comparison dc4 -dc2r

[spardikis]

hey guys, just a quick question for the people who 'HAVE' tried this...

a dc4 integra v's a dc2r integra: both audm stock.


with an off the line start, who will be faster until the type r hits vtec in first gear?

and this is for the pople who have done it or know exactly what will/does happen.

[Spunkymonkey]

dc4 gsi or dc2 vtir?

type r

[spardikis]

have you done it? gsi vs type r

[Da1nONLY]

hey guys, just a quick question for the people who 'HAVE' tried this...

a dc4 integra v's a dc2r integra: both audm stock.


with an off the line start, who will be faster until the type r hits vtec in first gear?

and this is for the pople who have done it or know exactly what will/does happen.

0 - 40 = same :)
after that its bye bye...

[spardikis]

haha thanks....anyone else?

[Mr.Pen]

HAHAHAHHAHAHA

are u slow? of course the type r will win AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAH even people who hate hondas know this HAHAHAAHA

[shebangs]

I'm not going to entertain you and do the comparison "BEFORE VTEC KICKED IN Y0" because that exhibits idiocracy beyond means my brain can comprehend. I will also assume you're going to change gears because assuming that you'd want to "race" (fully sik u-leh) in first gear until 4400rpm makes my stomach hurt with laughter.

Theoretically

DC2R
1st 3.230
2nd 2.105
3rd 1.458
4th 1.034
5th 0.787

Final drive w/ LSD at: 4.785

Compression: 11.1:1
141kW @ 7900rpm
178Nm @ 6300rpm

DC4
1st 3.166
2nd 1.857
3rd 1.259
4th 0.935
5th 0.742
Final drive w/out LSD at: 4.4

Compression: 9.2:1
107kW @ 6300rpm
172Nm @ 5200rpm-5200rpm
1116kg


so...
Heres a running commentary.
0m-20m - same
2m-50m - DC2R by 1m (now it's in VTEC @ roughly 6000, Gdc4 changes into 2nd now)
50-100m - DC2R by 6-7m (dc2r in 2nd @ almost redline, dc4 in 3rd, blame the noticable longer 2nd gear ratio)
100m-200m- DC2R by 10-13m (dc2r either in vtec in 3rd, or finished 2nd, never measured so honestly wouldnt know. dc4 still in its LOOONG 3rd gear)


Practically
I own a VTI-R, best mate owns a Type R. My other best mate owns a DC4 and I just recently bought my little brother a DA9. Stock for stock, same driver skill/weight over roughly 200-250m, the DC2R beats the DC2 by 1-2m (honestly, any lack of skill by the DC2R driver and the DC2 will win), followed by the DC4 by another 10-13m, followed by the DA9 about 2-3m behind. So to answer your question practically, the DC2R beats the DC4 by a good 13-15m. FYI, the measurement is from the front bar of the leading car to the front bar of the trailing car.

But do you want the know the honest truth? Put any n00b 17/18 year old kid Schumacher wannabe driving the DC2R, and a someone with actual driving ability to launch the dc4, and the dc4 will win.

Matt

[BIG`O]

just coz im 17 means i drive like a noob?
haha.
the non vtec b18bII will have more torque down low, as its not made for "high revving vtec yo" track work. therefore with the extra torque, should and probably would beat the itr untill 6krpm (40-50klms)
even though the itr weighs less, this doesn't really matter all that much in this scenario.
put simply. same driver skill level - the gsi and itr would be equal.
it's all up to the launch ^_^

[Mikeyas]

Very good information there...

Heres my input, i own a dc4 and have driven a dc2r. Both have been driven hard.

Dc4 overall is much tamer. Suspension, steering, brakes are all of lower performance. The type R's steering and brakes are far more balanced and give great feedback to input and output.

Acceleration wise... Straight line... type R all the way such as said in the previous post. But driven spiritedly and not at 90-100%, Both cars will be very quick on the streets. Where you drive and stay around 2nd gear's lower end in both cars say at around 40kmh - 70kmh, i wouldnt put such a big gap in performance. The type R will be quicker but not by much. But in a race situation anything above 80kmh and the type R is a superior car.

Between Gsi and Type R for street purposes... type R is quicker just.
Anythign more serious then slightly spirited street driving... Type R all the way

[shebangs]

just coz im 17 means i drive like a noob?
haha.
the non vtec b18bII will have more torque down low, as its not made for "high revving vtec yo" track work. therefore with the extra torque, should and probably would beat the itr untill 6krpm (40-50klms)
even though the itr weighs less, this doesn't really matter all that much in this scenario.
put simply. same driver skill level - the gsi and itr would be equal.
it's all up to the launch ^_^

Research the following before your next reply:
CR
Final Drive
Gear Ratios

I'll give you a hint though, look at the Torque rpm of the DC4, and think look at the torque/power the DC2R produces at same revs.

kousoku edit: no need for personal attacks

Matt

[BIG`O]

someone has a chip on their shoulder..
considering we have never even met thats a huge statement.
come along on the honda run, or are the mountains to scary? :P you can come "vtec" past all the gsi's
haha, damn i wish i was old and had a vtir just to be like you! nah if i had the money and could afford vtec insurance and didn't want a raped car, definetaly just buy an itr. dc2 = mayeswell buy a dc4.

[FR33K]

lol this thread is hillarious

im even with lambos from 0-5km/hr..

[28RAG]

kousoku edit. deleted quoted deleted quote.

When i grow up i wanna be a hero like you!

The scenario is, launches I see and it seems as though a Non Vtec Gsi will have the jump 'cause the Type R's main power comes higher in the rev range.

But at the end of the day when your as cool as Shebangs it doesnt matter what you drive your the best anyway!

[macoman69]

But do you want the know the honest truth? Put any n00b 17/18 year old kid Schumacher wannabe driving the DC2R, and a someone with actual driving ability to launch the dc4, and the dc4 will win.

Matt

I dont know what drugs your are on but i think you should stop right now.

Cause there is no way even if tsuchiya himself where driving a DC4 and a noob where driving the DC2R, the DC4 would still lose. (unless for some stupid reason the noob in the DC2R stalls cause he's so nervous)

Dont mean to sound blunt but its the truth.

[BIG`O]

When i grow up i wanna be a hero like you!

The scenario is, launches I see and it seems as though a Non Vtec Gsi will have the jump 'cause the Type R's main power comes higher in the rev range.

But at the end of the day when your as cool as Shebangs it doesnt matter what you drive your the best anyway!

haha gold!

[Mikeyas]

firstly!!!!

ONLY LAMBOS!! i swear from 0-3kmh im as quick as a ferrari.

but IF this was a dc5 vs type r overall based on useability. Id go the dc4..
Picked me dc4 up for 12k cheaper then a type R. Looks the same has a sunroof, drives well, still fast where it counts. I couldnt justify 10k for the, extra power handling etc. Also in the long run i hope to slowly build it beyond type R capabilities. Then you also have to remember we have a speed limit of 0-100kmh basically. Both cars are quick in this area... invest in some suspension and brakes and it will be even quicker in this area...

But in saying this... If i had the spare money to get a type R and use it for a track car. Id get ti so quickyl your head would spin :P

[macoman69]

you would probably spend just as much on parts to build it up to a type r.

Think about it.

Engine Parts (if you want something of a good quality not just X brand is gonna cost a crap load)
Bodykit (OEM lip, OEM sideskirts, OEM rear lip)
Suspension (again if you want quality and not brand X its gonna cost heaps)

and the most important thing
RECARO's what pretty much makes the TYPE R (as well as VTEC YO)

Remember Honda invested millions of dollars to build the TYPE R do you think you could do better than HONDA

[BIG`O]

ahh, this is not a "turn my dc4 into a R wannabe"

on topic guys!

[spardikis]

I'm not going to entertain you and do the comparison "BEFORE VTEC KICKED IN Y0" because that exhibits idiocracy beyond means my brain can comprehend. I will also assume you're going to change gears because assuming that you'd want to "race" (fully sik u-leh) in first gear until 4400rpm makes my stomach hurt with laughter.

Matt





i was rasing the question of 'before vtec y0, Im just not sure why your brain cant comprehend it, anyway this is the topic! and im a little bit lost here....why would your stomach hurt at 4400rpm? is there something special about that, like the vtec crossover point ~ ?
I think you are mixed up with the vti-r .... lol !

anyway, back to the topic, we all know the type r will kill a dc4 in a 1/4 mile, but i found it rather fascinating that the dc4 was fractionaly faster that the 'r' off the line up to about ~ 40kph. I have based my conclusion on these observations, and personal testing with equal driver ability's:

- type r:
has short runners, large plenium chamber, larger t.b, and less cc's
peak torque made - 178Nm @ 6300rpm
tuned for hi rpm.....


- gsi:
long runners, medium sized plenium chamber and more cc's
peak torque made - 172Nm @ 5200rpm
tuned for low rpm....



so what is shocking is the straight 'off the mark' speed that the underdog dc4 yelids and how in practice is rather remarkable.

so has anyone else done this?? any one has theorys?

[macoman69]

Well your little brain has seemingly forgotten about such things as power to weight ratio and suspension setup tires and other things.

All of these things have to be considered. Not just what your talking about.

PS. dont talk trash otherwise somebody might embaress you

[spardikis]

man, i have tryed it and this is what happened.....haha, this is crazy. why does everyone get all bent out of shape so easy???? obviously some people are very unsecure people deep down

anyway, ontopic please....who has tryed? and what happened?

[spardikis]

she bangs, maybe ur stomach would be hurting if u hoped into my 11 second evo.. anyway for the record spardikis DC4 had a slight edge on my 00 type R in first.. well at least until i hit vtec. so yeah go and hurt yourself u punk! -~~jakepitsville from clubrsx

[ewendc2r]

My god we have some idiots here (Obviously no offence to the people who have actual knowledge of a car beyond the fact that a Type R comes with Recaros :rollseyes).

Somebody talked about comparing a Type R to a GSi on a Mountain Run? My God.. Someone shoot them. The GSi MAY be quick-ish to 60kph or so, or similar to the Type R before 5800rpm but thats only straight line performance! The Type R will out break, turn harder and then accelerate harder (better throttle response and yes I've driven both) out of the corner. It will leave a GSi in its dust, and if not after the first corner, definitly after the 3rd or 4th corner.. I mean, you can't be serious in saying a GSi has a chance when racing? Comon man.. Grow up. The handling package is so superior to a GSi it isn't even fair. The Chassis is much stiffer, the stock suspension better than most sport cars (thus its ability to corner at speeds in excess of sport cars that cost much, MUCH more).

Take your GSi to a race track - See how badly you get beaten there. They are a nice car, but definitely not a performance car. Sorry.

EDIT: Btw, You guys are talking about 'before you hit vtec' etc when racing a Type R. That's like saying I can beat a GTR as long as it doesn't hit any boost. VTEC is part of the car. Anyhow, if you are racing and launching properly, launching at 4500-5000rpm and using the clutch to control wheel spin (not much really, more of chirp) then it takes qtr of **** all time to hit vtec with traction in 1st and then its game over for most cars. If a Type R can strip a Liberty GT which does approx. 6.3s 0-100kph, then a GSi is going to get massacred.

[macoman69]

AGREE 100%

Cmon you cant tell me you wouldnt want recaros over crap stock seats.

[Moya]

This thread is a crackup.

spardikis and Big`O obviously have nooooo idea what they are talking about. Mods, we can't ban these guys can we? lol.



but i found it rather fascinating that the dc4 was fractionaly faster that the 'r' off the line up to about ~ 40kph
HAHAHAHAHA

*breathe*

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

My car's faster than a v12 ferrari enzo from 0-10km/hr too..

HAHAHA

Back on topic though, On my way home just then. I beat a R34 GTR VSPECII NUR, completely owned him. Completely. Yes, he wasn't allowed to go past 3000rpm and change into 2nd gear, BUT I ****ed him up. I was doing 140 before he even hit 40!!

HAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[ewendc2r]

*wink* ... *shugs shoulders*

Some people here need to really do some reading and investigating and learn everything they can find about each aspect of a car and the research on why those differences are a benefit / hindrance.

I don't know why you give a **** about straight line performance anyway. If thats all you wanted go buy a VL and boost it. We all know how much skill is involved in drag racing at this level - If you want handling finesse then get a Type R. But for ****s sake, learn to REALLY drive first. Get out to the kart track, get out to the local race track and get some lessons. Otherwise the car will compensate for your poor ability and you will never reach its potential (which with good brake pads and semi slicks is scary).

[Moya]

learn to REALLY drive first. Get out to the kart track, get out to the local race track and get some lessons.

You missed Big`O's post where he already said he can drive :wave: :wave: :wave:

HAHAHAHAHA

[Mikeyas]

Who mentioned mountain runs :P

I know all i said that for daily driving under 80kmh spirited but legal driving, aint much differance. But yes goto a race track and BAM dc4 will lose Badly. But Both are hondas and are of great build quality, Both are comfortable and a pleasure to drive. One is ment for the track one is ment for the road..

Also... this was quoted
"makes my stomach hurt with laughter."
AS what i read was referance to how funny it is comparing below 4400 rpm.

Then they get attacked for saying that there stomach hurts form the power below 4400 rpm :P

Am i missing somethign here or do some people not read things properly???

[BIG`O]

Who mentioned mountain runs :P

I know all i said that for daily driving under 80kmh spirited but legal driving, aint much differance. But yes goto a race track and BAM dc4 will lose Badly. But Both are hondas and are of great build quality, Both are comfortable and a pleasure to drive. One is ment for the track one is ment for the road..

Also... this was quoted
"makes my stomach hurt with laughter."
AS what i read was referance to how funny it is comparing below 4400 rpm.

Then they get attacked for saying that there stomach hurts form the power below 4400 rpm :P

Am i missing somethign here or do some people not read things properly???


you missed a lil something over msn. haha. i never, not once, said my car would better a type r in any field. (except insurance - but that doesn't count);)

[spardikis]

this isnt a thread about who has recaros, or if a type r drives better up a mountain, its puerly about a trivial question.

So anyway the question i am asking is this -


who has done it? and what were your results? I dont really want to know about any of the other shit as it's quite obvious - so if anyone has first hand experiance please feel free to share.

[xtercii]

Anyhow, if you are racing and launching properly, launching at 4500-5000rpm and using the clutch to control wheel spin (not much really, more of chirp) then it takes qtr of **** all time to hit vtec with traction in 1st and then its game over for most cars.

Yes!!! I am sick and tired of seeing ppl saying shit like 2 cars should be even until 60km and when the other car's turbo or vtec kicks it's game over…when you race you hit boost or vtec almost instantly, it's all about midrange and top end, you don’t spend any time down low...

[shebangs]

Yes!!! I am sick and tired of seeing ppl saying shit like 2 cars should be even until 60km and when the other car's turbo or vtec kicks it's game over…when you race you hit boost or vtec almost instantly, it's all about midrange and top end, you don’t spend any time down low...

You do when you race Big`O or spardikis. ;) I've actually got an msn log of these two trying to convince me that the ITR is faster than GSI, I can up it of anyone wants a laugh or ten.


who has done it? and what were your results? I dont really want to know about any of the other shit as it's quite obvious - so if anyone has first hand experiance please feel free to share.

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showpost.php?p=755456&postcount=7? :wave:

[BIG`O]

haha. race spardikis - i dare you! :)

[ewendc2r]

You do when you race Big`O or spardikis. ;) I've actually got an msn log of these two trying to convince me that the ITR is faster than GSI, I can up it of anyone wants a laugh or ten.



http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showpost.php?p=755456&postcount=7? :wave:


Umm -- The ITR IS faster than the GSi ... :rolleyes:

[[XsCaPe]]

i cant believe i read this whole thread.

i felt dummer after reading the first post. now my brain is going to implode

[Da1nONLY]

If a GSi was on par with the ITR...
then i dont see why people would purchase the ITR over the GSi...
the ITR is well refined and serve its purpose around the track...
if you look at the 0 - 100 times for both of these cars...
i think you should get a rough idea or estimate which car is faster..
obviously the one with the B18C7 is more superior!...
the ITR is almost 60Kg lighter than the GSi...
thats alot of weight difference there...

estimate time for a GSi = 9 secs.
ive ran an average 0-100 time in my ITR of 6.5s. (G-tech)

difference of 2.5s is quiet alot.

I've driven both cars,
the ITR is quicker... lets face it
..wake up to reality..

[xtercii]

I reckon it could be an even race if the itr launches from its third gear..

[Spunkymonkey]

If a GSi was on par with the ITR...
then i dont see why people would purchase the ITR over the GSi...
the ITR is well refined and serve its purpose around the track...
if you look at the 0 - 100 times for both of these cars...
i think you should get a rough idea or estimate which car is faster..
obviously the one with the B18C7 is more superior!...
the ITR is almost 60Kg lighter than the GSi...
thats alot of weight difference there...

estimate time for a GSi = 9 secs.
ive ran an average 0-100 time in my ITR of 6.5s. (G-tech)

difference of 2.5s is quiet alot.

I've driven both cars,
the ITR is quicker... lets face it
..wake up to reality..

exactly....besides a vtir with type R cams can keep up to an ITR until the itr changes to second, and hits vtec straight away and starts pulling away....

although it may be closer next time with my new HD clutch....if I can get some traction ;)

[bennjamin]

who cares. On paper all teh numbers point to the ITR.
So as i said , in equal hands ofcourse the ITR will beat a GSI in pretty much all circumstances.

Dont talk or hint about street racing guys.

Closed.