Doing the EK hehehe

[Menzy]

ok now ive jst got my Ek which u all saw n loved :p heheh
now the engin is a standard 1.6L single cam manual
now i have been told that i can convert the engin into Vtec...

Now i dnt want to engin swap i jst wanna change the internals ...eg. head, cams, rods, pistons and so on ... does any1 have a cost wise of it ... and im thinking of like finding like a Type-R engin and jst replacing the head n stuff.... ny ideas... thanks for ur replies .....................

[crispy]

um... u should start reading a bit on engines i think. If you have a single cam 1.6, then a type r head will not fit onto your block, thats if i interpreted your post correctly. To be honest, i wouldnt worry about doing engine work to a single cam d series, unless your looking to turbo in future. I would save my pennies and get the good ol b16a2 conversion into your car. But first check out these sites to get an idea of what is and isnt possible..
Honda-Tech (http://www.honda-tech.com)
JDM Civic (http://www.jdmcivic.com)

[v3rdino]

hey dude
you are thinking of a mini me swap. what they do is take the head of a SOHC Vtec and replace it with your standard d16y one. i am actually thinking of doing one considering it is one of the cheapests ways to get more peformance out of your d16y engine.

there is a write up about here
http://www.jdmuniverse.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32971

[Menzy]

edit- OT reply


In here where if u mean the pic, then thats very nice of u... but like i said im jst trying to get some ideas ....... if ur gonna make comments like this in here then jst dnt bother ok.

[02ZZI]

yes you can convert the engine into vtec but it will be sohc vtec not dohc because you have a d series engine(i think your car is a ek1 which has a d16y4) for this you will need to put a d16y8or9 i think head i cant remember the code and also upgrade your comp to run vtec. Its quite a costly expierence.

How ever i think you are talking about doing a b16a conversion? which is the engine from vti-r's which is dohc vtec. just a tad more expensive then a "mini me" conversion.

I was going to do a mini me conversion and realised it really wasnt worth it. I race my friend with sohc vtec civic and its always even until i have to change gears and he can continue with his gear for another 1000rpm. even then he doesnt get me by much at all.

I hope i got that all right, if i didnt some one please let me know

[Menzy]

thank u, dats what ive been trying to say but i wanna use the internals of either a type R civic or Integra type R... but say i use all the components from the b16a would it have the same power output ... i noe engin swap is a betta option but my engin hasnt done much Ks and its really clean as it was driven by a good lad, and it was serviced every 10,000 kms so yea ... keep'em comin guys .. thank u hehehe

[02ZZI]

i dont think you will be able to use the internals of a ctr or itr in a d series engine(please correct me if i am wrong). I am in the same position. I dont know what to do with my car, i got a 99 ek with like 90xxx ks on it. I can either turbo or engine conversion.

[**Ghost**]

Menzy dude, welcome but u really need to get ur facts straight

in summary of wot the other guys here have sed

1. You have a D16Y engine. This means its a 88kw single overhead camshaft engine SOHC

2. All type R engines, not matter if its civic type R, integra type R, and even the b16A are DOHC engines... DUAL OVERHEAD CAMSHAFT, that means they ahve one camshaft more than you

3. Now you have to understand

a) the internals from any DOHC engine for hondas are NOT compatible with SOHC engines - your engine is SOHC, so b16a/civic R/teggy R stuff does not fit your engine

b) the HEAD (as in the part that makes it vtec) are NOT compatible with SOHC engines - does not fit your SOHC engine

so REMEMBERING THE ABOVE FACTS, what you are talking about is completely impossible

the only way u can get VTEC, is if you change the head of your engine (the SOHC engine) to a SOHC VTEC head, from a EG 92-95 civic sohc vtec VTi model.

OR

you can change yoru engine altogether

i was clueless too (and prolly partially still am now) at one stage so dun worry about it dude

edit: the fact that the head of TYPE-R/DOHC VTEC/b16A heads doesnt fit the bottom end block of your D16Y sohc isnt due to you not having enough money or its not a conventional way to do it. Its the shape and size.

[Menzy]

Menzy dude, welcome but u really need to get ur facts straight

in summary of wot the other guys here have sed

1. You have a D16Y engine. This means its a 88kw single overhead camshaft engine SOHC

2. All type R engines, not matter if its civic type R, integra type R, and even the b16A are DOHC engines... DUAL OVERHEAD CAMSHAFT, that means they ahve one camshaft more than you

3. Now you have to understand

a) the internals from any DOHC engine for hondas are NOT compatible with SOHC engines - your engine is SOHC, so b16a/civic R/teggy R stuff does not fit your engine

b) the HEAD (as in the part that makes it vtec) are NOT compatible with SOHC engines - does not fit your SOHC engine

so REMEMBERING THE ABOVE FACTS, what you are talking about is completely impossible

the only way u can get VTEC, is if you change the head of your engine (the SOHC engine) to a SOHC VTEC head, from a EG 92-95 civic sohc vtec VTi model.

OR

you can change yoru engine altogether

i was clueless too (and prolly partially still am now) at one stage so dun worry about it dude

edit: the fact that the head of TYPE-R/DOHC VTEC/b16A heads doesnt fit the bottom end block of your D16Y sohc isnt due to you not having enough money or its not a conventional way to do it. Its the shape and size.

yea dats what i thought ... but if u think about it, its not worth putting in the SOHC Vtec as its only gains a few more kw which is like 96kw if i remember correctly..
then i might be thinking of putting a type R integra engin or a b18B to make things a lil bit betta but yea thanks for that really helped hehehe

cheers

[wynode]

What do you want from the car (both power and application wise) ? That will determine your options.


yea dats what i thought ... but if u think about it, its not worth putting in the SOHC Vtec as its only gains a few more kw which is like 96kw if i remember correctly..
then i might be thinking of putting a type R integra engin b18B to make things a lil bit betta but yea thanks for that really helped hehehe

cheers

B18B is from the GSi (DOHC non-VTEC) NOT the Type R

[Setanta]

Sell the existing car and by an EK4 or EM1. Given what is your technical ability (not to mention your ability to use the search function), you'll save at least 10K by taking that route.

I honestly don't understand why people keep buying crap, buget entry level late model civics and then want to transplant when spending an extra 5K would have got them a B series powered car.

[chameleon]

I honestly don't understand why people keep buying crap, buget entry level late model civics and then want to transplant when spending an extra 5K would have got them a B series powered car.

Well i dont agree with the 'crap' part.
But i do agree that buying an ek1 then putting a b16 in it is a waste of money when u can buy an original ek4 for less money and problem.
Unless u wanted to put in a b18 then its slighly different.

[Menzy]

Well i dont agree with the 'crap' part.
But i do agree that buying an ek1 then putting a b16 in it is a waste of money when u can buy an original ek4 for less money and problem.
Unless u wanted to put in a b18 then its slighly different.

that is different hehehe ... as thats wat im planning for now since i cant change heads to twin cam vtec (DOHC) not worth it nymore so go the DOHC :D

[02ZZI]

because some people when they bought there civic didnt have the greatest knowledge of honda's. When i bought my car when i was 16 and a half i didnt even know what vtec was. I am now 18 had the car for 2 years i want to do the conversion because i dont want to sell my car, plus parents would be very disappointed if i sold my car plus it keeps all parties happy. Thats my reason

[Menzy]

we all have our circumstances from parents...

i knew about vtec but if u think about where can u buy a VTI-r thats not been thrashed to the sh!t house ... dats y ppl do engin swap coz its easier to work on the engin b4 putting it in, and i have neva seen a civic of this clean with this colour so we all have our reasons for our transplants :p so dnt come here complainng bout us ppl that buy Ek1 and so on n then think bout putting vtec in it... coz like i said we do have our reasons :)

[**Ghost**]

if u want to do it chaepo do wot the americans do...

some buy a b18b outta a non-vtec GSI teggy and put it into a Ek civic. The advantage of this is PRICE, b18b falls into usually the "no one wants it" category of engines... u can get one for way under $1000 with gearbox

although a mediocre engine in the GSI teggy, they are a vast improvemetn over the D16Y

[Encor3]

ever thought about turbo?

[ricky_wingki]

D16 --> Go for turbo. Thats my suggestion. I saw d series ek with turbo run on dyno, get 116kw power (but dunno @ engine or wheel)

[na]

used to have ek dseries non vtec with simple greddy bolt on turbo kit put on 126 hp @ wheels...just to give an idea...stock internals
maybe...this is much simpler and cheaper option...otherwise i agree...buy ek4...like i did...haha

[Setanta]

lol @ the kiddies.

Don't talk crap about EK4s being thrashed etc.

1. The donor JDM or Au engine/cut will most likely be an equal unknown.
2. You are still wasting money that you will never see back when it comes time to sell. Just because you've modded it, doesn't mean you'll see more than 20% of your investment back (and trust me, after 20 years of owning and modding a variety of cars, I know:) ).
3. If my EF9 can have 200,000kms on its original, unopened B16A - and we're talking about a 15 year old car and engine here - then an EK4 should do as well if not better.

4. Whaaaa mummy and daddy won't like it... ROFL :D I love kids today :D

[BlitZ]

ok now ive jst got my Ek which u all saw n loved :p heheh
now the engin is a standard 1.6L single cam manual
now i have been told that i can convert the engin into Vtec...

Now i dnt want to engin swap i jst wanna change the internals ...eg. head, cams, rods, pistons and so on ... does any1 have a cost wise of it ... and im thinking of like finding like a Type-R engin and jst replacing the head n stuff.... ny ideas... thanks for ur replies .....................

ok so u want to convert all your d16 parts to b series type r parts... and not do an engine swap..:thumbsup:


good luck on your quest.. im sure you would learn a thing or too about honda vtec engines on the way

and dont go to Hanny's and scare robert :thumbdwn:

[Menzy]

y the hell would u wanna make so much fun of ppl like me ... all it i asked was a question and all u give back is sh!t ... wats wrong with u ppl all i asked for was ur opinions ............

[Setanta]

box of tissues to table 3 please. You asked for opinions, you got them.

BTW - mixing internals is not a good idea and will run out more expensive than a cut as you have to drop in a new comp to deal with the changed conditions.

We are helping - here's some more help - to do it properly, put aside at least 9 grand to do it properly, either way.

[**Ghost**]

9gs is a bit expensive, but good enough quote given that he has such a new car...

lte model haflcuts go for around 4000 bucks given... water pumps, oil pumps, headgasket and consumables changed for $500... 1500 in labor from an expensive place... i dont see how its 9gs

but i DO agree iwth u a lot for the Box of tissues comment tho :P

[Menzy]

ah well i now should research b4 i put somthing up here ... but hey i jst cant make up my mind wether to go for boost or vtec ?? or even sell this (in future) n get ek4 :D
ill just sworm around here having a look if not ill be back on here :p

[xtercii]

What's so good about a civic vtir? totally and utterly over priced. It pisses me off when I see some of the ridiculous prices being advertised on these cars.
I reckon you to keep your car and drop in a integra vtir engine, mod it a bit and beat the **** outta an ordinary civic vtir.

[Setanta]

...and have spent more on one than you would have on a VTiR. On the other hand, as you have pointed out, a stock VTiR will sell extremely well given an excellent lack of depreciation - a GL or CXi with heavy mods or an engine swap will never sell well as it's been modded, increasing your insurance premium and that of any future buyer. Sure VTiRs get slugged more than most other stock Civics, but a modded car will get smashed by insurance companies in terms of premium - and if you don't declare the minutest of mods and have an accident - well the chances are that the company will default on a payout as you have not kept them up to date.

BTW - there are a lot of reasonably priced ones - it's the EM1s that are going for crazy prices.

BTW, to an earlier poast - 9K includes doing the exhaust, rear brakes etc, plus electrician's costs to merge looms etc. Or to do an internals swap (which is just nuts). Given that this would be a first attempt at doing a swap there's a reserve for if/when things go wrong.

[xtercii]

A stock integra vtir is heaps more heavier than a civic gli, a gli is about 1000kg and a teg vtir is at least 150kg heavier, by dropping in a teg vtir engine you are building yourself a pretty unique ride and it will beat any vtirs on the road, stock for stock.
And since when does money come into the equation when modifying ur car, the joy and excitement of seeing your car tranforming and becoming what you want it to become is not something can be valued by money. It's all about uniqueness and individuality.
And i don't think you will be spending that much more than buying a teg or civic vtir. Same for the insurance, you will certainly have to pay more, but if you gi shop around it's not hard to get a reasonable deal.

[johnn]

HI...totally agree.....with saying

"the joy and excitement of seeing your car tranforming and becoming what you want it to become is not something can be valued by money. It's all about uniqueness and individuality"

Nice car by the way...I actually saw that car myself....As I was looking for a civic. I know it was posted on carsales.com....so how much did u end up getting it for??

[**Ghost**]

What's so good about a civic vtir? totally and utterly over priced. It pisses me off when I see some of the ridiculous prices being advertised on these cars.
I reckon you to keep your car and drop in a integra vtir engine, mod it a bit and beat the **** outta an ordinary civic vtir.

whats so good? :D u have to mod one then drive one to understand the beauty of this piece of engineering... i've tried to go to another car...test drove... EK4 is the shizinit :wave:

[Menzy]

HI...totally agree.....with saying

"the joy and excitement of seeing your car tranforming and becoming what you want it to become is not something can be valued by money. It's all about uniqueness and individuality"

Nice car by the way...I actually saw that car myself....As I was looking for a civic. I know it was posted on carsales.com....so how much did u end up getting it for??

thanks for that yea its pretty clean, and nice guy that owned it ... well his wife drove it most of the time (so he says) but yea got a good deal for it too heheh :) and why didnt u get it or at least check it out ?

[wynode]

Menzy, keep it to PM mate.

If this thread goes Off topic we will have to lock it.

[aimre]

Problem i hate with these b series is that for $4 k (whats was quoted for a half cut) u get wat, a 22kw gain? b16 118kw? (my figueres may be slightly off)
On the other hand, for $4k, u could get a greddy turbo kit imported from the US and for that cash fitted (from posts i read in the turbo forum) and should get over 120kw atw.
I know which one id rather chose.... Just a bit of info for ya :):)
o and welcome by the way :wave:

[**Ghost**]

byfb turbo d16 is prolly the way to go in short term.... potential and refinement is still with teh b series tho... but then again u have to agree most ppl will be satisfied iwth a blwonn d16

[wynode]

But this isn't a thread about turboing :)

[Menzy]

hmm thats intresting things to hear ...so do the D series engins go far with turbo kits ... is it worth it putting money into it

[wynode]

hmm thats intresting things to hear ...so do the D series engins go far with turbo kits ... is it worth it putting money into it
Search a bit. Weq has a turbo on his Dseries. Please search!

[sivic]

also if not done properly (like so many) a turbo kit will throw reliability out the window.
given you do not yet know too much about the technical side of cars you may want to stay away from a turbo for now. they demand far higher maintanance than NA cars.
basically if you want to do a swap and are going to go B series you might as well bypass the B16 and get a B18C. not to say B16 is not good (its damn good) but while your spending that much you might as well put in a little extra.
but yeah, figure out if you want to go down the engine swap path or the turbo path and then SEARCH. there is all you need to know on this forum alone.

[na]

also if not done properly (like so many) a turbo kit will throw reliability out the window.
given you do not yet know too much about the technical side of cars you may want to stay away from a turbo for now. they demand far higher maintanance than NA cars.
basically if you want to do a swap and are going to go B series you might as well bypass the B16 and get a B18C. not to say B16 is not good (its damn good) but while your spending that much you might as well put in a little extra.
but yeah, figure out if you want to go down the engine swap path or the turbo path and then SEARCH. there is all you need to know on this forum alone.

hence get the turbo KIT...that comes with everything...chances are you are going to have more headache swapping engine...rather than installing a turbo kit...stock boost around 6-7psi should be fine for the internals...but as said if you want a REFINED engine and engineering go buy B series equipped car..

[aimre]

true a kits usually has everything
but i think he is trying to get to the point that a turbo car also need more TLC than an NA car, and for someon with littel mechanical knowledge, this my prove frustrating having ones car in the shop evry few weeks.

[BlitZ]

y the hell would u wanna make so much fun of ppl like me ... all it i asked was a question and all u give back is sh!t ... wats wrong with u ppl all i asked for was ur opinions ............

dude... do u know what u are saying....

u want to convert your single cam non-vtec to a twin cam vtec dohc (using type r components)... (not saying its impossible)..

but if u think that an engine swap is too much of an implication to do then what u are asking is beyond the reach of the world......... IF your lucky enough to find a mechanic in Australia who would perform this for you, your likelihood of producing more power than a str8 swap for a similiar factory engine is almost zero. + it would cost u twice as much too....

I dont think any mechanic in sydney would do this for you... not even crazy charlie...... he would tell u to get a b16...

just my 2 cents

[BlitZ]

byfb turbo d16 is prolly the way to go in short term.... potential and refinement is still with teh b series tho... but then again u have to agree most ppl will be satisfied iwth a blwonn d16

totally agree... the d series also runs lower compression......

it quick enough.......

but it will never ever be near as fast as a b16a turbo........ kakkkkakaak

it really depends on what u want for your honda...
Im bias to NA only cause im a true believer of precision engineering.. like the b series and the new K stuff.... i reckon its unbelievebale to produce a low budget street car producing over 100hp/ltr..... (b16a done in like 1989 CRZY)...
even till now there isnt many high volume car manufacturer producing the NA 100hp/ltr figure..

I like boost.. but would never turn to te dark side.. best bfyb....... but its compromises the natural design of the vtec engine and hence reduces its reliabilitly... its pretty safe to run like 5 psi... but i know if i had a hair dryer under my bonnet.. and a boost switch is so readily available.. i would be switcing the boost level like 20 times aday and in time blow my engine.. + i like to track my car......

just my 2 cents.. I know u might not all agree and thats just fair..

[Menzy]

hey guys, thank you for your 2cents ... but the main thing that i want from the car atm, is jst some reasonable power under my hood, i love having vtec to kick as noise and power but then i like having boost too, the reason i still got the ek1 is coz its so clean and i needed to get my hands on a new car asap, as my older civic was starting to spit the dummy and i did look around for a while, so yea now that i got this i do wanna get power but yea ... so to come to an answer now ... as the thread goes on .. what would be the best choice to go?

[ricky_wingki]

hey guys, thank you for your 2cents ... but the main thing that i want from the car atm, is jst some reasonable power under my hood, i love having vtec to kick as noise and power but then i like having boost too, the reason i still got the ek1 is coz its so clean and i needed to get my hands on a new car asap, as my older civic was starting to spit the dummy and i did look around for a while, so yea now that i got this i do wanna get power but yea ... so to come to an answer now ... as the thread goes on .. what would be the best choice to go?

turbo :thumbsup:

[vti-2]

hey guys, thank you for your 2cents ... but the main thing that i want from the car atm, is jst some reasonable power under my hood, i love having vtec to kick as noise and power but then i like having boost too, the reason i still got the ek1 is coz its so clean and i needed to get my hands on a new car asap, as my older civic was starting to spit the dummy and i did look around for a while, so yea now that i got this i do wanna get power but yea ... so to come to an answer now ... as the thread goes on .. what would be the best choice to go?

It seems like you don't really know what you want. In your first post you said:


Now i dnt want to engin swap i jst wanna change the internals ...eg. head, cams, rods, pistons and so on ... does any1 have a cost wise of it ... and im thinking of like finding like a Type-R engin and jst replacing the head n stuff.... ny ideas

Do you still want to do this? Or are you considering a transplant and possibly a turbo setup?

There are heaps of possible setups for your car, but you need to decide what you want to do before anything else. Decide whether you want to stick to n/a or go turbo and then start researching. There are heaps of threads here regarding turbo setups in particular, so any questions you might have would have already been answered. Do a search.

If you want to stay n/a, forget stuffing around with the internals of your D series motor. Finding a workshop that will actually do what you originally wanted to do will be a job itself. Save yourself the money and headache and get a Type-R engine or a B16A and transplant it into your car. Best thing to do is get a half-cut so you get the gearbox etc as well. This type of setup can be setup as a high powered n/a setup, or can even be turbo'ed later.

If you want power, then aim for a turbo setup. Going the n/a route is VERY expensive, especially if you are chasing a lot of power. If you are not convinced, ask some of the guys on this forum that are running n/a setups. Turbo is the best in terms of bank for your buck however you will need to lay out some money to strengthen the engine a little to make sure you don't blow it up (always better to be safe, than sorry). If you go VTEC and decide to turbo the car, you will need to run lower boost as the engine has a higher compression ratio. I think there are a few guys here that have turbo'ed the D series with no major issues, Weq being one of them so (again) you should do a search.

The rest is up to you. You need to decide what you want from your car and at the same time figure out a budget. Don't forget that a high performance n/a setup will get very expensive. A turbo setup will be much cheaper and return more power. I hope that helps.

Good luck.

[vti-2]

By the way, here are some threads to get you started.


Cost of a Turbo Conversion (D series turbo info)
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28515&highlight=series

any b16's running 13's? (all motor info on running fast times with B16's)
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23506&highlight=series

[Menzy]

By the way, here are some threads to get you started.


Cost of a Turbo Conversion (D series turbo info)
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28515&highlight=series

any b16's running 13's? (all motor info on running fast times with B16's)
http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23506&highlight=series

thanks for that ... :P ehehehe

[Menzy]

It seems like you don't really know what you want. In your first post you said:



Do you still want to do this? Or are you considering a transplant and possibly a turbo setup?

There are heaps of possible setups for your car, but you need to decide what you want to do before anything else. Decide whether you want to stick to n/a or go turbo and then start researching. There are heaps of threads here regarding turbo setups in particular, so any questions you might have would have already been answered. Do a search.

If you want to stay n/a, forget stuffing around with the internals of your D series motor. Finding a workshop that will actually do what you originally wanted to do will be a job itself. Save yourself the money and headache and get a Type-R engine or a B16A and transplant it into your car. Best thing to do is get a half-cut so you get the gearbox etc as well. This type of setup can be setup as a high powered n/a setup, or can even be turbo'ed later.

If you want power, then aim for a turbo setup. Going the n/a route is VERY expensive, especially if you are chasing a lot of power. If you are not convinced, ask some of the guys on this forum that are running n/a setups. Turbo is the best in terms of bank for your buck however you will need to lay out some money to strengthen the engine a little to make sure you don't blow it up (always better to be safe, than sorry). If you go VTEC and decide to turbo the car, you will need to run lower boost as the engine has a higher compression ratio. I think there are a few guys here that have turbo'ed the D series with no major issues, Weq being one of them so (again) you should do a search.

The rest is up to you. You need to decide what you want from your car and at the same time figure out a budget. Don't forget that a high performance n/a setup will get very expensive. A turbo setup will be much cheaper and return more power. I hope that helps.

Good luck.

well doing a transplant will give me more power and vtec ... so that is tempting, budget wise im not thinking about atm as im saving up for the project so right now im looking what ppl have done and yea most of them have done turbo kits and others have done transplants so depends what i like really ... but thank you for your time though really appreaciate it :)