EM1 B16a Fuel Issue

[abzndintegra]

Hi Guys

Bought a EM1 with what i thought was a stock setup :( (i like stock) , drove it now i notice a few things,
1. half tank only 150k's 98 optimax,
2. slight smell of petrol from exhaust.
3. sometimes cuts out kinda chokes when giving it.

Ive had another glance at the setup and found the following,

1. had a 2 inch apexi exhaust, which i have since removed to stock.
2. iridium IX bkr6eix-11
3. it has a denso sensor map, (will changing this fix the problem?)
4 the exhaust manifold is after market,
5. the fuel rail has been changed
6. the injectors are numbered nh25 on 3 and nh20 on one (are these stock?)
7, the throttle body has a brand of HAD.

this is wat i want, i want it to run normally with excellant fuel mileage, id really much rather get rid of all this stuff as opposed to keeping it on, but it may not be that easy to source all the stock parts.

i know the guy also had a computer and wasnt using the stock one but this has been removed,

what do you guys think is the easiest way to fix this problem, i mean can the stock ECU run all this diff injectors/manifold etc...

Help!

[[[d a n n y]]]

id say your computer is pretty much causing all your probles
it's running very rich..

[Weq]

u really need to take pictures and give more details of ur problems.
the plugs are iridiumns which are fine.

my first though would be iginition related. i highly doubt its a map sensor issue (denso are stock) but it also sounds like a few sensors - maybe o2 - are stuffed.

[ZeForce]

HAD is stock throttle body I do believe..... Well my B16a has the same...

[abzndintegra]

Ok ive taken a few photos

http://members.optusnet.com.au/myhonda/

can anyone confirm if these items are the stock one's of EM1's

after reading a few threads ive also reset my ECU,

filled up the car with Optimax 98 and will now test to see how far it gets me, as opposed to before.

[ProECU]

I have a funny feeling that car was once boosted.

from what I can see, the Map sensor doesnt look like the factory unit, which will cause your ecu all sorts of voltage reference problems

[Weq]

i dunno. everything looks fairly standard to me.

[ProECU]

my stock map sensor doesnt look like that.

Do you have a model number or some kind of serial # from that sensor?
whats it say?

[elim]

Ok ive taken a few photos

http://members.optusnet.com.au/myhonda/

can anyone confirm if these items are the stock one's of EM1's

after reading a few threads ive also reset my ECU,

filled up the car with Optimax 98 and will now test to see how far it gets me, as opposed to before.


just to confirm that those pics shows exactly what my em1 looks like

[Weq]

my stock map sensor doesnt look like that.

Do you have a model number or some kind of serial # from that sensor?
whats it say?

i have never seen a person with a aftermarket map sensor replace the stock unit like that. i dont see how the MAp can be different either as there would be no way that it would run with another. my guess if anything, the ECU has been chipped and they are running a basemap which are never right.. but then again i doubt its running odb1.

my guess is that it has been badly demodded. prolly some lose connectors/vac lines.. but why would u buy a car which wasnt running right? this is what stuns me. its stupid.

[ProECU]

i dont see how the MAp can be different either as there would be no way that it would run with another.

Not entirely True, but I cant be bothered getting into explanations...

It has to do with the Ref.voltage v Map translation equations.

[Weq]

Not entirely True, but I cant be bothered getting into explanations...

It has to do with the Ref.voltage v Map translation equations.

Dont speak down to me like a n00b. I know exactly how a map sensor works and exactly what voltages it puts out. I am more then interested in the model numbers of such sensors that read as such and fit in the stock location, to back up your theory.

[XQISIT]

Whats preformance like?

Any signs of smoke from the exhaust at full throttle?

You mention it chokes when you give does the engine signal appear when this happens?

How often does it choke?

Ill be looking at getting your timming checked out. Shit petrol mileage and struggle of
power sounds like a timming problem.

[Rufes1]

If its running a chipped ecu and by the general mods on the rest of the car id be taking first guess at a shitty fuel map. That would also explain the shit fuel mileage and the bogging down richness when u give it the boot.

What does it idle like?

[XQISIT]

Get a timming light and check your timming!

[abzndintegra]

my guess is that it has been badly demodded. prolly some lose connectors/vac lines.. but why would u buy a car which wasnt running right? this is what stuns me. its stupid.

Mate no need for the low blow and no im not stupid enough to buy a car that isnt driving correctly, but i did buy this car without driving it i bought it from Melbourne, of a friends recommendation,

Ok ive just done 102 kilometres in it and refilled still took 12.5 litres of optimax, so i still think there might be an issue

Every since i reset the ECU the car isnt missing no more and its idleing perfectly and no more choking when i give it, it appears to be running 100% except for the fact its still using more fuel that it should. hmmm. after all the replies from you guys i am starting to beleive the throttle body and fuel rail/manifold are stock.

im going to replace the fuel filter/sparks and leads this week and see what happens,

there is no modchip on this car i know that 100% how do i know cause near the cimputer all the wiring has been rewired to stock so it must have had a mod chip / different computer but has been since reverted.

[Weq]

its called constructive cri****m. it wasnt a low blow. if u read the technical section there is a nice thread on ECU's and how little 'resetting' an ECU will do. Therefor id say u still need to diagnose ur problem.

You said the ECU harness has been cutup? This could mean its been ghetto rigged to run a ODB1 ecu? Can u get a picture or tell us the model number of the ecu so we can put this idea to rest. Alternativly i would check the 'rewireing' job that the car has had done. A rushed seller might of badly soldered all connections and/or just twisted and taped the wires. this would cause intermittant issues as described.

Lastly, you said the car was running rich and spluttering. This could of adversly effected the plugs. Try pulling them, reading them, and cleaning/replacing and nessescary. BKR6E-11's are stock plugs and will run ~3-4 each.

[Waggy]

Ok noob question Weq - what is the point of rewiring to OBD1?

[ECU-MAN]

looks like a stock IM, TB and map to me

all OBDII

look at yoru air cleaner, if its blocked that can contribute to poor fuel economy, aslo a lazy O2 sensor wouldnt help.

[ProECU]

John

that MAP doesnt look like the one in my car... wierd.

...and if the injectors have been replaced, its suspect to me.

[abzndintegra]

Pro ECU

i thought it was differant as well, but i think the B16a series 1 and seris 2 differ, my friends b16a is a gen 1 and it looks completly different, do you have a gen 1 or 2 b16a?

[BlitZ]

just to confirm that those pics shows exactly what my em1 looks like

double that:thumbsup:

[Weq]

John

that MAP doesnt look like the one in my car... wierd.

...and if the injectors have been replaced, its suspect to me.

This is an EM1. Made ODB2 and made in the US. There are many diferences, but I cant be bothered getting into explanations...

[Weq]

Ok noob question Weq - what is the point of rewiring to OBD1?

To run hondata or any other modified ECU program.

[ECU-MAN]

John

that MAP doesnt look like the one in my car... wierd.

...and if the injectors have been replaced, its suspect to me.

hey dude

here's a pic of vutso's car

AUDM EM1-T

http://b16a2.kicks-ass.net/tech/EM1-T.jpg

Jap built used all black ones with denso written on them

[ECU-MAN]

http://b16a2.kicks-ass.net/tech/CRX-MAP034.jpgMAP in my AUDM jap built B16a2


if your injectors have been changed they used OBDII injectors as you still have the OBDII connectors

[zco]

if you have solved all your problems except for that fuel issue, then you should read what wyn posted. i had low fuel economy at one stage. had a read, and found out it was my tyres. i didnt even realise it was so low.. it looekd so normal. and i coudlnt feel the difference as the change was gradual instead of instant change in tyre pressure/

[bennjamin]

just a reminder to Weq + ProECU

dont reply anywhere in this entire forum with that kiddy chat thanks :) Consider it a warning to both of u.


Original poster , have u tried looking over obvious things like even zco posted above ?
Also have you run a ECU test to see if the ecu is giving a code for probably a crappy oz sensor or MAP sensor or anything that might be contributing to this prob ?

try here if it helps - DIY ECU TEST (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8218)

[abzndintegra]

bennjamin thanks heap for that thread i will test this weekend! never seen that thread before looks very good.



ECU-MAN thanks for the pics this now eliminates the possiblity anything has been changed, guess we learnt that there slightly differ from differant series of b16a's

At this point im still monitoring the system, gotta drive it to see if the fuel usage gets better,

one thing i forgot to add was, this motor wasnt turned on for 5 months! so it might have needed to be run in, the motor does only have 60k's on it thought so its really in good condition,

ive been noting how many k's i did with how many litres, so see if its getting better.

My expectations is at least 400k's of a tank.

[ECU-MAN]

yeah your fuel light should be coming on about 430, you could go to about 470 to 500 before running out.

another big factor of fuel consumption is driving habbits..