JDM B16A swap TROUBLE

[VTEChnique]

S.O.S.

just picked up car.. dont ask about the workshop.. is running in Limp Mode thus no vtec and EXTREMELY rich fuel mixture - used 20L in 40Kms !!

Throttle response is Shocking, with massive hessitation and most of the time stuttering and almost stalling when taking off form a start.

Obviously running in Limp Mode and with hte fuel mix so rich, the plugs are likely to be fouled by now so I already know that OK..

is throwing MAP Sensor code, Electronic Load Sensor Code, and Knock Sensor Code.

I know I havnt wired the Knock Sensor so that's OK, but I cannot locate the MAP sensor as it is different to Aussie EK4 and EJ VtiR Coupe's that have it right on top of the Throttle Body.. I cant find it and I cant see any unused plugs dangling down anywhere, however the wprkshop failed to connect the TPS when I picked up the car..

WHERE is the MAP sensor on this JDM B16A from 95+ Del-Sol SiR II ??

FYI my car is 94 Civic VTi SOHC VTEC D16Y1 (OBD1), using my original Firewall-side Harness and using the B16A Engine-side Harness.....

any other help with wiring advice etc GREATLY appreciated as thanks to the workshop My budget has been blown out of the water...

:(

[pornstar]

vtechnique, firstly go to the kick panel that houses the ecu and see if all plugs are plugged in, if just one plug is loose at the back the ecu will go into limp mode.

its hard to know from thsi side as uve described it, ur mixing and matchine the harness, so that means that the wires have to have been joined somewhere. im not sure where ur map sensor is if its not above or directly next to ur tb man, they hvae to be there... that or they didnt give u one!

[[[d a n n y]]]

SIR-ll i remeber it being on top of the intake manifold..
mate...my car ran stupid..
when my dizzy ****ed up too..
so ..
check either ECU for error codes..
or the dizzy..
but in your case

i dont think the dizzy ..
keep us informed

[ECU-MAN]

Please tell me what ecu you are running, what chip.

also
does your block have a knock sensor, this is relative to my above question.
does your car have a map sensor at all? If it not on the throttle body it should be on the firewall. towards the LHS of the firewall near the battery.

ELD wont go away unless you install the JDM fues box. or I can modify your ecu to stop it from tripping limp mode.
you 1st need to solve your MAP sensor issue as its most important to the car's running correctly.

[Weq]

if its not on the TB, then its gotta be grabbing a vacume source from the manifold somewhere. check all the connections..

ps. why dont u just take it back to the workshop, hell if i ran any kind of acceptable buisness, i wouldnt let a client go home with such a *ucked up ride..

edit: ecu-man, he was running a OBD1 p28 (from the d16y1 he swapped out) ECU afaik from his other thread. was gonna swap over to a b16 ecu soon.

[ECU-MAN]

cool thanks weq, he doenst need to change ecu's just chip his P28 for the B16a.
your right though, the place that got it all up and running should have sorted this unless it was mentiontioned when they took the job on.

[SIKCVC]

The map sensor on SiR's/SiRIIs are mounted on the firewall and have a vacume hose which runs from almost identicly the same possition as the Aussy location. The hose comes from just above the Throttle body and runs out the the MAP sensor... not to mention if your on a rewired loom the map sensor needs be wired up to the loom seperatly as the SiR's and SiRII's looms went strait from the ECU to the map sensor and bypassed the Engine bay Loom seperation plugs.

[Weq]

thats some good info! work sikcvc

[VTEChnique]

OK sorry for the confusion, I am running the JDM P30 ECU (stock)..

FYI the P28 (stock) threw MAP Sensor code.
As mentioned above, the P30 throws Electronic Load Sensor, MAP, and Knock sensor.

My knock sensor is damaged, so I need to hunt down a new one..

Will have a look tonight for the MAP sensor on the firewall, but I doubt it is there unless that is the stock location for the D16Y1's MAP sensor..

I will try and get a digital camera so I can take a photo to post of engine bay..

My dizzy should be OK.. cam-timing HAS been done, but not ignition timing..

FYI The workshop was only asked to physically swap the two motors over and sort the mounts and linikage out etc.. as I couldnt supply ALL the parts in working order, The workshop had to do a fair bit of modification of my linkage and mounts etc.. but I feel this should have been included in the cost.. the final price was 220% of the origianl quote - which was the highest I recieved.. I wanted to pay for a bit of service, but am doubtful as to the level of service I have recieved... but THAT is another thread hahaa

[tinkerbell]

ELD wont go away unless you install the JDM fues box. or I can modify your ecu to stop it from tripping limp mode.
.

just to confirm - i was not aware that an ELD would trigger limp mode, only a MIL?

VTECnique - make sure they have not connected the throttle position sensor and MAP sensor plgs to the wrong sensors - they are the exact same plugs...

appart from that - just make sure the MAP is plugged in and if it checks out visually, just 'borrow' someone elses MAP sensor and test to see if a known good one makes the problem go away...

make sure you reset the ECU often to ensure you are not chasing an old code...

[SiR JDM]

VTEChnique, welcome to the club.
It seems you are having a very similar problem to what i had on my b16a swap..
My linkage was too modified and my mounts were broken (well 1 was -_-)

I was going through way too much fuel too.. almost 40litres for 150/200kms..
The throttle responce you were experiencing i did too.. it is shocking..
I got my cams tested and the timing wasn't retarted ..

For me (which i asume for you as well from the sound of things) is the ECU. It doesn't seem to be wired properly. That was the major factor with mine.
I also hadda map sensor missing, Razztech here in melb picked me up a nice denso one that just sits at the top of my throttle body plugged into the vacume hose. Was only about 70$ or somethin from memory.

In addition to that my trottle body was filled up with carbon was black as vegemite!
A little petrol and some degreaser in the throttle cleaned it up pretty nicely.
The injectors may be a bit dirty and could use some cleaning ... would not be the main problem but could be an additional problem further hindering ur thortle responce. I recomment 2 or 3 bottles of injector fluid and mayb even throw in an octain booster for good measure.

And i agree with tinkerbell the plugs for MAP and Throttle position are exactly the same, they may have been switched around...
Rewire (or get someone to rewire ur ECU properly - because ur having almost exactly the same problems i did and that was the major problem i faced) and give it a reset.

Also check ur o2 sensor is plugged in properly and/or not faulty

[VTEChnique]

just to confirm - i was not aware that an ELD would trigger limp mode, only a MIL?

VTECnique - make sure they have not connected the throttle position sensor and MAP sensor plgs to the wrong sensors - they are the exact same plugs...

appart from that - just make sure the MAP is plugged in and if it checks out visually, just 'borrow' someone elses MAP sensor and test to see if a known good one makes the problem go away...

make sure you reset the ECU often to ensure you are not chasing an old code...

Yeah I have been re-setting the ECU every time I change something - same codes still keeps popping up.. the TPS code has gone away since I plugged in the TPS.. so that would suggest that it IS the right plug used ?

Once I've found the MAP sensor, I can check if it is plugged in at all.. then if it is I will replace it with a borrowed one as you suggested to test that it IS actually the MAP sensor - not another problem..

what is MIL ?

[tinkerbell]

sorry, a MIL is a Malfunction Indicator Lamp

it is the orange light on your dash known as the 'check engine light' (but it is really known by Honda as a MIL in their manuals)

[VTEChnique]

oops I just remembered, it's throwing an Primary 'Oxygen Sensor Heater' code also..

It looks that my O2 Sensor is the 4-wire.. ?? My D-series was a 2/3-wire ?

As for my TB, I removed the whole Intake manifold and cleaned the whole thing and also the TB.. so it is like new in that respect.. (new gaskets too)

[tinkerbell]

oops I just remembered, it's throwing an Primary 'Oxygen Sensor Heater' code also..



this explains alot!

is/are there oxygen sensor/s on your headers?

where?

is/are they connected top the ECU?

can you take several pics of your engine bay for us - this will make it much easier...

[VTEChnique]

yeah I will try to get someone with a digi=camera tonight to take some pics..

The O2 sensor is on the 2>1 2nd piece of the header - it is just before the cat basically..

as for the wiring - I have used the JDM B16A engine-side harness, and retained the SOHC VTEC fire-wall-side Harness.. so I am guessing any new pin-outs I need to do would only be from the Fire-wall Harness to the ECU ?

[tinkerbell]

yeah I will try to get someone with a digi=camera tonight to take some pics..

The O2 sensor is on the 2>1 2nd piece of the header - it is just before the cat basically..


OK, cool...

i think the O2 heater circut is meant to goto A6 on the ECU, and is an orange and black wire, the O2 sensor circut is meant to goto D14 on the ECU and is a white wire.

check these out for correctness and also test to see if the O2 sensor gets voltage on the orange/black wire with ignition on...

(there are also two black wires, which are the grounds)



as for the wiring - I have used the JDM B16A engine-side harness, and retained the SOHC VTEC fire-wall-side Harness.. so I am guessing any new pin-outs I need to do would only be from the Fire-wall Harness to the ECU ?

yep.

[ProECU]

Dude

Knock sensor, dont worry about replacing the sensor, just disable it in the rom.
ELD = same as knock

Let us all know how you get on.

[h22a accord]

you might have to get a pinout chart for the jdm ecu then run wires from the correct location on the euc to the map sensor.

I had a few dramas when i did my h22a swap and it was in linp mode running like absolute shiet/hig fuel consumption.

Just do one sensor at a time and you will sort it out. a multimeter will come in handy aswell.

Also get a vacuum hose diagram as i had also incorrectly connected these.

ELD sensor is nothing to worry about but you need the MAP and O2 sensors to be working.


The MAP sensor on my old f22b accord motor was connected directly onto the top of the throttle body, the h22a MAP sensor is mounted on the fire wall with some vacuum hose connected from it to the throttle body.

I used the all of the accord wiring harness, i had to lengthen a few of the wires to reach the right sensors as they were in slightly different locations on the h22a.

I had to make a seperate new loom that i ran from the correct locations on the JDM p13 OBD1 ecu to that connected to the extra senors that are on a h22a.


try www.hondaswap.com there is so much info on the b16a swap that u should be able to sort it out.

had to also swap the O2 sensor wires at the ecu with a different pin.

its a pain in the ass sorting it out but its worth it in the end.

[ProECU]

alternatively you can run in open loop.. ignore O2

[tinkerbell]

alternatively you can run in open loop.. ignore O2

will this cure the hesitation and stuttering?

[ProECU]

It depends if the O2 was bad to begin with or wired incorrectly -> common problem with B16A1 2x o2 sensored motor

Typically hesitation problems are from either running rich (not strong enought spark) or bad timing. That doesnt seem to be the problem here as it is a stock ECU, stock program.

[tinkerbell]

i think from the description it is a OBD1 set up...

ie one heated 02 sensor...

(VTEChnique - is it a OBD1 engine?)

teh MAP code needs to be sorted as a priority over the o2 sensor code i guess?

[ProECU]

AGREED.
btw: it must be OBD1 if ecu is a P30.

[VTEChnique]

as the B16A is from a JDM Del-Sol SiR-II, it is OBD1, and also the JDM B16A only has the single O2 sensor - only USA and Maybe AUS have the dual o2 sensors..

My plugs are probably fouled by now from the Limp-mode running sooooo rich.. If I get time tonight, i'll take out my plugs and have a look, but prob wont have time before it gets dark to clean the plugs..

[sikcivic]

When is the site, forum going to be ready? Cant wait for your site, its looking great

[ECU-MAN]

VTEChnique, has your P30 been socketed ?

Tinkerbell, I think your right ELD just trips MIL, Knock can trip Limp and MAP will trip Limp

PROECU P30 do come in OBDII eg P30 G02

[SiR JDM]

Have you checked ur plugs? You probably would have, but if the engine has been lying around in a 1/2 cut for awhile it may have gotten some sort of moisture in the plugs and/or leads and could be causing the car to missfire.. a possible reason or addition to why your trottle is mesed up..

Your cam timing isn't retarded you said right? Get ur ignition timing checked and adjusted.
It still sounds like an ECU problem to me, are you sure its all wired up properly?
The guy who did my conversion did a ****ed up job of wiring the ECU so I had to get it rewired and 95% of the problems were gone or not noticable afterwards

[KB]

When is the site, forum going to be ready?

I Set Up a temporary Forum for Our Club why the real one is being setup on a home based server. Feel free to post shit up. Theres a little catch while trying to log on, but look in the problem thread to see how to rectify the problem.

VTEChnique (http://honda.hollosite.com)

- Kyle

[SIKCVC]

man youve had some unlucky shit there... the map sensor runs off the vacume hose which enters the intake man closest to the engine side of the intake man. just above the TB. the hose definatly runs to the fiewall... so I'd say the idiots havn't put it on there. Its pretty hard to miss.

Oh and the o2 sensor may need to be rewired into the loom seperatly as well, I'm pretty sure i remember something like that.

[VTEChnique]

MAP >> well on the usa version of my engine, it's on the firewall.. is in my Haynes manual.. but the ausdm has it on the tb.. i looked at some old photos..
jdm b16 is on firewall.. aus ek4 is on tb..

Was just outside with a light, and it just aint there as far as I can tell..so basically there's no MAP sensor there, and buggered if I can find a spare plug for it !!

what is the thing on the firewall side of the intake plenum ? it has a couple of vac hoses and one sensor to a plug (similar to the knock sensor plug).. I checked and it is the right plug as the one i thaught was the knock sensor only reaches the knock sensor and vice versa.

FYI >> the engine was sitting in a workshop for a max of 4 weeks.. was out of a running car (private import JDM Del-Sol SiR-II Transtop).. but plugs are prob fouled from the rich mixture.. i'll take the plugs out and replace when i've fixed the MAP sensor and ELD problems.

I will take some pics tommorow after KB swings by..

[SIKCVC]

sounds like its your map sensor and I know the owner of the Del-Sol... sad story behind it.

[tinkerbell]

MAP >> well on the usa version of my engine, it's on the firewall.. is in my Haynes manual.. but the ausdm has it on the tb.. i looked at some old photos..
jdm b16 is on firewall.. aus ek4 is on tb..

Was just outside with a light, and it just aint there as far as I can tell..so basically there's no MAP sensor there, and buggered if I can find a spare plug for it !!

what is the thing on the firewall side of the intake plenum ? it has a couple of vac hoses and one sensor to a plug (similar to the knock sensor plug).. I checked and it is the right plug as the one i thaught was the knock sensor only reaches the knock sensor and vice versa.

FYI >> the engine was sitting in a workshop for a max of 4 weeks.. was out of a running car (private import JDM Del-Sol SiR-II Transtop).. but plugs are prob fouled from the rich mixture.. i'll take the plugs out and replace when i've fixed the MAP sensor and ELD problems.

I will take some pics tommorow after KB swings by..

yeah, need pics...

[VTEChnique]

sounds like its your map sensor and I know the owner of the Del-Sol... sad story behind it.

sad story behind what ???

[tinkerbell]

what is the thing on the firewall side of the intake plenum ? it has a couple of vac hoses and one sensor to a plug (similar to the knock sensor plug)..


i *think* you might be refering to the Intake Air Control Valve (IAVC), which controls the idle...

the 2 lines comming off it are meant to be coolant lines that are about as thick as your finger? it has a smallish type plug...

[Weq]

i *think* you might be refering to the Intake Air Control Valve (IAVC), which controls the idle...

the 2 lines comming off it are meant to be coolant lines that are about as thick as your finger? it has a smallish type plug...

yeah iavc it is!

[VTEChnique]

yeah my bad - it's the IACV..

:cool:

[tinkerbell]

yeah my bad - it's the IACV..

:cool:

got pics?

are you guys 3 or 4 hrs after Sydney?

[VTEChnique]

3 hours I'm pretty sure..

KB and I took some pics last night - will get them posted ASAP.

I'm 99% sure there's NO MAP Sensor - and no spare plugs in the engine bay - so it must come off the ECU-side of the harness (directly wired to ECU)..

I can get my MAP Sensor from My D16Y1, but how do I rig it up ?

[KB]

http://kylebrockway.netfirms.com/www/1.jpg

http://kylebrockway.netfirms.com/www/2.jpg

[tinkerbell]

3 hours I'm pretty sure..

KB and I took some pics last night - will get them posted ASAP.

I'm 99% sure there's NO MAP Sensor - and no spare plugs in the engine bay - so it must come off the ECU-side of the harness (directly wired to ECU)..

I can get my MAP Sensor from My D16Y1, but how do I rig it up ?

you can email the pics to me - i should eb able to put them up... (tinkerbell@techie.com)

IIRC - the D16 has the MAP sensor on the TB,

so you will need to remove it and i am not sure if it has a nipple/nozzle that you could run a vacuum line off.

if it hasn't - then it will be really hard to modify it to suit.

better to get one from a wrecker that has a bracket and stuff... (from say, an LS integra...)

(btw - i have one (with bracket) lying around that would be suitable)

KB - pics no worky :(

[KB]

http://kylebrockway.netfirms.com/www/looking_for_map_sensor.htm

[tinkerbell]

this vacuum line shoudl be attached to MAP sensor:

http://members.iinet.net.au/~joannepulis/sparefiles/KB%20-%20MAP%20pic.jpg

[VTEChnique]

yeah that's where I connect it, but what do I plug into the MAP sensor in terms of wiring ?

[KB]

hey my pic worked?

[tinkerbell]

yeah that's where I connect it, but what do I plug into the MAP sensor in terms of wiring ?

so is there nothing attached to that vacuum line?

you must be running a massive vacuum leak then - what is your idle at?

you need to find the other 3 pin plug that looks exactly the smae as teh one attached to the TPS...

if this is miossing - then you are fairly much screwed and have to run wires from the ECU...

have a REAL good fossick around at the back of your engine bay for it...

[VTEChnique]

hey my pic worked?

HAHA Tink hosted it I think - but thanks heaps for your help KB !!

[tinkerbell]

nah - KB's pics worked :)

they just took a while to sit on the server properly...

[KB]

*shakes fist at computer* arhhhh

Well if for some reason they didn't included a map sensor, couldn't you source one locally somwhere, plug it into that hose, then run the wires from the map sensor, bypassing the wiring harness ect. Directly routing it to the ecu?

[VTEChnique]

Yeah we've had a few people fossiking around back there - cant find ANY spare plugs.. it must connect to the ECU/Firewall side harness.. will steal the plug off my D-series engine-side harness MAP sensor and then directly wire to the ECU.

that hose was connected to the carcoal-cannister (EVAP cannister ?) down on the firewall.. when I got the car back, the hose was just dangling down to the ground, and it's length and diameter seemed to match that little nozzle on the TB.. when I connect it, it DOES make the idle a little better, doesnt quite stall so easilly when I take off ..

idles at about 1200RPM, before LIMP-MODE kicks in and raises the idle to about 1500RPM.

[KB]

What exactly is in, and what is the purpose of charcoal canister? if a hose is connected from throttle body to this canister, then shouldn't whatevers in the canister, being sucked up into engine????

Or should I just go back to my corner?

[tinkerbell]

What exactly is in, and what is the purpose of charcoal canister? if a hose is connected from throttle body to this canister, then shouldn't whatevers in the canister, being sucked up into engine????

Or should I just go back to my corner?

yes - the charcoal canister is filled with fuel vapours from the fuel tank and this is sucked into the engine through the thicker tube attached to the TB.

the vacuum line that *normally* attaches to it to purge it is meant to be attached to a vacuum triggered switch that allows the vapours to be sucked into the IM at idle but not at open throttle...

this vacuum triggered switch is usually on the firewall with the MAP sensor and is what the vacuum line that is attached top teh charcoal canister *should* have been attached to - not the TB...

good question KB ;)

and yes - it sounds like you will need to run new lines from the ECU...

i will get some details later...

[VTEChnique]

charcoal cannister is to 'filter' any fuel vapours from intake manifold hoses before the air can 'escape' to the atmosphere. correct me if i'm wrong or off track..

(corrected HAHAAH )

so what do I do with that tube i connected to the TB ?

[tinkerbell]

the reason it idled better when you attached it to the canister is that you reduced the vacuum leakage...

[KB]

Hahaha Bede looks like you got some work to do :)

[VTEChnique]

Hahaha Bede looks like you got some work to do :)
yeah I still dont have a MAP sensor tho HAHAH

[KB]

so what do I do with that tube i connected to the TB ?


From what i gather your missing 2 things. Map sensor and vacuum triggered switch. Pipe from throttle body goes to map sensor, while pipe from canister goes to vacuum triggered switch.

[VTEChnique]

nah man the vac switch is on top of the charcoal cannister, but there's no electrical plug there at all..

[tinkerbell]

here is hte vacuum diagram that *probably* best describes the set up as it isupposed to be (except for the pressure regulator cut-off)

http://members.iinet.net.au/~joannepulis/sparefiles/vacuumdiagram.jpg

[tinkerbell]

the points at the ECU you need to attach the MAP sensor wire to are:

D17 = MAP signal (white)
D19 = MAP +5v (yellow/red)
D21 = MAP ground (green/white)

this is a pic of the ecu side of the connector with the three pins you need to attach to... (this is looking at the ecu so the pins are on the far right...)

http://members.iinet.net.au/~joannepulis/sparefiles/OBD1%20-%20ECU%20pinouts%20MAP%20highligt.JPG

i rekon you should just get the MAP plug from the D and use it. the colours will be the same...

[VTEChnique]

farr out THANKS TINK - I owe you a carton of Beer or somethng !!

I will take that diagram and try to sort it out.. yeah I will try to use the MAP sensor from the D-series, but problem now ismy D-series is still at the worksho - about 10KMs away.. which in Limp Mode is about 20L fuel HAHAHAHAHA

[KB]

WOW!!! Good info Tinkerbell!!!

Can I ask where you got the info from?

[SiR JDM]

GW Tinkerbell!!

I shoulda asked you when i had same/similar problem =)

[tinkerbell]

well, this is this sort of stuff that made me famous on honda-tech.com a few years back...

this is the first time i have really made the effort on this forum, i understand that it is appreciated by all and i hope that peeps search for it in the future...

KB - the the info is from my head and all the research i have done over the years...

BTW - the problem hasnt been solved yet, only a solution has been put forward.

we have to wait to see if doing all this actually fixes the problem!!!

it is difficult over the internet...

[VTEChnique]

All your hep Tink is GREATLY Appreciated !!!

[wynode]

Lotsa good info.......VTEChnique, I think you'll need to send down a crate (or two!) of beer for Dave hehe

Let us know how you go

[Weq]

i still think thisis a warrenty claim. ovbiously the 1/2cut had a map sensor, correct? they didnt swap everything over...

[tinkerbell]

yeah - hassle the guys who lost/misplaced your parts!

[VTEChnique]

was a private sale.. not from a wrecker's.. not a front-cut.. thus all my problems..

however I will call the previous owner tonight to see if he has the MAP sensor but I suspect he doesnt know a great deal about what's going on under the hood..

Honbits had done a dodgy in relation to the knock sensor.. it was out of a perfectly good running car - so knock sensor would have been Fine, however when I picked the motor up from Honbits, the knock sensor was broken - as though someone hasd tried to remove it without pressing the tab.. and broke it.. then on the weekend, co-incidentally they had a knock sensor sitting in their Cash Register.. hmmm

[tinkerbell]

pls remember to disconnect the negative cable from the battery before re-pinning the ECU...

sorry i forgot to mention it!

[VTEChnique]

aharr I went and got my old D-series MAP sensor.. got the wires and plug - any suggestions HOW to wire it in and connect the vac line etc ?? is a job for Saturday..

man I NEEEEED VTEC.. this is the longest i've gone in 5 years without that VRRRAAAAATTTT..

[tinkerbell]

you will need to run new wires (or try REALLY hard to find the wires that are meant to be there) from the ECU

and run a vacuum hose from the throttle body to the map sensor and attach the map sensor to the chassis/engine somehow (i have seen people just use zip ties)

the wires you need to join to the map snsor are the ones listed above:

D17 = MAP signal (white)
D19 = MAP +5v (yellow/red)
D21 = MAP ground (green/white)

see the pic above to see which pins these are on the ECU

make sure the battery is disconnected and make a small slice off the ECU wire (dont cut the wires) and solder the new wire to the copper of the existing ECU wire.

make sure you tape up the splice so it wont short out.

then run the wires out into the engine bay and solder them to the wires conecting to the MAP sensor plug. make sure you use tape or shrink wrap here.

then see if this helps.

make sure you do not mix up the wires - make sure you use 3 different colours for each wire...

[VTEChnique]

Thanks Tink.. Will see how I go tomorow (Saturday)..

what kind of wire do you need to use ? and yeah will try to match - or at least use 3 different coloured wires.. and I am off to Honbits to get 3 x ECU pins that I can use.. no hang on I think I only need to locate the MAP sensor wires from the pin-out diagram, then splice to them hey.. hmmm but i'll have to extend the wire through the firewall.. hmm that shouldnt be too hard..

I hope the Electric Load detector code goes away..

hey someone I was talking to said that VTEC will work even in LIMP mode ? is this correct ? I am 99% sure it aint working, but not throwing any VTEC solenoid / oil pressure MIF codes..

Also, there is a small oil leak - it appears to come from under where the VTEC solenoid is.. one theory I have is that cause VTEC is not activating, yet I have taken it above 6,000RPM a few times, that the oil pressure at the solenoid end may be high because usually it is relieved by the activation of the pin that connects the cam-runners together to roll on the Hi-Cam lobes.. and cause it is not moving the pin, it is causeing excess oil pressure in that 'area' thus creating a small leak.. ??

I was told not to worry about it to omuch cause apparently it's common on B-series to get a leak around there.. ?? but I dont like leaks !!

[tinkerbell]

Thanks Tink.. Will see how I go tomorow (Saturday)..

what kind of wire do you need to use ? and yeah will try to match - or at least use 3 different coloured wires.. and I am off to Honbits to get 3 x ECU pins that I can use.. no hang on I think I only need to locate the MAP sensor wires from the pin-out diagram, then splice to them hey.. hmmm but i'll have to extend the wire through the firewall.. hmm that shouldnt be too hard..

I hope the Electric Load detector code goes away..

hey someone I was talking to said that VTEC will work even in LIMP mode ? is this correct ? I am 99% sure it aint working, but not throwing any VTEC solenoid / oil pressure MIF codes..

Also, there is a small oil leak - it appears to come from under where the VTEC solenoid is.. one theory I have is that cause VTEC is not activating, yet I have taken it above 6,000RPM a few times, that the oil pressure at the solenoid end may be high because usually it is relieved by the activation of the pin that connects the cam-runners together to roll on the Hi-Cam lobes.. and cause it is not moving the pin, it is causeing excess oil pressure in that 'area' thus creating a small leak.. ??

I was told not to worry about it to omuch cause apparently it's common on B-series to get a leak around there.. ?? but I dont like leaks !!

yes - extend wires from splice at the ECU side through firewall to the MAP sensor.

make sure you use a rubber grommet to protect the wires as they pass through the fire wall, idealy - use and existing grommeted hole - (like the one for the A/C water drain...)

try to get some Honda wires from Honbits

no - no VTEC in 'limp' mode, maybe VTEC in 'safe' mode, but not 'limp' mode...

BTW - if you can rev to 6k rpm, you are probably only in 'safe' mode, not 'limp' mode...

the oil leak around the solenoid could indicate a a clogged screen behind the solenoid which would prevent VTEC engaging.

also check your oil pan is not dented as this also might prevent VTEC engaging.

good luck!

[VTEChnique]

hmm well it lets me rev is as high as I want though have only gone to about 6800.. just to test VTEC , and there was no changeover.. that I could tell.. now I have cat-back and intake so should be able to hear it. and feel it.. after 6000 RPMS the tacho needle just goes freely towards redline but motor has stopped pulling.. so I am guessing no vtec cause my SOHC VTEC had way more top end and from the B16's i've driven it's all about top-end. we tried unplugging the VTEC solenoid to see if it was permanantly in VTEC ( thus super-bad fuel ecconomy and runinng so rich) but this seemed to make no difference..

now in relation to Limp mode versus safe mode.. when I start the car.. it idles roughly and no check engine light for about 5 sec.. then the check engien light comes on.. then about 2 seconds later the idling jumps to about 1600RPM... and the fuel ratio goes ballistic..

I will use the A-con hole or another existing hole and grommet.. I removed air-con..

[Weq]

Thanks Tink.. Will see how I go tomorow (Saturday)..

what kind of wire do you need to use ? and yeah will try to match - or at least use 3 different coloured wires.. and I am off to Honbits to get 3 x ECU pins that I can use.. no hang on I think I only need to locate the MAP sensor wires from the pin-out diagram, then splice to them hey.. hmmm but i'll have to extend the wire through the firewall.. hmm that shouldnt be too hard..

I hope the Electric Load detector code goes away..

hey someone I was talking to said that VTEC will work even in LIMP mode ? is this correct ? I am 99% sure it aint working, but not throwing any VTEC solenoid / oil pressure MIF codes..

Also, there is a small oil leak - it appears to come from under where the VTEC solenoid is.. one theory I have is that cause VTEC is not activating, yet I have taken it above 6,000RPM a few times, that the oil pressure at the solenoid end may be high because usually it is relieved by the activation of the pin that connects the cam-runners together to roll on the Hi-Cam lobes.. and cause it is not moving the pin, it is causeing excess oil pressure in that 'area' thus creating a small leak.. ??

I was told not to worry about it to omuch cause apparently it's common on B-series to get a leak around there.. ?? but I dont like leaks !!

Get a 12v light hooked up to it to make sure.
I wasnt running vtec for the first 3~weeks of turbo and i had no topend at all. it was useless revving and i would change way before redline. Alas at this time it wasnt throwing any codes. I only started throwing (consitantly mind u) a code when i got my exhaust/cooler put on.. its werid, but its true.

Make sure the vtec solenoid is correctly wired. The small leak may cause oil pressure in that area to drop and hence not activate it..

[Weq]

hmm well it lets me rev is as high as I want though have only gone to about 6800.. just to test VTEC , and there was no changeover.. that I could tell.. now I have cat-back and intake so should be able to hear it. and feel it.. after 6000 RPMS the tacho needle just goes freely towards redline but motor has stopped pulling.. so I am guessing no vtec cause my SOHC VTEC had way more top end and from the B16's i've driven it's all about top-end. we tried unplugging the VTEC solenoid to see if it was permanantly in VTEC ( thus super-bad fuel ecconomy and runinng so rich) but this seemed to make no difference..

now in relation to Limp mode versus safe mode.. when I start the car.. it idles roughly and no check engine light for about 5 sec.. then the check engien light comes on.. then about 2 seconds later the idling jumps to about 1600RPM... and the fuel ratio goes ballistic..

I will use the A-con hole or another existing hole and grommet.. I removed air-con..

Have u got the MAP hooked up yet? Driving without a MAp will be useless! its just gonna dump fuel no matter what, because it has no signal of air at all!

[VTEChnique]

that's what I thought - it has NO MAP sensor at ALL connected - as from the workshop !! ferkin idiots I tell ya !!

isnt throwing any VTEC related codes..

[ECU-MAN]

Thanks Tink.. Will see how I go tomorow (Saturday)..

what kind of wire do you need to use ? and yeah will try to match - or at least use 3 different coloured wires.. and I am off to Honbits to get 3 x ECU pins that I can use.. no hang on I think I only need to locate the MAP sensor wires from the pin-out diagram, then splice to them hey.. hmmm but i'll have to extend the wire through the firewall.. hmm that shouldnt be too hard..

I hope the Electric Load detector code goes away..

hey someone I was talking to said that VTEC will work even in LIMP mode ? is this correct ? I am 99% sure it aint working, but not throwing any VTEC solenoid / oil pressure MIF codes..

Also, there is a small oil leak - it appears to come from under where the VTEC solenoid is.. one theory I have is that cause VTEC is not activating, yet I have taken it above 6,000RPM a few times, that the oil pressure at the solenoid end may be high because usually it is relieved by the activation of the pin that connects the cam-runners together to roll on the Hi-Cam lobes.. and cause it is not moving the pin, it is causeing excess oil pressure in that 'area' thus creating a small leak.. ??

I was told not to worry about it to omuch cause apparently it's common on B-series to get a leak around there.. ?? but I dont like leaks !!

ELD wont just go away. and no VTEC wont engage in LIMP mode

[VTEChnique]

well.. 6.30pm Sunday finished wiring the MAP sensor.. reset the ECU.. idling dropped to around 1000RPM (still a little high).. MIF came on.. no LIMP mode.. checked the codes.. 20 and 41 = ELD and O2 heater.. ohh well no MAP sensor code YAY!!

took for a drive.. found a traffic light.. hmm seems to be running nicely, accelerates fine now with no hesitation, I wonder if VTEC is working ?

vvvvvvrrrrrrrrrraaaaaaaaRRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAA AATTTTTTTTTTTTTTT !!!

awrighty !! cant keep the grin off my face now !!

now gotta get rid of those other codes, but at least I got power and my eccconomy back now !

SUper big thanks to all that helped out on here especialy Tink who I owe a carton of beer or ..something haha

cheers guys, the OZ Honda network comes through once again !!

[2ds]

grats, welcome to b-series heavan ;)

-2ds

[tinkerbell]

that is fantastic!

congratulations on getting it going, it isnt an easy task to perform ;)

if you start another thread about your other codes - let me know, i will be able to provide suggestions on those ones too...

[pornstar]

good stuff tinker

[r|Ce_bOi]

great to hear that it worked out and that your VTEC issues are now gone.
Hope you wont have any further troubles fixing those other error codes.

Tinkerbell... You are a Honda God !!!
We praise you all for your Knowledge and Skill

[Weq]

glad to hear the map issue is sorted. as for the idle is still a bit high. u can try cleaning out ur IACV or check for vacume leaks.