Coilover install places and should I corner balance?

[snYpz]

hi,
I purchased tein ss coilovers and called ProConcept in Sydney for a quote. They quoted me 550 which also includes corner balancing and wheel alignment. I told them i didnt need the corner balancing but they prefer to do it to all their cars apparently.
So the question is, are there any other reliable places in Sydney to install coilovers for a cheaper price and includes wheel alignment?

cheers

[tony1234]

hi,
I purchased tein ss coilovers and called ProConcept in Sydney for a quote. They quoted me 550 which also includes corner balancing and wheel alignment. I told them i didnt need the corner balancing but they prefer to do it to all their cars apparently.
So the question is, are there any other reliable places in Sydney to install coilovers for a cheaper price and includes wheel alignment?

cheers
$550 seems a bit high.PM aaronng.He had Tein Flex installed,corner balance etc.i think it cost him $450

[aaronng]

If you don't want corner balancing, just go to any workshop. They can install it.

Also, you have a Lux. You'll have to disconnect your HID autolevellers because there isn't a mounting point for the sensor arm on the front left shock body.

[snYpz]

so is it worth the extra to get the corner balancing? I wont be tracking the car often if at all.

i need to also install comptech icebox, ingalls rear camber and whiteline rsb as well. I want somewhere that is reliable. If the corner balancing is really worth the extra, then i would go to proconcept.

Any recommendations around Sydney?

[aaronng]

so is it worth the extra to get the corner balancing? I wont be tracking the car often if at all.

i need to also install comptech icebox, ingalls rear camber and whiteline rsb as well. I want somewhere that is reliable. If the corner balancing is really worth the extra, then i would go to proconcept.

Any recommendations around Sydney?

Corner balancing makes handling predictable. Without it, you probably end up with a car that corners better to the left but worse to the right.

Was your quote of $550 for the coils, icebox, rear camber kit and RSB? Or was it just for the coils?

[snYpz]

$550 just for coils.
$132 for rear camber kit and RSB
$125 for intake

I was expecting abt $500 in total but as it stands atm, its $807! :(
If corner balancing is really worth the extra then so be it...lol

[J-TODA]

ummm pm benjamin...the mod on ozhonda.. he did a great job on my mates dc5r...

quick as well... however u dotn get balancing..allignment etc etc... jst straight out installation... highly recommended :)

[Shorty]

PM hondatechy, he does great installs, doesnt mind if you have to comeback a second time cuz you got excited about lowering your car, lowered it too much, and now need it at a more practical height! lol
so yeah, pm him or myself with your details, if your still interested

[aaronng]

It's up to you if you want to do corner balancing. But probably 80-90% of Hondas running coils on this forum don't do corner balancing. One thing about corner balancing, once you do it, you can't adjust your height without messing up the balancing.

Anyway, send a PM to Ben and see how much he charges. Also, remember to make a booking to get your wheel alignment done not too long after you install the coils and camber kit.

[snYpz]

is Ben hondatechy?

[Shorty]

nah different bloke

[J-TODA]

is Ben hondatechy?

ben is ben AHHAHA.... BENJAMIN dats his ozhonda nick... jst pm him...

he looks like The MR chuck norris ;)

[aaronng]

He IS Chuck Norris! Good stuff too. If you get it done at Ben's next month, I'll come and say hi. :)

[snYpz]

He IS Chuck Norris! Good stuff too. If you get it done at Ben's next month, I'll come and say hi. :)

hahaha yeh that would be cool! =)
However, i have been waiting all year to get all this done. I really want to get it over and done with! Do u guys mean Benjamin who is one of the mods?
If he is busy i might just get it done at Proconcept and maybe talk and see whether i can do without corner balance.

[aaronng]

hahaha yeh that would be cool! =)
However, i have been waiting all year to get all this done. I really want to get it over and done with! Do u guys mean Benjamin who is one of the mods?
If he is busy i might just get it done at Proconcept and maybe talk and see whether i can do without corner balance.

Yeah, find out the price without corner balancing. Also, call up other places as well.

[Pumped]

$550 just for coils.
$132 for rear camber kit and RSB
$125 for intake

I was expecting abt $500 in total but as it stands atm, its $807! :(
If corner balancing is really worth the extra then so be it...lol



Lol a place in newcastle quoted me over $700 to fit an Ingalls Rear Camber kit,
Just fit mind you!

some places have no idea

[aaronng]

Lol a place in newcastle quoted me over $700 to fit an Ingalls Rear Camber kit,
Just fit mind you!

some places have no idea

LOL, I can do it at home. DIY!

[snYpz]

LOL, I can do it at home. DIY!

man if only u were still in sydney aaronng, maybe u could help me out! :p jkjks

Can anyone please recommend other places around Sydney to install.
I will PM Benjamin 2morow or sth but atm, i would prefer a store that is reliable to fit all my parts in one go...:(

[aaronng]

man if only u were still in sydney aaronng, maybe u could help me out! :p jkjks

Can anyone please recommend other places around Sydney to install.
I will PM Benjamin 2morow or sth but atm, i would prefer a store that is reliable to fit all my parts in one go...:(

I'm moving back to Sydney next month. LOL. Anyway, see what other reliable workshops are there that people can recommend. I'm sure you want to get the coils and everything else installed with minimum fuss and potential problems dealt with by the workshop and not you. The only one I've used for coils is Proconcept, so I can't really comment on other good workshops.

I'll edit the title so that it is clearer what advice you require and also move this thread into the where to buy section to get more replies.

[snYpz]

thanks aaronng!

[BlitZ]

Corner balancing makes handling predictable. Without it, you probably end up with a car that corners better to the left but worse to the right.

Was your quote of $550 for the coils, icebox, rear camber kit and RSB? Or was it just for the coils?


corner balanced? how do they redistribute the weight?:confused:

[aaronng]

corner balanced? how do they redistribute the weight?:confused:

By adjusting the height of each corner. The shorter the height, the lower the weight on the wheel.

[BlitZ]

By adjusting the height of each corner. The shorter the height, the lower the weight on the wheel.

wow... is you car now all lob sided, front and rear, left and right? im very curious how purposeful it is if you aint going to relocate things around the car..

FWD will always be heavier in the front.. does that mean the rear is now really really low compared to the front?

[aaronng]

wow... is you car now all lob sided, front and rear, left and right? im very curious how purposeful it is if you aint going to relocate things around the car..

FWD will always be heavier in the front.. does that mean the rear is now really really low compared to the front?

It's to make your left and right cornering equal.

You don't balance front to rear. You balance the sum of of the opposing corners. So you adjust the heights so that the sum of the front left and rear right is the same with the sum of the front right and rear left corners.

Go and measure fully stock Hondas, the height at each corner is different from the factory. :)

[bennjamin]

He IS Chuck Norris! Good stuff too. If you get it done at Ben's next month, I'll come and say hi. :)

yup yup every weekend is a DIY @ mine. And alot of people chit chat and touch aarong too :p

PS pm sent

PPS corner balancing is hardly needed for a normal daily car. After the car is set at your dream height then just get a full F/R alignment and rotate your tyres every 5,000kms and there should never be any issues :)

[BlitZ]

yup yup every weekend is a DIY @ mine. And alot of people chit chat and touch aarong too :p

PS pm sent

PPS corner balancing is hardly needed for a normal daily car. After the car is set at your dream height then just get a full F/R alignment and rotate your tyres every 5,000kms and there should never be any issues :)

that is the first i have ever heard from factory.. does that mean they make a left and right spring?

[grumpy rooster]

Speak to Joe at Hi-Comp Performance. They install suspension as well as everything else. 96770505.

[aaronng]

that is the first i have ever heard from factory.. does that mean they make a left and right spring?

From the factory, Accord Euros have the front right corner lower than the front left corner by 1cm. When you look at the LHD version (Acura TSX), they are lower by 1cm on the left corner instead. This is to compensate for the driver's weight. Also, best motoring confirms that all Type Rs are corner balanced from the factory. From this, I'd say yes, they make left and right springs at least for the newer models.

Tony1234 bought Eibach springs for his Accord Euro and the actual height of the springs were different for the left and right corner.

[bennjamin]

that is the first i have ever heard from factory.. does that mean they make a left and right spring?

Not that its relevant , but corner weighting probably will adjust the drivers side % higher to compensate for the weight of the driver etc.
But TBH what do you refer to ? The post was my opinion :)
Once you get any suspension in your car @ your desired height , only then get an alignment.
No street car setup should really go as far as to "cornerweight" their car.
For everyones info check this out -
http://www.grmotorsports.com/news/012005/understanding-corner-weights.php

[snYpz]

Accord Euros have the front right corner lower than the front left corner by 1cm...This is to compensate for the driver's weight

From that, my interpretation is that corner weight balancing will be of no use for daily driving.

The height difference will compensate for the driver weight, but what happens when u have passengers in the car? would corner balancing still work? :confused:

[aaronng]

From that, my interpretation is that corner weight balancing will be of no use for daily driving.

The height difference will compensate for the driver weight, but what happens when u have passengers in the car? would corner balancing still work? :confused:
For normal driving, you won't corner hard enough to require corner balancing. Same as when you have passengers in your car. The only time corner balancing will be beneficial is when you are on the track.

[euro1986]

is there anyone in brisbane that can help me with install ????

[ekdez]

if u can be bothered, i got my tein ss installed into my ek for less then 250, with a wheel alignment and i dunno if they did that cornering thing.. but they leveled out my car using a sandbag.. so it will sit flat when i hop in the drivers seat, but remember its in an ek.. and not into a euro, which i would expect will cost more :\.. oh and btw this was done in canberra, at capital steering and suspension, whom the people at honda dealership recommend if u dont wanna get honda to do it.. and me being a cheap skate.. i went with the cheaper option... :) and my car is happy as is :P.. they offer a free 5000km check up too and then every 20000 after that is like $44?? or somthing lol

[BlitZ]

As a rule of thumb : its normally raised by ~5mm on drive side front to compensate for the weight.

[aaronng]

As a rule of thumb : its normally raised by ~5mm on drive side front to compensate for the weight.

Stock euros are lower by 10mm on the driver's side front. :)

[EG30]

To me the biggest attraction of having coilovers is the ability to adj corner weight balance, followed by the ability to choose from a wide range of spring rates.

Why not get the coilovers installed by a workshop, then fine tune the corner weights one weekend by hiring a set of racing scales from your local motorsport equipment shop? You could optimise the corner weight based on say with driver on board only, 3/4 tank of fuel, no luggage, or say optimised for driver and passenger with some luggage/tools onboard for a tarmac rally event. Well worth the effort for a well balanced car, a lot more predictable and easier to drive than a non optimised car.

The scales we hire from time to time is the Longacre DX model with cross weight and F & R percentages all worked out for you on the bottom screen and resolution of 0.5Kg.

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/8919/img0681kx9.th.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0681kx9.jpg)http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/8223/img0682ve6.th.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img0682ve6.jpg)

[nd55]

> From that, my interpretation is that corner weight balancing will be of no use for daily driving.

Not going to argue, because I simply don't know ....... but.

I hear/read the from mini2 guys that corner weighting mitigates torque steer effects.

Without getting into arguments over what causes torque steer, has anybody gone the corner weighting route and found this to be true?

Nick.

[aaronng]

> From that, my interpretation is that corner weight balancing will be of no use for daily driving.

Not going to argue, because I simply don't know ....... but.

I hear/read the from mini2 guys that corner weighting mitigates torque steer effects.

Without getting into arguments over what causes torque steer, has anybody gone the corner weighting route and found this to be true?

Nick.
Didn't find torque steer changed that when I corner balanced my car. Then again, I don't get much torque steer because there isn't much torque.

Corner balancing is more for achieving predictable handling for both left and right turns. On cars with their heights fiddled with to look equal at all 4 corners, you'll find that the car turns better in one direction than the other when you are pushing 10/10 on the track.

[dundas]

you lost me at Didn't :D

[i-vtec]

Heasman steering at sydneham does a good work on suspension. Give them a call.they have a really good reputation.

[snYpz]

Hey guys cheers for all the kind assistance!

Benjamin is going to fit my suspension for me 2morow! Can't wait!! =)

[Merlin086]

Hey guys cheers for all the kind assistance!

Benjamin is going to fit my suspension for me 2morow! Can't wait!! =)


Do what I did and measure your height to the wheel arch on a completely flat floor, and write them down.

After you have your coilovers installed, adjust all corners to a equal variation from the stock height....and you will have the same balance as factory, then get your alignment.

Only applicable if you drop a equal amount on all 4 corners, which I did to maintain the balance as Honda designed.

[bmybny]

I bought coil overs from my DC5s and i'm going to get them installed after my last service when the car gets out of warrenty. Does anyone know were i can get a electrinic damper control unit from, and of any places in sydney that are reliable at putting in the coil overs

Cheers
Jme

[JohnL]

It's to make your left and right cornering equal.
You don't balance front to rear. You balance the sum of of the opposing corners. So you adjust the heights so that the sum of the front left and rear right is the same with the sum of the front right and rear left corners.

Aarong is correct. The idea is to get the average diagonal weights as close as you can. You can't get perfect weight distribution from corner weighting, to do that you need to move mass around in the chassis, and the very best you can hope for in the best of all possible worlds on a production based car is equal front weight side to side and equal back weight side to side.

On purpose built racers the weight of each mass will be considered and as far as is practical within the other contraints placed where the mass will contibute best toward achieving the desired front / rear and side to side corner weights, and this will then be trimmed off with corner weighting because even with a purpose designed racer it would be rare to get the weight distribution perfect.


Go and measure fully stock Hondas, the height at each corner is different from the factory. .

I don't know about other Hondas, but this doesn't seem the case at least with CB7 Accords. When trying to track down a mystery 'pull' in my CB7, I went to great pains to very carefully and accurately measure the relative heights of all four upper spring seats (where the top of each spring / damper unit meets the chassis). With the rear spring seats exactly level with each other, the font spring seats were off by 1mm from each other. And before you ask this isn't anything to do with uneven floors etc, the measurements were made using flexible plastic tubing filled with fluid to find equal levels.

[JohnL]

Stock euros are lower by 10mm on the driver's side front. :)

Aaring,
How does that work? In a right hand drive car the driver's weight would add weight to both right side wheels, so lowering the right front chassis spring seat by whatever amount would increase right front weight over and above what left front weight would be with driver weight and without this lowering, and would all else being equal tend to increase differences in diagaonal weight averages?

I.e. if we assume equal side to side unladen weight, then adding driver will tend to load the right side front / rear more or less equally because the driver is close the middle of the wheelbase, so we'll be heavier front and rear on the right and lighter on the left, but still with a good diagonal average. Maybe I'm visualising something wrongly and need to resort to actual mathematics (god forbid!).

The only advantage a I can see is that a lower right front spring seat would make rear side to side weight more equal (placing more weight on the left rear), but perhaps this is the point? Perhaps rear weight equality or inequality has more influence on under / oversteer tendencies than does front weight equality or inequality? I don't know, I suspect trying to think my way through this without actual numbers is going to be a pointless exercise!

[kayot1k]

hmmm, interesting theory on different heights on each corner aaronng.

anyways IMO corner balancing for a road car is completely unnecessary.
if you add in all the factors that affect corner balancing you will come to realise that unless you are running the same weight on each corner the day you are corner balancing you will throw you balance off regardless. little things such as driver weight, amount of fuel in tank, skinny guy, fat guy, extra people in your car, any thing else that was fitted that wasnt previously etc.. will ruin that corner balancing you paid so much for.
corner balancing is primarily for race cars that have quite consistent variables on their car and they will corner balance again and again with upgrades.

just learn to compensate for differences i say.

[aaronng]

Aaring,
How does that work? In a right hand drive car the driver's weight would add weight to both right side wheels, so lowering the right front chassis spring seat by whatever amount would increase right front weight over and above what left front weight would be with driver weight and without this lowering, and would all else being equal tend to increase differences in diagaonal weight averages?

The concept of corner weight balancing is that when you reduce the height of the corner slightly, there is less weight pressing down on that corner. When you do it with scales on all 4 corners, you will find that the front right corner will be measured to be lighter as you reduce the height because there is less force on the scales due to the shorter suspension height.

Say for example you have a person with slightly uneven length legs stand with one foot on each weighing scale. If he tries to stand so that his body is upright and not slanted to the side, you will find that the scale with the longer leg will read a higher reading than the shorter leg.

[amirul]

install it urself man, it really easy.

[Sir_vtec]

watch ben do it, and diy in future.