View Full Version : Car wont start?????????
ok so heres what happened.
drove car to petrol station, filled tank with BP ultimate, picked up mates from house and drove about 10ks to go pub and drop them off. car drove fine on the way no problems at all.
Stayed about an hour and when i went to leave the car wouldnt start.
it turns over and is pumping petrol and immobiser is off.
spent about an hour trying different things with immboilser and just looking in the engine bay with NFI just hoping its somthing simple.
engine is a 2000 model b16a with spark plug and ignition leads replaced about 3 months ago
any ideas casue i got nothing.
cheers.
Twincam16
23-11-2006, 11:50 PM
First. Anything problems leading up to it? Or just normal then stopped working?
Second. Any wierd sounds? You say its turning over, do you mean it starts and then drops in revs and stalls, or tries to kick over but something is restricting it from re-turning.
Try a jump start.
Check your spark leads.
Check battery connections. Give them a wiggle.
Check oil level. Has it run low lately?
was running fine leading up to it
no weird sounds just sounds like a normal turnover but with no start
tryed a jumpstart no luck
checked spark leads their fine
checked battery conections fine
oil level is fine and was replaced about a month ago
fatboyz39
24-11-2006, 07:24 AM
your battery is dead...replace it with a new one.
battery is only about 6months old and evrything electic works in the car like lights and stero so i doubt its the battery
EuroDude
24-11-2006, 08:34 AM
If the engine is turning over properly and sounds normal, with all the dash lights working fine, then its not a flat battery.
Did you check if the spark leeds are sparking on the engine? Remove the ends of the spark plugs and hold it a few mm from an earth point on the engine and crank the ignition. If there is no spark, then it could be the Distributor...
Remove the dizzy cap and clean off the white powdery stuff and reinstall it. Replace it if you think the cap is at fault. Hopefully its not the coil or ignitor, but being a 2000 engine, it should be just the cap since they usually go first.
If there is spark, then it could be a fuel problem, injectors clogged, fuel pump gone, fuel leak, or dizzy timing off center, amongst other things..
Also check the colour of the spark plugs, the contacts should be a slight brownish greyish colour. If they are a different colour, then you can diagnose the problem associated with the colour. The Haynes maintenance manuals have a good spark plug colour guide in the rear.
no i havent checked if there is a spark or not i will do that after work as well as check the dizzy cap.
i did check the plugs and they are near new along with the leads and the are plugs are a brownish color so i take it that they are ok.
ill check these things and let you no the outcome.
thanx eurodude
CRXer
24-11-2006, 09:40 AM
How did u determine its pumping petrol?
Has it since restarted for u at all?
If this motor is in your EG,see if u can hear the fuel pump prime for 2 secs when u first turn the key onto ignition.
If it doesnt its time for a main relay refresh.
qstoria
24-11-2006, 10:04 AM
could the main relay die without any warning?
CRXer
24-11-2006, 10:12 AM
could the main relay die without any warning?
usually the prime suspect when all of a sudden your car wont start one day after turning it off for a little while & then tryin to restart.
There is no warning it either works or it doesnt.
well i can smell petrol after cranking it for a bit, so i assumed that pertol is getting pumped - could i be wrong??
the car hasnt started since this happened
ok so i have ECU error code 43 which is fuel supply system
i havent changed the filter ever i was planning on doing that but i couldnt get the filter off to replace it so i was waiting untill my car goes into the mechaninc next week to get it done but if i canrt start it then i guess it wont be going in there
CRXer
24-11-2006, 12:20 PM
stick your head under the back of the car while someone turns the key to ignition "ON" not start.
see if you can hear the fuel pump turn on for 2 secs when the key is turned.
the fuel your smelling could be just residual fuel left in the rail & bein injected when u try to start,doesnt mean there is any pressure behind it,ie no fuel pump.
EuroDude
24-11-2006, 12:31 PM
Fuel could be leaking from the filter, check the filter banjo bolt and fuel pump for leaks.
JasonGilholme
24-11-2006, 12:32 PM
Change the filter while your at it. Easy job, just a few bolts. Make sure you depressurize your fuel system by takin the fuel filler cap off.
yeha checked filter no leaks coming from it its dry
yeah i tryed to get the filter off to change it but its bolted on too tight spent about an hour trying
dont no if im doing it wrong but as you said it looks simple enough just a few bolts
how much is a new dizzy these days??
at this stage i think im going to have to tow it to a mechanic or auto electrican
EuroDude
24-11-2006, 01:01 PM
The bolt should have a "banjo" bolt on it, which means its a two piece bolt, one part of it goes clockwise, the other part goes counter-clockwise.
So you were probably tightening it instead of loosening it. Turn it the other way and see how that goes. I think you need to hold the lower part/bolt with a wrench, while you undo the top part/bolt using another wrench.
JasonGilholme
24-11-2006, 01:03 PM
As Euro dude said for the banjo bolts. :thumbsup:
Where you havin trouble with the bolts that mount it to the firewall?? You'll need a spanner for those cause the bracket can get in the way if your using a socket/rachet.
nah i got the bracket off its just getting the filter off ill try again after work
Edgeauto
24-11-2006, 03:16 PM
Did you check if the spark leeds are sparking on the engine:thumbsup:
Do this first ,code 43 is normally brought on by an engine miss or excess fuel. Sounds like a ICM or coil to me.
JasonGilholme
24-11-2006, 03:18 PM
Take the filter off before the braket otherwise you won't be able to turn the bolts
(i don't even think you have to take the braket off for a filter change)
i took the bracket off casue i couldnt get to the bolts on the bottom of the filter might have to get someone with smaller hands to do it .
i was talking to a few guys at work and they said that i might have got the bad petrol that was in the bottom of the tanks at the BP station and it would have water in it when he said that i remember the the Petrol tank was there at the station either refilling the tanks or about top refill the tanks i had just refueled b4 this problem happened.
what do you guys think?
could this be the problem?.... lets hope so
JasonGilholme
24-11-2006, 03:45 PM
possibly. i hope its as easy as that to fix.
You may need to take the air intake arm off to get to the bolts. Can't remember cause my car is at home. sorry. lol
ok so unbolted the filter and and cranked the engine and no fuel whatso ever came out im guessing that the fuel pump shat it self.
EuroDude
24-11-2006, 05:33 PM
I think the fuel pump has a fuse, check all the fuses in the engine bay fuse box first :thumbsup:
But didnt you say you can hear the fuel pump prime when you turn on the ignition?
yeah we checked all fuses and they are good
well we thought we could hear pump but today when tryed again couldnt hear anything so im guessing what we herd last night wasnt it csue today there was nothing
ECU-MAN
24-11-2006, 09:08 PM
check out your main relay
starter motor earth ok?
mine 'fell' off and seemed to have done what yours is doin now
im not all that kowledable when it comes to knowing whats what when under the hood.
how would i check the main relay and the starter motor earth?
EuroDude
24-11-2006, 10:18 PM
Grab urself a Haynes maintenance manual ftw. u can get them from auto shops like repco and have virtually everything you need mechanically, except for the gearbox internals. Thats reserved for the 'pros' ;)
when i read ur post, i was inclined to say u got bad fuel, especially since you filled up 10mins before it happend, and also the tanker was filling up at the same time. My girlfriend had the exact same problem (a tanker was filling the station up at the same time surprise surprise), and in the end it came down to her getting the fuel checked and having water in it. Apparently its not an uncommon problem at all. To check it, drain out some of ur fuel tank, just ask me if u dont know how, and check for water floating on top.
How much fuel did u put in?
ur saying the pump isnt working anymore, does anyone know if water can possibly seize the pump?
Anyway my bets on bad fuel, its cirtainly not hard to check, and if its all good, you can reuse it.
EuroDude
25-11-2006, 12:22 AM
But surely the petrol servo's have fuel filters in their tanks?
Cant see how a bit of bad fuel could completely bugger up a cars' fuel pump
Cant see how a bit of bad fuel could completely bugger up a cars' fuel pump
Yeah i agree with ya,
when i read ur post, i was inclined to say u got bad fuel
when i got to the part about the pump not working that threw off my theory alot lol.
But surely the petrol servo's have fuel filters in their tanks?
Im sure they would have some sort of filter, but i know water must be able to get through them somhow. My GF had the exact same symptoms as the OP in her new swift. I checked there was spark at the plugs, fuel was pumping, battery was fine etc. Her mechanic sent the fuel away to be tested, turns out there was water in her tank, and we know it came from the servo but they refused to pay for repairs cus we couldnt prove it, they were like you could of put the water in yourself.
According to the place that tested her fuel, its a problem that happens now and then. They believe the most likely reason is when the tank is low, during the day the air inside gets warm, and at night condensation builds up on the walls. slowly over time it all adds up, till one day, when the tank is very near empty, somone pumps up a little water with their fuel. The people that run the service stations are ment to check for a thin layer of water in the fuel every so often. They told us, if u see a tanker filling up the tanks at the servo, keep driving to the next one!
but yeah if ur pumps not working, that would account for the problems ur seeing, still not hard to take out a little fuel to check for water though just in case.
qstoria
25-11-2006, 06:55 AM
where would the best place to pump some fuel out be? would that be by taking off the fuel filter and draining with a hose from there when cranking the engine?
if it is bad fuel then like u mentioned it may be hard to prove but none the less worth a try mentioning it to the service station.
woudltn the water be heavyier than fuel and sit at the bottom of the petrol tank?? thats why the pump is pumping water not fuel.
apparently this subject was covered on a current affair recently people have been getting the same problem with bad fuel.
I only just joined up with the NRMA yesterday ( let it run out casue of loss of licence) so i have to wait 48hrs b4 i can call them but tommorrow i will call thm out to come and have a look and see what they say.
yeah good idea. fuel floats on the surface cus its lighter, but as u drive it must swirl around enough to get down near the fuel pick up. It happend to my girl when she had a full tank!
if ur pumps working doing it out the fuel filter would be good, otherwise u gotta do it ghetto style and suck it up through a hose till it gets near ur mouth, quickly block it with ur thumb, put the hose end in the container you wish to use, which is placed on the ground, & let it drain by gravity, or u could get a siphoning (sp?) hose (few dollars), which u pump back and forward till fuel starts coming out.
eitherway u need to have ur container on the ground, with the hose going down to it, so gravity pulls the fuel down the hose, sucking it up from the tank. Also id slowly pull the end of the hose upward, out of the tank so it catches some of the top layer, where the water would be.
thinking about it, if ur pump was working, and you did it by the filter, i dont think it would get any of the top layer while the cars stationary, unless u completly drained the tank. as the fuel pick up is down low.
bigjo5
25-11-2006, 05:21 PM
when i read ur post, i was inclined to say u got bad fuel, especially since you filled up 10mins before it happend, and also the tanker was filling up at the same time. My girlfriend had the exact same problem (a tanker was filling the station up at the same time surprise surprise), and in the end it came down to her getting the fuel checked and having water in it. Apparently its not an uncommon problem at all. To check it, drain out some of ur fuel tank, just ask me if u dont know how, and check for water floating on top.
How much fuel did u put in?
ur saying the pump isnt working anymore, does anyone know if water can possibly seize the pump?
Anyway my bets on bad fuel, its cirtainly not hard to check, and if its all good, you can reuse it.
nope water does not seize up ur fuel pump..
There was this car that had the same problem so we just drained out all the water from the tank.. and worked liek a treat. we undid the fuel line form the fuel filter and jsut started cranking the car adn all that came out was water, btw is it doesnt pump out nothing might be ur fuel pump.. get somebody to crank it and the other person get liek a rubber hammer and smack ur fuel tank.. mabye the fuel pump is faulty.
NRMA came out and said that there is power going to the dizzy but none comeing out. theres no spark in the cylinders so he said a new dizzy will fix problem.
he told me that could cost a few hundred for a 2nd hand dizzy is this correct??
Edgeauto
26-11-2006, 07:47 PM
Why replace the dizzy, get it checked properly and replace the faulty part or you can try test it your self http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56224 .You can never tell how good a second hand dizzy is.
NRMA came out and said that there is power going to the dizzy but none comeing out. theres no spark in the cylinders so he said a new dizzy will fix problem.
he told me that could cost a few hundred for a 2nd hand dizzy is this correct??
didnt u tell us u were getting spark?
no i hadnt check for a spark i juts called the NRMA as soon as i got back from sydney and he did all that.
thanx to everyone for your help im going to try that DIY edgeauto has sent me and will let you no the outcome.
TRUMAN
27-11-2006, 10:24 AM
couldnt it be a alternator problem?? :S
NRMA guy checked alternator battery and said that they were fine the dizzy is ghetting power into it but just isnt giving a spark
so mechanic came out to look at car for me and started at the ECU he took the ECU case off and found that there were about 10 hot spots on the board and that there is no power going into or out of the ECU, the main relay or fuel pump which confused him casue he thinks it is the main realy but isnt sure casue the ECU is looks like it shat itself.
what can casue the hotspots on the ECU???
i havent done the DIY main relay fix yet casue the mech said that it looked fine but i will do it anyway just to make sure.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.2 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.