warm up car..

[yeehou]

Just wondering do you guys warm up your car before driving? No/Yes, why?

Sorry for a stupid question

[chunky]

yea especially if cold
to run oil through your engine and make sure there is lubrication on the engine

[jdm_kid]

yup. warming up the oil, getting the coolant flowing, etc. I would recommend it if your car has some extra bits powered by or dependent on oil. e.g. variable valve timing (vtec, mivec, vvti etc.) or a turbo

vtec in cold no no no..

[Zdster]

Do you mean, put key in ignition and let car idle for 10 min before driving away or just not reving the heck out of the engine while it is cold?

I do the second not the first.

[fatboyz39]

Let the car warm up, but not too long. I would say give it a minture or 2 then start driving. Just slowly i.e not fanging it until the water and oil temps are at operating temperature.

Car needs about 10min of driving before oil temps are at normal operating temps.

[94_Accord]

yeah i let mine warm up for approx 2-3 mins first and then drive it sensibally for the next 5 mins or so. usually by then the car is at the right temp..

for some reason ive found in the mornings that if i just click the car over and drive i have some difficulty changing gears ie. gettin from 1st to 2nd and even gearing down from 3rd to 2nd.

anyone else have this prob or is it jst me? lol

[ICV 73C]

i usually jst start up my car for about 5min Or until the rpm goes on or jst right below 1rpm and then baby it whilst driving ( 2500 -2700rpm ) i rarely take it past 3000rpm, just got my license back and not gonna speed : )

[string]

yeah i let mine warm up for approx 2-3 mins first and then drive it sensibally for the next 5 mins or so. usually by then the car is at the right temp..

for some reason ive found in the mornings that if i just click the car over and drive i have some difficulty changing gears ie. gettin from 1st to 2nd and even gearing down from 3rd to 2nd.

anyone else have this prob or is it jst me? lol
Gearbox oil needs some loving too :)

On the original topic, I let it idle for about 30 seconds while I take my wallet and phone out of my pockets, put my seatbelt on and get it into reverse. It's a waste of time and fuel to do any more, just take it easy until it warms up, it's a no brainer really.

[Drew]

I warm up my cars for about 5-10 minutes on cold days...

But thats just so I got hot air coming from the heater when I get in :P

But otherwise don't really bother

The EF8 I used to warm up but meh don't care enough anymore... Have bigger things to worry about

[T-onedc2]

No need to warm up for long, the car warms up faster if you start driving, if you don't drive the gearbox won't warm up either. Plus the sooner you get the engine down from cold idle (higher revs), the sooner the engine runs leaner thus saving fuel.

[Mr_will]

i usually jst start up my car for about 5min Or until the rpm goes on or jst right below 1rpm and then baby it whilst driving ( 2500 -2700rpm ) i rarely take it past 3000rpm, just got my license back and not gonna speed : )

dont forget its just as important not to us WOT as it is not to over-rev the engine.

ie you want to have low load AND low rpm.

i idle for 30 secs and drive in 1st at 2500 until the bar starts to move.

[bevis90]

what about holding or revving to speed up would that stuff up the engine or cause any problems or should let engine idle as is

[shadou]

I've been letting my car idle 10 minutes in the mornings, I'm talking about frosted glass mornings. But other times I just let mine idle 5 minutes minimum before I start driving.

[Mr_will]

I've been letting my car idle 10 minutes in the mornings, I'm talking about frosted glass mornings. But other times I just let mine idle 5 minutes minimum before I start driving.

i dont think that is necessary at all.

[shadou]

why? I like to have my temp gauge needle at least registering before I start to drive, doesn't harm the engine to let it idle does it?

[dupac->]

i have a smoke then start driving slowly after that. 5 mins or so.

it's hard dirving cold entering morning traffic, everyones fanging it and i'm stuck still warming up my engine
haha..

[DLO01]

-Stock car:
Start car - make sure you have oil pressure (few sec's) - start driving.
Just as long as you don't cane your car till both Oil and Water are at opperating temps. You will have no problems.
Don't forget warming driveline as well.

-Modifided car with oil cooler (without thermostat):
Start car - make sure you have oil pressure - wait till you have oil temp (could be up to 10mins) - start driving.
Don't forget warming driveline as well.

[string]

-Modifided car with oil cooler (without thermostat):

No thermostat on an oil cooler is a very bad idea; do you have another method to maintain consistent (and appropriate) oil temperatures?

[DLO01]

No thermostat on an oil cooler is a very bad idea; do you have another method to maintain consistent (and appropriate) oil temperatures?

No I don't have another method? Do I need to?

You need to design your components to suit your setup.
Different engines, different mods, different applications, different weather conditions.

You get a cooler if you have the need one. You get one with a thermostat if you need one. You get a core size to suit your needs.

My new oil cooler and remote oil filter has no thermostat.

[Mr_will]

Ford has been using oil coolers on their cars since the early 1960's with NO THERMOSTAT with NO PROBLEMS. It is not a BAD IDEA. My personal 1969Super Cobra Jet was driven and started in MINUS 30 degree weather with no oil cooler thermostat and no problems resulted from not having a thermostat in conjunction with the oil cooler. This is another one of those "Internet myths".

i dont dispute that this didnt cause you problems, but i think whats string was getting at was something else:

its like when the thermostat in my cooling system was broken - because coolant was flowing through the radiator ALL the time (instead of just when it got hot enough), the temp would fluctuate, and end up running cooler than normal when i was on the freeway.

if an external oil cooler doesnt have a thermostat, the effect would be similar, on freeway driving the oil may actually get too cool. we all know that we shouldnt fang out cars when cold for two reasons - the mechanical components are not expanding consistently as they are not at operating temperature, and the oil is not at the correct viscosity to provide maximum lubrication.

it comes down to the efficiency of the cooler - the stock cooler on the car you describe was probably quite small, meaning that the overall temperature drop it contributed was small. almost all cars have SOME kind of oil cooler, with most being a single tube running across or behind the radiator. look at the front bar of an xr6 falcon next time you see one - theres tubes for trans fluid, p/s fluid and oil there.

[bennjamin]

I've been letting my car idle 10 minutes in the mornings, I'm talking about frosted glass mornings. But other times I just let mine idle 5 minutes minimum before I start driving.

There is a simialar thread on this in the teg section.

IMO its good to let the car warm up abit - say a minute or so two not 10 minutes as this is OVERKILL. Once you start driving , the temp gauge will rise regardless....if you sit there and idle it will take quite abit more time

Just dont jump in , turn on and drive off straight away. IF you MUST , be nice on the engine and light throttle until the tempo gauge reaches optimum.

[JohnnyVtec]

i dont dispute that this didnt cause you problems,


its like when the thermostat in my cooling system was broken - because coolant was flowing through the radiator ALL the time (instead of just when it got hot enough), the temp would fluctuate, and end up running cooler than normal when i was on the freeway.

if an external oil cooler doesnt have a thermostat, the effect would be similar, on freeway driving the oil may actually get too cool. we all know that we shouldnt fang out cars when cold for two reasons - the mechanical components are not expanding consistently as they are not at operating temperature, and the oil is not at the correct viscosity to provide maximum lubrication.

it comes down to the efficiency of the cooler - the stock cooler on the car you describe was probably quite small, meaning that the overall temperature drop it contributed was small. almost all cars have SOME kind of oil cooler, with most being a single tube running across or behind the radiator. look at the front bar of an xr6 falcon next time you see one - theres tubes for trans fluid, p/s fluid and oil there.




Claymore was actually refering to the 1969 Bigblock 429cubic inch super cobra jet, which is one of the largest displacement overhead valve conventional V8 engines ford ever produced. Those engines are made of cast iron. One of the cylinder heads for that engine weighs around the same as a b series block. The engines I presume we're discussing here are ally block and even ally cylinder head n/a honda's ? Aluminium is one of the best metals in the world for convection of heat. The oil cooler claymore's refering to is roughly the same size as the oil cooler deano is running. As far as having a thermostat on an oil cooler is concearned, i believe that it would be un-necessary and possibly damaging to most of the naturally aspirated 4 cylinder engines being produced in present day. There is no probablity for your naturally aspirated honda engine's oil to become quote *Too Cool* whilst being circulated through the engine during operation on the motorway or otherwise. Even if some of the oil is setting behind a thermostat in an oil cooler awaiting it's dispense to circulation there is no probablity that it will become *Too Cool*. Correct volume & pressure is what circulates your engine oil. If your engine oil cooler has a thermostat which has not been specifically designed to suit the exact engine it's used on. You're taking a chance in reducing the oil pump's effectiveness. It is the oil pump's job to assure proper oil volume as well as pressure throughout the crankcase/cylinder-head. Adding an oil cooler to that requires in some & or most cases that you increase your oil pump's performance so as to increase oil pressure & volume depending on the specific requirements of the engine in mind. By adding a thermostat to that oil cooler, you're then again varying the capablities of your oil pump most likely *Reducing*. Maybe a thermostat for the oil cooler on a larger displacement engine with forced induction could gain efficiency. Not a 1.6-2.2 liter n/a engine.


Thermostat for an oil cooler, Why?

[string]

Ford has been using oil coolers on their cars since the early 1960's with NO THERMOSTAT with NO PROBLEMS. It is not a BAD IDEA. My personal 1969Super Cobra Jet was driven and started in MINUS 30 degree weather with no oil cooler thermostat and no problems resulted from not having a thermostat in conjunction with the oil cooler. This is another one of those "Internet myths".
What is the specific setup of the standard oil cooler on these cars? Is the heat exchanging into the coolant? If you run an air to oil cooler you most certainly need a thermostat to keep from over-cooling in many situations.

It's your engine DLO01, do as you please. I'd love to see some of your oil temperature data-logs. Without a thermostat how have you setup your motor for consistent oil temperatures?

On a side note i'm not specifically talking about n/a 4 cylinders; i'm tending towards forced induction; I agree that on a little n/a motor it's a bit of a wank.

And on a second note, i am also talking about race and street applications since oil coolers are definately a wank just driving around daily (for our little motors that is, I don't know or care about 1960's v8's :D)

[string]

I OBVIOUSLY REALISE that many stock cars come with oil coolers. Hell, every air cooled porsche came with an oil cooler and guess what, they also have an oil thermostat.

About wank factor i'm talking about those little cores you buy and slap up front, not standard items. The parts that people buy and just run around the street with them. Completely unrequired and a wank.

You just said it, cool oil may not last as long. We all know how much good oils are. If you are spending good money on motors and oil cooling solutions, you're spending good money on oil, and you might aswell get an oil thermostat to make the most of it from the start.

[DLO01]

Hey guys,
Just for the info on this site I will update with oil temps when I have my oil cooler installed (which should be pretty soon) on my current NA setup.

This is no personal attack at all, but personally think and we shall see that String thinks oil coolers are 'too' efficent with cooling. Thats my thoughts.

With my previous oil cooler setup NA, with normal street driving my car maintained 80-85 degrees C.

I am not challenging anyone. I am open to the results. Once I install my new setup with no thermostat I will report back with my findings and we can all make out own decisions.

Personally for me I will be installing this in my current NA setup, but the main reason I am installing my cooler is because I am boosting my car. I previously removed my old cooler kit, because it was NA and it was a street driven car.

Stay tunned lads! :thumbsup:

[string]

Yeah i'm not trying to attack anyone. I just think that adding a cooling element and not another element to keep temperatures within a given band is not doing the job to 100%; and from reading your worklog thread, it seems like you want to do it all right.

[DLO01]

Na, thats ok man. Its all in the persuit of knowledge. :thumbsup:

I might start a new thread on my findings, since we are getting a bit more specific.

If I am right, temps will be maintained better than you think.

[040501912]

I drive my car when its cold but never pass 1500 rpm...
MY CAR DRIVE IT SELF!!
*start car
*clutch in
*gear in (1st)
*clutch out
*no foot on accelerator
*rpm goes to 1200
*change gears and soo oon ...

Wallaah !! car rev it self and i just drive with out pressing accelerator jsut change gear till 5 .. and the car still going like 50 km/h on the road with out me pressing the pedal on !!

Thats when the engine are cold ...

why i need to waste petrol not moving when the car can goes in side the suburb under 50km/h in the morning :p save me up sometimes if i was late to uni hahaha

WIERD HEY ?

[JohnnyVtec]

[QUOTE=claymore;1148447]First it was a 428 CI engine. :p Fair enough however, you and i both know that in late 1969 c9ae the FE blocks were surpassed by the canted valve design being the 429BB which did also come as the super cobra jet. Even better still the Boss 429 hemi in 1970. LOL i'll shut up now:zip: :thumbsup:

[DLO01]

Hey guys. Have done my study and writeup as we have been discussing in this thread.

Please see study here:

http://www.ozhonda.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1149149#post1149149

[aaronng]

I drive my car when its cold but never pass 1500 rpm...
MY CAR DRIVE IT SELF!!
*start car
*clutch in
*gear in (1st)
*clutch out
*no foot on accelerator
*rpm goes to 1200
*change gears and soo oon ...

Wallaah !! car rev it self and i just drive with out pressing accelerator jsut change gear till 5 .. and the car still going like 50 km/h on the road with out me pressing the pedal on !!

Thats when the engine are cold ...

why i need to waste petrol not moving when the car can goes in side the suburb under 50km/h in the morning :p save me up sometimes if i was late to uni hahaha

WIERD HEY ?
That's not good for a cold engine. You should use the throttle and limit your RPM to 2500rpm instead.

[TheSaint]

is there a certain temp/pressure figures that allow vtec to operate effectively?

rather than juss trying to guess wen its ok and wen its not?

i was thinking of getting water temp, oil temp + oil pressure gauges so i can tell wen the car is ready, but is there a recorded figure sumwer?

[040501912]

That's not good for a cold engine. You should use the throttle and limit your RPM to 2500rpm instead.

hahaahah i will to that next time.. :) thx for that..

[Photonic_Si]

the modern (or late 80s onwards) 4 cylinder honda motor, or any other for that matter, does not require a full warm up to prevent engine damage. They are designed to be started and driven. Having said that, no engine should be strapped cold and honda motors have countermeasures that prevent this.

[TypeRice]

so wat exactly is the normal temperature?
does it vary for winter / summer??

currently my gauge for the temperature thing always points just a bit below halfway point ...

[DLO01]

so wat exactly is the normal temperature?
does it vary for winter / summer??

currently my gauge for the temperature thing always points just a bit below halfway point ...

Sounds about right. :thumbsup: Unfortunatly the stock gauges are not accurate and you cannot see slight variations like you can see on a aftermarket gauge.

Normal/Stock 'water temps' under normal driving, for B series motors is 90-95 degrees celcuis. Thats water temperature exiting the motor. I would have thought other honda motors are simular/same.

Does not make a difference to the range if winter or summer because it is controlled by Thermostat, natural air flow cooling and Fan/fan switch.

[string]

That sounds a bit too hot. Most thermostats i've seen open around 80 degrees C.

With the stock gauge, you pretty much just have to make sure it's always in the same spot. If it moves any more than "usual" then you've got problems.

[DLO01]

Na its not. I have a mugen thermo and switch in my R. Water temps sit between 80-85 degrees.

Mugen/Spoon thermo's are 10 degrees cooler than stock. :thumbsup:

Maybe 80 is printed on the stock thermo. Thermostats are on the 'water in' side of the motor. But actuall temps are taken after the motor which are 90-95 degrees.

[string]

Isn't the stock temperature sensor on the thermostat housing...?

[DLO01]

Not sure, but quite possibly.

When people install aftermarket temp guages, the sensor is either installed as a section in the top hose (going back to the radiator) or as I have mine, tapped in the housing that the top hose is connected to, as I said in a previous post. When temps are quoted, it is usually the temp exiting the motor. :thumbsup:

[steve88]

you guys got me all paranoid and for the first time i didnt rev over 4k in the morning :p kept it nice and lowwwwwww

[92civicR]

i just get in and drvie jsut dont fang it to hard