Ground cable upgrade

[wynode]

Was bored on the weekend so decided do it and take some pics.

Disclaimer: The following is provided as a GUIDE ONLY, and neither myself nor Ozhonda take any responsibility for the outcomes of someone else doing the following. You follow these steps at your own risk!


Aim: Upgrade the grounding cable going from the rocker cover to the chasis. Most effective only if your existing cable is in bad condition/damaged. Pretty much the same deal for most DOHC and DOHC VTEC models in the Integras and the civics. Not sure about the preludes.

Required: x1 10mm socket wrench, 6AWG shielded cable (left over from my sterior install), plug/clamp for wire ends (forget what you call them!

Steps:

1. Undo the existing cable using a 10mm socket. Originally looks like this:
http://tech.ozhonda.com/diy/ground_upgrade/IMG_3828.jpg

2. Get your cable and sercurely fasten the clamps to the end of the cable. Give it a small yank to make sure its fit nice and tight. Once its done, new and old should look something like this:
http://tech.ozhonda.com/diy/ground_upgrade/IMG_3830.jpg

3. Simply slide the ring onto the bolt and tighten up using the same 10mm socket. Once done, she should look like this:
http://tech.ozhonda.com/diy/ground_upgrade/IMG_3831.jpg

I didn't have any black cable left so I used the red. But you can always spray it black for the 'sleeper' look!

[Jus-10]

This is sorta OT but along the same lines, only taking it further....

I was just wondering what everyone's opinion is regarding earthing kits?

I don't have one myself, but they seem to be huge in Japan and was just wondering about the pros and cons and if anyone has actually done the whole 'earthing kit' thing.

J

P.S. Wynode, looks much more impressive

[wynode]

Jus-10, a quick search found this:

http://www.ozhonda.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4309&start=0&postdays=0&postorder= asc&highlight=earth

[fozee]

Great! Cheers Win...

Mine are being upgraded with my audio install.

The stockies really dont look that flash, lightly corroded and in tatters.

[Jus-10]

Sorry about that Wynode. Thanks for the heads-up

[VTEC16]

Very nice wyn :thumbsup: ....gonna have to do that sometime soon...

are you gonna do a DIY for the gearbox earth (etc) too???!?!?!? :P

[A'PEXi]

dont even know if i have one???

[incoming]

haha looks like some 1 needs a peticure (spelling) :P

[wynode]

My toes are fine thang you very much!

VTEC16, I haven't looked for the gearbox earth (there is one?) but the one going from the battery terminal to the chasis looked pretty fat and in good condition.

But stay tuned for more DIY articles comming the week after next!

[incoming]

wo!
is that ur toes? Win ahahahah i thought that was ur fingers!!!...
whoops what i meant in previous post was a manicure!!...
my bad!

[VTEC16]

im pretty sure there is one on the gearbox.....looking forward to more DIY articles!!!

PS- we should really have a DIY section (like i suggested many months ago)..

[incoming]

im pretty sure there is one on the gearbox.....looking forward to more DIY articles!!!

PS- we should really have a DIY section (like i suggested many months ago)..
yeah theres one on the gearbox (for the jdm b16a anyways)

yeah i second the notion for a DIY section!.. i also suggested that .. not long ago hehe
great minds think alike!

[VTEC16]

;)

[wynode]

Thanks guys.......we will make up a DIY section ONCE we have some articles.

So start making some articles so we don't have an empty DIY forum! :P

[Civic Type R]

nice toes man :P

i did mine last month. But its been off the road in workshops so i havent been able to do a write up :(

I did that one you took a pic of and the one from the tranny to the wheel wall. Both items were 25 cm in length.

[EG_2_TEG]

heres a pic of my grounding:

http://integrated.org.au/cars/navrally/page2/imagepages/image35.htm

[Civic Type R]

OAS, can you do a write up for us on the uses of plastic drain pipe for intake piping purposes ... :P

[EG_2_TEG]

hahaha

its all gone now
finally have a *legal* short ram intake ;)

[Spoon-Accord]

wat does it do wyn..
i bought my car with earth wires everywhere..
still dunno wats the point of it..
someone tell me?

ken

[wynode]

Its only any good if your existing earth wires are worn/under sized.

[EG_2_TEG]

there was a article in hot 4's last year i think which explained the benefits of grounding

but powerwise:
overall powergain for a 400hp car is around 4hp
powergain for a ~60hp car is 1hp :P

[Nuttz]

When i changed my tranny wire the car felt idled a bit smoother :D

EG_2_TEG: How many freakin earth wires did u need?? :) i can see 3 maybe 4 there :)

[EG_2_TEG]

the HKS type grounding kits use about 5 grounding wires!

those ones earth back into the battery from the chassis as well

[Javed]

All unecessary bullshit.

[Civic Type R]

All unecessary bullshit.
why do u say that ?

[A'PEXi]

ive got 2 fairly detailed diys atm on my forum lol

[Boost]

i think by increasing the ground cable to an 4 or 8 guage.. you allow more current to flow when u hit the acclerator casue the sparks work harder and draws more current to produce better sparks. So by increase the thickness (gauge) you allow for more current flow hance better performance. I have tried this out... with 4 guage cables.. i have 5 points connect the batter to the chassis and rocker cover. I dont feel any diff. hahahha..
Can some confirm this... :)

[wynode]

As I said previously, you won't notice any difference unless your original cables were damaged to begin with.

[Boost]

:) thats true... when u say damage.. to what extent? :)

[wynode]

Damaged as in it no longer conducts efficiently. One way to check is stick two ends of a multimeter across it and see if there is any measurable resistance.

Its kind of like the reason you replace spark plug leads when they are no longer conducting.

[Javed]

It is unecessary to have so many cables as the amount of current flowing is less than what the 4/8 gauge cable can handle so the resistance is already minimised. Its extremely stupid to have so many cables, its pure rice.

[EG_2_TEG]

power difference will only be noticeable on a dyno

[Civic Type R]

... the ugly freyed copper wire with a noticeably shrunken black housing is unsightly in my books and needs to be replaced with a prettier one.

[fozee]

the amount of current flowing is less than what the 4/8 gauge cable can handle so the resistance is already minimised.


Baaaahhhhhhhhh!!!!! :roll:
You going to tell use that purely track or drag orientated cars maintain original cabling.......


With this proceedure you are improving the terminations and replacing cables with ones that are in much much better condition than the originals.
Im certain that speaker cable has a higher conductivity than that of the originals.
If anything you are decreasing the resistance between the two points. Yet it may not matter depending on the type of currents that are likely to flow through the cable. Either way it IS an improvement over the originals.

[fueltank]

hmmm, I might bring a set of this in and see how it goes :D

http://www.the-pivot.co.jp/product/flame-se-e.html

[fozee]

Im just guesing,

but i think it would just be a capacitor bank inside the blue box.
Just to smooth out the spikes in power supply after intial ignition and during driving....

[fueltank]

Im just guesing,

but i think it would just be a capacitor bank inside the blue box.
Just to smooth out the spikes in power supply after intial ignition and during driving....

yep. comes with earthing wires too.

[Javed]

the amount of current flowing is less than what the 4/8 gauge cable can handle so the resistance is already minimised.


Baaaahhhhhhhhh!!!!! :roll:
You going to tell use that purely track or drag orientated cars maintain original cabling.......


With this proceedure you are improving the terminations and replacing cables with ones that are in much much better condition than the originals.
Im certain that speaker cable has a higher conductivity than that of the originals.
If anything you are decreasing the resistance between the two points. Yet it may not matter depending on the type of currents that are likely to flow through the cable. Either way it IS an improvement over the originals.

Who the **** said anything about keeping stock wires? I said MULTIPLE wires are pointless. Read my post properly before trying to intimidate someone. Have a nice day :)
Javed

[fozee]

hahahaha

gee you get worked up easily. I wasnt trying to intimidate you at all man, geeze ease up

[Javed]

Nah soz mate, haha been up all night doin uni shit! Sorry, but do you see what i meant now tho?

[JohnnyBoy]

well, me a couple of my mates are doing our own DIY this wknd..

will get some pics and show ya's all.

Gonna get the multimetre out and test the points that we're gonna connect up before and after..

Also, just a thought, in regards to replacing wires / multiple wires. I think i'm gonna just add on extra wires, and leave the stock ones in place.

From what i figure, the whole point of this exercise is to reduced the resistance, in order to allow lost current to flow back to the battery. So, i'm gonna add in extra points, plus adding an extra wire of where the existing connections are already.

We're gonna wire up my 94 Accord, a 2001 DC2, Mazda 323 SP20, civic (dunno what year), and a Mazda Tribute.

If we see any major gains, we maybe looking to wire up a C class Merc as well.. But somehow i think the Merc should be pretty well grounded already.

[Nuttz]

you probably wont be able to measure the resistance difference beacuse it would be in the milli ohms range.

but seriously this mod is cheap and it just for people who have nothing better to do :)

[SIKCVC]

OK heres my results for anyone who cares... I went out and tested both cars to see their Ohmage. Both EG's one B16a one ZC.

EG-5 (1991)
Chassy to head
wire - 0.4ohm(average)-80ohm(bad spots)
Bolt! - 80ohm
test from battery to bolt at chassy - 150ohm
batter to head inconclusive(didn't test any higher then 200ohms)
Tranny untested

EG-6(1993ish):
Chasy to head
Wire - 0.4ohm(average0- 100ohm(bad spots)
bolt - 100ohm
test from battery to bolt 0.4ohm
battery to head 80ohm
chassy to head(bolt to bolt) 80ohm
tranny wire 0.3 - 0.4ohm didn't test bolts.

Aftermarket Stinger Amp wirer 8 guage, 0.3 ohm consistant.

Obviously every car will be different but my wires look like shit and as you can see only 0.1ohm of a difference, I dont know how much of a difference that will make to performance/engine running though.

I know what I'd be upgrading though... The chassy Bolt. That thing produces STUPID resistance and the thing is the wire has to use the bolt to gain grounding as there is a paint barrier, I'd just clean up the old wires (or upgrade them no biggy its only a few bucks) and make sure i buy Gold or copper bolts and clean out the tread in the chassy. I prosume the same goes for the tranny wire.

I hope that helps in inlightenment on how much of a difference there is... although the evidence is inconclusive without knowing how much ohm's makes a difference.


Nick

[wynode]

test from battery to bolt at chassy - 150ohm


Are you sure you got your multimeter on the correct setting? Cause 150ohms is HUGE.

Thats like almost 1W of power lost just due to that cable!

[SIKCVC]

yeah that was bolt to bolt... i didn't really doubt check it. My quess is that there is calcium deposist or alike on the bolts stopping any readings getting through the tops of the bolts. I'm 100% sure the threaded side of the bolts would have a very similar resistance to that of the cable... it would be more like 0.9 ohm at the max... and considering people have seen gains from a difference (prosumably) 0.1ohm then up grading to gold plated/copper bolts would be an idea too... not on the engine side, just on the chassy side of things as theres paint in the way of the connecting wire.

[wynode]

Somone wanna post up the resistivity of a copper cable? ITs a very small value per meter normally......

[geo41e]

while l'm idling...the engine sounds right
when i put my fog lights on..the engine note dies down abit...when i put my fogs+head lights..the engine dies down even more

will a grounding kit be worth it? or should i jus do the DIY as posted?

or issit my alternator ? or batt ?

[SIKCVC]

its not your alt or batt... I baught my multimeter to test out if that was the problem on mine, its perfectly normal for a small engined car to do that.

But dont bother buying a kit, its a blatent rip off to get a "brand" stamped on some cableing.

[geo41e]

what about jus changing the stock ground wire from rocket to chasses and gbox to chassis

will that help ?

[wynode]

Grab a multimeter and measure the voltage (for any drops across the battery terminals..Positive to battery positive and negative lead to rocker cover, metal bit) and see how much (if any) of a drop you get when you turn your lights on.

If you are getting a significant drop, it might be your alternator.

[Boost]

ok guys.. here is a link i found which has the added gound cables.. you can decide..
http://asia.vtec.net/article/MME2003DC5/

[Mooks79]

thks boss didnt think i could replace the old ground wiring as it starts to break.... its all good now