n/a timer

[DA9B18C]

hey noob question,
i need help installing a n/a timer in my da9. just where to find certain wires.
-o2 sensor
-ig1 output
-ig2 output
possibly what colors are these wires and where to find them.
also does anyone know how to set the timer up with my current alarm system. i know people say its hard but it must be possible.
thanks

[Bludger]

open up your steering column and make sure you're armed with a multimeter.
test out the different outputs with the key in the lock, acc and on positions.
with a lil bit of thinking and common sense, you will find them. sorry for the short answer, i'm busy

n00b questions should be in n00b section, but i think its a legit question.

[CRXer]

For O2 sensor if your car is,
1. OBD0 - pin C16 at the ECU (shielded white wire)
2. OBD1 - pin D14 at the ECU (shielded white/red wire)

For ignition,
Assume your colour code is the same as my '91 CRX
IGN 1 - black/yellow wire off the ignition switch
IGN 2A - yellow wire off the ignition switch

For alarm,
Yes it is difficult,as the timer holds the ignition on after u remove the key,so the alarm sees the ignition has not been released & wont let u arm the alarm until the timer releases the ignition.

Not a great problem if the timer is set for 30 secs as it usually takes this long to get your shit together & get out of the car anyway.Any longer u'll be standing around waiting to arm the alarm.

The only way i see around this is to place say a 5-10 sec "run-on" timer on the alarm ignition wire & relocate it to the ignition 2B position,so it will still tell the alarm the ignition is on while your cranking the engine(ignition 2B drops out while your cranking the engine & will also drop out when the key is removed),assuming it wont take u longer than 5- 10 secs to crank your engine,otherwise the alarm will immobilise again not letting u start the engine.Maybe a better time would be 20 secs cos u never crank your car longer than this.Then u will only have to wait 20 secs max to arm the alarm no matter what the n/a timer is set to.

A crude method would be to not connect the n/a timer up to the ign 2A wire but hook the alarm up to 2A.It means your radiator fans wont operate while your engine is runnin on,but the alarm will work normally.Not recommended if u plan to run on the engine for extensive times.

Maybe there is a better way,but i cant think of it right now,i got the same prob,i would like to know as well...........

[ACTI0NMAN-1]

why would you require a timer for n/a?

[Bludger]

cool the engine after spirited driving

[ACTI0NMAN-1]

you think a 20sec run-on timer will make a difference?

[Bludger]

if you have been near redline for 5 minutes, then an idle for 2 or 3 minutes, i think would make a difference

[Photonic_Si]

bludger is correct.

If you were hammering your B16 for the past 10 minutes, getting your journals all hot, the only thing keeping them from cooking the oil and the bearings is the oil pressure forcing cooler oil over them to keep them withing heat range. Now turn off your car. Instanly, your rods stop moving and the oil will boil where it is trapped in the bearing journal between the rod cap and the crank shaft.

if you state that a cool down device is useless on an NA machine, then throw out your turbo timers FI guys because what do you think a turbo timer allows you to do with your turbo. . . . keep cool oil flowing til its at a decent enough temp to stop oil flow without damaging over heated bearings.

Its actually more vital that you use an NA timer than it is on a turbo car. How many stock turbo cars come with a timer....

[DA9B18C]

cheers bludger and photonic_si, i like the idea of warm up and cool down. also the timer has o2 sensor and a neat little volt metre.
i probably will get sparky to install as i have bucked things up in the past.
credit to ure response bludger!!!

[wkdteg]

da9b18c... dude just wondering which timer ur using and where u got it from?

[CRXer]

sounds like its an apexi pen timer

[Mr_will]

bludger is correct.

If you were hammering your B16 for the past 10 minutes, getting your journals all hot

not hot enough to cook oil, unless you drive around with no coolant.


Instanly, your rods stop moving and the oil will boil where it is trapped in the bearing journal between the rod cap and the crank shaft.


like i said, they dont get hot enough


if you state that a cool down device is useless on an NA machine, then throw out your turbo timers FI guys because what do you think a turbo timer allows you to do with your turbo. . . . keep cool oil flowing til its at a decent enough temp to stop oil flow without damaging over heated bearings.

engines spin at say, 8000rpm. turbos spin at 150 000rpm in some cases.

there is a big heat difference, you are comparing apples with oranges


Its actually more vital that you use an NA timer than it is on a turbo car. How many stock turbo cars come with a timer....

you are very very silly



further to this, the fact that there is no airflow when the car is stationary means that you are, in fact, more likely to accumulate heat than dissipate it.

the reality is that the oil does not get hot enough in an n/a engine, street driven, to cause problems, and its going to cool down relatively slowly anyway, which is ideal.

[Bludger]

ever driven a 75' Torana interstate Mr will?
After 2 hours solid driving, you stop off at the side of the road, turn the engine off and take a piss as any man would do.
whats that 2 or 3 minutes off? turn the ignition on again and whalla.....
the temp guage is in the red zone.... DUH is this ****ing good or bad you n00b




Modern day cars run the same. just with more electronic BS. same principle applies

[ACTI0NMAN-1]

ever driven a 75' Torana interstate Mr will?
After 2 hours solid driving, you stop off at the side of the road, turn the engine off and take a piss as any man would do.
whats that 2 or 3 minutes off? turn the ignition on again and whalla.....
the temp guage is in the red zone.... DUH is this ****ing good or bad you n00b




Modern day cars run the same. just with more electronic BS. same principle applies

re-read mrwills post then reply.

[Bludger]

not hot enough to cook oil, unless you drive around with no coolant.

so people blow crank bearings racing around cos they got no coolant?
Theyt blow cos of too much stress & heat
have you ever blown a bearing?




engines spin at say, 8000rpm. turbos spin at 150 000rpm in some cases.

how many moving parts does an engine have compared to a turbo?
A turbo will generate very high heat but not alot of it. An engine produces alot



further to this, the fact that there is no airflow when the car is stationary means that you are, in fact, more likely to accumulate heat than dissipate it.

you're the person wrong here n00b, the car doesn't need to be moving to cool the coolant. As soon as the coolant reaches the radiator, it will sicnificantly reduce in temperature already. It certainly helps to have the care moving but a stationary idling car still cools the motor.

[ACTI0NMAN-1]

not hot enough to cook oil, unless you drive around with no coolant.


like i said, they dont get hot enough

engines spin at say, 8000rpm. turbos spin at 150 000rpm in some cases.

there is a big heat difference, you are comparing apples with oranges

you are very very silly



further to this, the fact that there is no airflow when the car is stationary means that you are, in fact, more likely to accumulate heat than dissipate it.

the reality is that the oil does not get hot enough in an n/a engine, street driven, to cause problems, and its going to cool down relatively slowly anyway, which is ideal.

i highlighted key points in his comment for you

[Bludger]

in my oppinion, street driven is a car driven at the "speed limit"

i'm sure alot of ppl here at OH build super duper engines just to drive on the street..I'm 999999999% sure a engine timer would not be benificial to my cars engine. BABAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

[bennjamin]

isnt that what a thermostat and thermofan / radiator is for ? To keep a car runnign at prime temp no matter what the situation ? ( within manufactures specs) :)

Mind you , on a stock B18c7 I ALWAYS warm thew car up and let it idle for alittle bit before switching off - it also depends on the oil viscosity range you are using (cold vs hot) too.

[Photonic_Si]

do not over look the value of a good cooling down of an NA machine. regrardless of what willie said. He has valid points but thats only half the story..

[Mr_will]

do not over look the value of a good cooling down of an NA machine. regrardless of what willie said. He has valid points but thats only half the story..

then why dont you be so kind as to give us the other half...

[TheSaint]

very interesting read

would like to hear more opinions and points =)

keep it going

[Bludger]

Mind you , on a stock B18c7 I ALWAYS warm thew car up and let it idle for alittle bit before switching off

There must be a reason why you do this.....

[bennjamin]

There must be a reason why you do this.....

indeed.

To prevent premature engine / brake wear and tear.
IE let parts / liquids cool down to normal operating temperature before switching off.

(its best not to)
You dont jump in a car , start up and thrash it straight away. Same goes when coming to a stop - you dont simply jump on the brakes , pull over and turn the car off.

[Mr_will]

indeed.

To prevent premature engine / brake wear and tear.
IE let parts / liquids cool down to normal operating temperature before switching off.

(its best not to)
You dont jump in a car , start up and thrash it straight away. Same goes when coming to a stop - you dont simply jump on the brakes , pull over and turn the car off.

warming up isnt the same as cooling down though, once again people are comparing things that are not the same.


its good to let the engine idle for around 30secs on startup, to get the oil circulating, then once you start driving you should use only light throttle pressure and stay in low rpms wherever possible.

when the car remains stationary, the oil is just moving around hot parts, which dont cool down particularly quickly. in an n/a car, as i have previously stated ,things dont get hot enough (in street driving) to warrant this 'cool down' period.

the fact that you need to warm up your engine is NOT a justification for saying you have to cool it down

[JasonGilholme]

They didn't come from factory with timers so whats the point for them. (goes for both NA and FI)

Just have a cool down lap or take the last few k's of your trip nice and easy to let her cool down. The air flow through the front of the car is much better then the heat soak from stationary idling.

If you want wank factor get a drift spec rear wing.

[Bludger]

things dont get hot enough (in street driving) to warrant this 'cool down' period.


You refer to street driving.
I refer to hovering near redline for 5 minutes

[Mr_will]

You refer to street driving.
I refer to hovering near redline for 5 minutes

yes, i can drive hard also, but thanks for the lesson. unless you are stationary, or on the freeway, you wont be 'hovering near redline for 5 minutes'. one of the features of our roads is that they have traffic lights, intersections, and stop signs, all of which require you to slow down/stop.

you forget that when you are at redline you are moving relatively quickly, thus passing a lot of air over the radiator and into the engine bay. this cools things down.

and the key distinction between track and hard street driving is that on the track you literally never, or very very rarely go under say 4-5 rpm. on the street you still have to stop for lights, intersections etc, so you spend more time in lower rpms

[TheSaint]

what if he is racing?

what if the car in question isnt even road liscenced...?

[Mr_will]

what if he is racing?

what if the car in question isnt even road liscenced...?

if he was racing it would be taken care of in his cool down laps, which would he would be doing to stop his rotors from warping/cracking.

and he would most likely have mentioned it

[DLO01]

We need to get a point across, a timer is soely an "Aid" only.

I have the view that a timer is usefull for both NA and FI cars.

Obvioulsy timers are helpfull for FI cars for the extra heat that a turbo makes.

But even in a NA car, with spirited driving and 'constant high Rpm', you go beyond the efficiency of your radiator and therefore beyond the 'normal' opperating water temps. Oil temps also rapidly rise.

Leaving your car at idel will keep fluids moving and will return them back to 'normal temperatures'

I know thats what I would do.

It depends on your setup, eg. aftermarket cooling aids as per, oil coolers, larger alloy radiators, etc.

However its always best to have some gauges to monitor you engines vitals.

But yeh, don't need one in either application. Its just an Aid. :thumbsup:

[bennjamin]

if he was racing it would be taken care of in his cool down laps, which would he would be doing to stop his rotors from warping/cracking.

and he would most likely have mentioned it

you mean...if i was driving the car the way it was designed for :)
No , not racing at wakefield with slicks - but on the road and the usual occasional VTEC tomfoolerey. WHICH i am speaking of.



the fact that you need to warm up your engine is NOT a justification for saying you have to cool it down

...who said we NEED to warm up our engines ? Its just a matter of opinion.
BTW - yes i can and did justify to both warm up and cool down an engine.
As i said its to prevent premature wear n tear.

Anyway - a turbo timer is only good for trucks with big turbos IMO.
You CAN "time" your car yourself and let it idle for a short time after stopping. Its not mandatory but its nicer on your engine.

[e240]

Guys, the only reason why you have a turbo timer in a turbo charged car is to prevent the oil from frying in the exhaust bearings by it remaining stationary. The exhaust side of the turbo charger runs much hotter than anywhere else in the engine.

The exhaust temp is way way way hotter than what you have in your crank, heads, valves etc etc. ...and really, you'd only need it if you've been thrashing the car, normally, a cool down down lap or even a slower drive (as long as your turbo charger doesn't turn red) home is sufficient. Hundreds of thousands of Turbo Charged cars have not died from the lack of a turbo timer.

You're never going to need a Timer in an NA period. Like someone mentioned, the heak soak from leaving the car idling is probably worse. At to that, at idle, you're probably going to get increased fuel contamination in your oil. If you're at the track, a simple cool down lap is sufficient and thats proven by hundreds of thousands of NA race cars.

Most of the time, if you're frying your oil in an NA car, its usually not from the lack of cooling down prior to shutting down, its when you're fanging your car. Your issue then is not about having a timer, rather, you have cooling/tuning problems, or maybe its your driving style.

Like it or not, Will is right...and what he says even applied to NA track cars...How many NA track cars do you see with timers? Waste of time and Money. Have you even seen F1 cars? they pit and shut off the engines almost immediately..if any NA car needs "cooling down" its these cars...

But hey, if you've got the the money and you want the bling..go for it.
Just please stop trying to justify it in an NA car. its painful to read.

[Mr_will]

you mean...if i was driving the car the way it was designed for :)
No , not racing at wakefield with slicks - but on the road and the usual occasional VTEC tomfoolerey. WHICH i am speaking of.

like i have already pointed out, there is a big difference between the occasional vtec, and being in the upper 30-40% of the rev range for 1/2 an hour, with zero low rpm action



...who said we NEED to warm up our engines ? Its just a matter of opinion.

are you seriously going to tell me you dont believe that the viscosity of oil changes as it heats up? and that you should warm your car up before thrasing it? you are smarter than that



BTW - yes i can and did justify to both warm up and cool down an engine.

As i said its to prevent premature wear n tear.
but you did not give any ACTUAL reasoning beyond this. like i have already said a road driven car simply doesnt get hot enough to warrant a cool down like this.



Anyway - a turbo timer is only good for trucks with big turbos IMO.
You CAN "time" your car yourself and let it idle for a short time after stopping. Its not mandatory but its nicer on your engine.

once again, you are making this claim without anything to back it up.

[Mr_will]

Guys, the only reason why you have a turbo timer in a turbo charged car is to prevent the oil from frying in the exhaust bearings by it remaining stationary. The exhaust side of the turbo charger runs much hotter than anywhere else in the engine.




The exhaust temp is way way way hotter than what you have in your crank, heads, valves etc etc. .. a cool down down lap or even a slower drive (as long as your turbo charger doesn't turn red) home is sufficient. Hundreds of thousands of Turbo Charged cars have not died from the lack of a turbo timer.




You're never going to need a Timer in an NA period. Like someone mentioned, the heak soak from leaving the car idling is probably worse. At to that, at idle, you're probably going to get increased fuel contamination in your oil. If you're at the track, a simple cool down lap is sufficient and thats proven by hundreds of thousands of NA race cars.




Most of the time, if you're frying your oil in an NA car, its usually not from the lack of cooling down prior to shutting down, its when you're fanging your car. Your issue then is not about having a timer, rather, you have cooling/tuning problems, or maybe its your driving style.




Like it or not, Will is right...and what he says even applied to NA track cars...How many NA track cars do you see with timers? Waste of time and Money.



Just please stop trying to justify it in an NA car. its painful to read.

that was a super dooper post. i made some bits bold in the hope that people might read them again and take some notice :D

[bennjamin]

once again, you are making this claim without anything to back it up.

well duh. We are saying the exact same thing.
I have to admit myself and Mr will have taken this off topic into personal driving habits and nothing to do with the above so -


This is about timers on a NA car and as usual this is going off into different topics and opinions. We can all agree that NA timers are a waste on NA cars :thumbsup:

[Hullabaloo]

Seems like a cool down lap the way to go. But is idling for a minute or two better than immediately shutting off (if there was no cool down lap)?

Extreme hypothetical: Say a person pushes their car hard because they are late somewhere and doesn't have time to sit in their car and idle nor to drive slowly in the last 10 minutes. Would a timer be of some benefit?

[bennjamin]

Seems like a cool down lap the way to go. But is idling for a minute or two better than immediately shutting off (if there was no cool down lap)?

Extreme hypothetical: Say a person pushes their car hard because they are late somewhere and doesn't have time to sit in their car and idle nor to drive slowly in the last 10 minutes. Would a timer be of some benefit?

read the last few posts dude.

On a NA car , no massive damage is done if it is shut off straight away.
Its better IMO to let the car sit for abit but you dont HAVE to. Its fine for the engine.

[Mr_will]

well duh. We are saying the exact same thing.
I have to admit myself and Mr will have taken this off topic into personal driving habits and nothing to do with the above so -


This is about timers on a NA car and as usual this is going off into different topics and opinions. We can all agree that NA timers are a waste on NA cars :thumbsup:

agreed 100%

[Bludger]

I'll agree to disagree