B16A Not Starting

[vtek16]

Hi Guys,

I'm hoping someone with a little more knowledge on the Vtec's than me can help me out,

The car isn't starting at the moment, to begin with we noticed the dizzy cap tracking to a steel brake line . We have replaced Coil, Leads (tried 2 x sets one new, Plugs, & Dizzy Cap

IACV is still connected but not in use , we have also replaced fuel and checked the fuses that are still in the system (this is a project car and a few fuses have been removed that are no longer needed )

has anyone got any ideas , there is fuel on the plugs after extended cranking and there is spark but it seems a little weak and erratic to me , it sounds as if it wants to start but just isn't getting there . The tracking is now gone , we have also disconnected the battery and reconnected it

PS before we replaced the coil it was backfiring through the TB but since its replacement its not but still not starting


any ideas appreciated

Regards,


Ash

[destrukshn]

your ignitor?
timing is off?

[vtek16]

Ign timing hasnt been adjusted since it ran last, Iv printed out the honda tech page on the igniter unit and will test it on the weekend sometime , so this supplies volage to the coil ?

Just ran through the tests and its got power in all the right places - the next step on the tests if everything is ok is to replace it ... Any ideas on what to do next ?

[Drew]

Make sure that the timing is set correctly

If you have fuel and spark; however small it maybe, you should at least be able to studer

If you actually took the dizzy off then it might be 180deg out if you put it in the wrong way

[CRXer]

Are your leads in the right order?

[vtek16]

yep leads are in correct order and dizzy never came out just the cap . Ignitor had power in all the right places - does this need to be replaced

[Drew]

Check the timing just to be sure

[destrukshn]

it can't be 180 out, it only goes in 1 way, if you try put it the other way, it won't go in, the 2 keys on the shaft of the dizzy, is angled a bit, so you can't it on the right way.
i know the ignitors love to die on these things.
lol.

[Drew]

I've seen people do stranger things...

[bennjamin]

if it hasnt been started for abit - some things that might be wrong are
weak battery , timing out , flooded cylinders or burnt out coil/igniter unit.
Flooded cylinders and blown coil/igniter will happen and further piss u off.

[vtek16]

the time between running and not was only about 2 weeks at the most, The dizzy was not removed or the adjustment bolt still has factory tape on it , is there anyway the ecu could have fried

Now i think about it , it has done this once before a few months ago but just repaired itself wich sounds a lil dodgy, is there any relays that could be fried etc

may have to look into this ignitor a little bit more as it would explain a few things , would this cause a weak erratic spark

Battery is brand new its not flooded and iv taken plugs out and cleaned them...It has to be a relay or something on the Ign.

[CRXer]

Are u sure your getting fuel?

Can you hear the fuel pump prime when u turn on the ignition,or hear it running while your cranking? If not then u have a main relay problem.

With all the fuses uve removed are u sure there is still 12v on the injectors with the ignition turned on?

If its an intermitent problem then most likely an ignitor or main relay prob.

[vtek16]

yeah u can definatly hear it , every time the ign is turned on and the plugs are wet when removed there is still 12 at the injectors

Definatly looking like a igniter problem

ill see if i can get one from honda tomorrow , replaced everything else so i mosewell give it a go . can a ignitor cause weak spark

[ECU-MAN]

it can't be 180 out, it only goes in 1 way, if you try put it the other way, it won't go in, the 2 keys on the shaft of the dizzy, is angled a bit, so you can't it on the right way.
i know the ignitors love to die on these things.
lol.

you certinly can put the dizzy in 180 out. if you have remove the drive from the dizzy shaft.

try another coil and ICM.

make sure you have fuel pressure and spark ( good spark )

are there any codes in the ecu

make sure valve timing and ign timing is right

make sure all sensors are connected. mostly map, tps , dizzy ect

[destrukshn]

valid point there ecu-man.
but i dare say most people don't do it, unless they are rebuilding it?

[Drew]

Maybe he did cause he was trying to fix it?
Anyway we know he didn't now

[eg92b16a]

SOunds like the exact thing that happened to me.
Drove perfectly one day and then went to start the car the next day and nothing. Everything seemed to work but engine wouldn't fire. I got erratic spark as well. I replaced the igniter and all was good.

If you get an igniter from Honda be prepared.... They're not cheap.
I ended up getting a reconditioned dizzy and using the igniter from it. Cheaper than the honda part and now I have a spare dizzy (less igniter).

[vtek16]

Yeah you are spot on with the price mate, if anyone has a known good ignitor wich they wana part with please let me know (or a spare dizzy)

cheers guys

[Bludger]

Make sure that the timing is set correctly

If you have fuel and spark; however small it maybe, you should at least be able to studer

If you actually took the dizzy off then it might be 180deg out if you put it in the wrong way

what i was gonna suggest
LOL, happen to me once

but 180 degree its a lil bit harder to slot in....

like a lil bit stiff to get in and out

[eg92b16a]

You can't put the dizzy in the wrong way, the key is offset.
I have tried to put it in incorrectly just to see what would happen, and every time it went in correctly.
I think the idea is NOT to force things. If there is reistance then it probably isn't meant to go that way.

[Bludger]

You can't put the dizzy in the wrong way, the key is offset.
I have tried to put it in incorrectly just to see what would happen, and every time it went in correctly.
I think the idea is NOT to force things. If there is reistance then it probably isn't meant to go that way.

being n00b as i am, have had it in the wrong way, bolted up and cranking.

[dc2itr]

hey vtek 16! Did u find solution, has it started yet?

I've got similar problem at moment with b18. Can you lemme know if u find out wht its.thx

[ThEbLaCk]

my car had the problem with ICM and could start today but not tmr, pretty much unpredictable. Bldy one day stall at freeway and got towed for couple of hundred dollars + fixing.

Look at the ICM mate as ECUMAN has mentioned

[vtek16]

Nah havent fixed it yet, Im actually gettiung the ICm off ECU Man this week to replace so i will let you all know

[vtek16]

Well i just got home and installed the replacement Ignitor....... turned over the motor and it didnt start , just the same cranking issues


im stuffed if i have any more ideas :-(

[dc2itr]

so yours cranks but no fuel going to motor? Is that whats happenin vtek? I've got this prob. I started new thread cause thought we had different probs.

[eg92b16a]

One thing that hasn't been checked is if the ECU is throwing any codes.

There could be other issues that need attention.

Example: car not starting as stated above. Most likely is igniter but could be something else as well. The dizzy is complex and could have a couple of things wrong with it.

The second time this problem happened to me I replaced the whole dizzy.

Ended up being the ICM and the TDC sensor not working, which caused the erratic spark because the engine didn't know when to fire cos couldn't find TDC.

[eg92b16a]

so yours cranks but no fuel going to motor? Is that whats happenin vtek? I've got this prob. I started new thread cause thought we had different probs.

No fuel = main fuse relay which controls the fuel pump and ignition. In drivers side foot well. Engine won't start if no fuel pressure.

[dc2itr]

No fuel = main fuse relay which controls the fuel pump and ignition. In drivers side foot well. Engine won't start if no fuel pressure.

I've checked this already and doesn't seem to be a prob but I might check it in case. But its not just fuel, my VAFCII works only when the fuel pump primes, but if one doesn't work the other doesn't either.

I'm gonna try the things that everyone has suggested this wkend and get back to you.

[Bludger]

air, fuel, spark

3 things that make it run

just work your way back from the fuel rail and spark plug...\\

back to the source

spark plug > battery
Fuel rail > fuel tank

no reason why iw won't run if its all bolted together properly

[ECU-MAN]

timing is very important as well

you can have all 3 but if the timing is out she wont start

[ECU-MAN]

Well i just got home and installed the replacement Ignitor....... turned over the motor and it didnt start , just the same cranking issues


im stuffed if i have any more ideas :-(

I nkow you have a new coil, but would you like to try another one ??

[JDM_VTIR]

if the car's sounding like it wants to start but doesn't. check to see if the key locks itself into II mode after igniting the engine. if this doesn't happen they may need replacing. or it might be your fuel pump...

[Paul1985]

i reckon it sounds like it could be an ignition switch.
do you have dash lights etc with the key set to "ON"??