Weighing up pros and cons: AUDM DC2r/DC5r versus AUDM S15 200sx

First of all, I love my Hondas, so don't flame me for this thread.

I know that in the reliability stakes, Honda > Nissan, but as a motoring enthusiast, I'm open to all options. DC5r/s15/WRX of the same age are on the same level when it comes to age and price range. I am a bit old fashioned when it comes to performance cars, and IMO a coupe is much nicer to have than a sports sedan. Furthermore, the WRX comes with a stigma attached + turbo lag/agricultural soundtrack and bland styling.

IMO, the s15 and the DC5r have nice, clean, modern looks, even though the type r is less common, making it more of a cult car. Both have great potential for mods (less so the DC2r).

The purpose of this thread is to get informed and educated opinions, and not opinionated burnings, as I'll be in the market for a new car of this age in the latter half of this year.

Decent links/articles will receive rep points, and so will unbiased reports and comparisons concerning reliability/things to look out for when buying these vehicles/insurance and maintainence costs etc.. I do have a pretty good knowledge of these vehicles, but I want to hear your 0.2

Peace out to everyone at OH,

Mike:honda:

I think if you are going to mod each car with the same amount of money, you'll get more bang for buck if you do spend the same ona S15.

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Originally Posted by r3ckless

I think if you are going to mod each car with the same amount of money, you'll get more bang for buck if you do spend the same ona S15.

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True, the AUDM s15 is very under tuned, especially compared to the JDM version. Not so much the DC5r.

What's faster? Stock vs Stock

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Originally Posted by noobcake

What's faster? Stock vs Stock

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Not too much difference, I would say that the s15 has the edge, torque wise anyway. ITR is lighter.

On paper: Nissan 200sx: (s15)

Power: 147kW @ 6400rpm
Torque: 265Nm @ 4800rpm
Approx weight: 1265

DC5r:

Power: 147kW @ 7400rpm
Torque: 192Nm @ 6000rpm
Approx Weight: 1160

It depends on your launch, but ultimately, it really depends on the driver, as well as condition of the car etc...

Mod for mod the S15 will definately be better than a DC2R/DC5R, you'll get much higher gains if you spent the same money on an S15 compared to a DC5R.

Personally I like the look of the S15 better over the DC5R, but that's just personal preference.

i'm honestly surprised you haven't given your opinion on the most obvious thing that stands out to me when looking at your 3 options...do you prefer rear, front or four wheel drive? considering you said you're fairly knowledgeable and you have your mind set on one of them, i think it would come down to what drive type you desire. if you've always driven honda's, why not try a rear-wheel drive? i think the silvia would beat the dc5r in a straight line, even aus-spec, but wouldn't you just go jap spec?

anway, what cars have you had in the past? if you've had some decent honda's, i reckon go the s15. if you've had stock-ish, non-type-r's, then maybe go the dc5r so that you can have an enhanced experience of what you've always loved.

From what I have heard from s15 owners they are very fragile cars and are prone to things going to wrong down the line, where as the dc2r/dc5r are not.....For reliability go the dc5r but for speed and sleekness go the s15.

i remember one of the mainstream motoring magazines (wheels/motor) had a review head to head for the S15 vs the DC5, might be worthwhile trying to track one of these down

my 2c

Reliability wise we know the answer
Looks is a personal thing
mod for mod the S15 will be better, but will also affect reliability

really depends what you want to do with the car also?

i used to own both dc2r and s15 spec 4 gt at the same time
both stock - in the end i kept the dc2r

reason being it was more of a drivers car and it was simply more fun to drive..
i loved the sharp cornering, short throw of the gear box, snug recaros, reliability and also the efficiency on fuel
insurance for both were high and maintenance was pretty much the same

once you start modding though - thats another story....
bang for buck is definately with the s15

again it is what you want outta the car at the end of the day..

I have owned a modified 2002 wrx which was faster than the sti and have owned a race preped dc2r and a stock dc2r. I would take the stock dc2r any day. I have also owned an mx5 which is a rwd drivers car and I enjoyed the drivability of the dc2r slightly more.

Here's my opinion man, I've owned all three cars (DC2R, S15 and DC5R) in that order.

What you really have to look at is what you want in the car. My S15 had just a touch under 200rwkw, which I built from the ground up just after selling my DC2R to a mate. It was an absolute straight line weapon, got sideways easily and was a pretty fun car to drive. All was well and good, until I drove the DC2R I'd sold to my mate once again a few months later. It was then I realised that the S15 gearbox felt notchy and fragile and the interior was cheap (I had an 02 SpecR GT). The DC2R steering was just so precise, the gear shifts on the Honda (which was 2 year OLDER than the S15) just felt so smooth.... it's hard to describe, but the car was just SO much more fun to drive than my S15 with double the wheel kilowatts. Anyone who owns or has owned a DC2R I'm sure will agree with me here! My S15 had coilovers, swaybars, bracing, the works, so it's not like I neglected suspension tuning.

I had originally decided to sell the DC2R because I was sick of the lack of low down torque and having to hit vtec just to merge lanes in front of a commodore off the lights. As a daily driver (like all my cars have been) it was just starting to grate and I just felt like a change.

So I sold the S15 and picked up a mint 02 CW DC5R from NSW. The moment I jumped in the car, I knew I wanted it! The gear shifts felt even nicer than the DC2, it had plently of low range torque and you could really feel the research and development that was put into the car. Both the S15 and the DC5R being 2002 models, I didn't think they would be so many worlds apart, but the DC5R really did make the S15 feel like it had been thrown together from spare parts by Nissan.

At the end of the day, it will end up being your personal choice. Straight line power RWD or a fun and precise FWD. Before the DC2R I owned a 180sx and an R33 Series 2, so I'm definitely not one sided when it comes to Nissan and Honda.

As far as insurance goes, both cars were roughly the same, if I had gotten a jap-spec S15 it would have cost more. 2-door coupes will always be expensive though, so there's no real escaping it whether you're turbo or NA.

Things to look out for... the
-S15s almost always have a scratched up centre console and it's hard to find a clean example with so many 99 Jap spec models going around.
-Make sure all mods have been done properly and if the turbo has been replaced, make sure it isn't a KKR piece of junk and that the car has been tuned to the new turbo. If it is a bigger turbo and the car doesn't have an aftermarket tuned ECU, walk away.
-If it has a FMIC, is it cut through the battery tray neatly? Is the piping on the turbo side larger than the turbo inlet? This will cause laaaaaag.
-Make sure the gearbox doesn't crunch.. the S15 6-speed is a piece of crap.

For the DC5
-Make sure the oil's at the correct level to see if eats any.
-Make sure it doesn't blow white smoke on vtec.
-Check for general oil leaks, mine had a drive shaft seal leaking.
-If it has coilovers, have they been set up properly? Some people are stupid enough to not bother with a wheel alignment after.

I guess I could go on forever... I'm sure others on here will be able to tell you more about the issues with DC5Rs and DC2Rs. Or just give it a search, I'm pretty sure I've seen threads on the topic before. I hope what I've written about my own experience helps with the decision man.