Cry02 on your hondas

[accordforlife]

hey people just wondering has anyone have this on there hondas?? if so hows is it?? just curious coz so a dyno on it and gives ya about 30hp more. anyone know where i can get this in bris

[panda[cRx]]

watchu talkin 'bout willis? :confused:

[bennjamin]

are u referring to liquid nitrogen ? As in , to cool the intake / intercooler or wtf are u on about ? nitros oxide ?

[BiGANG]

its a spray that shoots a liquified gas at the intercooler which then vapourises and gets FKN cold. Like a water spray with a gas instead of water. Its pretty good from what i've heard but its REALLY expensive. My mate put it on his Cooper S and it hammered, he hasn't dynoed it yet but if he does i'll post up a before and after, i doubt it'll be anytime soon though.

PS i think the gas is carbon dioxide but dont quote me.

[amurray]

yea its, Co2 spray, hooks up to a bottle in your boot, and is sprayed on the intercooler, and some other places i think. but its just like nos, when u want more power u hit the button

[BiGANG]

My mates one just has a ring on hit top mount that has little jets on it, thats the only place it sprays to on his, I think its totally different to Nitrous as nitrous is actually used in the combustion process whereas this Cry02 is not. Yeh Im guessing some copper would defect you for it though on the assumption it is a nos bottle if anyone was pulled over with this hooked up.

[zco]

my friend has this on his top mounted STi. i think it comes stock. its a intercooler sprayer. makes the intercooler, COOLER i guess..

so dont think you can get defected for it

[amurray]

its street leagle in QLD

[amurray]

im pretty sure it doest come stock..... it all works on the theroy that when air is colder the atoms are mor tightly packed, in turn more air, so if you cool the are before it goes back into the engine it pushes more air into the engine when it heats and expands again

[BiGANG]

No i dont think its illegal either, but some highway patrol would see the bottle in the boot and instantly think you have a nos kit. But yeh, would be interesting to see how much power it does make on top of just a efficeient cooler setup. On a dyno im talking about now.

[b00std]

cry02 is leagal in qld.. ive looked into it and it is pretty much the same as carrying a fire extinguiser in the car so you are right.. as for what it does.. there are three ways to use it.. 1 is the way mentioned on the cooler.. 2 there is a bit that goes on your fuel rail and chills the fuel on th way to your injectors and 3 is a little insertion that goes in your induction pipe or airflow meter that chills the air going in to the engine..

dont know anyone that uses it but am pretty sure would give pretty good results especially on a dyno due to the lack of air flow compared to being on the road..

chris

[wynode]

yea its, Co2 spray, hooks up to a bottle in your boot, and is sprayed on the intercooler, and some other places i think. but its just like nos, when u want more power u hit the button

It's not like nitrous. It just cools the intake air temprature. Some people use a fire extinguisher on the intercooler just before their 1/4 mile run.

[saxman]

there have been several tests done on the matter of using an intercooler sprayer.

Basically, they tend to come in either co2 sprayers or nitrous sprayers.

With co2 sprayers, especially on a front mount intercooler, power results tend to decrease due to extra c02 getting into the intake track. C02 going into the intake path signifcantly lowers the available 02 to burn, and as such, less power.

Nitrous sprayers have the opposite effect. They make a lot more power, because of stray nitrous getting into the intake. Obviously, unmetered nitrous getting into the engine is bad, as you're not getting the extra fuel for it.


Now, if you understand that an intercooler is more of a heatsink then an active heat exchanger, and use an intercooler sprayer prior to a high load run(i.e. while staging at the drag strip prior to running), both set ups can produce good results. To try to use them while driving(i.e. a lot of people set them up so that they spray under full boost, which is the worst time to use them) is rather unsafe.


This has been tested several times on the dyno... baseline runs with the intercooler mounted in front of the car, sprayed with both co2 and nitrous, then with the intercooler mounted remotely, sprayed with both. power with it mounted remotely shows up about the same, power drops with co2 and the intercooler in front, and goes way up with nitrous and the intercooler in front.

[yourfather]

... so basically if you have CO2 up front, its getting into the intake and taking place of oxygen in the combustion process, so therefore, its a waste of time?

Because, when remote located it made a difference, but when near the engine intake, it made a negative effect? yeah?

[saxman]

... so basically if you have CO2 up front, its getting into the intake and taking place of oxygen in the combustion process, so therefore, its a waste of time?

Because, when remote located it made a difference, but when near the engine intake, it made a negative effect? yeah?
correct... when you have it spraying the intercooler while moving/making power, it gets into the intake, displacing o2, causing a loss in power.

But, like I said, you can make a difference by cooling the intercooler prior to running hot air through it. When used in this fashion, co2 and nitrous work about the same. It will result in a bump in power, but only temporarily.

[filoaccord]

more cold air in more power and its not only for turbo cars NA as well, it goes in the intake pipe

[wynode]

How does co2 get inside the intercooler when sprayed from outside?

[b00std]

thats what i was gonna say...???
if it was getting in the intake through the cooler then you obviously have a boost leak that needs attention before you go with co2..

[saxman]

How does co2 get inside the intercooler when sprayed from outside?
because about 90% of the turbo'd hondas out there have the intake with in pretty direct proximity to the turbo... which usually is behind the intercooler...

where does most of the air that gets into the engine bay from? the grill in the bumper...
where does a front mount intercooler sit? the grill in the bumper...

c02 gas is sprayed on the intercooler, as the car moves, it's carried directly into the path of the intake... it's really not that hard of a concept.

[bennjamin]

from what ive read , this "c02" spray is intended to cool the fins of the intercooler and thus reduce the intake charge temp. (like a fridge for the compressed air out of the turbine) Not intended to be sucked into the intake charge at all ~

[Slow96GSR]

You sure he didn't mean this (http://www.newstarget.com/008351.html)? Freezing motor parts makes them stronger thus making it possible to make more power? Had it done on my motor but still haven't dyno'd it. Also see this (http://www.onecryo.com/onecryo/motorsport-imssept98.htm)!

[wynode]

Thanks for clearing that up saxman.


from what ive read , this "c02" spray is intended to cool the fins of the intercooler and thus reduce the intake charge temp. (like a fridge for the compressed air out of the turbine) Not intended to be sucked into the intake charge at all ~

I think what he's saying is that it's not intended to get sucked in......but invariably does get sucked in :)

[wlee2]

interesting read.. but i always assumed the freezing a metal would make it brittle.. are they actually freezing the metal or something else?

[Sexc86]

nos and cryo2 are completely different and used in completely different ways, they only thing they have in common is that come compressed in a bottle. Nos is used in the motor and co2 is used to cool components.

Cryo2 can be hooked up to an intercooler, fuel rail, radiator, intake... etc etc
pretty good stuff but just expensive. however not as expensive to refill as nos

[Slow96GSR]

interesting read.. but i always assumed the freezing a metal would make it brittle.. are they actually freezing the metal or something else?

Nope they actually deep freeze the metal parts. They basicly dip it in them let it warm back up. The molecules change so it ends up making the part stronger. If you heat the part up too much like when you put the pin in to the piston and rod you heat up the rod, if you leave the rod in the heater too long you make it brittle. A lot of new engine builders do that because they wonder off for the 2-3 min you leave them in. Noobs!

[saxman]

I think what he's saying is that it's not intended to get sucked in......but invariably does get sucked in :)
Exactly... it's supposed to cool off the fins of the intercooler, but because you're spraying a gas directly into the air supply for the engine, it gets sucked in

[b00std]

yes you most probably would suck co2 in but thats where you have to think about where you are putting your filter.. i know when i build my turbo honda i wont be putting the filter close to the turbo cos all its gonna do is suck hot air.. id rather have it as far away from the heat as possible and put a sheild around the hot side aswell.. after all the colder the charged air the better.. then you would have a significantly lower chance of getting a dose of co2 but its still possible i guess.. and has anyone actually seen one of these in action??

[Slow96GSR]

Actually for spaying the I.C. it has a ring that connects to the CO2 and sprays the front of the I.C. If you got the CO2 in the motor you would get a big carbon build up and run a little bit rich. You would have a big issue there. The sprayer needs to be far away from the intake filter.

Here (http://www.designengineering.com/products.asp?m=sp&pid=5) What we use on drag cars here!

[saxman]

Actually for spaying the I.C. it has a ring that connects to the CO2 and sprays the front of the I.C. If you got the CO2 in the motor you would get a big carbon build up and run a little bit rich. You would have a big issue there. The sprayer needs to be far away from the intake filter.

Here (http://www.designengineering.com/products.asp?m=sp&pid=5) What we use on drag cars here!
have you tested the time difference in spraying the intercooler right before you run and spraying during?

[Slow96GSR]

Yes we have.

[saxman]

can you share with us?

[Slow96GSR]

Oh well next time ask for that!!! Actually I just wanted to whore it up on this thread!!! But yes we noticed about a .2 second drop in time when spraying going down the track. Now on a car that does the 1/4 mile in 9 seconds that's a lot. Spraying it before the launch does no good. It heats up fast with twin turbos so that was useless. Here in the U.S. circuits they don't let you use the co2 or any sprays while racing but if it's just for show or testing you can use it. Now if it came stock on the car you can use it but no cars come with it yet that we've seen so no worries there. I would invest in it if you do street racing but since you all are too mature for that I would get it for the weekend track meets. As for pro there are better things to spend your 500 bucks on like 120 oct racing fuel @ $40 USD a Gal!!! Yes and it has that great smell to it too!

[spetz]

What about those Co2 bulb things that connect on your intake piping?

It is like an aerodynamically shaped bulb that with a press of a button has Co2 run through it to cool the air right before it gets into the TB.
Just wondering what this would do for NA cars?

[yourfather]

make them fall asleep from lack of oxygen

[Slow96GSR]

make them fall asleep from lack of oxygen

Took the words right outta my mouth. I haven't seen those yet but I bet I will. I would guess that they were designed to run Co2 thru them but not release it into the intake. Just to kind of cool the air as it passed by. I'll look to see what I find.

[spetz]

It's been out for ages, and there are ads for it in every car magazine

[Sexc86]

Took the words right outta my mouth. I haven't seen those yet but I bet I will. I would guess that they were designed to run Co2 thru them but not release it into the intake. Just to kind of cool the air as it passed by. I'll look to see what I find.


of course it does, its just there for the co2 to flow through and the passes air is cooled by this devise, hence the air is colder and denser and produces more power

[yourfather]

why not get a refridgerator, and hook it up to your intake .

in all seriousness...

does it REALLY make THAT much of a difference.

im sure when air is getting jammed into the engine at that speed, the effect of having a co2 'cooler thingy' on the inlet pipe is going to be minimal

[Sexc86]

why not get a refridgerator, and hook it up to your intake .

in all seriousness...

does it REALLY make THAT much of a difference.

im sure when air is getting jammed into the engine at that speed, the effect of having a co2 'cooler thingy' on the inlet pipe is going to be minimal


Think about the perforamcen different between a hot day and a cold night? big difference just from temperature imo....

[yourfather]

just thinking about how relevant it would be for street use.

[spetz]

Well, like sexc86 mentioned, there is a huge difference in the cars performance even with just 10 degrees change in the temperature

I don't know the price of these kits, but I do think the bottles are quite cheap to fill up, and considering with NA cars there are some initial not so expensive steps, before you reach the area where you need a rebuilt with forged internals, I think NA people could use every little bit of help. And if this makes 10kw difference just from pressing a button, well it'll be like a tiny shot of Nos. Or if you have a car that does 14.1 seconds down the quarter and you want to hit 13s and this can do it, why not...

[Slow96GSR]

Here (http://www.designengineering.com/products.asp?m=sp&pid=4) you go kids.

"Product Description
The CryO² Air Intake consists of an aerodynamically designed bulb with a cryogenic chamber which is mounted in a 4" segment of air tube. The air passes over the bulb, heat is removed from the air charge resulting in a colder, denser, more powerful charge. Dyno testing showed a reduction in intake air temperature of more than 50 degrees. The CryO² Air Intake can be used on turbocharged, supercharged or naturally aspirated applications. Multiple units can be used for colder results. Installs in minutes and comes with silicone connection sleeve, hose clamps and connection / vent hose."

Now I want you all to remember that some heat is needed to vaporize the fuel for maximum burn. If it's too cold you won't burn the fuel thus run lean and waste fuel. If you read the description you will see that it does NOT release the Co2 into the air intake just has the air pass over it.

Enjoy!

[Sexc86]

yes of course!! we have allready established that CO2 DOES NOT enter your motor what so ever... in any shape or form.... only used to cool the air that does

[Sexc86]

i have found these kits on the us ebay they look great however if you start bulking up on accessories the c02 does not last as long as you would like
say if you are running a bar for.... intercooler, Radiator, oilcooler,fuel rail and intake bulk.. 1 10lbs bottle may only last 10mins of constant use

[Twincam16]

which is roughly the same as No2... except much cheaper to refill :P

Only difference is... in Sydney, would you risk the $1200/cylinder fine for having a No2 bottle connected in your car?

[locote]

hahah cops are not very bright!!!
they wont tell the difference.

[Muzz]

hot4s, or maby autosalon did a test on the cry02 intercooler spray setup.
they found it very hard to find anywhere that was able to fill it, most places refused too cus the bottle wasnt certifyed or watever. in the end they ended up paying like $40 to fill the bottle. personally id rather spend my money elsewhere as ud need to keep spending money to keep it full. i think the car they tested on gained like 15kw atw. ill try find the article for ya. i think there overall score for it was like 16%

[Muzz]

get a water sprayer. much cheaper & easier to refill :), using icy cold water for dragracing, i dont see much differance between them except the cost.

[superR]

30hp.....highly doubtfull of that....maybe like 5hp.
As bOOsted stated it is the same stuff that they put in fire extigushers for liquid fires.
They do the job they are supposed to do well i have heard, but a window sprayer motor hooked up to a water supply spraying on the cooler does the same job.....i have this rigged up on my car and i see large air temp drops just by spraying water on the cooler with a set up that cost me $15 as opposed to $300+

[Cold Fusion]

i was thinking of doing a water one because it seems much cheaper, just re-rig the washer one (dont use it anywhay) and then while drivin if i ever went turbo it would put water all over the FMIC.

but how did u make it so the windscreen wipers didnt move too? heh

[saxman]

i was thinking of doing a water one because it seems much cheaper, just re-rig the washer one (dont use it anywhay) and then while drivin if i ever went turbo it would put water all over the FMIC.

but how did u make it so the windscreen wipers didnt move too? heh
wire it up to a seperate switch...




worth mentioning that spraying the intercooler is most efficient if done PRIOR to giving the car a lot of boost, not during.

[Cold Fusion]

Nice, when i go turbo (a few months hopfully) then im gonna seriously look into this :)

cheers everyone! saxman great info BTW- i gave u rep point ;) hehe

[AmateurJazz]

someone is currently selling this kit - the tank, installation kit and the cry02 air intake. Does anyone know what is required for the installation? I believe it is not likely to be direct bolt on right?

[smoknhothonda]

Nope they actually deep freeze the metal parts. They basicly dip it in them let it warm back up. The molecules change so it ends up making the part stronger. If you heat the part up too much like when you put the pin in to the piston and rod you heat up the rod, if you leave the rod in the heater too long you make it brittle. A lot of new engine builders do that because they wonder off for the 2-3 min you leave them in. Noobs!
What your trying to explain there is the martensite finish temperature for some steels (predominantly high carbon tool steels) is below room temperature.

Therefore to prevent the formation of retained martensite, the component is quenched to low temperatures using liquid nitrogen etc to ensure that there isnt any martensite formed.

Martensite is an extremely hard and brittle phase, that is undesirable when applied to high load conditions. Martensite is more suitable for high wear applications.

What wlee2 stated is correct to some extent. Some steels when subjected to extremely low temperatures results in reduced notch toughness of the material. Notch toughness is basically the impact strength of the material. This was discovered in WW2 when some of the yanks ships and subs encountered vessel ruptures in the artic climates.

[Mitchman]

in Honda Tuning a 600hp turbo h22a had a gain of 60hp with the Co2 spray just on the intercooler..... im actauly making my own co2 cooled intake same type of principle but more efficient (i think). Ill post designs when i get my computer back.

[Muzz]

30hp.....highly doubtfull of that....maybe like 5hp.
As bOOsted stated it is the same stuff that they put in fire extigushers for liquid fires.
They do the job they are supposed to do well i have heard, but a window sprayer motor hooked up to a water supply spraying on the cooler does the same job.....i have this rigged up on my car and i see large air temp drops just by spraying water on the cooler with a set up that cost me $15 as opposed to $300+

personally thats what id do:thumbsup:
saves getting the tank refilled $$$$
Saves weight in the car aswell :thumbsup:

[Muzz]

Think about the perforamcen different between a hot day and a cold night? big difference just from temperature imo....

yeah but u gotta remember thats a constant differance in temp.
having the cooler spray goin constant would waste it real quick, costing shitloads at the same time.

personally i dont think this mod is worthwile cus its gunna be a constant cost to keep refilling - just another consumable for your car. I dont see how it would be any better than a waterspray, which is cheap to make and use.
Of course u get a pretty bottle but that only applys to the ricers:thumbdwn: .
u can get good water spray kits which run electronically automatically when the cooling is most effective (with a manual spray button aswell) for much better prices.