DA9 B18a (turbo) V B18c

[A-man]

hey guys im wondering wots the diff is there much

im not just tokin bout one has turbo one dont

is insurance more then other? and fuel?

and wot bout traction and stuff

and where can i get a turbo kit for one????

anyone one done anythin like that to a DA9?

[TRU32U]

nope but once u find a turbo kit let me know!!!

[locote]

been discussed many times. SEARCH
go get some quotes and compare bro,
other wise youll open up something you might regret:)
(a big arguement that leads to no where)

[Cold Fusion]

why not go b18c turbo ;)

turbo > vtec :) definitly (IMO)

u can import turbo kits or i think there are SOME in aus sumwhere over east, there around 3 grand upwards. installation will cost a bit depending on who u kno :P

and traction is always a concideration you need to take, but practise ur take offs and ull get little spin after a while (if you are having traction probs)

[A-man]

yeh but wont u loose traction if u have vtec aswell

i have been reading somethin about vtec torque curves tend to stay even thats y when take off its harder to get the initial chirp off the wheels...

the car needs to b practical aswell because it still is a daily driver

my engine is comin up to 233000kms on the clock so will prob need replacing soon right?

[locote]

i have a gsi and i get lots of wheel spin if i launch it hard, i know a vtec will spin even more!!!

[vti-2]

yeh but wont u loose traction if u have vtec aswell

Are you talking about traction issues on take off? Or traction issues on accelerating on a rolling start? Or traction issues in the wet around the corner?

I don't understand the context of your question... :confused:

[__arjay__]

my engine is comin up to 233000kms on the clock so will prob need replacing soon right?

If you look after your engine it should last you for another 100,000 kms.

FR33k's engine blew at 380,000kms from memory..

[IN73GZ]

i wouldnt recommend vtec turbo, vtec is not designed to be turboed in the eyes of many people including myself. id stick with one or the other. If u have problems with traction then u may want to look into traction bars and ur definately going to need sum good tyres to give u a little bit more grab, possibly look at sum semi slicks as they are the closest thing ull get to a track tyre that is road legal.
IMO i would recommend going the b18c as its a bit more unique and there is nothing like seeing a NA car take down turbo.
as locote said "search" is ur frend.

[LO_N_SXC]

i wouldnt recommend vtec turbo, vtec is not designed to be turboed in the eyes of many people including myself. id stick with one or the other. If u have problems with traction then u may want to look into traction bars and ur definately going to need sum good tyres to give u a little bit more grab, possibly look at sum semi slicks as they are the closest thing ull get to a track tyre that is road legal.
IMO i would recommend going the b18c as its a bit more unique and there is nothing like seeing a NA car take down turbo.
as locote said "search" is ur frend.
Thats true! Vtec + Turbo = Problems, I've heard of people that have had Vtec Turbo cars and later on experienced problems with the Vtec kicking in and al sorts of stuff, I've also heard that One of the problems comes from the Solenoid that engages the Vtec, it plays up due to increased heat from the Oil which runs through the Turbo which gets super hot and pressure problem from running the stock oil pump, remember Oil is the entire life of not only your engine but of Vtec also.

[string]

Thats true! Vtec + Turbo = Problems, I've heard of people that have had Vtec Turbo cars and later on experienced problems with the Vtec kicking in and al sorts of stuff, I've also heard that One of the problems comes from the Solenoid that engages the Vtec, it plays up due to increased heat from the Oil which runs through the Turbo which gets super hot and pressure problem from running the stock oil pump, remember Oil is the entire life of not only your engine but of Vtec also.
Oil will only drastically increase in temperature if you are constantly beating hard on your engine. Now, the only case I can imagine this, is in a track car scenario, certainly not on the street. In which case, an oil cooler is nearly mandatory.

VTEC + Turbo does NOT EQUAL PROBLEMS.

Thats like saying, TURBO + HIGH RPM EFFICIENT CAM SHAFTS = PROBLEMS.

Vtec simply allows torque to be held until higher rpm. With a large enough turbo, this means that your torquey chunk can be raised by say 25% of your rpm. (6000rpm -> 7800rpm for example). Same torque at 25% higher rpm = 25% more power.

So if you like making less power, then boost a non-vtec engine. The trade off in this case is price. A B18C will probably cost as much as all turbo parts for a B18A; I sure know which one I would prefer...

[locote]

dollars = power .
every one knows that

[JETYPR]

Id really depends on what sort of power your looking at. I got a B18C7 in my Type R and its turbo'd. I was making 226 at the wheels and traction aint a problem if you learn how to drive with it, Sure i wasn't hitting full throttle till 3rd gear but still i wasn't loosing take off by much and when i hit 3rd i was close enough to make them look like going backwards. More importantly boost plus high compression plus vtec means lots of power, but your stock rods are only good for about 300hp then it gets a bit uncertain. I have since used Darton sleeve's CP pistons and custom rods and decompressed to 9.0:1.

You will see my car in Fast Fours and Rotories around April, hopefully before the article is finished i want to run a sub 11.4 and make it the fastest Integra in OZ. It was a very expensive process, i would recommend going for a small kit on low boost or buying something already done but make sure it was done properly and make sure you ring round and compare quotes for components and quality not just price.

If anyone knows anyone wanting a nice car get them to pm me as i need to free up some cash for a house, im in Melb you can also get me on 0413 606 659

[Lokmok1234]

so b18c is a good engine then..

[A-man]

i was tokin bout loosing traction goin in a straight line at take off in a drag

still even with 380000kms on a engine mite get me a yr and a half say coz i travel alot because i live near byford...

ive heard alot of people say that vtec + turbo = problems aswell
i heard it was just hard to tune and keep maintained....

wots the life on most b18c's??? and there r diff types of a b18c isnt there theres one from a type R and a vtir. much diff? (id perfer peoples opionions as opposed from specs and data...

[vti-2]

ive heard alot of people say that vtec + turbo = problems aswell
i heard it was just hard to tune and keep maintained....

wots the life on most b18c's??? and there r diff types of a b18c isnt there theres one from a type R and a vtir. much diff? (id perfer peoples opionions as opposed from specs and data...

You heard from who and where? The net is a good place to research but when it comes to opinions everyone turns into an a-grade mechanic who knows how to tune cars. If you want real results, go to track meets and drag events cause thats where the real cars run. I know of quite a number of turbo VTEC's that run reliably. Unfortunately a lot of these haven't really run at Calder, so you don't really hear about them but there are a lot out there. I personally know of at least 4 or 5 turbo VTEC's here in Melbourne (some with street tunes) that run daily with no problems. There are heaps more, just look at some of the other forums out there (particularly Melbourne based ones).

The life of the engine depends on how you've driven the car. If you regularly service the engine and don't trash the life out of the car, you can get over 300,000 kms. There's a member on here with a CRX that did more than 300,000 with his car (hard driving too) and the engine and gearbox were still holding up. If you already have over 200,000kms, i'd get the engine freshened up before slapping on a turbo kit. And if you want to go for a high boost setup, its a good chance to rebuild the motor anyways. :)

Tuning wise, theres a few guys on here that are reputable and can give you further advice. But from my experiences (not personally, but close friends etc) turbo VTEC's are tunable with a good ECU and will run reliably, all day, every day. :thumbsup:

[A-man]

a bloke at the honda wreakers who has spent 4 yrs tuning his prelude....

wot bout insurance wot sort of dollars r people payin for there turbo vtecs or just vtecs???

ive been doin heaps of research on vtec and varible valve timing and stuff and its really interesting and incredible how vtec works....

i also cam across ferrari cams and they r pretty cool and worth lookin at aswell

i get the jist of how a turbo works but only a thereoy on it... im not sure wot parts do and stuff...

my mates bro owns a vtir i think its a dc2 and he said im more then welcome to check it out which i mite do...

[IN73GZ]

there are many differnt b18c's u can find them around, the b18c1 is from the US i think from a GSR,b18c2 is from the aussie vtir, b18c7 is from the aussie dc2r and the b18c5 is from the jap dc2r. not 100% thats just off the top of my head.
personally id stick with a b18a turbo or just go straight b18c5 or b18c7. I think the money would be roughly the same and the NA would be more preferable, IMO.

[majic777]

If you look after your engine it should last you for another 100,000 kms.

FR33k's engine blew at 380,000kms from memory..

yeah for sure, if you're not losing oil or coolant, no strange sounds in the engine, and it makes decent power.. she'l do another 100,000km's easy if you keep it maintained.. and freeks b18a had a headgasket leak and was burnin a bit of oil by 330,000kms.. didn't actually blow up! :wave:

[FR33K]

correct hrhrhr had the headgasket leak for over a year.. but nothing blew up..
probably woulda kept going for another 100,000kms
only changed the engine coz i was bored.. and i had holidays.. and wanted a change

[Q_ball]

sigh...
this is a stupid thread...many threads have been created about this issue on vtec+turbo VS non-vtec+turbo...

as for insurance, hehehe, hope u have deep deep pockets mate ;)

[bennyBear]

why not go b18c turbo ;)

turbo > vtec :) definitly (IMO)

u can import turbo kits or i think there are SOME in aus sumwhere over east, there around 3 grand upwards. installation will cost a bit depending on who u kno :P

and traction is always a concideration you need to take, but practise ur take offs and ull get little spin after a while (if you are having traction probs)

There is a red type r (dc2) on carsales that has been boosted, not bad, not bad!

[IN73GZ]

that red dc2r has been there for ages n ages n ages, hmmmmm wonder why it hasnt sold yet????? :rolleyes:

[A-man]

its like buyin a commodore of a p plater lmao

my mates bro took me for a spin in his dc2 its a vtir and that thing flew second gear 110 i was impressed.... and wit a 9 grand redline....

he was also sayin bout it being more fuel effiecent is that true??? in a way i can see how it could be because when the vtec isnt on its only using two valves right??? (b18c is only a 3 valve right?)

[string]

its like buyin a commodore of a p plater lmao

my mates bro took me for a spin in his dc2 its a vtir and that thing flew second gear 110 i was impressed.... and wit a 9 grand redline....

he was also sayin bout it being more fuel effiecent is that true??? in a way i can see how it could be because when the vtec isnt on its only using two valves right??? (b18c is only a 3 valve right?)
If fuel efficiency is a concern for you, modifications are not for you, so get the idea out of your head.

You need to learn so much more about cars before you even consider an engine swap or turbo. All B series motors are 4 valves per cylinder. Vtec does not enable or disable any extra/less valves. It increases duration and lift.

[IN73GZ]

If fuel efficiency is a concern for you, modifications are not for you, so get the idea out of your head.

You need to learn so much more about cars before you even consider an engine swap or turbo. All B series motors are 4 valves per cylinder. Vtec does not enable or disable any extra/less valves. It increases duration and lift.
^^^^^^^^^^^^ :thumbsup:
i think he has mistaken the extra valve for an extra cam lobe. the vtir is a twin cam with an extra cam lob which is put to use when vtec is engaged. this is seperate to your valves which lift which vtec kicks in.

[A-man]

yeh sry guys i wasnt thinkin this morning

the b18c has 4 valves per cly yeh?

im moving closer to my tafe and stuff now so fuel isnt really a issue but is it true u can get more economy from a vtec as opposed to a non vtec for normal driving?

[yourfather]

B18C is the JDM engine code, not B18C5.

And yeah it has 4 valves per cylinder, so that's 16 valves all up.

2 camshafts obviously, int, exhaust.

VTi-R does not redline at 9k, it redlines at 8.
It does not do 110 in 2nd gear at redline, it does about 102km/h

Fuel economy depends more on the displacement of the engine and the weight of your right foot, plus the condition of the mechanical parts in your engine rather than the type of head it has.

It is true that you can get better fuel economy from having variable valve timing. Plus, you get a flatter torque curve, which means that the engine 'pulls' more evenly across the range.

As has been said by DynoDave, TODAau and a myriad of other well respected people on this forum, Honda engines are well engineered, and can be run very reliably with boost, whether that engine is modified or stock.

From what I have heard you can run between 7-10 lbs of boost with a stock engine with a good tune.

There are a lot of people on here who seem to know how to tune, and know a lot about the hardware required.

Building your own turbo kit costs about 4-5k just for parts, if you're going to do it yourself.

Tuning is 1.5K including a standalone ECU, depending on your engine.

obviously with the engine, if you aren't acheiving good compression because of engine wear and tear, you might need to rebuild, which is when you do the forged internals thing.

[IN73GZ]

B18C is the JDM engine code, not B18C5.

And yeah it has 4 valves per cylinder, so that's 16 valves all up.

2 camshafts obviously, int, exhaust.

VTi-R does not redline at 9k, it redlines at 8.
It does not do 110 in 2nd gear at redline, it does about 102km/h

Fuel economy depends more on the displacement of the engine and the weight of your right foot, plus the condition of the mechanical parts in your engine rather than the type of head it has.

It is true that you can get better fuel economy from having variable valve timing. Plus, you get a flatter torque curve, which means that the engine 'pulls' more evenly across the range.

As has been said by DynoDave, TODAau and a myriad of other well respected people on this forum, Honda engines are well engineered, and can be run very reliably with boost, whether that engine is modified or stock.

From what I have heard you can run between 7-10 lbs of boost with a stock engine with a good tune.

There are a lot of people on here who seem to know how to tune, and know a lot about the hardware required.

Building your own turbo kit costs about 4-5k just for parts, if you're going to do it yourself.

Tuning is 1.5K including a standalone ECU, depending on your engine.

obviously with the engine, if you aren't acheiving good compression because of engine wear and tear, you might need to rebuild, which is when you do the forged internals thing.

YOU HEARD THE MAN!!!! :cool:

[crx_boy7]

don be so harsh -hes obviously not had as much experience as you guys when it comes to honda engines
from wat iv seen turbo b-seres blow up due to parts and mods been left out ie tv seen so many turbo bseres run pcv valves fron their stoc position which causes lio to be spat into ur intake or too much boost on stock sensors cause the ecu to take a crap or sandard gap plugs on full boost ect ect

of u know what ur doing and just sit and think befor u do a turbo it wont throw up however a safe setup is 5g min to run 10psi with no junkyard turbo crap

turbo will be allot cheaper on money to power no a b18a compared to buying installing a b18c but si atot more complex to do properly than as stock motor being thrown in
(for sum reason in allways type 'si' instead of 'is' and then hav to correct it all lol)

[crx_boy7]

sorry about my very bad spelling

[yourfather]

i dont think I was being harsh, just stating the facts as I knew them, and I could be wrong.

[A-man]

B18C is the JDM engine code, not B18C5.
VTi-R does not redline at 9k, it redlines at 8.
It does not do 110 in 2nd gear at redline, it does about 102km/h



i didnt say it was a stock vtir donk it had been tuned and had breathing mods and i kno wot i saw.....

im more of a toyota person and only since ive had the honda (few months) ive been learning bout em.... and i think im doin pretty good wit the stuff im learning.

[ProECU]

i have a gsi and i get lots of wheel spin if i launch it hard, i know a vtec will spin even more!!!

There's a lot of Bullshit floating around these forums.

Vtec does not engage in 1st gear under hard launch conditions because the VSS sensor is not registering a minimum speed requirement for the ECU.

Try it, launch at 5k rpm and tell me if vtec engages.

[IN73GZ]

There's a lot of Bullshit floating around these forums.

Vtec does not engage in 1st gear under hard launch conditions because the VSS sensor is not registering a minimum speed requirement for the ECU.

Try it, launch at 5k rpm and tell me if vtec engages.

first i think you have to define hard launching conditions, ive seen it kick in under this type of launch, one of my mates had a vtec light set up and it kicked in when he launched at 5k rpm.
so tell me again, sorry whats that i can smell??? hmm yeh think it was bullshit

[FR33K]

There's a lot of Bullshit floating around these forums.

agreed..



Vtec does not engage in 1st gear under hard launch conditions because the VSS sensor is not registering a minimum speed requirement for the ECU.

agreed..

VSS must pick up a certain speed before vtec engages.. ie vtec does not engage revving it in neutral while stationery.. but it does if your rolling in neutral.
IN73GZ ur mates vtec probably engages with a 5k Launch coz hes sitting on the spot spinning his wheels.. therefore the ECU thinks the car has reached the minimun speed

[A-man]

wot sort of price have people got for a b18c out of a vtir and type R?

my mate was sayin the diff between vtir and type R POWER wise is like 16kw... he also said the type R donk is blue printed and there is a few other things about it...

and wots a dc2 type r and vtir worth?

[yourfather]

i didnt say it was a stock vtir donk it had been tuned and had breathing mods and i kno wot i saw.....

im more of a toyota person and only since ive had the honda (few months) ive been learning bout em.... and i think im doin pretty good wit the stuff im learning.

ok, well, seeing as its had 'breathing' mods, which prolly means, intake, exhaust, and a v-afc.

Why would it redline to 9k. if you've had no valve train upgrade, its a pretty silly thing to do from what I've learned.

and, seeing as the DC2 model shape was released in 94 and discontinued in 2001, giving you a ballpark figure would be laborious.

Go to redbook.com.au

[IN73GZ]

agreed..


agreed..

VSS must pick up a certain speed before vtec engages.. ie vtec does not engage revving it in neutral while stationery.. but it does if your rolling in neutral.
IN73GZ ur mates vtec probably engages with a 5k Launch coz hes sitting on the spot spinning his wheels.. therefore the ECU thinks the car has reached the minimun speed
well said, point taken :)