 84mm pistons; or to look for a new block all together; he's left with the option of using this 'posted' block (with a more conservative piston size). Hence my suggestion of "at least bore it, make sure the shop machines it with a dummy head in place."

Apologies for my original post if it seemed to not relate to the original question (do you think this is safe), nor help the oriinal posters concerns...

[Flanderz]

the advice you are getting on here is not worth shit

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[tinkerbell]

Well, to explain myself better, to answer the original question of "do you think this is safe?" - no I don't believe it's an ideal situation to have dis-similar metals in contact with each other (esp with a 0.02 - 0.03mm piston to bore). But, as you mentioned before, it might not be ideal to remove the dowels as it may cause further issues.

Now if this is the same person who was looking to use 84mm pistons in this block I would be sending the whole thing over to Darton to be resleeved with correct sleeves for 84mm piston size. Running 84mm pistons on stock sleeves is a tragedy waiting to happen.

However, if the thread starter isn't prepared to outlay $2000+ for resleeve and shipping to run 84mm pistons; or to look for a new block all together; he's left with the option of using this 'posted' block (with a more conservative piston size). Hence my suggestion of "at least bore it, make sure the shop machines it with a dummy head in place."

Apologies for my original post if it seemed to not relate to the original question (do you think this is safe), nor help the oriinal posters concerns...

now THAT is a better explaination :thumbsup:

[ALLMTR996]

Well, to explain myself better, to answer the original question of "do you think this is safe?" - no I don't believe it's an ideal situation to have dis-similar metals in contact with each other (esp with a 0.02 - 0.03mm piston to bore). But, as you mentioned before, it might not be ideal to remove the dowels as it may cause further issues.

Now if this is the same person who was looking to use 84mm pistons in this block I would be sending the whole thing over to Darton to be resleeved with correct sleeves for 84mm piston size. Running 84mm pistons on stock sleeves is a tragedy waiting to happen.


Ok the material used for the posts is alloy and it is in alloy it does not touch the sleeve at all.This type of post I have seen used in 9sec WRX engines running 30psi of boost and over 150hp of NOS on top of that.So unless you have experience with this type of process do not reply to this thread as you have no way of knowing if it works or not.Now the thing about 84mm pistons in a none sleeved B16A-B18C type engine yes it will split the sleeves.
ALLMTR996

[ProECU]

The advice you are getting on here is not worth shit

Oh... you must be new around here. :D :D :D

[zco]

hey guys. im intersted to know how this works. i've created a little picture thingy.. tell me if im right or wrong. want to learn

http://home.iprimus.com.au/zco/question.jpg

#1 - these are those "rods".. which arent normally there.. RIGHT ? so usually its empty ?

#2- is this the sleeve? that is inserted between outside of the cylinder wall and iinner wall of the block ?

#3- the inside of the cylinder.. where the piston goes up and dwon.. and theres a layer of oil between the piston and the cylinder wall/ CORRECT ?!

#4- piston itself. YEH ?!

FORGIVE MY NOOBNESS. i.. unlike others.. am not embarrased to ask. so flame away HAHA

just want to know what you guys are talking about

one more thing.. howcome theres holes in the sleeve ? is it so that when it expands.. it doesnt put too much pressure onto the block ?

EDIT:
i foudn this
http://www.customdesignperformance.com/ecatalog/aebs_honda_sleeving.html
but it sorta confuses me.. is that bronze coloured thing they inserted the "sleeve" ??

[ginganggooly]

the advice you are getting on here is not worth shit

:D
don't hold back now...

[ALLMTR996]

hey guys. im intersted to know how this works. i've created a little picture thingy.. tell me if im right or wrong. want to learn

http://home.iprimus.com.au/zco/question.jpg

#1 - these are those "rods".. which arent normally there.. RIGHT ? so usually its empty ?

#2- is this the sleeve? that is inserted between outside of the cylinder wall and iinner wall of the block ?

#3- the inside of the cylinder.. where the piston goes up and dwon.. and theres a layer of oil between the piston and the cylinder wall/ CORRECT ?!

#4- piston itself. YEH ?!

FORGIVE MY NOOBNESS. i.. unlike others.. am not embarrased to ask. so flame away HAHA

just want to know what you guys are talking about

one more thing.. howcome theres holes in the sleeve ? is it so that when it expands.. it doesnt put too much pressure onto the block ?

EDIT:
i foudn this
http://www.customdesignperformance.com/ecatalog/aebs_honda_sleeving.html
but it sorta confuses me.. is that bronze coloured thing they inserted the "sleeve" ??
Ok here goes
1 is what the installer calls a post which is put in there to support the cylinder wall to stop distortion.
2 is what is know as a block guard and does the same job as no1
3 is the cylinder or sleeve in which the piston moves up and down in.
4 yes is the piston
And what you called the sleeve os not as I have said it is a block guard and there are holes in it to allow the collant to pass thru it to the head.
ALLMTR996

[zco]

so with the sleeves.. found in that link..
http://www.customdesignperformance.com/ecatalog/aebs_honda_sleeving.html
WHY do they remove the original one ? and then place new ones in ? ALSO. why do they only go half way down ? but not al lthe way

ie.. just make the whole thing from that stuff they are putting in

[ALLMTR996]

Oh... you must be new around here. :D :D :D
I was under the impression that forums where to help young guys & girls to learn more about doing up there cars.
ALLMTR996

[ALLMTR996]

so with the sleeves.. found in that link..
http://www.customdesignperformance.com/ecatalog/aebs_honda_sleeving.html
WHY do they remove the original one ? and then place new ones in ? ALSO. why do they only go half way down ? but not al lthe way

ie.. just make the whole thing from that stuff they are putting in
They remove the original sleeves because it is not as thick as the new T-Sleeves that they fit.This type of sleeve is good for 5 bar of boost.Quite a few All Motor guys are now using them because of the compression and the RPM that they are running as it makes the block very strong.
ALLMTR996

[MrJDMCivic]

so people, since i have 84mm pistons im going to get the block bored and honed and the head/headgasget also bored to 84mm, but im not sure it will hold up in this engine, and another thing, does anyone know of a good place in sydney that bores out honda b18c's for a good price and uses the dummy head thingey.

[ALLMTR996]

so people, since i have 84mm pistons im going to get the block bored and honed and the head/headgasget also bored to 84mm, but im not sure it will hold up in this engine, and another thing, does anyone know of a good place in sydney that bores out honda b18c's for a good price and uses the dummy head thingey.
Mate you go 84mm with those STD sleeve's it will break no questions if you are going to boost it.
ALLMTR996

[MrJDMCivic]

no, no turbo, just standard, i got a set of je pistons with a compression ratio of 11.5:1 at 84mm, so it should be alright.

[online]

ok well where do i start, yes i would use that posted block in a customers car. we use them in WRX's and is a very common thing in them.. Sleeving would be the ultimate for strength but can be expensive.


As for using 84mm pistons with a std block, i'd say whoever you are listening to and whoever is building your engine should be shot. that will not last long at all..

[ALLMTR996]

ok well where do i start, yes i would use that posted block in a customers car. we use them in WRX's and is a very common thing in them.. Sleeving would be the ultimate for strength but can be expensive.


As for using 84mm pistons with a std block, i'd say whoever you are listening to and whoever is building your engine should be shot. that will not last long at all..
What he said :thumbsup:
ALLMTR996

[MrJDMCivic]

so 84mm pistons arnt any good at all. i guess im gonna have to get 81mm pistons.

[tinkerbell]

did you not read the whole thread?

or is it that you dont want to re-sleeve it?

[MrJDMCivic]

shit sleeving cost over 2000, dont wanna spend that type of money only on a block. i think im better off getting 81.5mm pistons and boring it out to 81.5 specs.

[tinkerbell]

how much did you pay for the posted block?

[MrJDMCivic]

bought it off this guy for 500, bored already to 81.25mm,. so looks like im gonna have to buy 81.50mm pistons and bore it out to that so the sleeves dont break.

[tinkerbell]

sound like a good plan...

i know someone who is running 82mm pistons with stock sleeves, but i think the block was sent to Japan to get it bored...

[MrJDMCivic]

also if i bore it out to 81.50mm do i have to bore out the head and the headgasget?

[tinkerbell]

IMO no, you don't have to, but other peopls may say that you should...

[MrJDMCivic]

so the standard headgasget with standard head will fit perfectly and have no clearence issues being the pistons are 0.5mm bigger

[tinkerbell]

no, 'perfectly' is the wrong word.

but there should be no 'clearance' issues, what pistons are you going to use? have you actually looked at them (or a picture of them?)

the reason why people might suggest boring out the head and HG is not for clearance concerns, more detonation 'hot-spot' concerns...

[MrJDMCivic]

ahh., im getting je pistons. what do you think about them? also they are meant to have a compresion ratio of 11.5:1

[tinkerbell]

i think they are as good as any other forged piston in that price range...

11.5 is *only* ITR compression, why not go with 12.5:1?

do you have a ECU to tune the engine?

[MrJDMCivic]

basically i have a integra vti-r b18c2 and since my block crackd from the acident, i bought this type r block, now since i gotta bore out the block i can't use my original pistons. so im going with 81.50mm je pistons, but i only have the standard 1.8 head. not the type r. so im hoping that since my engine only has 10.? compression ratio and the type r has 11.5, it should bump up the power to somewhat similar to a type r engine. also my ecu is a standard p72., ive seen this site called http://www.pgmfi.org/ and they program ecus. so i wanna see if i can incress the fuel since im incressing the compression ratio from standard 81mm @ 10.1 cr to 81.50 je forged 81.50mm @ 11.5 cr....
tell me if im doing anything wrong cause im new at the b series engines.

[tinkerbell]

ha ha ha, oh crap...

i think your plan is OK and is obviously to a budget.

perhaps a VAFC could be better since it is adjustable, a reporgramed ECU is not really that simple, as there is no way to really know how much fuel you r engien will need untill you dyno it...

the engine (with just the pistons) will probably not be anymore powerful than your old engine.

unless you get ITR cams, intake and header...

[MrJDMCivic]

but itr intake doesnt fit on my head, so ive been told, also i don't really know where to find itr cams..

[MrJDMCivic]

im thinking of porting out the head valves... kind of like what omniman does on that dvd.... so it allows more air flow...

[tinkerbell]

stop watching DVD's,

and start searching the internet.

[MrJDMCivic]

stop watching DVD's,

and start searching the internet.
loll :D i did. but the net sux,.

[tinkerbell]

www.honda-tech.com
www.team-integra.net

[EG5]

but itr intake doesnt fit on my head, so ive been told, also i don't really know where to find itr cams..

we can supply you anything from mild to wild!