Single VS Dual Exhaust System.

[markasia]

Hey Guys....Getting A Custom Exhaust System As Soon As My Headers Arrive. Was Going To Get A Straight 2 Quater System With Full Catback, Should I Change It To A Single System For More Power Gain? Or It Wont Make Any Difference Having A Dual System?

Much Help Is Appreciated Thankyou!!

[Chris_F]

if your searching for every last kw a single outlet exhaust is the better option (though slightly louder depending on the number of resonators etc.)

most tuner brands for the CL7/CL9 use 60mm piping so that's something to consider when your choosing piping diameter

what are your plans for the car?

[aaronng]

They use single for more power because there are fewer bends compared to a dual muffler design.

[EuroAccord13]

What headers are you getting?

A properly built dual system can deliver more power than a single outlet system that is done badly or using press bend. The Euro's dual system is more for emissions and looks than anything else.

If you are after pure power, take a single system. You will need from memory, four mandrel bends with two of them being 90 degree angles.

Here's a thread that deals with the exhaust system for the Euro...

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22763

[Chris_F]

don't forget the weight saving factor as well... my exhaust saved me 15+kg over standard

[markasia]

60mm piping...ill note that down and all other info u guys give me, so i know whats best to get when i go down to the work shop.

when i got my euro, it was just going to be a standard everidae car that stands out, thats why i got my coilovers and 20" rims, but now i decided to go to the performance option, and see what i can do to the euro.


if your searching for every last kw a single outlet exhaust is the better option (though slightly louder depending on the number of resonators etc.)

most tuner brands for the CL7/CL9 use 60mm piping so that's something to consider when your choosing piping diameter

what are your plans for the car?

[markasia]

What headers are you getting?

A properly built dual system can deliver more power than a single outlet system that is done badly or using press bend. The Euro's dual system is more for emissions and looks than anything else.

If you are after pure power, take a single system. You will need from memory, four mandrel bends with two of them being 90 degree angles.

Here's a thread that deals with the exhaust system for the Euro...

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22763


Im Getting Comptech headers.

Thanks For The Link.

[markasia]

So Far:

60 mm piping...

Four Mandrel Bends With Two Of THem Being 90 Degree Angles.

Weight Factor.

Is there anything else i need to look upon??

[Chris_F]

going with a smaller diameter rim will help with performance aswell, 17" is best but 18" isn't too harmful either.

you should also probably consider how loud you want it to be? once you know that you can decide on the number of resonators you'll get made and the type of muffler.

if you want something quieter 2 resonators and an oval shape (i.e. non-cannon) muffler will probably work better

otherwise one resonator and a canon style muffler should be a good compromise.

the tough thing with a custom system is that there's no guarantee on sound quality/volume.. most pre-made exhausts seem to have a good balance between sound/performance.

[markasia]

going with a smaller diameter rim will help with performance aswell, 17" is best but 18" isn't too harmful either.

you should also probably consider how loud you want it to be? once you know that you can decide on the number of resonators you'll get made and the type of muffler.

if you want something quieter 2 resonators and an oval shape (i.e. non-cannon) muffler will probably work better

otherwise one resonator and a canon style muffler should be a good compromise.

the tough thing with a custom system is that there's no guarantee on sound quality/volume.. most pre-made exhausts seem to have a good balance between sound/performance.

Yeah I'm selling My 20" at the moment, and do have a set of 18" on my mind, its just a matter of selling the 20" first.

and about sound, like u said, theres no gurantee on sound on a custom one, but il probabli go with the one resonator and canon style muffler, wouldnt mind it being a bit loud...lol.

Roughly how much of a power gain is a exhaust system, i know every figure is different, but like a estermate would be great.

thankyou.

[EuroAccord13]

Put it this way, if you have a bigger pipe size, the exhaust pulses will be wider vertically when it is travelling down the pipe, therefore, the you will need high RPM to extract it faster out of the system, the opposite is applied for smaller piping.

For the Euro, too large a pipe means it's useless because the Euro's engine doesn't rev high enough for it to be effective... 60-63mm is about right..

[tony1234]

So Far:

60 mm piping...

Four Mandrel Bends With Two Of THem Being 90 Degree Angles.

Weight Factor.

Is there anything else i need to look upon??
IMO wait for JTUNE IHE.Impressive dyno figures from their gear.Peekay34 is one of their test cars.

[Euro76]

Hey Guys....Getting A Custom Exhaust System As Soon As My Headers Arrive. Was Going To Get A Straight 2 Quater System With Full Catback, Should I Change It To A Single System For More Power Gain? Or It Wont Make Any Difference Having A Dual System?

Much Help Is Appreciated Thankyou!!

Single exhaust produce more power and makes the car slightly lighter over the standard dual exhaust. Even the aftermarket dual exhaust also gives you more power, but not as not good as single exhaust system. You can also opt to remove resonator to gain extra power and makes the exhaust louder. Add that to the header you're gonna change plus the CAI then it will give you nice power upgrade you can afford :cool: :thumbsup:

P.S. correct me if I'm wrong.

[EuroAccord13]

I'd advise against going without a resonator, reason is that you are going to get tremendous resonance in the cabin even though the car is well insulated... You won't like it.... :)

[Euro76]

I did it in my Celica before, but not going to do it in Euro :)
Some people have done it but I then realized it's not going to be a good idea :)

[tony1234]

Noisy exhaust doesn't suit Euro.Carefull what you put on,do some reasearch.Or.wait for JTUNE,it's not far away now.:p

[Chris_F]

^ some may agree but different demographics will have different tastes ;)

[aaronng]

When I drive pass ppl waiting by the side of the road, I get weird stares from them because of my engine note. LOL

[Chris_F]

^ lol just the way it should be

[aaronng]

^ lol just the way it should be

But my exhaust is stock. LOL

[[ricer]]

I did it in my Celica before, but not going to do it in Euro :)
Some people have done it but I then realized it's not going to be a good idea :)

i had no resonator in my civic before
sounded like one of those old pulsars.... really really terrible... didnt want to rev over 3k....
was probably like a week later i went and got a resonator put in...

but i see some cars making that noise and owners seem pretty proud of it lol

[Chris_F]

But my exhaust is stock. LOL

sounds like you have the loudest intake known to man, a drive-by clip would be sweet hehe

you can probably imagine the look on peoples faces when i drive past with a single sided 'limp dick' exhaust with a bright blue tip lol

do you have any plans for an exhaust?

[aaronng]

sounds like you have the loudest intake known to man, a drive-by clip would be sweet hehe

you can probably imagine the look on peoples faces when i drive past with a single sided 'limp dick' exhaust with a bright blue tip lol

do you have any plans for an exhaust?

The GruppeM is still louder. I got a taste of that on another member's car. :p

Not sure if you can hear how loud the ghetto intake is... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbJiFuYCnLA

As for the exhaust, I'm still thinking about it. I might see how Jtune's exhaust is. But I'm not going to get just the exhaust, it would have to be with a header too.

[Chris_F]

Sounds pretty similar in the clip, but I've forgotten what it used to sound like when i had the stock exhaust.

Yea i think without a header a cat-back is wasted to some degree. You could have a lightweight flywheel installed for cheaper and notice more benifits ;)

[tony1234]

The GruppeM is still louder. I got a taste of that on another member's car. :p

Not sure if you can hear how loud the ghetto intake is... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbJiFuYCnLA

As for the exhaust, I'm still thinking about it. I might see how Jtune's exhaust is. But I'm not going to get just the exhaust, it would have to be with a header too.
Aaron is that yours?sounds good.

[Lukey13]

Not sure if you can hear how loud the ghetto intake is... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbJiFuYCnLA


What the hell kind of intake noise is that? Ghetto what?????

And are you saying that that's the standard exhaust and headers?! :honda:

Very loud and powerful it seems. :thumbsup:

[aaronng]

Aaron is that yours?sounds good.
Thanks! Yup, that's mine.


What the hell kind of intake noise is that? Ghetto what?????

And are you saying that that's the standard exhaust and headers?! :honda:

Very loud and powerful it seems. :thumbsup:
It's the Ghetto™ intake (http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53595). I have standard exhaust and headers, so I don't think I am making more power than stock.

[markasia]

Sounds Soo Nice Though!!

[h1coupe]

you could check out the proracer A-spec from 5Zigen.

http://store.racinglab.com/ac03tsxk5zpr.html

I am really leaning towards that one myself.

[Tobster]

I think people need to be very careful when talking about exhausts to "increase power" -- because exhaust systems tend to be tuned either for the lower-mid rev-zone or the upper rev-zone.

Tuning for the upper rev-zone means you use such things as "racing headers" which have longer primaries and generally you're increasing your maximum power output. This allows aftermarket manufacturers to make impressive claims about "10 kW increase in peak power", but that only happens right at the top of the rev range -- and how many people spend 80%+ of their time in a car with the engine at over 5000 rpm? This sort of tuning is really only useful for dyno shootouts and drag racing where you're looking for sustained maximum power high in the rev range. I suspect that the J-Tune exhaust falls into this category.

More useful for street use is the middle of the rev range -- where we spend most of our time. What you're actually doing there is not so much increasing the peak power (although you may be increasing the amount of power at a certain rev-point) as generally increasing the torque -- so you actually go somewhere when you put your foot down, rather than dropping the accelerator and waiting for the engine to spin up before you go anywhere. The Comptech headers are mid-range headers.

Many of the posts I see on the TSX boards are obsessed with "tell us the dyno results" -- which don't generally reflect the real-world driving picture unless you're smart enough to compare the middle of the graphs rather than just the peak outputs.

I just think people need to think carefully about how they drive their car, and what about it they actually want to improve before embarking on a quest for maximum power. I still remember an article on Autospeed about plenty of Integra Type Rs that lost power through mods trying to make more power. For me, based on the sort of driving that I do, I'd be looking to increase the mid-range without losing any of my top end (and generally most mid-range breathing mods make the top end a bit more free anyway).

I just think it's something that doesn't actually get discussed much... or maybe I'm just getting hung up on terminology! :)

[Chris_F]

it's a good point!

one thing to consider with the k24 though is that once it passes 5.5krpm-6krpm it starts to become starved for air because it's hard for the cylinders to be filled with air due to its really long stroke.

If you go for a more free flowing setup and plan on getting a tune later on you should increase the mid-range significantly.

That's why the jtune products allow the vtec point to be lowered to around 4000rpm. The K24's biggest advantage is always going to be it's mid range power.

If you don't plan on ever tuning the car or changing the vtec point tho all the extra flow you achieve won't be taken advantage of (just like any other car). If you check out the hondata reflash ppl in the states go crazy over its the 25+hp gain in the mid-range that makes it great bang for the buck, peak power is essentially unchanged.

[aaronng]

I suspect that the J-Tune exhaust falls into this category.

From their early dynos, they got more gains in the mid range than at the upper RPM. I remember, the midrange got an additional 13kW over the gains at upper RPM. So I don't think thier headers are tuned for only the upper RPM range. Also, it's possible to sacrifice a little power up top for a big gain in the mid range, like what Toda headers do.

[markasia]

it's a good point!

one thing to consider with the k24 though is that once it passes 5.5krpm-6krpm it starts to become starved for air because it's hard for the cylinders to be filled with air due to its really long stroke.

If you go for a more free flowing setup and plan on getting a tune later on you should increase the mid-range significantly.

That's why the jtune products allow the vtec point to be lowered to around 4000rpm. The K24's biggest advantage is always going to be it's mid range power.

If you don't plan on ever tuning the car or changing the vtec point tho all the extra flow you achieve won't be taken advantage of (just like any other car). If you check out the hondata reflash ppl in the states go crazy over its the 25+hp gain in the mid-range that makes it great bang for the buck, peak power is essentially unchanged.


So In A Way I Have To Take Into Consideration Of Tuning The Car Or Changing The Vtec Point In The Future?

[aaronng]

it's a good point!

one thing to consider with the k24 though is that once it passes 5.5krpm-6krpm it starts to become starved for air because it's hard for the cylinders to be filled with air due to its really long stroke.


It's not the stroke. It's the cylinder volume. In fact, the longer stroke helps with filling. If it was a short stroke-large bore engine, the filling efficiency would be worse than it is now.

[Lukey13]

So if the Euro would only benefit from a maximum exhaust pipe size of 60-63mm, what is the standard piping size and what will be the piping size of the Jtune product (when it's released in 2011)??

[ginganggooly]

So if the Euro would only benefit from a maximum exhaust pipe size of 60-63mm, what is the standard piping size and what will be the piping size of the Jtune product (when it's released in 2011)??

If the K-series powered race cars are anything to go by, a 3" system would be the way to go.

[Euro76]

When I drive pass ppl waiting by the side of the road, I get weird stares from them because of my engine note. LOL

So I think that's to do with your intake if your exhaust is standard, what intake do you use?

[aaronng]

So I think that's to do with your intake if your exhaust is standard, what intake do you use?

This one: http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53595

[mugen88]

Aarons videos dosen't do his car justice u have to hear it in the flesh to believe how good the Ghetto intake sounds. ;)

[tron07]

errrmmm.... it sounds noisy to me :p

[Euro76]

This one: http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53595

At first I was smiling to see the cardboard, but in the end you've done a good job, did you make it on your own?

[aaronng]

errrmmm.... it sounds noisy to me :p

The volume is based on the throttle. I can go all the way up to 4000-5000rpm and it still sounds stock. It's only loud at full throttle. And it is loud in a good way. It's different to an exhaust sound.

[aaronng]

At first I was smiling to see the cardboard, but in the end you've done a good job, did you make it on your own?

Yup, with my own hands. Took a long while since I did it only on weekends. I think 2 months or so.